Breaking: Varsho in, Moreno, Gurriel out

[s e n s i]

as I've mentioned a few times before here. no one does it better in the league imo. the ability to find holes with such delicate contact, usually on the ground. gabby moreno is elite at this. unreal and uncanny light-hitting prowess.

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/746717/play/46

[johanliebert]

you're still using raw batting average in your arguments in the year 2024. if anything is saying something, it's that.

From the father of sabrametrics

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[bluerap23]

Yeah ba is a useless stat - wade boggs was trash
Also rbi is stupid - it only indicates a guys ability to get guys on the bases home. This team doesn’t need that

[Randle McMurphy]

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Most valuable player on the Jays.

Most valuable player in the trade.

[Mehar]

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Most valuable player on the Jays.

Most valuable player in the trade.

The best .214 hitter in baseball. No doubt.

[-MetA4-]

The best .214 hitter in baseball. No doubt.

Literally wins the game (1 run saved, 1 run created), whines anyway .

[s e n s i]

moreno jockriders every time varsho does something good for the team they support, the toronto blue jays

[s e n s i]

"ThiS OnE gAmE fRoM vArSHo sHoULd nOt GeT aNyOnE eXcItEd. He sTiLL oNLy hAS 19 RuNs BaTteD iN tHiS sEasOn WhIcH iS nOt eVeN toP 10 iN aMeRiCa leAgUe!"

[Mehar]

"ThiS OnE gAmE fRoM vArSHo sHoULd nOt GeT aNyOnE eXcItEd. He sTiLL oNLy hAS 19 RuNs BaTteD iN tHiS sEasOn WhIcH iS nOt eVeN toP 10 iN aMeRiCa leAgUe!"

Varsho had a great game. Give him credit. He had one solid week in April also hitting wise. He has been terrible offensively the other 6 out of 7 weeks (hitting below .200), and racking up the Strikeouts. It is like your hero Kirk also, who has been terrible all year at the plate (hitting .188, OPS .534).

One single good game from either of them does not mean I overlook how terrible both guys have been at the plate (except the one hot week of Varsho in April). I have also said that Varsho seemed to turn it around hitting in the bottom of the order, but this organization started moving him around all over the place for no reason.

[Randle McMurphy]

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[Hottie McShotty]

Lol. let's not count last years stats when comparing the trade.

Varsho is 6 for his last 36 ABs batting a spectacular .214 for the season.

GrEaTeSt TrAdE oF aLl TiMe!

[Asianiac_24]

I'm happy for Varsho and he is no doubt a good player that any team would love to have, if he can actually bat well for a full year then we won the trade. It's too early to tell so far.

[Randle McMurphy]

I'm happy for Varsho and he is no doubt a good player that any team would love to have, if he can actually bat well for a full year then we won the trade. It's too early to tell so far.

He doesn’t even need to hit well for us to win the trade (although he has this year so far); that’s how bad Moreno is

[-MetA4-]

Lol. let's not count last years stats when comparing the trade.

I don't see anyone "not counting last year's stats". I think everyone is very cognizant to the fact that Varsho was horrible at the plate last season. Does anyone want to place a consideration on the fact that it was his first season moving from the NL to the more competitive AL East?

But here's the irony to the post you just made: while you all were beating your chests last year about how we made "the worst trade of all time", how come you didn't want to reference "the previous year" then? The previous year being 2022 when Varsho posted a 4.4 fWAR/4.8 bWAR season in Arizona?

So all of a sudden his current year success doesn't matter because he slumped horribly last year. But when he was slumping horribly last year, it didn't matter at all that he was very good in 2022?

Gee, its almost like you are actively trying to pick and choose your data-points to try to prove some point. "Look at the previous year" can't be an argument when it is convenient to you, but not an argument when it hurts your position.

