GT Play-In #2: Chicago Bulls @ Miami Heat - Fri 4/19 @ 6:00pm CT - ESPN

[madvillian]

This is the most treadmill team that has every treadmilled.

It's uncanny, on almost exactly 1 year to the day, they lose (again) to Miami to get bounced out of the 8 seed.

Problem is everybody on the roster is a year older, a year closer to FA or retirement and it was a lost year for not only us fans, but for Zach and Pat as well.

I think the first domino to fall will be if BD is fired. I don't think he'll resign, but you never know. If they fire him, hopefull it at least signals we are going to move off the mid 3.

[umfan83]

Billy should be fired after this. I think the players have given it their all on the court. I feel the players got abandoned by Billy due to his lack in game coaching. Sometime you need the coach to set things straight on the court. I rarely see this from Billy.

But he won’t. There is no accountability with this franchise. They succeeded this year in their eyes by almost getting to the playoffs and have injuries as a built in excuse to justify why everyone is coming back.

I just really hope DeMar is just saying the right things when it comes to being open to an extension. It would crush the team to lose him but if he bails and goes to a winner but it will force the Bulls to actually do something different. Plus DeMar deserves to be a 6th man somewhere and contribute to a winner

Derozan can start for plenty of good teams. He isn’t the problem. The is just like Zach he is not a 1st option. Best as 3rd option.

Yeah sorry if my post was worded poorly, I wasn’t suggesting he was a problem. He’s fine, I was saying that at this stage of his career he deserves to play on a contender where he can be a 3rd option or whatever rather than have to be the focal point of a 39 win lottery team that is going nowhere. The Heat were throwing guys on him like crazy tonight and it completely shut down the Bulls offense. On a team with actual star players beside him he would be lethal as no one is going double and triple DeMar to leave guys like Durant and Booker wide open (just as an example).

So in my mind, while I don’t blame anyone for going after the money, I think it would do him and the Bulls both a disservice if he actually re-signed. He deserves to be playing for championships similar to the last stage of Ray Allen’s career (different skill sets though), and the Bulls need to be forced to do something different because the FO has shown utter complacency with keeping the status quo. Losing DeMar would force them into action.

[League Circles]

I'm goad it's all over finally. Perfect for us cause we got the mild excitement of the play in including a feel good win at home on Wednesday but then the proper wakeup call tonight, and especially ensuring that our draft pick odds don't get unnecessarily worse by a meaningless Boston series.

We need to fire Billy, trade Zach, Vuc, Carter and Caruso, re-sign Demar, Patrick, and possibly Drummond depending on what centers we have after the draft and trades of Vuc and Zach.

[NZB2323]

?

The man has 11 titles. He is obviously at minimum a top 3 coach of all time.

People have knocked him from going from prime Jordan/Pippen to prime Shaq/Kobe.

He also won 2 championships with Kobe and Pau Gasol, won 55 games with the 94 Bulls, and 45 wins with the 06 Lakers.

[kodo]

This is the most treadmill team that has every treadmilled.

There are 3 EC treadmill teams, Miami-Chicago-Atlanta. We blew out Atlanta and got blown out by Miami.
So we're even treadmilling the treadmill.

[Muzbar]

Continuity.

[weneeda2guard]

At this point if we don't recognize it's the coach I don't know what can be said. A good coach gets more out of this team, been saying that for years.

Billy isn't the best coach in the league, and you can make a solid argument he is the bottom tier of coach rankings currently in the league, however, this isn't Billy's fault. In fact, I could argue that this may have been his best coaching season with the Bulls yet, when you factor in how poorly this team has been constructed, how devastated this team has been without key players, he kept the team engaged and playing hard for the most part this season.

I'm not going to define Billy's season on this one game, because considering all the circumstances, this team probably played above it's expectations, with Zach and Pat being out for most of the season, with key free agents not performing and other injuries to key role players spattered throughout the season.

I'd say the bulk of the blame needs to go to the front office, and if we are fortunate enough to get that change, I'm sure a change to the head coach would swiftly follow.

We just lost to a team missing butler and rozier and we still talking roster construction? Lol was it a problem with roster construction a day or so ago when we were wiping the floor with the hawks? This heat team is not some well constructed roster lol they are worst in pace on the season than us and equally as bad a 3pt shooting team as us. There was simply 1 glaring difference between us and them, they came out prepared with a game plan offensively and Defensively, and we didn't. We made no half time adjustments, we didn't even call a time out when it was getting out of hand. Look at what thibs is doing in New York. I'm sorry this team has talent.

