Ayo Dosunmu has leveled up

[dougthonus]

Point is, it’s kinda nitpicking isn’t it? I don’t know if Ayo is a future Bulls starter or not. But if he is or isn’t it will be because of his overall game and talent level relative to his peers, not because of isolated plays in random games.

He takes nothing off the table. He probably doesn't have any dominant strengths yet. However, he's developed into a solid, reasonable volume 3 point shooter, good and versatile defender, and is at least capable at ball handling, passing, shot creation, and can play multiple positions.

He may not start on every team in the league depending what roster options those teams have, but he is a capable starter already IMO and is in excellent position to more or less help fill in the gaps at virtually anything a team needs from a non-star player.

[nekorajo]

I'm not defending Ayo. I’m just talking about your scouting approach. You have to look at everything.

I'm not attacking Ayo. I'm questioning if he can become more reliable, particularly when the pressure is on. I think any self respecting shooter would be somewhat embarrassed by shooting an uncontested airball. Ayo has more than his fair share of airballs this season alone, and the fact that he still has a great % from 3 is a testament to his growth and toughness.

It's also fair to point out when he shoots multiple uncontested airballs in the same game. Yesterday was not the 1st time I've commented about this. I just hope it's the last, because it can become a mental hurdle. Maybe it already is. Ayo wants to be the starter of the future, so I expect him to learn how to stay focused under internal and external pressure. That's what starters should do. Time will tell if he can.

[DuckIII]

Well sure, but I frankly don’t understand what “air balls” has to do with it. It’s arbitrary. They are all misses. His volume and accuracy from 3 are above starter quality.

[Stratmaster]

I know Ayo has leveled up, but I'm still not convinced that he should be relied on as a starter. He still makes blunders that you don't expect from a pro. Against the Jazz, he airballed open 3s back to back. Who else does that?

Evidently even guys who are shooting 40% from 3 on 5 attempts per 36. Would your analysis be different if he had grazed the rim?

He also fumbled Caruso's pass when they had a 2 on 1 break in clutch time. Also, clutch time in Sacramento, Coby had to chase down a loose ball that Ayo almost threw away.

There's no doubt that Ayo is outplaying his contract, as I predicted, but is he built for the biggest moments?

Yeah, but you can do this with almost every player. I could make a highlight reel of DDR making atrocious plays in the 4th quarter from this year alone (like his pass into the void during a crucial possession in last night’s game because he forced a drive that wasn’t there). And despite that, DDR is one of the best closers in the NBA.

Point is, it’s kinda nitpicking isn’t it? I don’t know if Ayo is a future Bulls starter or not. But if he is or isn’t it will be because of his overall game and talent level relative to his peers, not because of isolated plays in random games.

I am beginning to believe the Bulls have found a serviceable starting PG and his name is Ayo.

Obviously, you have to have a Coby and/or Zach type player at the other Guard because Ayo isn't going to put up 25 a night. But Ayo makes Vuc better and plays defense better than anyone whose last name doesn't begin with the letter C.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

[DuckIII]

I know Ayo has leveled up, but I'm still not convinced that he should be relied on as a starter. He still makes blunders that you don't expect from a pro. Against the Jazz, he airballed open 3s back to back. Who else does that?

Evidently even guys who are shooting 40% from 3 on 5 attempts per 36. Would your analysis be different if he had grazed the rim?

He also fumbled Caruso's pass when they had a 2 on 1 break in clutch time. Also, clutch time in Sacramento, Coby had to chase down a loose ball that Ayo almost threw away.

There's no doubt that Ayo is outplaying his contract, as I predicted, but is he built for the biggest moments?

Yeah, but you can do this with almost every player. I could make a highlight reel of DDR making atrocious plays in the 4th quarter from this year alone (like his pass into the void during a crucial possession in last night’s game because he forced a drive that wasn’t there). And despite that, DDR is one of the best closers in the NBA.

Point is, it’s kinda nitpicking isn’t it? I don’t know if Ayo is a future Bulls starter or not. But if he is or isn’t it will be because of his overall game and talent level relative to his peers, not because of isolated plays in random games.

I am beginning to believe the Bulls have found a serviceable starting PG and his name is Ayo.

Obviously, you have to have a Coby and/or Zach type player at the other Guard because Ayo isn't going to put up 25 a night. But Ayo makes Vuc better and plays defense better than anyone whose last name doesn't begin with the letter C.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

Ideally Ayo becomes a star in his own right and he and Coby keep developing into the clear starting backcourt of a conference contender quality team. Ideally.

More likely, I’d still like to see the Bulls get a playmaking PG and have Coby, Ayo and “Playmaking PG” as a three guard rotation.

I’m not trying to leave Zach out on merit. I just don’t think he’ll ever play for the Bulls again except possibly to try to pump his value early next season at most. So I don’t calculate him as a returning player.

