Game 2: Thunder @ Cavs 10/27/2023

[afarmenian]

Team is just going nowhere with JB...... thanks for wasting the rebuild Cavs let's enjoy another 45 wins and first round thumping. I can't get excited for games anymore its a constant drag. We got Mike Brown hero ball without the defense

[toooskies]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

[JujitsuFlip]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

Same thing for 5 years straight, it's absurd to still co-sign a 7 man rotation on night 2 of the NBA season.

[toooskies]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

Same thing for 5 years straight, it's absurd to still co-sign a 7 man rotation on night 2 of the NBA season.

He played nine guys.

[JujitsuFlip]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

Same thing for 5 years straight, it's absurd to still co-sign a 7 man rotation on night 2 of the NBA season.

He played nine guys.

Lol ain't no one getting in a rhythm with less than 10 minutes played.

You understand this is night 1 of a back to back and this is a 3 games in 4 night situation, correct?

I literally can't wait until this guy gets fired and if his dad wasn't in the front office, i assume he woulda already been gone.

Edit: ok and the team that beat us played 11 guys, so.......

[toooskies]

Same thing for 5 years straight, it's absurd to still co-sign a 7 man rotation on night 2 of the NBA season.

He played nine guys.

Lol ain't no one getting in a rhythm with less than 10 minutes played.

You understand this is night 1 of a back to back and this is a 3 games in 4 night situation, correct?

I literally can't wait until this guy gets fired and if his dad wasn't in the front office, i assume he woulda already been gone.

Edit: ok and the team that beat played 11 guys, so.......

Earlier today there were mentions that JBB had a hot seat. If that's true, and he has to coach every game to win, he's going to have to use his best players as much as possible. We have no chance of winning this game if Mitchell plays fewer minutes. (We probably do if Strus plays less, but everybody still loves him.)

[jbk1234]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

Same thing for 5 years straight, it's absurd to still co-sign a 7 man rotation on night 2 of the NBA season.

He played nine guys.

I mean after Okoro took the elbow to the head and got called for being semi-concious on the ground, I wanted TT in there just not for the purpose of winning the game.

All kidding aside, I really do feel like other teams are able to keep pushing the boundaries with how physical they are with us and I'm willing to lose a game, or two, to let them know it's not entirely up to whatever idiot officials the league assigns to our games.

[ijspeelman]

The JBB sky is falling junk is ridiculous. Who did you want out there, Merrill? Tristan Thompson on Giddey or Jalen Williams?

I mean, Strus was bad in all the ways I'm worried about. But with Garland out, there was no other option but to run the Mitchell & Strus show.

I’m definitely not on the JBB hate train (yet). Still want to see more guys get chances especially on a day with no Garland and Allen and game the next day. I would like some minutes for Merrill, IMo, Porter, and possibly Tristan from time to time. This seemed like a good game to do it.

Strus shot poorly, but played well outside of it imo. I loved the off-ball movement and defense. Would love to see him get a few ball handling opportunities as well. He tried one drive this game and it didn’t go well, but I like at least seeing it lol.

I actually don’t think our sets were half bad. The offense wasn’t working either way with shooters missing. Defense looked great despite OKC’s hot shooting.

After hearing Garland was out, I wasn’t expecting much from this game. What hurt was their comeback and ultimate falling. It wasn’t even necessarily a crazy choke, but OKC capitalizing on every slight opportunity in the last two minutes. Can’t give them the opportunity.

[ijspeelman]

Also Mobley’s offense is concerning me early. Im not ready to call it, but this seemed like a game for Mobley to take some of the load and it just didn’t happen.

He’s not attempting threes which is fine, but his closer jumpers are all over the place. We are two games in so let me see a larger sample before I’m officially concerned lol

[JujitsuFlip]

He played nine guys.

Lol ain't no one getting in a rhythm with less than 10 minutes played.

You understand this is night 1 of a back to back and this is a 3 games in 4 night situation, correct?

I literally can't wait until this guy gets fired and if his dad wasn't in the front office, i assume he woulda already been gone.

Edit: ok and the team that beat played 11 guys, so.......

Earlier today there were mentions that JBB had a hot seat. If that's true, and he has to coach every game to win, he's going to have to use his best players as much as possible. We have no chance of winning this game if Mitchell plays fewer minutes. (We probably do if Strus plays less, but everybody still loves him.)

Toooskies, he's had this mindset for this now being the 3rd season in a row. It is not beneficial to the team.

What is the best case scenario of him riding stars 40+ minutes a night to squeeze out a couple extra regular season wins?