If you want to say it needs more to be a contender I agree there but we are not so poorly constructed that we should be looking that out classed and unprepared vs a depleted heat team. What happened to us is what we used to do to team when we had thibs. Thibs regardless of who was on the floor kept us locked in and prepared every night. We are up and down, night and day because we are not prepared and have horrible game plans.

Please tell me what was the strategy for tonight? What did we attempt to take away? How did we defend the guys we knew would have to step up with no Jimmy? What was the half time adjustments? We haven't added a mega star but we have added different role players and it still comes out looking the same. Why? Because of the coaching. No we are not contenders but no one is going to convince me that a great coach wouldn't have pieces like vuc, derozan, coby, ayo, Caruso, Drummond, green and Craig looming better than what we looked like tonight.

[WindyCityBorn]

But he won’t. There is no accountability with this franchise. They succeeded this year in their eyes by almost getting to the playoffs and have injuries as a built in excuse to justify why everyone is coming back.

I just really hope DeMar is just saying the right things when it comes to being open to an extension. It would crush the team to lose him but if he bails and goes to a winner but it will force the Bulls to actually do something different. Plus DeMar deserves to be a 6th man somewhere and contribute to a winner

Derozan can start for plenty of good teams. He isn’t the problem. The is just like Zach he is not a 1st option. Best as 3rd option.

Yeah sorry if my post was worded poorly, I wasn’t suggesting he was a problem. He’s fine, I was saying that at this stage of his career he deserves to play on a contender where he can be a 3rd option or whatever rather than have to be the focal point of a 39 win lottery team that is going nowhere. The Heat were throwing guys on him like crazy tonight and it completely shut down the Bulls offense. On a team with actual star players beside him he would be lethal as no one is going double and triple DeMar to leave guys like Durant and Booker wide open (just as an example).

So in my mind, while I don’t blame anyone for going after the money, I think it would do him and the Bulls both a disservice if he actually re-signed. He deserves to be playing for championships similar to the last stage of Ray Allen’s career (different skill sets though), and the Bulls need to be forced to do something different because the FO has shown utter complacency with keeping the status quo. Losing DeMar would force them into action.

The problem for DeMar is that no contender likely has the cap space to offer him anything remotely comparable to what Chicago will. And he would be foolish to not cash in on his last big contract.

Most likely scenario is he signs with the Bulls for a big 3 year deal and asks out after next season’s repeat disappointment. There is zero reason to take less money upfront when you can just get traded later. It’s the established way to do it.

[Dan Z]

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[Dan Z]

Derozan can start for plenty of good teams. He isn’t the problem. The is just like Zach he is not a 1st option. Best as 3rd option.

Yeah sorry if my post was worded poorly, I wasn’t suggesting he was a problem. He’s fine, I was saying that at this stage of his career he deserves to play on a contender where he can be a 3rd option or whatever rather than have to be the focal point of a 39 win lottery team that is going nowhere. The Heat were throwing guys on him like crazy tonight and it completely shut down the Bulls offense. On a team with actual star players beside him he would be lethal as no one is going double and triple DeMar to leave guys like Durant and Booker wide open (just as an example).

So in my mind, while I don’t blame anyone for going after the money, I think it would do him and the Bulls both a disservice if he actually re-signed. He deserves to be playing for championships similar to the last stage of Ray Allen’s career (different skill sets though), and the Bulls need to be forced to do something different because the FO has shown utter complacency with keeping the status quo. Losing DeMar would force them into action.

The problem for DeMar is that no contender likely has the cap space to offer him anything remotely comparable to what Chicago will. And he would be foolish to not cash in on his last big contract.

Most likely scenario is he signs with the Bulls for a big 3 year deal and asks out after next season’s repeat disappointment. There is zero reason to take less money upfront when you can just get traded later. It’s the established way to do it.

I agree, but if that's the case the Bulls should let him go.

[greenwing]

I'm goad it's all over finally. Perfect for us cause we got the mild excitement of the play in including a feel good win at home on Wednesday but then the proper wakeup call tonight, and especially ensuring that our draft pick odds don't get unnecessarily worse by a meaningless Boston series.

We need to fire Billy, trade Zach, Vuc, Carter and Caruso, re-sign Demar, Patrick, and possibly Drummond depending on what centers we have after the draft and trades of Vuc and Zach.

