Do you agree with hinkie's rebuild plan for the sixers?

[HartfordWhalers]

Interesting nugget (to me anyway) considering all the talk about Sixers drafting:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/LakerGMC/status/666378199866077184[/tweet]

Whats amazing is that is with Covington (the best undrafted player on the Sixers) getting 0 minutes in all but 1 game.

But yeah:
TJ McConnel (2nd on team in minutes)
Hollis Thompson (3rd)
Jakarr Sampson (8th)
Christian Wood (10th)
Phil Pressey (11)
Covington (12th)


McConnell having beaten out a high second rounder in Canaan for minutes and the starting job (as well as the former late 2nd rounder dleague extraordinaire Pierre Jackson), Wood having beaten a late 2nd round Euro Stash in Furkan (being paid almost 3m a year guaranteed) and Hollis and Jakarr beating out the super late 2nd rounders (Tokoto, McRae).

[BullyKing]

Please start a poll on which you would rather have right now, the Lakers top 3 protected pick or MCW. I eagerly await the numbers of people that also think that is a push.

Would be smarter to make one asking about the pick values for past ROYs the year after they won the award.

Hold on, so instead of judging the trade based on the actual player traded, you think it's smarter to judge it based on other players?

As I was reading/catching up on this, I kept waiting and waiting for someone to say this. Thank you. People who put more value on the label ROY rather than the person and context behind the award are the type of people Hinkie feasts on.

[Blkbrd671]

No i don't in that the length of time. You look at Detroit pistons and SVG has turned there roster over and future is looking 100x's brighter than it has been in 7 years. Will it translate to playoffs and championship is yet to be determined, the point is improvement. SVG also did this in 1 season.

Hinkie's idea takes too long and doesn't matter if you continuously make crap picks. Furthermore, winning a championship as any player tells you takes "luck". They invest so much time into putting a less than adequate lineup out that if the return isn't a "championship" = a failure. And there are too many factors that go into winning a championship, that you can't put it into a formula for success.

IF Philly essentially ends up having a team like OKC, with young superstars that never get over the hump. I'd consider his experiment a failure. I am sure Philly fans would disagree, but if the idea was jut to have a superstar team, then there's other ways of doing that. You just have to have a GM that doesn't make sh* moves like Philly's previous GM.

[BullyKing]

No i don't in that the length of time. You look at Detroit pistons and SVG has turned there roster over and future is looking 100x's brighter than it has been in 7 years. Will it translate to playoffs and championship is yet to be determined, the point is improvement. SVG also did this in 1 season.

Hinkie's idea takes too long and doesn't matter if you continuously make crap picks. Furthermore, winning a championship as any player tells you takes "luck". They invest so much time into putting a less than adequate lineup out that if the return isn't a "championship" = a failure. And there are too many factors that go into winning a championship, that you can't put it into a formula for success.

IF Philly essentially ends up having a team like OKC, with young superstars that never get over the hump. I'd consider his experiment a failure. I am sure Philly fans would disagree, but if the idea was jut to have a superstar team, then there's other ways of doing that. You just have to have a GM that doesn't make sh* moves like Philly's previous GM.

Good lord, we might as well just lock this thread now.

[Blkbrd671]

Spoiler:

No i don't in that the length of time. You look at Detroit pistons and SVG has turned there roster over and future is looking 100x's brighter than it has been in 7 years. Will it translate to playoffs and championship is yet to be determined, the point is improvement. SVG also did this in 1 season.

Hinkie's idea takes too long and doesn't matter if you continuously make crap picks. Furthermore, winning a championship as any player tells you takes "luck". They invest so much time into putting a less than adequate lineup out that if the return isn't a "championship" = a failure. And there are too many factors that go into winning a championship, that you can't put it into a formula for success.

IF Philly essentially ends up having a team like OKC, with young superstars that never get over the hump. I'd consider his experiment a failure. I am sure Philly fans would disagree, but if the idea was jut to have a superstar team, then there's other ways of doing that. You just have to have a GM that doesn't make sh* moves like Philly's previous GM.

Good lord, we might as well just lock this thread now.

OP: Do you agree with Hinikie's rebuild

Me: No

Bullyking: LOCK THE THREAD!

way to facilitate discussion there bud

[old rem]

I AGREE... and it was a gamble that MIGHT have worked had Embiid not been so fragile. Sometimes you roll the dice and land on Boardwalk. with a Hotel... screwed. NEXT time.. 76'er may draft high.. Embiid may get healthy.. Sixers could get another top pick.. and end up VERY good. Or... they may flounder. Its a risky plan but....how else can you contend in 5 yr or less?

