Potential Zach Trade Partners? Playoff Edition.

[DuckIII]

I'm starting to think the postseason might increase the number of potential trade partners for, and the value of, a Zach trade. Just to get it started for discussion, which will change based on series' outcomes.

1. Atlanta: Hard to imagine them not pursuing a major shake up, and the only way to do that is by trading Young. Murray is better for contention level team building, and it appears they finally figured it out. And despite their defensive issues, Zach is a much better fit with Murray and though not much of a defender he's definitely an upgrade over Trae on that end. Plus Zach (plus more) for Trae sounds like the type of "front page news" deal AK will feel pressured (in his own mind) to make and is entirely consistent with his MO.

2. Sixers: I have always felt this was the team that should be gunning for Zach. To me he's a terrific off ball scorer playing third fiddle to Maxey and Embiid and would provide things they clearly lack. If they go down to the Knicks while struggling to score, perhaps something here heats up.

3. Warriors: They need to move on, and they won't find a better partner for Curry than Zach given the presumed price. Maybe they get desperate and included Kuminga and picks to go after an even bigger fish, but if they are looking for something involving less assets then Zach should get a real look.

4. Lakers: Hard to imagine them not looking to add a major talent if they get whooped by Denver.

Others? I have entered the offseason thinking Zach won't have trade value until we rehabilitate him for a month or two next year. But I'm starting to think postseason results might raise his value without the Bulls doing anything at all.

[HoopsterJones]

LaVine has a 15% trade kicker by the way. Which makes his contract worse (unless he waives the trade kicker).

[League Circles]

Good list to start brainstorming.

I heavily doubt we trade Zach for Trae Young. Zach is better and fits better, which is hilarious.

IIRC the sixers have cap space, so they wouldn't need to necessarily send us back stuff we don't want. Not sure what they can offer that we would want though.

Warriors are a definite possibility, though it's hard for me to understand the appeal of Kuminga, though I haven't watched him much. I see a larger deal, likely involving Draymond and/or Chris Paul and/or Vuc and maybe others as more likely.

I'm still intrigued by the possibility of a Zach for Ben Simmons deal, hopefully with more coming back to us, but that's mostly due to cap management.

[sco]

I already put my neck out in the trade thread about Zach for Trae, so I won't start that here.

The Warriors are an angle I'd go "all in" on and try to nab Kuminga as he is probably the player with the highest potential we could possibly net in a deal (and that's unlikely, but possible), but it would likely require us to take all of their bad contracts (green and/or wiggins) and add in Caruso, and I'd gladly do it. He's a below average 3pt shooter, but if he were a great one, we'd have no shot.

Maybe the Lakers aren't as high on Reaves as they were a year ago, but again, I think we'd need to throw in AC and take back all of LA's crap contracts.

[jnrjr79]

I'm starting to think the postseason might increase the number of potential trade partners for, and the value of, a Zach trade. Just to get it started for discussion, which will change based on series' outcomes.

1. Atlanta: Hard to imagine them not pursuing a major shake up, and the only way to do that is by trading Young. Murray is better for contention level team building, and it appears they finally figured it out. And despite their defensive issues, Zach is a much better fit with Murray and though not much of a defender he's definitely an upgrade over Trae on that end. Plus Zach (plus more) for Trae sounds like the type of "front page news" deal AK will feel pressured (in his own mind) to make and is entirely consistent with his MO.

The prospect of this terrifies me, precisely because it seems so on-brand for AK.

2. Sixers: I have always felt this was the team that should be gunning for Zach. To me he's a terrific off ball scorer playing third fiddle to Maxey and Embiid and would provide things they clearly lack. If they go down to the Knicks while struggling to score, perhaps something here heats up.

The Sixers are the team that should want him most, and IMO it's not close. I think the biggest reason the Sixers need to do this is that Embiid is effectively a part-time player. You have to construct your roster to withstand his absences. We saw how much worse they were without Embiid this season and their resultant seeding. Zach is a guy who could immediately handle whatever scoring burden you needed to put on him when Embiid is out, keeping things afloat. And they certainly could use a better third option generally, even when Embiid is around.

3. Warriors: They need to move on, and they won't find a better partner for Curry than Zach given the presumed price. Maybe they get desperate and included Kuminga and picks to go after an even bigger fish, but if they are looking for something involving less assets then Zach should get a real look.

IMO, this is the one that should appeal most to the Bulls, if they can get Kuminga, but I'd be fairly surprised if Kuminga would be made available for Zach.

4. Lakers: Hard to imagine them not looking to add a major talent if they get whooped by Denver.

I don't love what they have to trade, but a trade with the Lakers would be better than nothing.