For him personally, he keeps his job. From a selfish perspective, i get. But when we step back and look at the grand scheme of things, this in all reality is probably Mitchell's final season in the wine&gold. That being the case we need to make the most of it, given the high price tag of assets he cost.

Game 2 of the NBA season is the perfect time to establish deeo rotations and work an actual offense to get Mobley involved.

Trying to hero ball Mitchell to a bunch of regular season wins is what we did last year, it doesn't work in the playoffs.

[toooskies]

Lol ain't no one getting in a rhythm with less than 10 minutes played.

You understand this is night 1 of a back to back and this is a 3 games in 4 night situation, correct?

I literally can't wait until this guy gets fired and if his dad wasn't in the front office, i assume he woulda already been gone.

Edit: ok and the team that beat played 11 guys, so.......

Earlier today there were mentions that JBB had a hot seat. If that's true, and he has to coach every game to win, he's going to have to use his best players as much as possible. We have no chance of winning this game if Mitchell plays fewer minutes. (We probably do if Strus plays less, but everybody still loves him.)

Toooskies, he's had this mindset for this now being the 3rd season in a row. It is not beneficial to the team.

What is the best case scenario of him riding stars 40+ minutes a night to squeeze out a couple extra regular season wins?

For him personally, he keeps his job. From a selfish perspective, i get. But when we step back and look at the grand scheme of things, this in all reality is probably Mitchell's final season in the wine&gold. That being the case we need to make the most of it, given the high price tag of assets he cost.

Game 2 of the NBA season is the perfect time to establish deeo rotations and work an actual offense to get Mobley involved.

Trying to hero ball Mitchell to a bunch of regular season wins is what we did last year, it doesn't work in the playoffs.

Yes. You need to take the perspective that JBB shouldn't be on the hot seat right now even if you'd have fired him in the off-season. The GM or POBO needs to tell him that we need to have guys ready for the postseason and he shouldn't be coaching to squeeze the margins of every game.

But as competitive as the NBA is, it remains to be seen whether the deep bench is good enough talent-wise to win games when getting more minutes. It actually remains to be seen if our new lineup additions actually fix our issues from last year.

So pushing to win early and getting a lead in the standings before experimenting is fine with me. Experiment when you can afford to drop a few games. Or when you're favored to win a game because you're not missing two of your four best players.

As for Mitchell-- I think he's still getting better and past results don't dictate his ceiling.

[Iwasawitness]

A lot to take in here.

First off, Cleveland having a ten point lead that late in the game in the first place was surprising to me. No Garland and no Allen, I fully expected this to be an easy win for OKC, who I’m high on as a team. Mitchell had other ideas, and had himself a hell of a game. I may not like us trading for him, but I can’t deny he had some crazy carry jobs last season and so far he’s been doing that here. I’m normally mad about blowing a late lead like that, but in this case, I’m happy we were even competitive to begin with.

I personally don’t have a problem with how JBB ran his rotation last night. There was never any point where the game was out of reach for Cleveland and Bickerstaff understood this. You definitely want to help establish other players, but at the end of the day, your main goal is to still win. I don’t think Mitchell or any of the other players would have accepted going down and giving up. He played nine guys, were missing two starters, I don’t know what you guys are expecting. You’re asking him to do something that is downright illogical.

The better team won. It’s silly to put this on Bickerstaff.

If there’s any concern for me right now, it’s Niang. I haven’t been thrilled with his shot selection or performance in these first two games. I expect him to find his spots better and hit his shots soon, but right now he’s not doing too good.

Someone mentioned that Mobleys offensive performances in these first two games have been disappointing. I would just like to remind you guys that in the first game, Mobley was up against Claxton… in the second one he was up against Chet, who had seven blocks on us. I’m not disappointed at all by his performances and if anything, what we’re seeing is encouraging.

Cleveland is obviously missing Allen. And last night they really missed Garland. I imagine that when those two are back, things will go a lot better for the team. I’ve been pretty happy with what I’ve seen so far and I’m thrilled to be 1-1 despite both games missing key rotation players and starters. Way too early in the season for me to be concerned about anything, but I’m very happy that we’ve been competitive.

With that said, if Garland returns tonight, I expect another close game. But if we lose this one too, I’m not going to be too concerned about that either. For now, let’s wait until everyone’s at least healthy, see what Bickerstaff does then, and go from there.

[JujitsuFlip]

Earlier today there were mentions that JBB had a hot seat. If that's true, and he has to coach every game to win, he's going to have to use his best players as much as possible. We have no chance of winning this game if Mitchell plays fewer minutes. (We probably do if Strus plays less, but everybody still loves him.)

