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[toooskies]

I'd much rather get O.G. back in a S&T than a package centered around IQ in a S&T. Frankly, moving Mitchell in season was always going to prove difficult.

Did the S&T rules get relaxed in the new CBA or is OG's matching value stuck around his current contract plus 20%?

You're thinking of extensions. I'm pretty sure the only limitation surrounding S&Ts is the 4 year limit and smaller raises.

I'm thinking of the Sexton situation.

[Iwasawitness]

That Knicks trade shuts down their ability to make a Mitchell trade until the off-season, which diminishes any return we could get in-season from elsewhere.

I'd much rather get O.G. back in a S&T than a package centered around IQ in a S&T. Frankly, moving Mitchell in season was always going to prove difficult.

Will have to wait and see what the cap ramifications are, but I wonder if this sets them up nicely to add Mitchell via free-agency or ends up precluding it.

Paying OG the max is still a tricky decision for whoever cares to do it unless there's a another cap spike in the near future.

This move by the Knicks should theoretically make it easier to acquire Mitchell in the off-season if Cleveland does in fact trade him and NY still wants him. OG is a perfect fit in Cleveland’s system and would make them a defensive juggernaut. My only concern is whether or not NY would still want to make such a move, but OG decides he wants out and so does Mitchell, Cleveland needs to be all over this opportunity.

[JujitsuFlip]

That Knicks trade shuts down their ability to make a Mitchell trade until the off-season, which diminishes any return we could get in-season from elsewhere.

I'd much rather get O.G. back in a S&T than a package centered around IQ in a S&T. Frankly, moving Mitchell in season was always going to prove difficult.

Will have to wait and see what the cap ramifications are, but I wonder if this sets them up nicely to add Mitchell via free-agency or ends up precluding it.

Paying OG the max is still a tricky decision for whoever cares to do it unless there's a another cap spike in the near future.

Pretty sure the new CBA has cap smoothing as part of the negotiations.

OG would be an awesome piece to get in return for Mitchell, just with how often he's injured, i would hate to overpay him.

I doubt OG would agree to come to the Cavs anyways, tbh.

[JonFromVA]

I'd much rather get O.G. back in a S&T than a package centered around IQ in a S&T. Frankly, moving Mitchell in season was always going to prove difficult.

Will have to wait and see what the cap ramifications are, but I wonder if this sets them up nicely to add Mitchell via free-agency or ends up precluding it.

Paying OG the max is still a tricky decision for whoever cares to do it unless there's a another cap spike in the near future.

This move by the Knicks should theoretically make it easier to acquire Mitchell in the off-season if Cleveland does in fact trade him and NY still wants him. OG is a perfect fit in Cleveland’s system and would make them a defensive juggernaut. My only concern is whether or not NY would still want to make such a move, but OG decides he wants out and so does Mitchell, Cleveland needs to be all over this opportunity.

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

[jbk1234]

Will have to wait and see what the cap ramifications are, but I wonder if this sets them up nicely to add Mitchell via free-agency or ends up precluding it.

Paying OG the max is still a tricky decision for whoever cares to do it unless there's a another cap spike in the near future.

This move by the Knicks should theoretically make it easier to acquire Mitchell in the off-season if Cleveland does in fact trade him and NY still wants him. OG is a perfect fit in Cleveland’s system and would make them a defensive juggernaut. My only concern is whether or not NY would still want to make such a move, but OG decides he wants out and so does Mitchell, Cleveland needs to be all over this opportunity.

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

[JujitsuFlip]

Will have to wait and see what the cap ramifications are, but I wonder if this sets them up nicely to add Mitchell via free-agency or ends up precluding it.

Paying OG the max is still a tricky decision for whoever cares to do it unless there's a another cap spike in the near future.

This move by the Knicks should theoretically make it easier to acquire Mitchell in the off-season if Cleveland does in fact trade him and NY still wants him. OG is a perfect fit in Cleveland’s system and would make them a defensive juggernaut. My only concern is whether or not NY would still want to make such a move, but OG decides he wants out and so does Mitchell, Cleveland needs to be all over this opportunity.

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

Jon, you already know if Mitchell walks for nothing the Cavs only have $15 million in cap space, if that.

Also, Cavs are still getting trapped at half court even with Mitchell, look at the Knicks series lol

[JonFromVA]

This move by the Knicks should theoretically make it easier to acquire Mitchell in the off-season if Cleveland does in fact trade him and NY still wants him. OG is a perfect fit in Cleveland’s system and would make them a defensive juggernaut. My only concern is whether or not NY would still want to make such a move, but OG decides he wants out and so does Mitchell, Cleveland needs to be all over this opportunity.

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

[JujitsuFlip]

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Like LeBron James Sr? ; )

[JonFromVA]

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Like LeBron James Sr? ; )

I was hoping for an MLE deal there when we draft Bronny, but I suppose he'd still be worth it.

Cool story ... the Cavs value was supposed to tank when he walked out in 2010, and it did for a bit, but they (and everyone else) appreciated maybe 10x since Gilbert bought the team.

Maybe that's mostly based on gambling being accepted, but they're just getting started figuring out how to milk that cash cow.

[toooskies]

I'd much rather get O.G. back in a S&T than a package centered around IQ in a S&T. Frankly, moving Mitchell in season was always going to prove difficult.

Did the S&T rules get relaxed in the new CBA or is OG's matching value stuck around his current contract plus 20%?

You're thinking of extensions. I'm pretty sure the only limitation surrounding S&Ts is the 4 year limit and smaller raises.

I was thinking BYC rules: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/06/hoops-rumors-glossary-base-year-compensation-2.html#:~:text=A%20relic%20of%20past%20agreements,facilitate%20salary%2Dmatching%20in%20trades.