But if he did return, the three of them would not be optimal compliments but it could work.

[Stratmaster]

Evidently even guys who are shooting 40% from 3 on 5 attempts per 36. Would your analysis be different if he had grazed the rim?



Yeah, but you can do this with almost every player. I could make a highlight reel of DDR making atrocious plays in the 4th quarter from this year alone (like his pass into the void during a crucial possession in last night’s game because he forced a drive that wasn’t there). And despite that, DDR is one of the best closers in the NBA.

Point is, it’s kinda nitpicking isn’t it? I don’t know if Ayo is a future Bulls starter or not. But if he is or isn’t it will be because of his overall game and talent level relative to his peers, not because of isolated plays in random games.

I am beginning to believe the Bulls have found a serviceable starting PG and his name is Ayo.

Obviously, you have to have a Coby and/or Zach type player at the other Guard because Ayo isn't going to put up 25 a night. But Ayo makes Vuc better and plays defense better than anyone whose last name doesn't begin with the letter C.

Sent from my SM-S911U using RealGM mobile app

Ideally Ayo becomes a star in his own right and he and Coby keep developing into the clear starting backcourt of a conference contender quality team. Ideally.

More likely, I’d still like to see the Bulls get a playmaking PG and have Coby, Ayo and “Playmaking PG” as a three guard rotation.

I’m not trying to leave Zach out on merit. I just don’t think he’ll ever play for the Bulls again except possibly to try to pump his value early next season at most. So I don’t calculate him as a returning player.

But if he did return, the three of them would not be optimal compliments but it could work.

I agree with all of that. If the Bulls can find a way to get that PG.

[jump]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

[DuckIII]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

[sco]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

It was a great game. Two things hurt Ayo's game these days. Shot blockers and his lack of confidence that stems from getting blocked at the rim or missing a couple of 3's in a row. If he were more aggressive on a regular basis, we'd have a consistently very good player on our hands. As things stand, we have an occasionally very good player.

[MrSparkle]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

It was a great game. Two things hurt Ayo's game these days. Shot blockers and his lack of confidence that stems from getting blocked at the rim or missing a couple of 3's in a row. If he were more aggressive on a regular basis, we'd have a consistently very good player on our hands. As things stand, we have an occasionally very good player.

I’ll add that NOT having a shot blocker (at C or PF) also hurts Ayo. Not sure if he’s more Plumlee, Walker or NBA scrub, but if he’s playable (quick and skilled enough for NBA), somebody like Donovan Clingon would make life easier for our little defensive guards.

Argument to be made that speed and skill (handles, finishing %) are more important than height, in regards to bigs (Bam, Dray before the decline, Gafford-sigh)… but it would be nice to get a fluid big.

Ayo can throw some nice alleys for oops too.

[Dan Z]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

I've said this before, but I never understood why Washington traded for Jordan Poole. The pick they got (2030 protected 1-20) isn't much of an incentive.

I bet if Washington could use that pick to get off of Pooles contract today they'd do it (obviously they'd need to add more).

[dougthonus]

Where’s the love for Ayo after this Wiz game? 34 pts, 9 assts, 3 rebounds, 4-7 3pointers. Damn, that’s a great game.

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

I've said this before, but I never understood why Washington traded for Jordan Poole. The pick they got (2030 protected 1-20) isn't much of an incentive.

I bet if Washington could use that pick to get off of Pooles contract today they'd do it (obviously they'd need to add more).

My guess is they simply believed in Poole and thought the situation with Draymond just put him in a buy low situation and that he could rebound into a good player again.

[Dan Z]

Maybe no one is really surprised that much? Also, as much as I love Ayo and have been pimping him in here his whole Bulls career, Washington’s defense was about the worst I’ve seen all year.

They are so fortunate for all the attention Detroit draws away from the fact that they are by far the worst team in the NBA.

I've said this before, but I never understood why Washington traded for Jordan Poole. The pick they got (2030 protected 1-20) isn't much of an incentive.

I bet if Washington could use that pick to get off of Pooles contract today they'd do it (obviously they'd need to add more).

My guess is they simply believed in Poole and thought the situation with Draymond just put him in a buy low situation and that he could rebound into a good player again.

I think if you do research on him you could see that he's a flawed player, even before the Draymond incident.

If you put his low BB IQ aside for a minute he's suppose to be a great three point shooter, but looking at the numbers...is he? Last year it was .336 and the year before .364 (7.6 attempts). Not bad, but is it that good when you consider that he's on a team where his opponents are focused on Curry, Klay, etc and not him?

Even if I thought he was a buy low situation I'd want a better pick for taking the chance. That pick will most likely end up being one 2nd round pick.