[BullyKing]

You can't really expect your opinion to be taking seriously when:

1. SVG walked into Monroe and some scrub named Drummond. Last I checked, Hinkie walked into a situation with slightly fewer assets. If anything, you should be mad SVG lost Monroe for NOTHING.

2. Since winning championship involves "luck," you shouldn't do whatever you can to put yourself in the best position possible? I don't even understand what you're saying.

3. Building the next OKC would be a failure. Ok, umm, yes I disagree.

4. There are other ways to build a superstar team. Please, by all means, let us know.

5. Are we really popping the champagne over a Pistons team that had a good first week but just lost to the Lakers and is now 5-5?

[Blkbrd671]

I AGREE... and it was a gamble that MIGHT have worked had Embiid not been so fragile. Sometimes you roll the dice and land on Boardwalk. with a Hotel... screwed. NEXT time.. 76'er may draft high.. Embiid may get healthy.. Sixers could get another top pick.. and end up VERY good. Or... they may flounder. Its a risky plan but....how else can you contend in 5 yr or less?

5 years or less?..........sixer fans is that correct. I thought i read 10 years?

[Blkbrd671]

You can't really expect your opinion to be taking seriously when:

1. SVG walked into Monroe and some scrub named Drummond. Last I checked, Hinkie walked into a situation with slightly fewer assets. If anything, you should be mad SVG lost Monroe for NOTHING.

he walked into a crap roster that didn't compliment each other, no first round pick, limited salary cap, a PG that no one believed it. Funny you make starting kyle singler or caron butler sound like a dream roster.

Look at Detroits roster now vs 2015. It doesn't take tanking to reshape a roster. Also last year Dre was considered a bust, now he's a gift?

2. Since winning championship involves "luck," you shouldn't do whatever you can to put yourself in the best position possible? I don't even understand what you're saying.

Context helps in understanding

My discussion was length of time to rebuild.

What i am saying is Philly wants derive a "forumla" for a championship team and there's no forumla for anticipating injuries, last minute shots, another up and coming "lebron james", or LUCK. i see it as there putting their eggs in one basket that isn't even guratnee'd to work. Its not hard to understand.

4. There are other ways to build a superstar team. Please, by all means, let us know.

The problem is that Hinkie's plan is to get as many picks as possible to increase the chances of getting the first shot at grabbing a superstar. well, there's also understanding which player is a superstar and selecting them. So far Hinkie has failed at that, though not entirely his fault. However these are the problems/risk of his plan. My problem isn't the way hinkie's doing the rebuild, its the lenght of time he plans on taking.

5. Are we really popping the champagne over a Pistons team that had a good first week but just lost to the Lakers and is now 5-5?

i didn't say prop up, matter fact i said it hasn't translated to anything as of yet(but of course you fail to read that). My point in all that is that SVG flipped our entire roster and by all accounts improved it dramatically in 1 season. Yet some philly fans are admit that it takes so much longer than that. My point is that it can be done in less.

[BullyKing]

You can't really expect your opinion to be taking seriously when:

1. SVG walked into Monroe and some scrub named Drummond. Last I checked, Hinkie walked into a situation with slightly fewer assets. If anything, you should be mad SVG lost Monroe for NOTHING.

he walked into a crap roster that didn't compliment each other, no first round pick, limited salary cap, a PG that no one believed it. Funny you make starting kyle singler or caron butler sound like a dream roster.

Look at Detroits roster now vs 2015. It doesn't take tanking to reshape a roster. Also last year Dre was considered a bust, now he's a gift?

2. Since winning championship involves "luck," you shouldn't do whatever you can to put yourself in the best position possible? I don't even understand what you're saying.

Context helps in understanding

My discussion was length of time to rebuild.

What i am saying is Philly wants derive a "forumla" for a championship team and there's no forumla for anticipating injuries, last minute shots, another up and coming "lebron james", or LUCK. i see it as there putting their eggs in one basket that isn't even guratnee'd to work. Its not hard to understand.

4. There are other ways to build a superstar team. Please, by all means, let us know.

The problem is that Hinkie's plan is to get as many picks as possible to increase the chances of getting the first shot at grabbing a superstar. well, there's also understanding which player is a superstar and selecting them. So far Hinkie has failed at that, though not entirely his fault. However these are the problems/risk of his plan. My problem isn't the way hinkie's doing the rebuild, its the lenght of time he plans on taking.

5. Are we really popping the champagne over a Pistons team that had a good first week but just lost to the Lakers and is now 5-5?

i didn't say prop up, matter fact i said it hasn't translated to anything as of yet(but of course you fail to read that). My point in all that is that SVG flipped our entire roster and by all accounts improved it dramatically in 1 season. Yet some philly fans are admit that it takes so much longer than that. My point is that it can be done in less.

