RS 23/24 - Mavs @ Spurs (Tuesd., 8:30PMEST)

[tleikheen]

The last game against Denver it was a game of the Mavs playing their own bully ball and shooting awful from 3's and this game Luka having one of his worst shooting games of his career and still the Mavs won both games .

Call this game ugly if you want but I call them beautiful games to watch because the Mavs in front of our eyes are Winning games in ways we havent seen this year and as they are fighting for playoff position.

And at the center of all this is the is the 2 headed Center Gafford & Lively who have changed how the Mavs are playing as a team. They put pressure in the middle of defenses and Luka and Kyrie are learning how to play off of that.

Game planning for Luka and Kyrie just got harder.

[ChipotleWest]

Yeah I'd like to see the Mavs get in that 4 or 5 spot (preferably 4) and face the Clippers again. Luka is in his prime now and he actually has a good team around him. Not that it would be easy.

[41Dirk41]

PJ and Dante are elite role players.
They fight every possessions, sometimes they lack on shooting but it's ok.

Maxi at the C again. It's embarassing. We lose rebounds and rim protector for 1 triple in 22minutes.OMG.

[ChipotleWest]

PJ and Dante are elite role players.
They fight every possessions, sometimes they lack on shooting but it's ok.

Maxi at the C again. It's embarassing. We lose rebounds and rim protector for 1 triple in 22minutes.OMG.

He's still getting credit for defense he played when he was younger. We have better defenders now he shouldn't be getting more than 10 min. per game. Sadly he's here two more years after this barring a trade but the Mavs love him.

[dirkules_41]

Powell > Maxi

Somehow he's +27 for the game, so he did something right.

Why is why it's mostly a useless stat. He was 2 for 2 from the field so it wasn't offense, he had a total of 1 rebound, he wasn't locking down the Spurs either. He was just in the game when we outscored our opponent by 27, that's all that means. It's not an individual stat.

That's a lot more production from Maxi than in most games!

[dirkules_41]

PJ and Dante are elite role players.
They fight every possessions, sometimes they lack on shooting but it's ok.

Maxi at the C again. It's embarassing. We lose rebounds and rim protector for 1 triple in 22minutes.OMG.

Tbf the Spurs have absolutely no bigs other than Wemby so when he exits the game it does give you that option in theory at least.

[Bob8]

Half decent coach should be able to communicate to Luka that he should take less shots, if he can't hit anything. Watching Luka chucking shots was a surreal experience.

Read on Twitter

[MassimoPayne]

Ugly ugly W. But a few weeks ago we would've lost this game.

Luka was not focused at all. He had an awful shooting night and was still laughing. And not the "I got this and the refs scuk"- laughing. He was joking around and not motivated at all.
i get, that he contoinues shooting but if you shoot like this please stop at 18 shots and not 30. Go instead for a crazy 20+ ast game which could easily been the case and the game would've won earlier.

Love to see Dante get it going.
Maxi was not as bad as most of you think. I still don't get why Gav/Liv didn't play at the end of the game.

Still impressive to manage a win when 2/5 guys were afraid to shoot or drive (Maxi and Luka). Like Maxi passed every single open shot. At least this led to another open shot from guys like Kyre and Dante

[ozwizard8]

Incredible triple-double stat line by Luka! He really deserves a good team around. FO this year really did nice moves after the last year's disaster. There were some mistakes, and some overpay, but overall it is nice to have Exum coming from bench to fill a portion of Brunson-Dinwiddie role, and now we have 2 solid centers in Lively+Gafford. This is the 1st year Luka having good centers in the roster. I only hope less THJ going forward. Maybe more Hardy?

PJ and Dante are elite role players.
They fight every possessions, sometimes they lack on shooting but it's ok.

Maxi at the C again. It's embarassing. We lose rebounds and rim protector for 1 triple in 22minutes.OMG.

Maxi Kleber is not back in his form of 2022 playoffs. However, he is doing better than most casual fans see.
We won Spurs game by 6 points where Maxi Kleber posted +/- rating of +27.
This stat may have some flaws but this kind of discrepancy indicates that Maxi Kleber minutes were helpful for the team. +27 doesn't mean he scored many 3pt shots, but his minutes objectively helped the team.

On offense, he brings better spacing. Without him scoring the 3s, he still contributes with movement and spacing to the team. When Gafford-Lively plays, other teams bring help to the ball handler more. This ball handler can be Luka-Kyrie-Exum. When Maxi plays, there are vastly more space inside and when help defense arrives, there is an open 3 available.

On defense, he used to be more switchable than some centers. He doesn't look as good as he was. But the idea is basically having worse defense/rebounding and trading that with superior offense.

I trust Maxi to gear up in playoffs. Maxi was solid in the 2022 playoffs. PJ-Gafford-Lively-DJJ dont have playoff experience so if we can improve Maxi's form, he'll be an asset in playoffs whether it's 15 or 22 mpg based on the matchup.

[ozwizard8]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

[Archx]

Somehow he's +27 for the game, so he did something right.

Why is why it's mostly a useless stat. He was 2 for 2 from the field so it wasn't offense, he had a total of 1 rebound, he wasn't locking down the Spurs either. He was just in the game when we outscored our opponent by 27, that's all that means. It's not an individual stat.

That's a lot more production from Maxi than in most games!

Yeah he was decent in this game. But be careful with +/- without proper context. Maxi was mostly matched vs Spurs bench which has no length and is horrible without Wemby. PJ did the most damage vs him on defense and held him to 8 pts.

