D-Rose 2015/16 Thread Part II: It's not safe anymore, Dragic!

[Red Larrivee]

Red, what are your thoughts on him getting to the line? Do you think he'll have to resort to flopping or baiting contact like Jimmy does or Harden?

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Rose literally has to barrel his way into contact and sell to get calls and I'm just not sure if he's up for that. Plus, he's never been good at selling like Butler or even Mirotic.

But the more and more he drives, I feel like the officials are going to be forced to make calls. He's putting the pressure on them.

[Ice the knees]

If you spend your time working on your game, you are done with recovery. You want to give recovery time he does not need. He has been full bore conditioning this off season to be ready for an NBA season. If he is not ready 100%, then he did not prepare. I'm not saying he isnt ready. You are.

To be fair you really can't get into Bball shape without 2 consistent weeks of high energy ball. Miles and wind sprints aren't going to get you anywhere near ready for a game of ball.


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[fleet]

If you spend your time working on your game, you are done with recovery. You want to give recovery time he does not need. He has been full bore conditioning this off season to be ready for an NBA season. If he is not ready 100%, then he did not prepare. I'm not saying he isnt ready. You are.

To be fair you really can't get into Bball shape without 2 consistent weeks of high energy ball. Miles and wind sprints aren't going to get you anywhere near ready for a game of ball.

Its February

[Ice the knees]

If you spend your time working on your game, you are done with recovery. You want to give recovery time he does not need. He has been full bore conditioning this off season to be ready for an NBA season. If he is not ready 100%, then he did not prepare. I'm not saying he isnt ready. You are.

To be fair you really can't get into Bball shape without 2 consistent weeks of high energy ball. Miles and wind sprints aren't going to get you anywhere near ready for a game of ball.

Its February

Yep. He's recently found another gear. Started in around the time of that GSW game when he checked himself out after 6 minutes. Every game since has been a more sustained effort from Rose to keep the foot on the gas.

I find it hard to be very critical of Rose right now, he's certainly one of the more in shape athletes in the league


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[fleet]

Well people are still calling him out of shape (that is what being out of condition is). I dont get it. The most amazing thing is, that it would be perfectly acceptable at the same time.

[TheGOATRises007]

I think the issue isn't his conditioning in general.

It's the fact that he is going hard and playing harder than he has since his ACL tear. A while ago, he turned this corner physically and continues to exert on a high level. There are some games where he doesn't fade much and some where he fades. Hopefully the continuation of high exertion will get him conditioned to exert at the highest level Rose was accustomed to.

Because the Rose that's playing now isn't the same Rose we saw at the beginning of the season. Not just in performance, but in effort put on the floor.

[TheGOATRises007]

One positive so far this month: Rose is getting to the line 6 times per game. His shooting % is a low 37 though. But small sample size. Only 4 games so far.

I want to see him shoot 45%+ for the month and get to the line 6 times per game with at least 6 assists. That would mean another step forward.

[bullsRlife]

I said it earlier, but Rose looks back. I know some people are timid to say that because of past injuries, but he looks back. He's never going to put up MVP numbers again, but the explosion, quickness, ball handling, in-air contortion, hesitation dribbles...he looks like Derrick Rose. The talent never left.

I don't care if dunking or not. Getting more free throws is the next step.

Agree. He finally looks back to his old ultra athletic, and pull off crazy moves in small crevices self.

The FTs are even starting to come back to him. I think once the refs were put on notice and called out for the blatant mistreatment of him, and his constsinecy, they've been better about giving him calls lately.

Although, in his last game the refs missed 2-3 legit fouls on him.

And I think he's always had the assist and playmaking in him, except he's been taking too many breathers, and giving Butler the ball all the time to appease him, and to save his energy at times during games, so he could still be hgohly effective, late in games.

But yeah, for the most part he's back. Now, one of the only things left is his stamina to reach his former MVP level of endurance. I predicted thatz that would be back on full display, and for a full season, next season.

Next season is where there's gonna be legit MVP cnadidate rumblings. Mark it down.

Also, I think he's gonna put up a great playoffs, and mimick what he did against the Cavs his sophomore season, then use that to catapult his game to elite status in next seasons regular seson, and the cycle continues. He'll keep progressing and progressing like he was supposed to all those seasons of missed time and rehabbing.

[bbconair]

unfortunately, he's on the wrong side of age, and i think he's more likely to get injured than return to MVP form...

[Pnjguy]

The worst thing that no one seems to mention is that with all the hours of rehabbing he has done over the years, those are hours that he could have put toward getting better as a basketball player. Hope the serious injuries are behind him.

[bullsRlife]

Well people are still calling him out of shape (that is what being out of condition is). I don't get it. The most amazing thing is, that it would be perfectly acceptable at the same time.

Remember, you have to use context when talking about, "game shape", and what HIS level of stamina should be at. His current level of stamina is enough for a guy like Damian Lillard, or a Kyle Lowry, but the moves Rose does on the court take a higher amount of energy, and exertion, so that's still gonna take a bit longer, until he can go full out "vintage" Rose again.

He's trying to get back to "MVP Rose" level of stamina, and endurance. pre injury, Rose was a god among mortals with his stamina, and endurance, the way he was able to sustain his energy levels for all 4 quarters if need be. Hell, I remember during his pre injury days where it barely looked like he was breathing hard in the 4th quarter, and I remember it like it was yesterday where I was telling myself, "this guy's stamina is on ATG levels".