1. Nice strawman as no one said it was a dream roster only much better than what Hinkie inherited. Dre was a bust, yeah ok. Hinkie owed more 1sts and had less cap space so that holds no water.

2.Hinkie has always said he wants to build a team that is consistently a contender. He knows you can't guarantee that you'll make that shot at the end but wants to build a team that will be in position to have a shot go in for a championship. "i see it as there putting their eggs in one basket that isn't even guratnee'd to work. Its not hard to understand." How can you not understand how indecipherable this is. There is no basket that is guaranteed to work - so your point is what exactly? I mean, do you really think the Pistons have an equal chance of winning the title as the Warriors? No, one team is clearly better and has more of a chance to be in position to win.

Oh, and the "context" appears to be your belief that the plan is for this rebuild to take 10 years. You seriously thought this? What did you think Hinkie's plan was for guys drafted in the first couple years who would be past their prime and their second contracts by then?

4. Non-sequitor - the question is how else you build a superstar team. Still waiting.

5. I think there are many accounts that wonder whether SVG has improved the team at all let alone dramatically. They were a playoff bubble team before and that's what they look like now.

[Blkbrd671]

1. Nice strawman as no one said it was a dream roster only much better than what Hinkie inherited. Dre was a bust, yeah ok. Hinkie owed more 1sts and had less cap space so that holds no water.

your the one throwing words out like "gift" which by the way we got monroe and Dre at #8 and #9 by not tanking. If you want to keep acting like everyone knew dre was a allstar then by all means keeping lying to yourself. Dre was and still is very much potential vs production.

The point was that Hinkie and SVG both entered teams who's previous GM put them is sh* position to rebuild and i don't think "TANKING" was the only road out.

2.Where has Hinkie said he wants to win a championship? He has always said he wants to build a team that is consistently a contender. He knows you can't guarantee that you'll make that shot at the end but wants to build a team that will be in position to have a shot go in for a championship. "i see it as there putting their eggs in one basket that isn't even guratnee'd to work. Its not hard to understand." How can you not understand how indecipherable this is. There is no basket that is guaranteed to work - so your point is what exactly?

yet you agree that no championship would = failure. So what are you arguing? And again, you still have to make the right pick, whether it be at #1 or #10(for you miami fans ). It took Philly 3-4 years to find a superstar(which i think Okafor is). Looks like it took miami 1(JW). Again, i don't disagree with increasing your chances, but if you keep whiffing, maybe the problem isn't not enough chances, but the use of those chances.

4. Non-sequitor - the question is how else you build a superstar team. Still waiting.

And there's the problem. You , like hinkie, want A+B= superstar team/contender. However when you look at the superstar teams, there's not one forumla. Until you can get that simple fact that you can't take all factors into a equation, the easier it'll be for you to understand.

There's multiple ways to building a superstar team, the one thing that they all have in common is that they have competent GM.

5. I think there are many accounts that wonder whether SVG has improved the team at all let alone dramatically. They were a playoff bubble team before and that's what they look like now.

did you just call us a playoff team in 2014? Just stop.

I see your trying to take this discussion on a tangent and i'm not biting. Your opinion doesn't change fact, though feel free to argue how Smith+Monroe+Dre+singler+john lucas 3 is a better roster. I'll just have a good laugh and ignore it.

[bondom34]

Drummond was a bust? Where am I?

[HotelVitale]

yet you agree that no championship would = failure. So what are you arguing? And again, you still have to make the right pick, whether it be at #1 or #10(for you miami fans ). It took Philly 3-4 years to find a superstar(which i think Okafor is).

Maybe you got the timeline wrong? They won 34 games in 2012-13 (not tanking), drafted Noel + MCW that year; tanked in 2013-14, drafted Embiid and Saric; tanked last year, drafted Okafor.

So it's taken two years of tanking to get Noel, Okafor, Saric, and Embiid. With the third year hopefully getting two of Simmons/Brown/Ingram or whomever else moves up into that top-6 range.

[Blkbrd671]

yet you agree that no championship would = failure. So what are you arguing? And again, you still have to make the right pick, whether it be at #1 or #10(for you miami fans ). It took Philly 3-4 years to find a superstar(which i think Okafor is).

Maybe you got the timeline wrong? They won 34 games in 2012-13 (not tanking), drafted Noel + MCW that year; tanked in 2013-14, drafted Embiid and Saric; tanked last year, drafted Okafor.

So it's taken two years of tanking to get Noel, Okafor, Saric, and Embiid. With the third year hopefully getting two of Simmons/Brown/Ingram or whomever else moves up into that top-6 range.

your right, if anything they didn't fully commit the first year.


In all seriousness, the point is you still have to make the right pick, whether its at #1 or #10.

