Who is the better center: Vuc or Drummond?

[Afan_84]

Offense - Vuc
Despite his shooting got worse this season, he's still a far better offensive player with his mid range shooting and post moves. He seems to hitting his PnR floaters better lately, hope he can start hitting his 3s better soon. He's also a much better passer.

Defense - Drummond
Both suffers from slow defense rotations lapses but Drummond is quicker at containing guards after switching with his speed and he's a little better at contending shots. He's also much better at getting steals with his quick hands.

Overall I will pick Vuc because his offense versatility outweighs his defensive flaws in comparison to Drummond. I love seeing Drummond throws his weight around for rebounds and dunks but spacing are better with Vuc. Like others said, there's a reason Drummond can only get minimum deals since he last big contact.

I will say Vuc's defense looks worse these last few games because Bulls are missing Patrick and Craig with help defensive rotations. Opposing guards run PnR with their rim running centers and other Bulls on the court are often either too small or too slow with the help.

[Stratmaster]

The craziest thing about Vuc is I'll be watching the game and seeing this man screwing up pivotal play after pivotal play, whether it's a blown bunny, bricked 3, missed rotation, or outright laziness on defense and the boards to the point where I'm thinking "This dude blows", but then I'll check the box score after the game and this dude will have like 21 points, 12 rebounds and 4 assists on like 8/13 shooting and I'm just like what...how???

He consistently puts up good box score numbers in spite of the eye test saying he's killing the team. Just a brief glance at his stats (17/11/4 on 47% shooting) and the average person would think we're nuts for trashing him. That to me is the definition of an empty stats player. He's the most empty stats player I can think of.

I don't disagree. The only defense I will make is that there is no such thing as empty stats. Averaging a double double every night with 17 ppg is exactly what it is.

How valuable that production is is entirely dependent on context and the personnel of the team you are playing on.

Since Drummond easily replaces the rebounds (and then some), and is better overall defensively... how much do you need Vuc's post and PnR scoring versus Drummond's opportunistic scoring.

When you have Demar, Zach and Coby I say you need Drummond's style of play. He doesn't have to have the ball in his hands and he cleans up misses from the high usage players.

Vuc isn't bad. He just isn't the right guy to play with 3 high usage scorers.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

[Stratmaster]

I think people would be surprised by how little difference per minute there is between their scoring.

per 36 Vucevic: 17.9 points
per 36 Drummond: 17.7 points

With Drummond you're also getting 19 boards vs 11, the difference being offensive boards which actually gives you more possessions and free points, 2.6 steals which would be insane for a guard, 1.4 blocks, and 6 FTA which is another area we're deficient in (28th).
 

Exactly. And the Bulls need Drummond's type of scoring more than Vuc's because of their other personnel.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

[Stratmaster]

I think people would be surprised by how little difference per minute there is between their scoring.

per 36 Vucevic: 17.9 points
per 36 Drummond: 17.7 points

With Drummond you're also getting 19 boards vs 11, the difference being offensive boards which actually gives you more possessions and free points, 2.6 steals which would be insane for a guard, 1.4 blocks, and 6 FTA which is another area we're deficient in (28th).
 

Drummond's offensive rebounding numbers, though, are significantly boosted by rebounding his own missed layups.

Very true lol

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

[Stratmaster]

I think people would be surprised by how little difference per minute there is between their scoring.

per 36 Vucevic: 17.9 points
per 36 Drummond: 17.7 points

With Drummond you're also getting 19 boards vs 11, the difference being offensive boards which actually gives you more possessions and free points, 2.6 steals which would be insane for a guard, 1.4 blocks, and 6 FTA which is another area we're deficient in (28th).
 

Drummond's offensive rebounding numbers, though, are significantly boosted by rebounding his own missed layups.

You are correct, which is why Drummond's TS isn't higher than it should be for a center playing around the rim, BUT I'd rather have a player who can clean up their own misses than a one and done. You're at least giving yourself a few shots to score in that possession than a guaranteed miss. Vooch shooting 3 = no offensive rebounding because the center is away from the basket.

Plus, Drummond gets those 17.7 points with 3 fewer FGAs than Vooch.