Maxi on 5 is still a horrible idea because he slowed down a bit and doesn't take most of his open shots to justify his "spacing". Spurs literally sagged off of him and he still didn't take those shots, which effectively erases any plans of going 5 out if guys don't shoot when open.

He's a poor rebounder but a good box out guy. I'm not convinced he should even be in the game in the clutch situations, DJJ for now would be a much better option. At least he takes shots when presented.

[Bob8]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

[Bob8]

Why is why it's mostly a useless stat. He was 2 for 2 from the field so it wasn't offense, he had a total of 1 rebound, he wasn't locking down the Spurs either. He was just in the game when we outscored our opponent by 27, that's all that means. It's not an individual stat.

That's a lot more production from Maxi than in most games!

Yeah he was decent in this game. But be careful with +/- without proper context. Maxi was mostly matched vs Spurs bench which has no length and is horrible without Wemby. PJ did the most damage vs him on defense and held him to 8 pts.

Maxi on 5 is still a horrible idea because he slowed down a bit and doesn't take most of his open shots to justify his "spacing". Spurs literally sagged off of him and he still didn't take those shots, which effectively erases any plans of going 5 out if guys don't shoot when open.

He's a poor rebounder but a good box out guy. I'm not convinced he should even be in the game in the clutch situations, DJJ for now would be a much better option. At least he takes shots when presented.

Looking at +/- we should assume that Kleber was a monster, Luka very solid and Kyrie disastrous.

The only thing that we can get from Kleber's +/- is that lineups he played in were playing very well, not necessarily because of Kleber.

[Archx]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

His scoring averages would make a whooping jump from 4.3 to 4.5

[Michaellam1987]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

44% make us great and so memorable, is because he is suddenly super confident and becomes a volume 3PT shooters during that playoff time.

[ozwizard8]

That's a lot more production from Maxi than in most games!

Yeah he was decent in this game. But be careful with +/- without proper context. Maxi was mostly matched vs Spurs bench which has no length and is horrible without Wemby. PJ did the most damage vs him on defense and held him to 8 pts.

Maxi on 5 is still a horrible idea because he slowed down a bit and doesn't take most of his open shots to justify his "spacing". Spurs literally sagged off of him and he still didn't take those shots, which effectively erases any plans of going 5 out if guys don't shoot when open.

He's a poor rebounder but a good box out guy. I'm not convinced he should even be in the game in the clutch situations, DJJ for now would be a much better option. At least he takes shots when presented.

Looking at +/- we should assume that Kleber was a monster, Luka very solid and Kyrie disastrous.

The only thing that we can get from Kleber's +/- is that lineup's he played in were playing very well, not necessarily because of Kleber.

+27 is not sth you can explain with lineup coincidence.
If you like you can call it a mysterious happening and that's fine. Maybe Kleber is a luck charm and suddenly makes team play better and other team worse.

+27 in a 6-point game does not mean Kleber is a monster but it shows a stretch-5 minutes helped us in some way.

[ozwizard8]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

His scoring averages would make a whooping jump from 4.3 to 4.5

This is a very casual fan mindset. Maxi Kleber is not a scorer. We do not expect him to be THJ either. His role is being a 3-pt threat. And occasionally making couple 3s. I dont care if he scores 5 ppg or 8 ppg. If he makes the 3-pt shots when its needed then that's a plus for role player.

Luka or Kyrie being +5 or -3 doesn't mean much. However, if you are +27 in a 6-pt game, then it shows you were not a negative. Some casual fans here don't know much about basketball and they think playing Kleber is not worth it because he only scored 5pts. Anyone understand basketball fundamentals would understand his role. Altough he is not doing as good as he used to be, yesterday night it helped the team.

[Bob8]

One more optimistic note on Maxi:
Maxi is a career 36% 3-point shooter. This year, he is shooting badly with 31%.

- Two years ago, Maxi was shooting with 32% during the regular season.
+ Maxi improved his 3-pt shooting to 44% during the 2022 playoffs.

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

44% make us great and so memorable, is because he is suddenly super confident and becomes a volume 3PT shooters during that playoff time.

And that player could be Washington this year. His 3pts shooting will be crucial for Mavs. I hope Kleber plays and shoots as little as possible.

[Michaellam1987]

Maxi is in the game to stretch the floor yet he passes on every single open look he gets. What a 5head strategy.

Yep...maybe Lively should Play instead...he did hit 13 in a row before the draft... wasn't that one of the reasons they were so impressed with him...I mean,he probably could hit the same amount as Maxi right now

Lively is far from a threat in the 3PT line. FT% can give you some clues on his shooting ability. I know there are some exceptions, e.g. Bruce Bowen. But this apply to majority.

[Bob8]

Do you believe that Kleber shooting 31% for 3 or 36% for 3 would make a difference?

His scoring averages would make a whooping jump from 4.3 to 4.5

This is a very casual fan mindset. Maxi Kleber is not a scorer. We do not expect him to be THJ either. His role is being a 3-pt threat. And occasionally making couple 3s. I dont care if he scores 5 ppg or 8 ppg. If he makes the 3-pt shots when its needed then that's a plus for role player.

Luka or Kyrie being +5 or -3 doesn't mean much. However, if you are +27 in a 6-pt game, then it shows you were not a negative. Some casual fans here don't know much about basketball and they think playing Kleber is not worth it because he only scored 5pts. Anyone understand basketball fundamentals would understand his role. Altough he is not doing as good as he used to be, yesterday night it helped the team.

Just forget about +/- when analysing single players impact in a single game. Lively was - 18 against Denver and THJ + 2.