Prospects and trade discussion

Neddy · Post #1061 » by **Neddy** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:14 am

getting this deal rather early, I don't think we are done making deals. we are getting a pitcher. if we are gonna go over the Lux Tax line, what difference does it make if we go for broke this year, the consequences are the same once this season is over with.

Ranma · Post #1062 » by **Ranma** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:25 am

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With the Dodgers reportedly on the verge of acquiring Manny Machado, here's what president of baseball operations Andrew Friedman told me recently about balancing prudence with chasing stars: "I think the No. 1 thing we're solving for is winning baseball games and trying to put ourselves in position to be as good as we can in the current year, while maintaining that ability as far as we see out. That's the primary driver in everything that we do. That plays out in different ways at different periods of time. One thing I think I appreciate most about this job is the passion that our fans have for the Dodgers. That's something that struck me right away and I continue to encounter, whether it's at the ballpark or at Starbucks or wherever. And we feel a pretty fee responsibility to do everything we can to bring a championship back to Los Angeles, and to put ourselves in position to contend for a championship perennially. With that, we have to balance some short term and long term."

Ranma · Post #1063 » by **Ranma** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:27 am

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Neddy · Post #1064 » by **Neddy** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 9:08 pm

what do you guys think? move CT3 back to CF and have him platoon with Joc? this will free up Max to play second.

the problem I see is that if we go into the playoffs with Max and Manny in the middle of the infield, can we handle two net negative defensive middle infielders?

move CT3 to 2B, then we can keep Joc/**** platoon at CF which has been as productive (****) or better ( Joc) but we lose Max from everyday lineup card.

Quake Griffin · Post #1065 » by **Quake Griffin** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:43 pm

Hell no at putting Max at 2nd.

Bellinger is hitting that OF.
CT3 to 2nd.

No problem with Yusniel + filler for the rental either.

Quake Griffin · Post #1066 » by **Quake Griffin** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:48 pm

Now we need to trade for deGrom if we are in win now mode.

Neddy · Post #1067 » by **Neddy** » Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:54 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Hell no at putting Max at 2nd.

Bellinger is hitting that OF.
CT3 to 2nd.

No problem with Yusniel + filler for the rental either.

there are conflicting info regarding who's the other 4 prospects, if May and Robinson are not a part of it, sweet.

Ranma · Post #1068 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:02 am

Neddy wrote:there are conflicting info regarding who's the other 4 prospects, if May and Robinson are not a part of it, sweet.

I'm posting details in the dedicated thread now that the trade is official. Neither May or Robinson was included in the deal.

Neddy · Post #1069 » by **Neddy** » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:22 pm

everything seems to point towards Clayton's end of his prime, or at least his peak.

out of curiosity, looked up his pitch velocity and separation between pitch types. found out unlike his prime years where his fastballs clocked in average of mid-90s with low 80's mph slider, giving him anywhere from 12 mph to 7 mph difference between them, all through out this season so far he is managing through with just 3 mph separation. his fastballs are averaging 90.7, and his sider 87.5. that is just 3.2 mph separation between them. more alarmingly, he is using these two pitches more than 80% of the time, with his fastball being used only 42% of the time, which is his all time low.

what this tells me, is a guy who is a power pitcher that is losing his "stuff" and does not have enough in his arsenal to morph into a finesse pitcher. we can always give a benefit of the doubt that Clay has been hurt this year, and maybe his mechanics aren't there because of his physical ailments. if so, is this safe of a bet to gamble 40 a year salary at 6-7 years into his late 30s? typically power pitchers tend to last longer than finesse types but there have been plenty of power pitchers who declined as soon as running into that 30-wall.

granted, these particular set of information came without distinction between his sweeping slider of his early days to tighter, cutter like slider he throws in there more often nowadays, but the dramatic decline in velocity separation can be the reason of his last 2 season's sudden increase of HRs/9.

Ranma · Post #1070 » by **Ranma** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:30 pm

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Ranma · Post #1071 » by **Ranma** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:28 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Now we need to trade for deGrom if we are in win now mode.

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Ranma · Post #1072 » by **Ranma** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:59 pm

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Ranma · Post #1073 » by **Ranma** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:55 pm

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Quake Griffin · Post #1074 » by **Quake Griffin** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:35 pm

If Puig goes out, do we have any plus OF defenders?

It makes sense if the FO doesn't want to sign a 28 year old Puig to a new deal that takes him into his 30s.

We most definitely need an elite pitcher backing up Jansen or even, given Jansens's struggles this year, co-closing with him.
The bullpen ace theory. We'd just have 2 of them.

Quake Griffin · Post #1075 » by **Quake Griffin** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:38 pm

Ranma wrote:
Quake Griffin wrote:Now we need to trade for deGrom if we are in win now mode.

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Not buying this.

The Mets suck as an organization but they cannot be so inept as to not have began scouting these other farms since the beginning of the season in anticipation of this. Even if you factor in their hot start, they've been terrible for months now. How could they have gone this long without scouting and then decided one week before the deadline they it would be too difficult to do.

Plus the rumors were around months ago.
I like Olney but I don't completely buy this.

Quake Griffin · Post #1076 » by **Quake Griffin** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:42 pm

Ranma wrote:

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Anybody think this is a discussion Ned Colletti would be having with his pitcher?

Happy with my front office.
Happy to see them help develop Ross into an actual starter much to everyone's surprise.

Ranma · Post #1077 » by **Ranma** » Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:56 pm

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Ranma · Post #1078 » by **Ranma** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 12:43 am

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Quake Griffin · Post #1079 » by **Quake Griffin** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:03 am

Neddy wrote:everything seems to point towards Clayton's end of his prime, or at least his peak.

out of curiosity, looked up his pitch velocity and separation between pitch types. found out unlike his prime years where his fastballs clocked in average of mid-90s with low 80's mph slider, giving him anywhere from 12 mph to 7 mph difference between them, all through out this season so far he is managing through with just 3 mph separation. his fastballs are averaging 90.7, and his sider 87.5. that is just 3.2 mph separation between them. more alarmingly, he is using these two pitches more than 80% of the time, with his fastball being used only 42% of the time, which is his all time low.

what this tells me, is a guy who is a power pitcher that is losing his "stuff" and does not have enough in his arsenal to morph into a finesse pitcher. we can always give a benefit of the doubt that Clay has been hurt this year, and maybe his mechanics aren't there because of his physical ailments. if so, is this safe of a bet to gamble 40 a year salary at 6-7 years into his late 30s? typically power pitchers tend to last longer than finesse types but there have been plenty of power pitchers who declined as soon as running into that 30-wall.

granted, these particular set of information came without distinction between his sweeping slider of his early days to tighter, cutter like slider he throws in there more often nowadays, but the dramatic decline in velocity separation can be the reason of his last 2 season's sudden increase of HRs/9.

Straight fastball.
Slider/ cutter.
Curve.

If he had movement on his fastball and a change, I might feel differently.
But it's looking bad....regardless of if you've grown to hate his playoff garbage like I have or if you love him.

It is not pretty.

btw, longest outing this year is 7.0 IP. I've always remarked how he hasn't got into the 8th inning of a postseason start...but now he isn't getting there in regular season starts. The Kershaw we all know will throw a few CGs every year.

I can't justify a big pay day for him and if I can't justify a big pay day for him....the question is...what kind of pay day can I justify for him?

Quake Griffin · Post #1080 » by **Quake Griffin** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:09 am

Yankees get Zach Britton....smfh