Speaking of TS, one way I look at it is how many shots are you taking per game and how efficient are you. Per 36, Vooch LEADS the team in FGA (16.4) while sporting a TS of 52.7%. I mean, that's just terrible, no way around it. He's the main contributor to why our offense is so lowly rated. You swap those with Drummond's 57% TS (again - not great, but better) and take away 4-5 of his shots and distribute them to other players who are more efficient, we could be a better offensive team.

I said "could be" because it's unfortunately not as simple as just swapping Vooch with Drummond, because this team and coaching staff don't know how to play with a traditional, non-passing Center. So chances are, if we swap them permanently, there's a high likelihood that everyone's efficiency will also go down.

I'm not sure we know your last paragraph to be true. I'm not saying it wouldn't be true. I just don't think we know that.

In fact, I think Zach and Demar might just fit better with a traditional center who isn't in the middle of everything. Coby on the other hand, relies a lot on Vuc (and makes Vuc better).

Remember that in the off-season, Vuc insisted he be a bigger part of the offense. When it didn't happen immediately in game 1, he was already throwing fits. Now he's leading a team in shot attempts per 36 that has DDR, Coby and Zach on it? That is just insane. You have two extremely efficent (historically) high volume scorers and Vuc is taking the most shots?

Just another indictment of Donovan.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

[League Circles]

Drummond is the better rebounder, and a big part of that is that on offense he stays much closer to the basket than Vuc, and I mean all the time. Most of the time Drummond is playing against the backup center. Also Vuc's man has to guard him away from the basket or somebody has to switch onto him and that makes the defenders work. It's not that they get exhausted but making players work on defense gives them less energy to spend on offense. Not the case with Drummond. On defense while Andre can guard outside better he is almost always on the floor with a smaller and younger lineup so he has to get back to the basket more.

It's not a per 36 game, it's what you do when you're out there, how tired do you get, that's why players who look great in 24 minutes off the bench don't instantly add 50% to their totals when they actually play 36 minutes.

This would be helpful if it were true. Vuc is left alone at the top of the 3 point line for open shots which he then hits at well below league average efficiency, which is a huge problem for our offense.

[FriedRise]

You know what, this post reminds me of a few years ago when we had a discussion about who's the better center: Wendell Carter or Daniel Gafford?

It's hard picking between a couple of C-level players

[League Circles]

It's always been a mystery why this is surprising to anyone. Andre Drummond is, like Vuc, a **** 2 time all star, and he's younger than Vuc, and he's arguably the greatest rebounder in nba history. The question isn't "how is our vet min guy almost as good or better than our significant contract starting C". The question is "why are so many teams too dumb to offer Drummond at LEAST an MMLE or room MLE contract, or whatever it takes?"

Which is how you know Drummond isn't as good as this board likes to make him out to be.

He's a good player - better than his contract - but he makes a lot of poor decisions and can't get the ball moving the way Vooch can. The offense looks a lot clunkier with him on the floor.

That said, neither guy is your ideal starting 5.

If you agree he's better than his contract, then you essentially agree he's worth the room MLE or MMLE, which indeed makes many teams pretty dumb.

[sco]

Some great points raised. I think that in the NBA it rarely matters who's better, it's either who is paid more or who was a high/recent draft pick, because FO's are VERY focused on rationalizing their big contracts and high draft picks.

We signed Vuc to a slightly above market deal (nobody was going to steal him for a penny more than the MLE), but IMO AK seems willing to overpay Euro guys for his future career interests.

I was suprised we got AD for his deal. He is flawed, but honestly so are 1/2 of the starting C's around the NBA.

I think the problem is that Billy doesn't like AD because he makes probably one boneheaded play a game, and he feels like the needs to send a message. I also think that Billy was given the directive to turn this team into Denver-lite where everything runs through a playmaking C.

IMO, with Coby, Zach and Demar starting, there's no way anybody with half a brain would say Vuc is the better fit than AD.

[jnrjr79]

It's always been a mystery why this is surprising to anyone. Andre Drummond is, like Vuc, a **** 2 time all star, and he's younger than Vuc, and he's arguably the greatest rebounder in nba history. The question isn't "how is our vet min guy almost as good or better than our significant contract starting C". The question is "why are so many teams too dumb to offer Drummond at LEAST an MMLE or room MLE contract, or whatever it takes?"

Which is how you know Drummond isn't as good as this board likes to make him out to be.