[dougthonus]

I think if you do research on him you could see that he's a flawed player, even before the Draymond incident.

If you put his low BB IQ aside for a minute he's suppose to be a great three point shooter, but looking at the numbers...is he? Last year it was .336 and the year before .364 (7.6 attempts). Not bad, but is it that good when you consider that he's on a team where his opponents are focused on Curry, Klay, etc and not him?

Even if I thought he was a buy low situation I'd want a better pick for taking the chance. That pick will most likely end up being one 2nd round pick.

I'm not saying I think it was a good move, just guessing at their thinking. He was also 23 years old and had shown signs of being able to be a legit scorer. I mean they probably hoped he'd continue to improve and perhaps with more touches would develop further.

Sometimes you take those type of chances, especially when you're a lousy team looking for talent.

[Dan Z]

I think if you do research on him you could see that he's a flawed player, even before the Draymond incident.

If you put his low BB IQ aside for a minute he's suppose to be a great three point shooter, but looking at the numbers...is he? Last year it was .336 and the year before .364 (7.6 attempts). Not bad, but is it that good when you consider that he's on a team where his opponents are focused on Curry, Klay, etc and not him?

Even if I thought he was a buy low situation I'd want a better pick for taking the chance. That pick will most likely end up being one 2nd round pick.

I'm not saying I think it was a good move, just guessing at their thinking. He was also 23 years old and had shown signs of being able to be a legit scorer. I mean they probably hoped he'd continue to improve and perhaps with more touches would develop further.

Sometimes you take those type of chances, especially when you're a lousy team looking for talent.

I think you only do it if there's a good incentive to do so. A late first (which might end up as a 2nd) in 2030 isn't it.

[MrSparkle]

I personally think it’s stupid to close the book on Poole. He’s 24, getting the ego check he needed.

He’s a high-% FT shooter. That usually indicates shooting skill level more than raw 3P%, a noisy stat that highly fluctuates based on team spacing, usage and volume. He also probably needs more structure and pressure, something a tank job can’t provide. Would he really suck this bad if Miami picked him up and whipped him into shape?

He’s obviously a bad contract, but he won a chip as the clear 6th man on that Warriors team… and he played an important role. Klay was very inconsistent. He should be spotting up more, handling less, yelled at (and punched/jk) a bit more.

[Chi town]

https://youtu.be/EPR8NAVsLaQ?si=DMwX3cTqcc9Bdv1X

That 3 ball is getting more and more confident. Ayo taking more off the dribble and behind screens.

[Dan Z]

I personally think it’s stupid to close the book on Poole. He’s 24, getting the ego check he needed.

He’s a high-% FT shooter. That usually indicates shooting skill level more than raw 3P%, a noisy stat that highly fluctuates based on team spacing, usage and volume. He also probably needs more structure and pressure, something a tank job can’t provide. Would he really suck this bad if Miami picked him up and whipped him into shape?

He’s obviously a bad contract, but he won a chip as the clear 6th man on that Warriors team… and he played an important role. Klay was very inconsistent. He should be spotting up more, handling less, yelled at (and punched/jk) a bit more.

Those are a few reasons why I wouldn't want him if I'm a rebuilding team and the only way I'd take him is if the incentive is enough (the 2030 protected 1-30 pick isn't it.).

[jump]

Ok. This is an Ayo thread. I don’t give a shot that the Wiz’ defense sucks. Ayo scored 34 points! And one of you is sloughing it off as it it’s Washington’s fault? Are you a fan of this team or just a troll? Give Ayo some respect and quit being a bitter”fan.”

[League Circles]

Well sure, but I frankly don’t understand what “air balls” has to do with it. It’s arbitrary. They are all misses. His volume and accuracy from 3 are above starter quality.

Air balls are actually good IMO (not joking). All other things being equal, if a guy's misses are more airballs that reveals an issue in consistency which can be improved by training and repetition, whereas consistently missing by tiny margins is more indicative of a guy who has kind of maxed out his ability to refine his shot, and thus reveals more of just a limitation in muscle precision IMO. It's kind of like when you compare two young similar caliber overall players but one guy makes more mistakes than the other. I'd rather have the guy that makes more mistakes because there is more room for improvement. Ironically that's why I wasn't high on re-signing Ayo, I thought he was such a low mistake player that he didn't have a ton of room to improve. Fortunately I'm looking more wrong by the day.

All that said, I still stand by what I said when we extended him - that there probably isn't room for the luxury of having both Caruso and Ayo on the roster given our other inadequacies. I'd like to see Caruso traded this summer which should allow Ayo to blossom that much more. With Zach and/or Lonzo back and Patrick hopefully playing more SF if he's re-signed (even with Demar also back), one of Caruso or Ayo is highly likely to be underutilized, and we can't afford that luxury while we're so thin at the 4/5 spot.