Here is your actual wake up call:

2022:
Varsho: 4.4 fWAR, 4.8 bWAR
Gurriel: 1.6 fWAR, 2.2 bWAR
Moreno: 0.8 fWAR, 0.7 bWAR

2023:
Varsho: 2.1 fWAR, 3.9 bWAR
Gurriel: 2.0 fWAR, 3.0 bWAR
Moreno: 2.3 fWAR, 4.3 bWAR

2024:
Varsho: 1.5 fWAR, 1.8 bWAR
Gurriel: 0.5 fWAR, 0.2 bWAR
Moreno: 0.8 fWAR, 0.4 bWAR

So Varsho was worth more than both Gurriel and Moreno combined in 2022 (yes I'm aware that Moreno played a short season), and he is worth more than both of them combined this season as well through ~40 games.

Everyone already knows that Gurriel went on a heater last season and Varsho posted the worst full season of his career. What's funny is that no one was blind to the fact that Varsho majorly disappointed; the only thing that was said was that you shouldn't consider the trade "closed" because he was still a young player who had performed the prior year and could easily turn it back around again....which he has done so far in 2023.

But instead of being happy that the GOOD player we acquired is back to having another VERY GOOD season so far (which really shouldn't surprise you because again, he was actually very good in 2022), you want to play this idiotic game of trying to find the needle-in-the-haystack argument to somehow show that we actually still "lOST thE tRaDe".

My guy, pointing out Varsho's low BA isn't going to overturn the fact that neither Moreno nor Gurriel have done much of anything so far this season. There is no argument to be made. Gurriel is posting an 88 wRC+ and Danny Jansen has been much better than Moreno.

Varsho is 6 for his last 36 ABs batting a spectacular .214 for the season.

GrEaTeSt TrAdE oF aLl TiMe!

I don't think you want to play this game:

Gurriel is 7 for his last 35 (a 66 wRC+)
Moreno is 8 for his last 37

So what is your point supposed to be? Varsho is an a "slump" (the other two aren't doing anything better either) but yet he is still a much better defender than both of the others over that stretch. And that is actually what makes Varsho so appealing: even if he is "in a slump", his defense is so good that he is still worth playing every day. That is why these lame arguments to his low BA are so weak: he will hit HR's and save a **** ton of runs with his glove...all the way to another 4-5+ WAR season if he stays healthy.

[Hottie McShotty]

Okay, whatever. Keep defending Varsho. I could care less about your nerdy advanced stats. I watch the games on TV. What I see is a player who is struggling to hit for average. A lot of 0 for games by Varsho who leads the Jays in strikeouts btw. If you can't hit and get on base you're a problem, especially with a team like the Blue Jays who are challenged to score runs.

Let's see how this pans out over the length of their careers. I still think we could have received a better player back and sold high on the top catching prospect in Moreno. Varsho is 27, Moreno is 24 years old. He has more potential and could very well end up being the better player in this trade when it's all said and done. Moreno has been great behind the plate calling games for Arizona. I'd much rather have him than Kirk (who has been awful this season) and often injured Jansen.

Some of you just can't admit that Atkins made a bad trade here.

[Randle McMurphy]

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[s e n s i]

your daily reminder that we acquired the best defensive outfielder in baseball who is tracking for a 5 fWAR season for a catcher whose power is so non-existent that he is now splitting catching duties with Tucker freakin' Barnhart lmao and also for a left-fielder with a 83 wRC+ on the season whose defensive metrics are going to nosedive the deeper we get into the season, because historically he has never been a good defender.

what are we ever going to do. life comes at you fast when you're being compared to buster posey but end up being jeff mathis.

[Madvillainy2004]

your daily reminder that we acquired the best defensive outfielder in baseball who is tracking for a 5 fWAR season for a catcher whose power is so non-existent that he is now splitting catching duties with Tucker freakin' Barnhart lmao and also for a left-fielder with a 83 wRC+ on the season whose defensive metrics are going to nosedive the deeper we get into the season, because historically he has never been a good defender.

what are we ever going to do. life comes at you fast when you're being compared to buster posey but end up being jeff mathis.

There were BIG red flags during Morenos 2022 AA/AAA season where he virtually hit for no power in the minors and other than a hot post season still can't hit besides singles.

[s e n s i]

without considering gurriel jr., who the jays understandably wanted no part of, when you look at the key players swapped in the deal (i.e. varsho/moreno), at least the jays got back an every day player lmfao