Others? I have entered the offseason thinking Zach won't have trade value until we rehabilitate him for a month or two next year. But I'm starting to think postseason results might raise his value without the Bulls doing anything at all.

With the Bulls heading to luxury tax land if DeMar is re-signed at anything near the rumored numbers (particularly if Pat is back), I think you have to look at what teams would be able to avoid salary matching and have some cap space. Perhaps Detroit rekindles some interest. I suppose Charlotte is another contender here. As small-market, non-destination franchises, does either bite to get a somewhat big name like LaVine?

[jnrjr79]

LaVine has a 15% trade kicker by the way. Which makes his contract worse (unless he waives the trade kicker).

FWIW, it appears the trade kicker will have no effect here. Because Zach is on a max deal, he can't make more than the max under the current salary cap, so the best it can do is function as a "gap-fill" between whether his raises have actually kept up with the increase in the cap since the year he singed his deal. The trade kicker kicks in at the time of the trade and doesn't continue to "gap-fill" afterward, so you'd just be looking at whether the cap in the 2 years since he signed his deal has gone up more than the 8% or whatever his raises are in the contract. The cap for next year is actually going down by about $1 million, and Sportrac projects that Zach's salary will actually be slightly more than 30% of the cap next year, so there won't be any gap to fill and the kicker will not increase his salary.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/chicago-bulls/zach-lavine-15365/#:~:text=Zach%20LaVine%20signed%20a%205,dead%20cap%20value%20of%20%2443%2C031%2C940.

[SalmonsSuperfan]

he'll be traded to philly for a couple picks + cam payne. get it done, garpax!

[Peelboy]

I've had similar thoughts about Atlanta, that seems to be the clear most likely opportunity. My issue is outside of hating Trae the player, the one position you need least is G with Coby/Ayo both young, improving, and on good contracts. But maybe Bulls can route Trae elsewhere for picks and/or young players. Would Detroit take him as a star to pair with Cade and send some youngsters? If AK ends up with a team of Trae/Coby/Ayo and Vuc and lets DDR go...... . (Essentially swaping DDR and Zach for Trae is exactly the kind of catastrophically stupid idea I imagine this FO is drooling over.)

Would the Kings try to make a move up by adding Zach? They went after him a while back and have some younger players who might need contracts soon in Monk/Murray.

Not sure how the 76ers make a deal work, even though they'd seemingly be interested. Probably have to take back Harris, but they don't have a ton of talent you're drooling over to get (Embiid/Maxey excepted). Harris+picks? Does that move the needle for them?

TO m, snowing GSW that Zach is a solution of some sort and that in that system with Kerr, Dray, Curry he'll up his game is the wet dream. Some combo of Podz/TJD/Kuminga would be a coup.

[ChiefILL53]

When I saw the title of this thread, I immediately thought Lakers and prolly the Sixers. I went to sleep with the Lakers being up 20 only to wake up and hear they had a 5 minute scoring drought and lost the game on a buzzer beater. They're definitely gonna need scoring and might have space to just straight up absorb Zach depending on Bron leaving to go sign with whoever drafts Bronny.

I think the Sixers are gonna lose to the knicks cuz Embiid is hurt (like he's always been), but Zach would prolly pair nice with him and Maxey, but I also saw somewhere Philly is interested in bringing back Tobias Harris so Zach might not be an actual option.

I want no parts of anything from Atl involving Young. Only thing I want from them is Murray

[Michael Jackson]

Orlando could use Zach

[kodo]

I don't think it will be someone as expensive as Trae. You cannot keep all 3 of Derozan, Patrick, and Lavine's equivalent salary (eg, Trae Young) and stay under lux tax.

- KC said Derozan is $40M or "high 30s", I used $38M.
- Patrick wanted $27M but didn't have a breakout year, I lowered this to $20M which is in line with Deandre Hunter, another top 5 pick with many of the same strengths, weaknesses, and #4 pick status
- Lonzo will not be medically retired unless a doctor stops him from playing (eg Bosh's blood clots). If he wants to play and just is absolutely terrible, that is not medical retirement. He is not a danger to himself if he plays and shoots 1-10 and can't defend a chair, he's still counts under cap. He's also untradeable because another team can't have insurance pay for his contract if he can't make it back on court, only the Bulls have that benefit.



We can only get back about $22M from the Zach trade and stay under lux threshold. Although this heavily depends on the Patrick extension, but with AK publically saying we want to resign him sounds like all the leverage is in Patrick's camp now.