Toooskies, he's had this mindset for this now being the 3rd season in a row. It is not beneficial to the team.

What is the best case scenario of him riding stars 40+ minutes a night to squeeze out a couple extra regular season wins?

For him personally, he keeps his job. From a selfish perspective, i get. But when we step back and look at the grand scheme of things, this in all reality is probably Mitchell's final season in the wine&gold. That being the case we need to make the most of it, given the high price tag of assets he cost.

Game 2 of the NBA season is the perfect time to establish deeo rotations and work an actual offense to get Mobley involved.

Trying to hero ball Mitchell to a bunch of regular season wins is what we did last year, it doesn't work in the playoffs.

Yes. You need to take the perspective that JBB shouldn't be on the hot seat right now even if you'd have fired him in the off-season. The GM or POBO needs to tell him that we need to have guys ready for the postseason and he shouldn't be coaching to squeeze the margins of every game.

But as competitive as the NBA is, it remains to be seen whether the deep bench is good enough talent-wise to win games when getting more minutes. It actually remains to be seen if our new lineup additions actually fix our issues from last year.

So pushing to win early and getting a lead in the standings before experimenting is fine with me. Experiment when you can afford to drop a few games. Or when you're favored to win a game because you're not missing two of your four best players.

As for Mitchell-- I think he's still getting better and past results don't dictate his ceiling.

It is his mindset weather it is reality or not. There's no way this guy has been on the hot seat that long and still has a job, especially after having underwhelming back to back post season showings.

Well, we have never known what our bench can or can't do under JB bc the guy refuses to play them.

It's October, we can afford to drop as many games as is needed to keep our guys fresh and actually develop a bench for when we know Mitchell will go cold and we get bounced early in April for a 3rd consecutive season, which i guess some people around here are content with.

[ijspeelman]

A lot to take in here.

First off, Cleveland having a ten point lead that late in the game in the first place was surprising to me. No Garland and no Allen, I fully expected this to be an easy win for OKC, who I’m high on as a team. Mitchell had other ideas, and had himself a hell of a game. I may not like us trading for him, but I can’t deny he had some crazy carry jobs last season and so far he’s been doing that here. I’m normally mad about blowing a late lead like that, but I’m this case, I’m happy we were even competitive to begin with.

I personally don’t have a problem with how JBB ran his rotation last night. There was never any point where the game was out of reach for Cleveland and Bickerstaff understood this. You definitely want to help establish other players, but at the end of the day, your main goal is to still win. I don’t think Mitchell or any of the other players would have accepted going down and giving up. He played nine guys, were missing two starters, I don’t know what you guys are expecting. You’re asking him to do something that is downright illogical.

The better team won. It’s silly to put this on Bickerstaff.

If there’s any concern for me right now, it’s Niang. I haven’t been thrilled with his shot selection or performance in these first two games. I expect him to find his spots better and hit his shots soon, but right now he’s not doing too good.

Someone mentioned that Mobleys offensive performances in these first two games have been disappointing. I would just like to remind you guys that in the first game, Mobley was up against Claxton… in the second one he was up against Chet, who had seven blocks on us. I’m not disappointed at all by his performances and if anything, what we’re seeing is encouraging.

Cleveland is obviously missing Allen. And last night they really missed Garland. I imagine that when those two are back, things will go a lot better for the team. I’ve been pretty happy with what I’ve seen so far and I’m thrilled to be 1-1 despite both games missing key rotation players and starters. Way too early in the season for me to be concerned about anything, but I’m very happy that we’ve been competitive.

With that said, if Garland returns tonight, I expect another close game. But if we lose this one too, I’m not going to be too concerned about that either. For now, let’s wait until everyone’s at least healthy, see what Bickerstaff does then, and go from there.

Basically in full agreement with this.

I may have the person you were referencing with the “Mobley disappointing offense”. I’m not ready to be fully disappointed, but wanted him to be able to show he can attack those guys.

Without Garland and Allen, OKC is probably the better team and once we were down 10 in the second, I doubted we’d come back. Then we did, and then we lost so it was still disappointing. Buuut, I’m not ready to throw anyone under the bus.

[Iwasawitness]

A lot to take in here.

First off, Cleveland having a ten point lead that late in the game in the first place was surprising to me. No Garland and no Allen, I fully expected this to be an easy win for OKC, who I’m high on as a team. Mitchell had other ideas, and had himself a hell of a game. I may not like us trading for him, but I can’t deny he had some crazy carry jobs last season and so far he’s been doing that here. I’m normally mad about blowing a late lead like that, but I’m this case, I’m happy we were even competitive to begin with.