He's a good player - better than his contract - but he makes a lot of poor decisions and can't get the ball moving the way Vooch can. The offense looks a lot clunkier with him on the floor.

That said, neither guy is your ideal starting 5.

If you agree he's better than his contract, then you essentially agree he's worth the room MLE or MMLE, which indeed makes many teams pretty dumb.

Even the room MLE is worth more than double what Drummond is making, so no, I don't really agree. I just agree he's outperforming the $3M he's getting paid.

I just bristle at this whole thing where it's like "I, RealGM poster, am so much smarter than half of the front offices in the NBA. Everyone in the league is so stupid!"

[BigUps]

You can spit any advanced stat at me telling me Vuc is better and I'm just going to disagree. Stats lie here.

The reality is Vuc excels at nothing. He's average and below average at virtually everything on the court. At a minimum, Drummond excels at rebounding and is an above average defender. His offense is complete crap, but Vuc isn't good either. I give the nod to Drummond because he has skillsets that are above average.

[sco]

Which is how you know Drummond isn't as good as this board likes to make him out to be.

He's a good player - better than his contract - but he makes a lot of poor decisions and can't get the ball moving the way Vooch can. The offense looks a lot clunkier with him on the floor.

That said, neither guy is your ideal starting 5.

If you agree he's better than his contract, then you essentially agree he's worth the room MLE or MMLE, which indeed makes many teams pretty dumb.

Even the room MLE is worth more than double what Drummond is making, so no, I don't really agree. I just agree he's outperforming the $3M he's getting paid.

I just bristle at this whole thing where it's like "I, RealGM poster, am so much smarter than half of the front offices in the NBA. Everyone in the league is so stupid!"

IMO the NBA player market is not anywhere near efficient. The many guys playing on MAX deals are underpaid. Guys are usually paid for past performance (which tails off after 32 or so) or are paid for potential that often isn't realized. And when it comes down to MLE, MMLE and vet min deals, those deals are more often driven by roster holes after teams look at their MAX guys and high draft picks who are slotted for key roles.

[chitownsports4ever]

Drummond's offensive rebounding numbers, though, are significantly boosted by rebounding his own missed layups.

You are correct, which is why Drummond's TS isn't higher than it should be for a center playing around the rim, BUT I'd rather have a player who can clean up their own misses than a one and done. You're at least giving yourself a few shots to score in that possession than a guaranteed miss. Vooch shooting 3 = no offensive rebounding because the center is away from the basket.

Plus, Drummond gets those 17.7 points with 3 fewer FGAs than Vooch.

Speaking of TS, one way I look at it is how many shots are you taking per game and how efficient are you. Per 36, Vooch LEADS the team in FGA (16.4) while sporting a TS of 52.7%. I mean, that's just terrible, no way around it. He's the main contributor to why our offense is so lowly rated. You swap those with Drummond's 57% TS (again - not great, but better) and take away 4-5 of his shots and distribute them to other players who are more efficient, we could be a better offensive team.

I said "could be" because it's unfortunately not as simple as just swapping Vooch with Drummond, because this team and coaching staff don't know how to play with a traditional, non-passing Center. So chances are, if we swap them permanently, there's a high likelihood that everyone's efficiency will also go down.

I'm not sure we know your last paragraph to be true. I'm not saying it wouldn't be true. I just don't think we know that.

In fact, I think Zach and Demar might just fit better with a traditional center who isn't in the middle of everything. Coby on the other hand, relies a lot on Vuc (and makes Vuc better).

Remember that in the off-season, Vuc insisted he be a bigger part of the offense. When it didn't happen immediately in game 1, he was already throwing fits. Now he's leading a team in shot attempts per 36 that has DDR, Coby and Zach on it? That is just insane. You have two extremely efficent (historically) high volume scorers and Vuc is taking the most shots?

Just another indictment of Donovan.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

Vooch threw a fit that we were not playing team ball which Zach and Demar were not doing at the time after talking all offseason about how that needed to change.

You notice he doesn't throw a fit since everyone else has gotten involved even if sometimes he doesn't get shots because that at least hustling and trying to make the right basketball play. The difference with Coby and Ayo having a larger role is that unlike Zac and Demar everything doesn't turn into 8 dribbles and a mid-range shot. As long as Zach and Demar were taking those sorts of shots Vooch was saying throw it down low sometimes to counter that style of play as Donovan has said repeatedly that we need to get to the basket. Now that Coby and Ayo are taking more shots they are driving to the basket much more frequently and thus Vooch is glad to step out and set the screen.