The Bulls are in a situation where we are going to bring back the same team as last year, but because we have to pay Derozan & Patrick much more money, we can't add anything significant even with Zach's contract gone.

If Patrick makes closer to Coby's contract, you get more space to sign someone in the high 20's which opens up the possibilities much more like Julius Randle, but since we can't take Lavine's full salary back some salary has to go to a third team with cap space. In the end, I think Zach is going to be mostly a financial trade.

[Dan Z]

I'm starting to think the postseason might increase the number of potential trade partners for, and the value of, a Zach trade. Just to get it started for discussion, which will change based on series' outcomes.

1. Atlanta: Hard to imagine them not pursuing a major shake up, and the only way to do that is by trading Young. Murray is better for contention level team building, and it appears they finally figured it out. And despite their defensive issues, Zach is a much better fit with Murray and though not much of a defender he's definitely an upgrade over Trae on that end. Plus Zach (plus more) for Trae sounds like the type of "front page news" deal AK will feel pressured (in his own mind) to make and is entirely consistent with his MO.

The prospect of this terrifies me, precisely because it seems so on-brand for AK.

2. Sixers: I have always felt this was the team that should be gunning for Zach. To me he's a terrific off ball scorer playing third fiddle to Maxey and Embiid and would provide things they clearly lack. If they go down to the Knicks while struggling to score, perhaps something here heats up.

The Sixers are the team that should want him most, and IMO it's not close. I think the biggest reason the Sixers need to do this is that Embiid is effectively a part-time player. You have to construct your roster to withstand his absences. We saw how much worse they were without Embiid this season and their resultant seeding. Zach is a guy who could immediately handle whatever scoring burden you needed to put on him when Embiid is out, keeping things afloat. And they certainly could use a better third option generally, even when Embiid is around.

3. Warriors: They need to move on, and they won't find a better partner for Curry than Zach given the presumed price. Maybe they get desperate and included Kuminga and picks to go after an even bigger fish, but if they are looking for something involving less assets then Zach should get a real look.

IMO, this is the one that should appeal most to the Bulls, if they can get Kuminga, but I'd be fairly surprised if Kuminga would be made available for Zach.

4. Lakers: Hard to imagine them not looking to add a major talent if they get whooped by Denver.

I don't love what they have to trade, but a trade with the Lakers would be better than nothing.

Others? I have entered the offseason thinking Zach won't have trade value until we rehabilitate him for a month or two next year. But I'm starting to think postseason results might raise his value without the Bulls doing anything at all.

With the Bulls heading to luxury tax land if DeMar is re-signed at anything near the rumored numbers (particularly if Pat is back), I think you have to look at what teams would be able to avoid salary matching and have some cap space. Perhaps Detroit rekindles some interest. I suppose Charlotte is another contender here. As small-market, non-destination franchises, does either bite to get a somewhat big name like LaVine?

I think the Sixers want to try for Paul George and maybe even a few other players before they consider Zach. If PG and other ideas fall through (there's a good chance PG re-signs with LA) then I could see them inquiring about Zach. The problem is...what would they offer the books? Cap Space? Picks? I don't think they'd offer much.

As for Trae Young...he's a good player, but doesn't make sense for this roster. I also think Atlanta would want more than just Zach for him.

[jnrjr79]

I think the Sixers want to try for Paul George and maybe even a few other players before they consider Zach. If PG and other ideas fall through (there's a good chance PG re-signs with LA) then I could see them inquiring about Zach. The problem is...what would they offer the books? Cap Space? Picks? I don't think they'd offer much.

As for Trae Young...he's a good player, but doesn't make sense for this roster. I also think Atlanta would want more than just Zach for him.

The Sixers could have something like $60 million in cap space, so yeah, they theoretically could trade for Zach without having to send outbound salary, getting the Bulls out of the tax.

The Sixers basically won't have anyone that has to stay under contract besides Embiid and Maxey will be an RFA, whom they will surely extend/match.

Due to the Harden trade, the Sixers have some draft picks to offer - including their own and some picks owed to them, though it doesn't seem like any of them is likely to be a high first rounder.

So, for the Sixers, you could basically pick any expiring player from their roster that you would be interested in offering a new deal to make it a S+T and the Sixers could throw in some draft capital. Whatever they offer, it would mostly be a salary dump. Maybe the Bulls want Buddy Hield for some bench shooting? Mo Bamba as a developmental Drummond replacement?

[Donkedave]

I don't think it will be someone as expensive as Trae. You cannot keep all 3 of Derozan, Patrick, and Lavine's equivalent salary (eg, Trae Young) and stay under lux tax.

