Will any current Pistons be here when we win a playoff series?

[JennetteMcCurdy]

The youth is developing….. the youth doesn’t fit…… Troy’s doing fine….. Troy should be fired…… we have lots of cap space…… Monty will be fine……

Instead of the current loops in this forum, here’s a simple question -

How many of the current Pistons will be on the roster the next time we actually WIN a playoff series?

Get your crystal balls out….. lots of flexibility in your thinking….. for example……

Will Cade get his max and ask to be traded? Will he play the long game and be part of success?

Will Ivey/Duren be traded? Will Thompson pan out?

Will Stewart soak up more contracts long enough to be part of a winner?

Sasser? Grimes? Anyone else?

And is Troy the GM at the time? Because Troy turned over the entire roster in one year - something to consider.

Winning a playoff series basically means top four in the East.

So again, how many current Pistons will be Pistons the next time we win a series? And who?

Zero, by the way, is a very depressing response

[vege]

Zero, by the way, is a very depressing response

But it is by far the most realistic response. We are in a **** situation.

Our young guys don't fit, and while they're talented they're developing bad habits and they're a bunch of losers. Even Duren and Cade.

The only guy who has any fire and leaves everything on the court is Ausar, and he still need a lot of development. He could be an all NBA player but he could be useless, it's 50/50 imo.

The only way to turn it around is firing Weaver/Tellem and burning everything to the ground and starting again from the scratch, this time, with a real plan and someone who knows what he is doing, not a bunch of guys trying to steal money from the owner and employing their family and friends.

[bstein14]

From 2019-2020 roster only Sekou was there by the end of the 20-21 season and no Pistons were there by the start of the 21-22 season. I know that's largely due to Weaver making a full rebuild cleaning house.


So the start of the 21-22 season had 100% Weaver players on that roster, and by the end of the 23-24 season only Cade and Stew remain from that roster even though all 15 were guys Weaver brought in.

Even if you just look at last year's opening day roster we're missing.

Bey
Bagley
Burks
Bojan
Diallo
Killian
Knox
Livers
McGruder
Noel

Only five (Cade, Ivey, Duren, Stew, and Wiseman) are here from 14 months ago.

Right now best case scenario is we make the playoffs in 2 years and perhaps win a playoff series in 3-4 years and at most probably 2-3 guys are still here but 1 or 0 is also possibly most realistic and it won't be easy to win a playoff series in 3-4 years either we very well could make a playoff series and win a playoff game or two but it could be another decade without a playoff series win sadly only four teams get those in the East each year.

[JennetteMcCurdy]

To the people that said 3+ - I’d really like to know which players…..

I was torn between zero and one - Stewart. First, i think he’s the least likely to be moved because his contract is so bad. Second, I could see Troy or whoever is the GM at the time giving him another deal, playing the “heart and soul of the franchise” card again.

But I voted zero because winning a playoff series seems farther away than Stewart retiring.

[Canadafan]

Next year we makin the playoffs with Duren Stew Fontecchio Ausar Cade Grimes Sasser because we traded ivey and picks for Lauri and signed Tyus Jones and Buddy Heild

[Snakebites]

I’m not sure any of our current players will still be in the league when we win our next playoff series.

The most statistically probable answer is zero- it’s more likely than any of the other numbers. This team hasn’t found an identity yet.

Fun fact: 2008 was the last year we won a playoff series (or a playoff game, by the way. The last player from that team left the league nearly 5 years ago. Amir Johnson played his last NBA game in 2019.

[buzzkilloton]

Hornets,Spurs,and Blazers will win a series before us. We've already been way surpassed by the teams that were tanking at the same time us such as Hou,OKC, and Orl. Only team we have a edge on winning a series sooner would be the Wizards.

[NYPiston]

I’m not sure any of our current players will still be in the league when we win our next playoff series.

The most statistically probable answer is zero- it’s more likely than any of the other numbers. This team hasn’t found an identity yet.

Fun fact: 2008 was the last year we won a playoff series (or a playoff game, by the way. The last player from that team left the league nearly 5 years ago. Amir Johnson played his last NBA game in 2019.

I know things are grim but this is some insane hyperbole.

I think it's more like....no current NBA players will still be in the league when the Pistons win their next playoff series.