We swapped Drummond in for Vooch a few weeks ago and Drummond all but tanked the offense with our offense getting worse and worse every game he was out there. He was turning us into the Drummond Pistons with him getting his rebounds and points but it was coming off everyone's misses as he basically wasnt part of the offense and it became basically everyone trying to create their shot.

Drummond is a great backup center but he is no longer a starting center.I can't believe its a discussion as every single time the level of competition is raised hes nowhere to be found. Vooch is a starting center but hes stretched to the limit of his abilities trying to compensate for Billys small ball infatuation. Drummond's numbers look nice but he has ZERO responsibility and everyone including him knows this

[Red8911]

You can spit any advanced stat at me telling me Vuc is better and I'm just going to disagree. Stats lie here.

The reality is Vuc excels at nothing. He's average and below average at virtually everything on the court. At a minimum, Drummond excels at rebounding and is an above average defender. His offense is complete crap, but Vuc isn't good either. I give the nod to Drummond because he has skillsets that are above average.

How much better is Drummond at defense than Vuc? Slightly maybe but still Drummond is also no rim protector or shot blocker or lock down defender.

Drummond has been very good this season off the bench but I also think the Bulls should get a back up who is a better defender. Also have to wonder if the Bulls are even thinking of resigning him this summer. There’s interest around the league for him, I think he gets traded.

[sco]

You can spit any advanced stat at me telling me Vuc is better and I'm just going to disagree. Stats lie here.

The reality is Vuc excels at nothing. He's average and below average at virtually everything on the court. At a minimum, Drummond excels at rebounding and is an above average defender. His offense is complete crap, but Vuc isn't good either. I give the nod to Drummond because he has skillsets that are above average.

How much better is Drummond at defense than Vuc? Slightly maybe but still Drummond is also no rim protector or shot blocker or lock down defender.

Drummond has been very good this season off the bench but I also think the Bulls should get a back up who is a better defender. Also have to wonder if the Bulls are even thinking of resigning him this summer. There’s interest around the league for him, I think he gets traded.

Hey we all have our POV's. I think Drummond is an above average defender and rim protector among NBA starters and Vuc may be the worst single defensive C in the league. He's so bad that we don't have our guys defend 3pt shooters because we need 2 guys to buttress Vuc to prevent penetration.

Vuc is horrible for our offense now that he can't make 3pt shots. Teams just sag off him on the perimeter, where at least we have a rebounder in Drummond vs Vuc standing on the perimeter.

Vuc is not a zero on offense. He is a good bumslayer, but that's against the bottom half of C's in the league, but he gets torched by the other half. We're stuck with this dude, but of the mid-3, he should be the one playing with the bench guys.

[HomoSapien]

Ok so here's my takeaway:

Drummond is the better player. Though Vuc is the more skilled scorer, Drummond scores at essentially the same rate as him. Vuc is a good rebounder, but Drummond is significantly better. That actually matters for us since we get lackluster rebounding out of the 4 spot. Drummond is much more mobile than Vuc, which works in favor with all the switching we do. Per 36, Drummond would be in the top 20 in BPG, would be first in steals per game, and 1st in rebounds per game. This is elite production.

We all saw what Drummond did as a starter: 14 PPG and 17.4 RPG in under 28 minutes. To me, he looked better in that stretch than Vuc really ever has in Chicago.

Drummond makes 1-2 hilariously silly mistakes a game, but I'd rather have that than a high-volume shooter who is going to miss 73% of his three-pointers. For the most part, Drummond knows his limitations and plays within his strengths. Vuc is the better passer and he doesn't fall apart when he's emotional. Drummond's never been a good player when upset. Vuc is also an elite free-throw shooter. Not just for a center. He's the best free-throw shooter on the team. It's a shame he doesn't draw more fouls.

Now all that said, I know Vuc can be a useful player. We've just set him up to fail. We're asking the least mobile guy on the roster to switch on almost everything on defense. If you're going to do that, you need an athletic shot blocker at the 4. We don't have that. Instead, we're constantly asking him to be the only big guy on the floor whenever he's in. He's solely responsible for manning the paint and chasing down rebounds. That has to be exhausting, and do you know what happens when you're exhausted? You lose your legs and start missing three-pointers. That's what is happening with Vuc.