I personally don’t have a problem with how JBB ran his rotation last night. There was never any point where the game was out of reach for Cleveland and Bickerstaff understood this. You definitely want to help establish other players, but at the end of the day, your main goal is to still win. I don’t think Mitchell or any of the other players would have accepted going down and giving up. He played nine guys, were missing two starters, I don’t know what you guys are expecting. You’re asking him to do something that is downright illogical.

The better team won. It’s silly to put this on Bickerstaff.

If there’s any concern for me right now, it’s Niang. I haven’t been thrilled with his shot selection or performance in these first two games. I expect him to find his spots better and hit his shots soon, but right now he’s not doing too good.

Someone mentioned that Mobleys offensive performances in these first two games have been disappointing. I would just like to remind you guys that in the first game, Mobley was up against Claxton… in the second one he was up against Chet, who had seven blocks on us. I’m not disappointed at all by his performances and if anything, what we’re seeing is encouraging.

Cleveland is obviously missing Allen. And last night they really missed Garland. I imagine that when those two are back, things will go a lot better for the team. I’ve been pretty happy with what I’ve seen so far and I’m thrilled to be 1-1 despite both games missing key rotation players and starters. Way too early in the season for me to be concerned about anything, but I’m very happy that we’ve been competitive.

With that said, if Garland returns tonight, I expect another close game. But if we lose this one too, I’m not going to be too concerned about that either. For now, let’s wait until everyone’s at least healthy, see what Bickerstaff does then, and go from there.

Basically in full agreement with this.

I may have the person you were referencing with the “Mobley disappointing offense”. I’m not ready to be fully disappointed, but wanted him to be able to show he can attack those guys.

Without Garland and Allen, OKC is probably the better team and once we were down 10 in the second, I doubted we’d come back. Then we did, and then we lost so it was still disappointing. Buuut, I’m not ready to throw anyone under the bus.

I saw Mobley attack both of those guys multiple times throughout the games. Obviously Mobley was picking his spots and that's what you want someone to do to begin with. I'm happy that Mobley is taking a cautious approach with it. It's a sign that he's a really smart player and that's going to help him out in the long run.

[toooskies]

A lot to take in here.

First off, Cleveland having a ten point lead that late in the game in the first place was surprising to me. No Garland and no Allen, I fully expected this to be an easy win for OKC, who I’m high on as a team. Mitchell had other ideas, and had himself a hell of a game. I may not like us trading for him, but I can’t deny he had some crazy carry jobs last season and so far he’s been doing that here. I’m normally mad about blowing a late lead like that, but I’m this case, I’m happy we were even competitive to begin with.

I personally don’t have a problem with how JBB ran his rotation last night. There was never any point where the game was out of reach for Cleveland and Bickerstaff understood this. You definitely want to help establish other players, but at the end of the day, your main goal is to still win. I don’t think Mitchell or any of the other players would have accepted going down and giving up. He played nine guys, were missing two starters, I don’t know what you guys are expecting. You’re asking him to do something that is downright illogical.

The better team won. It’s silly to put this on Bickerstaff.

If there’s any concern for me right now, it’s Niang. I haven’t been thrilled with his shot selection or performance in these first two games. I expect him to find his spots better and hit his shots soon, but right now he’s not doing too good.

Someone mentioned that Mobleys offensive performances in these first two games have been disappointing. I would just like to remind you guys that in the first game, Mobley was up against Claxton… in the second one he was up against Chet, who had seven blocks on us. I’m not disappointed at all by his performances and if anything, what we’re seeing is encouraging.

Cleveland is obviously missing Allen. And last night they really missed Garland. I imagine that when those two are back, things will go a lot better for the team. I’ve been pretty happy with what I’ve seen so far and I’m thrilled to be 1-1 despite both games missing key rotation players and starters. Way too early in the season for me to be concerned about anything, but I’m very happy that we’ve been competitive.

With that said, if Garland returns tonight, I expect another close game. But if we lose this one too, I’m not going to be too concerned about that either. For now, let’s wait until everyone’s at least healthy, see what Bickerstaff does then, and go from there.

Basically in full agreement with this.

I may have the person you were referencing with the “Mobley disappointing offense”. I’m not ready to be fully disappointed, but wanted him to be able to show he can attack those guys.

Without Garland and Allen, OKC is probably the better team and once we were down 10 in the second, I doubted we’d come back. Then we did, and then we lost so it was still disappointing. Buuut, I’m not ready to throw anyone under the bus.

I saw Mobley attack both of those guys multiple times throughout the games. Obviously Mobley was picking his spots and that's what you want someone to do to begin with. I'm happy that Mobley is taking a cautious approach with it. It's a sign that he's a really smart player and that's going to help him out in the long run.