If we're judging his endurance levels compared to the rest of the league, it's already there. If we're judging it based on pre injury Rose levels, there's still quite a bit of way's to go for him to be back to those levels. It doesn't happen after a few months. His aerobic levels were off the charts, and it needed to be with the moves he used to pull off, and the amount of explosion he'd used on a regular basis, and he's now starting to do it on a CONSISTENT basis. Every other year before this, he wasn't putting this much effort on a nightly basis. He was trying directly after the ACl injury, and his first return, but you could see the huffing and puffing during the beginning of the season, and especially during the Portland game, where he suffered the meniscus tear. That had to have spooked him, and that's when he toned his game way down, in fear that he'd red line for too long, and get another injury, because he was trying to push his body to the limits without being fully ready.

Now, his body is getting used to redlining for longer periods, and even for whole games again, and it's getting back to business as usual. Just give it a bit more time, before it's back to pre injury, "MVP Rose" levels again.

[bennjuiced34]

Well people are still calling him out of shape (that is what being out of condition is). I don't get it. The most amazing thing is, that it would be perfectly acceptable at the same time.

Now, his body is getting used to redlining for longer periods, and even for whole games again, and it's getting back to business as usual. Just give it a bit more time, before it's back to pre injury, "MVP Rose" levels again.

Your redlining comment is spot on and a great metaphor.

Before, he'd redline it, but not for extended periods of time. Now, it's pedal to the floor for most of the game. It's been close to 4 years since he's done that on a nightly basis.

Derrick is in good basketball shape, but not good MVP Rose shape, like you said, and that's what he's trying to get back to.

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[bullsRlife]

Well people are still calling him out of shape (that is what being out of condition is). I don't get it. The most amazing thing is, that it would be perfectly acceptable at the same time.

Now, his body is getting used to redlining for longer periods, and even for whole games again, and it's getting back to business as usual. Just give it a bit more time, before it's back to pre injury, "MVP Rose" levels again.

Your redlining comment is spot on and a great metaphor.

Before, he'd redline it, but not for extended periods of time. Now, it's pedal to the floor for most of the game. It's been close to 4 years since he's done that on a nightly basis.

Derrick is in good basketball shape, but not good MVP Rose shape, like you said, and that's what he's trying to get back to.

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Exactly. There's a difference between being in "average" NBA shape, and pre injury/MVP Derrick Rose shape. He's getting there. Just gotta be patient. I think he'll be back to "normal" once the playoffs hits, OR, he'll hit a wall from not playing for an entire season since his ACL tear, and next season is when his stamina, and ability to "red line" is fully back.

But of course, if he hits a wall during the playoffs, people will make a huge deal out of it, when he's essentially replaying his rookie/sophomore season, all over again. And that's if he was coming back from major knee injuries in his rookie and sophomore seasons.

[Mbrahv0528]

unfortunately, he's on the wrong side of age, and i think he's more likely to get injured than return to MVP form...

Lol what? What "wrong side of age" are you referring to? He's 27 fyi.

[kyrv]

Well people are still calling him out of shape (that is what being out of condition is). I dont get it. The most amazing thing is, that it would be perfectly acceptable at the same time.

I've never seen it acceptable to be out of shape in mid-season. But a lot of firsts with Rose.

If he's having soreness, might not be easy to get in better shape.

[TyrusRose2425]

He just finished playing 3 in 4 nights and a back to back. He's also had three knee surgeries, general soreness is just a reality we will have to deal with. It's not really a problem as long as he has better luck avoiding the major injuries from this time forward.

[musiqsoulchild]

He just finished playing 3 in 4 nights and a back to back. He's also had three knee surgeries, general soreness is just a reality we will have to deal with. It's not really a problem as long as he has better luck avoiding the major injuries from this time forward.

We dont HAVE to deal with it.

We can always deal it.

[bullsRlife]

He just finished playing 3 in 4 nights and a back to back. He's also had three knee surgeries, general soreness is just a reality we will have to deal with. It's not really a problem as long as he has better luck avoiding the major injuries from this time forward.

We dont HAVE to deal with it.

We can always deal it.

Curious to see what you think we'll get in a Rose trade that would even remotely help us win a ring.

[musiqsoulchild]

He just finished playing 3 in 4 nights and a back to back. He's also had three knee surgeries, general soreness is just a reality we will have to deal with. It's not really a problem as long as he has better luck avoiding the major injuries from this time forward.

We dont HAVE to deal with it.

We can always deal it.

Curious to see what you think we'll get in a Rose trade that would even remotely help us win a ring.

Knicks will be sellers.

I'd do Rose for Melo. Eyes shut. Except they are looking for a triangle PG.

So, I'd then attempt Rose for Teague + Splitter. Or, Rose for Conley for Jeff Green.

Or Rose for Joe Johnson.

These are general ideas which brings the trade close to completion. Minor pieces have to be moved to make the trades work.

[pb-ceo]

He just finished playing 3 in 4 nights and a back to back. He's also had three knee surgeries, general soreness is just a reality we will have to deal with. It's not really a problem as long as he has better luck avoiding the major injuries from this time forward.

He just had a day off. That's why the old school ballers are ripping him.