We have two flawed centers on this team, yet we have one of the better center rotations in the league. We just don't use it right. I started this thread asking you to discount their salaries. Vuc makes a lot, Drummond makes a little. But the reality is that political dynamics matter in almost all situations -- work, sports, family. The Bulls are no different and keeping Vuc happy makes sense. What doesn't make sense is riding him when he's struggling. It gets him criticized more by the fan base and makes us worse on the floor. I think giving both guys 24 minutes evenly is unrealistic, but it's not unrealistic to just ride the guy who is playing better in close games. We've lost a lot of close games this year with Vuc laying an egg. I guess my point is, it just doesn't have to be that way.

[dougthonus]

The craziest thing about Vuc is I'll be watching the game and seeing this man screwing up pivotal play after pivotal play, whether it's a blown bunny, bricked 3, missed rotation, or outright laziness on defense and the boards to the point where I'm thinking "This dude blows", but then I'll check the box score after the game and this dude will have like 21 points, 12 rebounds and 4 assists on like 8/13 shooting and I'm just like what...how???

He consistently puts up good box score numbers in spite of the eye test saying he's killing the team. Just a brief glance at his stats (17/11/4 on 47% shooting) and the average person would think we're nuts for trashing him. That to me is the definition of an empty stats player. He's the most empty stats player I can think of.

He consistently puts up high totals.

However:
Only 3 players in the history of the NBA have shot as many 3s as he does per game at a lower percentage. He's having an all-time worst type shooting year, and 93% of his threes have no one within 6 feet (most open category NBA.com tracks).

He is the least efficient center by TS% in the NBA that has played over 500 minutes (and this would be true with his career numbers not just present year numbers which are worse than career numbers)

His post offense is frequently against mismatches, and still ridiculously inefficient. It would be about 30 points per 100 possessions worse than the worst offense in the league.

He has 20 hockey assists on the season last I checked a few days ago, so his connective passing is vastly overly rated.

He's the least efficient offensive rotation player on the team, yet has a ton of touches which overall is a massive, massive drag on the offense.

His touches often take a lot of time if they are in the post, because he has to set up, you usually feed the ball slowly, then move it out, so if it doesn't get you a good look (which by definition it never does because a Vuc post look is awful) it also chews up a ton of time leaving you very little time to do anything else.

On defense:
He can only play drop coverage.

He cannot switch.
He cannot protect the rim.
He can't hedge and get back.
He can't guard multiple positions.

Vuc is really just terrible. He's SO much worse than people think he is and is a massive drag on the team.

[dougthonus]

Now all that said, I know Vuc can be a useful player. We've just set him up to fail. We're asking the least mobile guy on the roster to switch on almost everything on defense. If you're going to do that, you need an athletic shot blocker at the 4. We don't have that. Instead, we're constantly asking him to be the only big guy on the floor whenever he's in. He's solely responsible for manning the paint and chasing down rebounds. That has to be exhausting, and do you know what happens when you're exhausted? You lose your legs and start missing three-pointers. That's what is happening with Vuc.

Here's another thought for you instead:

How would you use Vuc successfully?

He's literally had one good shooting year in his entire career. He's not a good shooter. Any other player with one good shooting year in a 12 year career wouldn't even have this thought following them around, especially since we're now 3 seasons removed from it.

He's a terrible post player. His efficiency there is absolutely awful.

He cannot draw fouls.

His career efficiency would be the worst of any rotation center in the NBA, so it's not a bad year.

There is literally no way to get good offense out of him in this version of the NBA, because he has literally no efficient shot in his arsenal. He just has a huge variety of bad shots. He can get you a bad shot in 10 different ways. That just isn't useful though.

Defensively, there are ways you can hide his weaknesses some, but he is really bad at the most critical defensive position. There are no defensive strengths.

He has one and a half legitimate strengths: Defensive rebounding and passing. Passing gets a half, because he's good "for a center" and the impact here is still minimal and even less valuable because he's not actually a threat to do anything if he doesn't pass and will never generate a double team.

I have no idea what the "right way" to use Vuc is, but the best I can come up with is let him set lots of picks and always roll to the basket, eliminate his three point shot from his game, and dramatically cut out his touches and give him only opportunity baskets a which point he probably provides backup utility.