This. Donovan is a good NBA coach but not a great one. If Zach wants out we should move on from him given the emergence of Coby and Ayo as legit NBA guards. Carter doesn't really have a role on this team beyond an insurance guard. Patrick Williams should be given a Coby/Ayo-like short-term deal - I can't imagine any team signing him for a big amount. Vucevic is still a useful center but he needs to take less 3PA's. I think he could be a useful chip in matching salaries for a larger trade but is unlikely to fetch much as a standalone piece. Drummond really should be resigned to a decent contract if he's willing to return here.

[Dan Z]

This is the most treadmill team that has every treadmilled.

It's uncanny, on almost exactly 1 year to the day, they lose (again) to Miami to get bounced out of the 8 seed.

Problem is everybody on the roster is a year older, a year closer to FA or retirement and it was a lost year for not only us fans, but for Zach and Pat as well.

I think the first domino to fall will be if BD is fired. I don't think he'll resign, but you never know. If they fire him, hopefull it at least signals we are going to move off the mid 3.

Billy signed a contract extension. I'd be surprised if he got fired.


Hopefully they move in a new direction with the roster, but I doubt they'll do that. At some point AK needs to be accountable for losing seasons.

[MrSparkle]

Well- the Bulls fan in me wanted a miracle run, but the reality is even an encouraging win in Miami would’ve been a 4-0 sweep in Boston.

Gimme that lotto pick, a new coach, new roster and new management.

Dunno how there’s any positive takeaway to aim for continuity with this club. Coby and Ayo need a lot of work to become playoff players. You can’t have one good game and then lay an egg.

[Rose2Boozer]

AK is on the clock.

[umfan83]

This is the most treadmill team that has every treadmilled.

There are 3 EC treadmill teams, Miami-Chicago-Atlanta. We blew out Atlanta and got blown out by Miami.
So we're even treadmilling the treadmill.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the definition of a treadmill team but I'm not sure how the Heat fit that definition. They've made the playoffs 13 of the last 16 years including each of the last 5. And in those last 5 they've gone to the Finals twice and EC Finals another time (so 3 of the 4 playoffs they've completed in this 5 year streak have resulted in at least 2 playoff series victories). They have as many playoff series wins over the last 2 seasons as the Bulls have had since the dynasty ended in 1998. They've had a couple of mediocre (for them) years where they had to win the play-in to advance, but in those 2 years they averaged more wins (45) than the Bulls have had in any one season over the last 9 years except the 46 win Bulls team 3 years ago. The Bulls don't belong in a comparison with the Heat, they are in a completely different class that the Bulls in almost any way you can compare them historically except overall championships.

[umfan83]

Well- the Bulls fan in me wanted a miracle run, but the reality is even an encouraging win in Miami would’ve been a 4-0 sweep in Boston.

Gimme that lotto pick, a new coach, new roster and new management.

Dunno how there’s any positive takeaway to aim for continuity with this club. Coby and Ayo need a lot of work to become playoff players. You can’t have one good game and then lay an egg.

Other than the lotto pick, I'll believe the rest of those things will happen when I see it happen.

[mj234eva]

Dammit Zach..

[MrSparkle]

This is the most treadmill team that has every treadmilled.

There are 3 EC treadmill teams, Miami-Chicago-Atlanta. We blew out Atlanta and got blown out by Miami.
So we're even treadmilling the treadmill.

TBF, a team that made G7 of the ECFs under 11 months ago doesn’t count as a treadmill team.

We and the Hawks are exclusively millin’. Although I’d further argue that were lotto’in at this point (as in, for the foreseeable future).

Had this been an exciting, close loss with Jimmy, I could see AK using the “but injuries” excuse. But losing in a blow out with your crew (since the last 4 months), seeing Billy out coached drastically, the roster out worked by a short-handed and “less talented” group…

I think ownership may take a hard line “no” to the idea of continuity. 4 April busts in a row, with no promise in sight.

Coby and Ayo had nice jumps, but you don’t build rosters around guards who can’t average 20 PPG on a bad night.

[WindyCityBorn]

Dammit Zach..

So much for addition by subtraction. We got a slightly worse final result without Zach. Our situation will not be changed by moving on from any one key player.

[Red8911]

I'm goad it's all over finally. Perfect for us cause we got the mild excitement of the play in including a feel good win at home on Wednesday but then the proper wakeup call tonight, and especially ensuring that our draft pick odds don't get unnecessarily worse by a meaningless Boston series.

We need to fire Billy, trade Zach, Vuc, Carter and Caruso, re-sign Demar, Patrick, and possibly Drummond depending on what centers we have after the draft and trades of Vuc and Zach.

Which pick do they have now ? and what are the odds to move up ?