- KC said Derozan is $40M or "high 30s", I used $38M.
- Patrick wanted $27M but didn't have a breakout year, I lowered this to $20M which is in line with Deandre Hunter, another top 5 pick with many of the same strengths, weaknesses, and #4 pick status
- Lonzo will not be medically retired unless a doctor stops him from playing (eg Bosh's blood clots). If he wants to play and just is absolutely terrible, that is not medical retirement. He is not a danger to himself if he plays and shoots 1-10 and can't defend a chair, he's still counts under cap. He's also untradeable because another team can't have insurance pay for his contract if he can't make it back on court, only the Bulls have that benefit.



We can only get back about $22M from the Zach trade and stay under lux threshold. Although this heavily depends on the Patrick extension, but with AK publically saying we want to resign him sounds like all the leverage is in Patrick's camp now.

The Bulls are in a situation where we are going to bring back the same team as last year, but because we have to pay Derozan & Patrick much more money, we can't add anything significant even with Zach's contract gone.

If Patrick makes closer to Coby's contract, you get more space to sign someone in the high 20's which opens up the possibilities much more like Julius Randle, but since we can't take Lavine's full salary back some salary has to go to a third team with cap space. In the end, I think Zach is going to be mostly a financial trade.

Add 4.3 for pick 11 also

[dougthonus]

Zach to Sacramento for Barnes + Huerter seems like a common one.

[dougthonus]

1. Atlanta:

I'd rather keep Zach than get Trae TBH. Though if Zach is like "get me out of here no matter what" then maybe I'd change my mind.

Sixers

Agree, feels like a good fit except potentially the money. Would probably mostly just be a salary dump which makes me wonder whether we'd do it. Trae at least gives you a name coming back, but because they can absorb at least some salary, it would solve a lot of our potential luxury tax concerns.

Warriors

Might be a bit complicated depending what you take back and what they do with Klay. They can't aggregate salaries in a trade and go above the 2nd Apron, so assuming we aren't getting Klay back (which doesn't seem like a GS thing to do), then they'd need to aggregate salaries and send us Wiggins + Paul for Zach + someone else and then fit Klay and all other moves under the 2nd apron.

Not saying it's impossible, but feels a bit unlikely to me.

Lakers

Maybe? I wonder if the Lakers think LaVine gives them anything D'Angelo Russell doesn't at 2/3rds the cost.

Others? I have entered the offseason thinking Zach won't have trade value until we rehabilitate him for a month or two next year. But I'm starting to think postseason results might raise his value without the Bulls doing anything at all.

I posted separately, but Barnes + Huerter is one I've seen floating around a lot as an idea. If the Kings think they need more firepower and like Zach then this move makes a lot of sense for both sides.

[League Circles]

It's mind boggling to see proposed Zach trades that solve zero problems for us.

If the returning player isn't a pretty obvious upgrade at the 4/5 positions or a high level prospect, I don't see the point in trading Zach at all.

[jnrjr79]

It's mind boggling to see proposed Zach trades that solve zero problems for us.

If the returning player isn't a pretty obvious upgrade at the 4/5 positions or a high level prospect, I don't see the point in trading Zach at all.

From everything that's publicly available in terms of reporting, it does not sound like either side has any interest in Zach returning, so I assume he's out of here if there's a market for him. The only way I see him sticking around is if he has to demonstrate he's healthy before anyone will trade for his salary.

IMO, the ship has sailed on the "well, what if we keep Zach after all" scenarios.

[jnrjr79]

I posted separately, but Barnes + Huerter is one I've seen floating around a lot as an idea. If the Kings think they need more firepower and like Zach then this move makes a lot of sense for both sides.

I can see the Bulls doing this because it saves aa decent chunk of salary, but positionally it's a bit awkward if Coby, Ayo, and DeMar are around.

Has Barnes reached that point of "old 6'8'' SF is now a 4 and not a 3?" Hell, even if he hasn't, I suppose Billy will happily play him there.

[League Circles]

It's mind boggling to see proposed Zach trades that solve zero problems for us.

If the returning player isn't a pretty obvious upgrade at the 4/5 positions or a high level prospect, I don't see the point in trading Zach at all.

From everything that's publicly available in terms of reporting, it does not sound like either side has any interest in Zach returning, so I assume he's out of here if there's a market for him. The only way I see him sticking around is if he has to demonstrate he's healthy before anyone will trade for his salary.

IMO, the ship has sailed on the "well, what if we keep Zach after all" scenarios.

You're probably right, but I don't really care what Zach or AK want. If there isn't a trade to improve us we shouldn't do it. Now that improvement can either be now or in the future, but I wouldn't dump Zach just to formalize a divorce.