[HomoSapien]

Now all that said, I know Vuc can be a useful player. We've just set him up to fail. We're asking the least mobile guy on the roster to switch on almost everything on defense. If you're going to do that, you need an athletic shot blocker at the 4. We don't have that. Instead, we're constantly asking him to be the only big guy on the floor whenever he's in. He's solely responsible for manning the paint and chasing down rebounds. That has to be exhausting, and do you know what happens when you're exhausted? You lose your legs and start missing three-pointers. That's what is happening with Vuc.

Here's another thought for you instead:

How would you use Vuc successfully?

He's literally had one good shooting year in his entire career. He's not a good shooter. Any other player with one good shooting year in a 12 year career wouldn't even have this thought following them around, especially since we're now 3 seasons removed from it.

He's a terrible post player. His efficiency there is absolutely awful.

He cannot draw fouls.

His career efficiency would be the worst of any rotation center in the NBA, so it's not a bad year.

There is literally no way to get good offense out of him in this version of the NBA, because he has literally no efficient shot in his arsenal. He just has a huge variety of bad shots. He can get you a bad shot in 10 different ways. That just isn't useful though.

Defensively, there are ways you can hide his weaknesses some, but he is really bad at the most critical defensive position. There are no defensive strengths.

He has one and a half legitimate strengths: Defensive rebounding and passing. Passing gets a half, because he's good "for a center" and the impact here is still minimal and even less valuable because he's not actually a threat to do anything if he doesn't pass and will never generate a double team.

I have no idea what the "right way" to use Vuc is, but the best I can come up with is let him set lots of picks and always roll to the basket, eliminate his three point shot from his game, and dramatically cut out his touches and give him only opportunity baskets a which point he probably provides backup utility.

On a basic level here's how Vuc would become a more useful player:

1. Surround him with lengthy/athletic defenders.
2. Have a skilled passer that gets Vuc the ball on the move. He's much more successful scoring when he catches the ball at an angle and has the defender off-balance. Like you said, he's a below average post-scorer.
3. Stop using him as a volume three-point shooter. Don't completely eliminate it from his game, but instead let him shoot it when he's feeling it rather than forcing the issue.
4. Stop being married to rotation minutes during the 4th when he's not producing. Instead, ride the player having the better game.
5. Stagger his minutes so that he plays a good portion of the time with the bench instead of DeRozan and LaVine when healthy. Vuc is a bum slayer. That's not an insult, because it's actually a useful skill to have against second units. It would also eliminate the mid three's taking turns rather than just playing with a flow.

I think if these 5 things were happening, we'd feel a lot better about him on this roster.

[jnrjr79]

You can spit any advanced stat at me telling me Vuc is better and I'm just going to disagree. Stats lie here.

The reality is Vuc excels at nothing. He's average and below average at virtually everything on the court. At a minimum, Drummond excels at rebounding and is an above average defender. His offense is complete crap, but Vuc isn't good either. I give the nod to Drummond because he has skillsets that are above average.

How much better is Drummond at defense than Vuc? Slightly maybe but still Drummond is also no rim protector or shot blocker or lock down defender.

Drummond has been very good this season off the bench but I also think the Bulls should get a back up who is a better defender. Also have to wonder if the Bulls are even thinking of resigning him this summer. There’s interest around the league for him, I think he gets traded.

Hey we all have our POV's. I think Drummond is an above average defender and rim protector among NBA starters and Vuc may be the worst single defensive C in the league. He's so bad that we don't have our guys defend 3pt shooters because we need 2 guys to buttress Vuc to prevent penetration.

Vuc is horrible for our offense now that he can't make 3pt shots. Teams just sag off him on the perimeter, where at least we have a rebounder in Drummond vs Vuc standing on the perimeter.

Vuc is not a zero on offense. He is a good bumslayer, but that's against the bottom half of C's in the league, but he gets torched by the other half. We're stuck with this dude, but of the mid-3, he should be the one playing with the bench guys.

IMO, the bolded is pretty far off-base. It'd be much better if Vooch could return to form from the 3-point line, but his screening and passing are still huge pluses relative to the team's other options. The ball moves around much better and find the right guy when he is on the floor. The idea that he's hurting the offense relative to Drummond seems kinda nuts.