For matching purposes OG's cap figure going out would be his 2023-24 salary and not his new contract, making it impossible to do a straight 1-for-1 deal for Mitchell (in terms of salary, of course there would be picks going to the Cavs as well.)

[JonFromVA]

Did the S&T rules get relaxed in the new CBA or is OG's matching value stuck around his current contract plus 20%?

You're thinking of extensions. I'm pretty sure the only limitation surrounding S&Ts is the 4 year limit and smaller raises.

I was thinking BYC rules: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/06/hoops-rumors-glossary-base-year-compensation-2.html#:~:text=A%20relic%20of%20past%20agreements,facilitate%20salary%2Dmatching%20in%20trades.

For matching purposes OG's cap figure going out would be his 2023-24 salary and not his new contract, making it impossible to do a straight 1-for-1 deal for Mitchell (in terms of salary, of course there would be picks going to the Cavs as well.)

I think there's a rule where a S&T can hard cap you, which if we qualified wouldn't be the end of the world, but it complicates things quite a bit.

[JujitsuFlip]

I think there's a rule where a S&T can hard cap you, which if we qualified wouldn't be the end of the world, but it complicates things quite a bit.

Cavs are hard capped right now due to the Strus S&T but they still would be bc they used the BAE on TJ, and they still would be bc they paid Niang over a certain threshold of the MLE.

Being hard capped really isn't super restrictive, unless it's big contracts tied up in a couple guys bc filling out the roster becomes difficult.

Cavs have so many tiny contracts and guys in the pipeline, it's fine.

[Iwasawitness]

OG is certainly better than nothing, but I wouldn't call him a perfect fit on a max deal. We brought in Mitchell in part because we saw the need to have a secondary playmaker when opponents had a guy who could make it hard for Garland to dribble or simply trapped him.

Not to mention we could just keep Isaac around and let him continue to develop while investing Mitchell's salary cap space somewhere else. He's had a rough month, but are we sure Max Strus shouldn't be coming off the bench for a high level contender?

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

[toooskies]

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

He literally went 0/10 and lost the Heat game 1 of the Finals.

Of course he also pretty much won them a play-in game by himself.

Such is the life of a streaky shooter.

[Iwasawitness]

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

He literally went 0/10 and lost the Heat game 1 of the Finals.

Of course he also pretty much won them a play-in game by himself.

Such is the life of a streaky shooter.

I said he wouldn't shoot you out of a playoff series... I never said he wouldn't cost you a game.

[JujitsuFlip]

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

He literally went 0/10 and lost the Heat game 1 of the Finals.

Of course he also pretty much won them a play-in game by himself.

Such is the life of a streaky shooter.

At least he's been to the Finals and the ECF the season before, as a starter both times, might i add.

The only other players on the Cavs to play in the Finals are obviously Tristan, then Jones played 1:37 in the 2019 Finals, and Merrill played 1:18 in the 2021 Finals.

[jbk1234]

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

He literally went 0/10 and lost the Heat game 1 of the Finals.

Of course he also pretty much won them a play-in game by himself.

Such is the life of a streaky shooter.

I'll deal with the Kevin Love had a bad Finals performance after any player on the roster helps get us there.

[JujitsuFlip]

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

He literally went 0/10 and lost the Heat game 1 of the Finals.

Of course he also pretty much won them a play-in game by himself.

Such is the life of a streaky shooter.

I'll deal with the Kevin Love had a bad Finals performance after any player on the roster helps get us there.

Right? I don't understand this dumping on Strus' deep playoff performances, like at least the guy has been there.

Cavs paid a premium for a guy who has never been outta the 2nd round.

[JonFromVA]

With Garland and/or Mitchell out, Strus has been getting a lot more attention from opposing defenses. He's absolutely good enough to start on a good team. He started for the Heat last year and played a pretty important role in getting them to the Finals. If I see Okoro do anything when matched up against good defenders, or consistently put together good shooting performances, I'd consider changing it up. I've seen enough flashes followed by a return to the mean with Okoro that it's going to take a lot more for me to believe he's the better option.

Strus was pretty awful in the finals, could be a connection. I wouldn't want to gamble he's the answer at SG with OG and Garland, at least at this point in time. Not to mention, but Max was supposed to be a backup in Miami.

If we're going to pay our SF max money, I'd much prefer someone who will earn it.

Strus has admittedly had a really awful stretch of games from a shooting standpoint as of late and I’m starting to see what everyone was talking about in regards to him being a streaky shooter (after being near 40% shooting from three, he’s currently back down to 34% due to an awful month of shooting in December).

With that said, I still really like the idea of having him be the starting two guard next to Garland if we ever do move on from Mitchell. He’s still a threat from outside, but he’s got other benefits as well. He’s been a very good defender since coming to Cleveland (didn’t see him enough to Miami to know if he was always this good), and he’s a pretty decent playmaker as well. And he’s shown that there’s more to his offense than just three point shooting. There’s better SG options out there and I totally get that, but for the most part I think he does enough good things to make him a positive player for us. I think he has to stop falling back on that three point shot so much when it’s not falling but I don’t think he’s someone that can shoot you out of a playoff series.

We won’t know what will happen with OG into the end of this season, so all we can do is speculate. But I’m going to make a bold prediction and say that if the cavaliers were to in fact get OG from Mitchell, and the rest of the starting lineup stays the same, Cleveland would be poised for a deep playoff run.

Sure, Max can start and he certainly brings more than shooting, what I was pushing back on was trying to replace what Mitchell brings with OG and Strus.

If Mobley looked ready to jump to #1/#2 option and plsymaking hub it could make sense.

[toooskies]

It's a team game. Mitchell's Utah teams lost because they had solvable defenses more than anything.