[Blkbrd671]

Drummond was a bust? Where am I?

Do you guys even remember last year? Its some what funny that the image of Dre changes based on the argument trying to be made. By and large, Dre prior to this year has been disappointment in terms where ppl had him vs where he is. Additionally that comment in context was referring to how Bullyking made it sound like SVG inhereited this season's version of "Dre" and a amazing roster.

He was benched last year multiple times for various reason.

Dre is not a bust.

[bondom34]

Drummond was a bust? Where am I?

Do you guys even remember last year? Its some what funny that the image of Dre changes based on the argument trying to be made. By and large, Dre prior to this year has been disappointment in terms where ppl had him vs where he is. Additionally that comment in context was referring to how Bullyking made it sound like SVG inhereited this season's version of "Dre" and a amazing roster.

He was benched last year multiple times for various reason.

Dre is not a bust.

No, he's not. And I don't remember anyone ever saying it, which is why I found that statement so bizarre. Everyone has always (for like 2 or 3 years) thought he was a fantastic pick that draft.

[Blkbrd671]

No, he's not. And I don't remember anyone ever saying it, which is why I found that statement so bizarre. Everyone has always (for like 2 or 3 years) thought he was a fantastic pick that draft.

being that i am a active if not the most activate detroit poster. Believe me when i say that "the majority" of posters, weren't calling dre a superstar last season. but a "maybe starter on a playoff team", black hole on offense etc. sh* dre was benched last year mulitple times. So while the word "Bust" was thrown around by trolls. Lets stop acting like Dre's always been a sure thing. Which is what Bully alludes too. Dre's expectations is one of the best centers in the league, he didn't show that until this year consistently.

[bondom34]

No, he's not. And I don't remember anyone ever saying it, which is why I found that statement so bizarre. Everyone has always (for like 2 or 3 years) thought he was a fantastic pick that draft.

being that i am a active if not the most activate detroit poster. Believe me when i say that "the majority" of posters, weren't calling dre a superstar last season. but a "maybe starter on a playoff team", black hole on offense etc. sh* dre was benched last year mulitple times. So while the word "Bust" was thrown around by trolls. Lets stop acting like Dre's always been a sure thing. Which is what Bully alludes too. Dre's expectations is one of the best centers in the league, he didn't show that until this year consistently.

So he wasn't viewed as a superstar, but always had that potential. The exact type of player Philly wants. SVG was handed that. Along with the asset that was Monroe. Really his only issues that were on that roster were lack of a PG and Smith. He had a decent bit to work with that Hinkie didn't at all.

[Blkbrd671]

So he wasn't viewed as a superstar, but always had that potential. The exact type of player Philly wants. SVG was handed that. Along with the asset that was Monroe. Really his only issues that were on that roster were lack of a PG and Smith. He had a decent bit to work with that Hinkie didn't at all.

So if i am understanding this correctly, the argument is that SVG fell into a great position with a great roster????????

SVg remolded this roster with

No first rounder in 2014
Backup pg+ backup SG+2nd round pick for starting pg
Non guranteed contract+2nd round pick for starting SF
2nd round pick for backup stretch 4
2 non gurantee'd contracts for starting PF

Cut josh smith and pay him not to play

i am so glad we had all those assets for him to make moves that Hinkie obviously didn't have.........

The point being made, as i continue to have to repeat, is the whole notion that SVG was "gifted" anything is largely false and so is the notion "he had a bit to work with". If "lack of pg and smith" are the only problems your able to derive,maybe its more a lack of knowing detroits situation vs detroits situation.

[bondom34]

So he wasn't viewed as a superstar, but always had that potential. The exact type of player Philly wants. SVG was handed that. Along with the asset that was Monroe. Really his only issues that were on that roster were lack of a PG and Smith. He had a decent bit to work with that Hinkie didn't at all.

So if i am understanding this correctly, the argument is that SVG fell into a great position with a great roster????????

SVg remolded this roster with

No first rounder in 2014
Backup pg+ backup SG+2nd round pick for starting pg
Non guranteed contract+2nd round pick for starting SF
2nd round pick for backup stretch 4
2 non gurantee'd contracts for starting PF

Cut josh smith and pay him not to play

i am so glad we had all those assets for him to make moves that Hinkie obviously didn't have.........

The point being made, as i continue to have to repeat, is the whole notion that SVG was "gifted" anything is largely false and so is the notion "he had a bit to work with". If "lack of pg and smith" are the only problems your able to derive,maybe its more a lack of knowing detroits situation vs detroits situation.

And he had assets on the roster. Hinkie had Holiday, owed draft picks, and nothing else. And Holiday is in no world as valuable as either of Drummond Monroe, or maybe KCP.