For me it's less about Mobley and more about the offense in general. We aren't working the ball to Mobley all that much, and particularly not running offense through him. He was great on the boards, though.

[jbk1234]

Basically in full agreement with this.

I may have the person you were referencing with the “Mobley disappointing offense”. I’m not ready to be fully disappointed, but wanted him to be able to show he can attack those guys.

Without Garland and Allen, OKC is probably the better team and once we were down 10 in the second, I doubted we’d come back. Then we did, and then we lost so it was still disappointing. Buuut, I’m not ready to throw anyone under the bus.

I saw Mobley attack both of those guys multiple times throughout the games. Obviously Mobley was picking his spots and that's what you want someone to do to begin with. I'm happy that Mobley is taking a cautious approach with it. It's a sign that he's a really smart player and that's going to help him out in the long run.

For me it's less about Mobley and more about the offense in general. We aren't working the ball to Mobley all that much, and particularly not running offense through him. He was great on the boards, though.

He's matched up against Claxton and Chet the first two games and apparently didn't work on any midrange game last offseason. I'm not running a stupid offense against good teams for the purposes of *development. * The Cavs aren't presently rebuilding. The time for development is the off season, or against bad teams where we can burn possessions, if you want a bigger role in the offense.

Come back after summer comfortable shooting a 12-15 foot shot that pulls the better shot blockers away from the rim and you can get 20 touches a game.

[JujitsuFlip]

I saw Mobley attack both of those guys multiple times throughout the games. Obviously Mobley was picking his spots and that's what you want someone to do to begin with. I'm happy that Mobley is taking a cautious approach with it. It's a sign that he's a really smart player and that's going to help him out in the long run.

For me it's less about Mobley and more about the offense in general. We aren't working the ball to Mobley all that much, and particularly not running offense through him. He was great on the boards, though.

He's matched up against Claxton and Chet the first two games and apparently didn't work on any midrange game last offseason. I'm not running a stupid offense against good teams for the purposes of *development. * The Cavs aren't presently rebuilding. The time for development is the off season, or against bad teams where we can burn possessions, if you want a bigger role in the offense.

Come back after summer comfortable shooting a 12-15 foot shot that pulls the better shot blockers away from the rim and you can get 20 touches a game.

I know you're against the idea but even if he refuses to work on a middie, at least Mobley can learn to take and make 3s.

[jbk1234]

For me it's less about Mobley and more about the offense in general. We aren't working the ball to Mobley all that much, and particularly not running offense through him. He was great on the boards, though.

He's matched up against Claxton and Chet the first two games and apparently didn't work on any midrange game last offseason. I'm not running a stupid offense against good teams for the purposes of *development. * The Cavs aren't presently rebuilding. The time for development is the off season, or against bad teams where we can burn possessions, if you want a bigger role in the offense.

Come back after summer comfortable shooting a 12-15 foot shot that pulls the better shot blockers away from the rim and you can get 20 touches a game.

I know you're against the idea but even if he refuses to work on a middie, at least Mobley can learn to take and make 3s.

Yeah, putting a guy like Mobley out at 3 point line is dumb. Opposing defenses will live with that all day. You think Claxton or Chet are following him out there? Maybe you get a wing out there on him, but I suspect everyone helps off him and you lose all the value that comes with having him closer to the basket in terms of rebounding.

[JujitsuFlip]

He's matched up against Claxton and Chet the first two games and apparently didn't work on any midrange game last offseason. I'm not running a stupid offense against good teams for the purposes of *development. * The Cavs aren't presently rebuilding. The time for development is the off season, or against bad teams where we can burn possessions, if you want a bigger role in the offense.

Come back after summer comfortable shooting a 12-15 foot shot that pulls the better shot blockers away from the rim and you can get 20 touches a game.

I know you're against the idea but even if he refuses to work on a middie, at least Mobley can learn to take and make 3s.

Yeah, putting a guy like Mobley out at 3 point line is dumb. Opposing defenses will live with that all day. You think Claxton or Chet are following him out there? Maybe you get a wing out there on him, but I suspect everyone helps off him and you lose all the value that comes with having him closer to the basket in terms of rebounding.

I mean if he could get to Marc Gasol or Brook Lopez level, they would have no choice but to go out there, i think it's a fantastic idea.

If those 2 guys can do it who were thought of has traditional back to the basket bigs I don't see why not.

If Mobley will never attempt 3s with any kind of respectable volume or efficiency then he will have to be paired with a Gasol, Lopez, or Ibaka type guy for the entirety of his career, if he wants to find any level of success.