[theBigLip]

There’s two parts to this.
1. When will the Pistons win a playoff series
2. Who will still be around

On the first one, it’s hard to win a playoff series. Ask Minnesota, Cleveland, Memphis, even Milwaukee last year. Only 8 teams a year win a playoff series. When will OKC, Orlando, Houston and San Antonio win one? At least we’re in the East. Getting a 7th or 8th seed isn’t going to cut it. Very rarely do these teams win, and that’s usually if a good team has injuries so their regular season record takes a hit. So we probably have to be at least the 6th seed to have a chance. Last year that took 45 wins. But that’s only for a chance. I’d say you need to get that far at least twice before you have a chance to win a series. So in my normal optimistic mindset, our win totals per season could go like this:
24/25: 30 wins
25/26: 38 wins
26/27: 45 wins
27/28: 45+ wins, win playoff series

Now to the second part. Who is going to be with us for four more seasons? I would expect Cade and Duren for sure. I would also expect a trade or two by then. But rookie contracts give you player control for 5 years, so I’m sure a few more will stick, so the 3+ pick seemed reasonable to me.

Like most things, this will hinge on how this summer goes. If we can get a couple of long term starters (preferably wings, PF), then we have a chance. If we sign Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva, then we’ll have to blow it up again and the easy answer is zero.

[joedumars1]

Oh **** series not just a playoff win, I voted 2, but a series win, maybe 1 lol

[whitehops]

i'm *hoping* cade is kind of in an SGA situation where he signs a max deal, the team continues to be a lottery team for a couple years and cade makes a big leap in addition to better talent around him.

in SGA's 3rd season the only guy from that team that is a rotation player for OKC today is lu dort, who was in his second year (he was an undrafted free agent). after that they added two stud players (chet and jalen williams) and two rotation players (cason wallace and josh giddey) via the draft. most of their rotation players were added after SGA's 3rd season.

if we make a huge leap in the next 3-4 years i have a strong feeling it won't be with ivey or duren playing big roles and it's questionable if it will even be with ausar or stewart either.

[Mr Peanut]

People seem a bit pessimistic in here, maybe rightly so as it has been 16 years since our last playoff series win and we've had such a bad season this year.

I'm going to be glass half-full and say three - Cade, Duren and Ausar.

[Patrick27]

Does a play-in game count as a 'series'? Or does winning a series only count as advancing to the final four of the east?

Either way it's a fascinating question, and it gets right to the meat and potatoes of the current state of the rebuild.

Rebuilding isn't always about draft picks, sometimes it's about acquiring assets to cash in for something better. Turning $1 into $2 into $4 is an iterative process that takes lots of different moves to get there. Do you know how rare it is for a #1 overall pick to with a championship with the team that drafted them? Happened for Kyrie Irving because Lebron returned. Before that, it was Tim Duncan and David Robinson in the prior century. (I'm not counting Lebron because he left and came back as a free agent, after Cleveland won the top overall pick in 3 of 4 seasons)

[JennetteMcCurdy]

Does a play-in game count as a 'series'? Or does winning a series only count as advancing to the final four of the east?

A full series - meaning when there are four teams left in the East, the Pistons are one of them.

We just extended Metu, so we’ll have to adjust our answers

[Moses ShamMoses]

I picked zero but I hope I'm wrong. It would be nice to see Cade take a Pistons team for a deep playoff run but I also know guys get traded or lose their luster over time.

[Vampirate]

Hornets,Spurs,and Blazers will win a series before us. We've already been way surpassed by the teams that were tanking at the same time us such as Hou,OKC, and Orl. Only team we have a edge on winning a series sooner would be the Wizards.

I'm bored so i'm posting here.

Houston and OKC are exceptions to the rule in which they had All Nba talents to trade for multiple firsts, OKC in particular is an extreme exception because of SGA.

Orlando has been in perpetually mediocrity until they lucked into Paolo.

The Spurs lucked into Wemby.

The Hornets have yet to do anything with a healthy LaMelo.

The Blazers have drafted an equally flawed player as any on the Pistons in Scoot.


Really this question is will Cade/Duren/Ausar be around when the Pistons luck into drafting 'the' player or will Cade become close to that player?

Possibly.

I think Ivy is probably too flawed and doesn't have the skills over an overwhelming physical edge to stay long enough.


I think you guys are in a better situation than you think you are as i'd rather be the Pistons going forwards than say the Bulls.

[GreekAlex]

Hornets,Spurs,and Blazers will win a series before us. We've already been way surpassed by the teams that were tanking at the same time us such as Hou,OKC, and Orl. Only team we have a edge on winning a series sooner would be the Wizards.

I'm bored so i'm posting here.

Houston and OKC are exceptions to the rule in which they had All Nba talents to trade for multiple firsts, OKC in particular is an extreme exception because of SGA.

Orlando has been in perpetually mediocrity until they lucked into Paolo.

The Spurs lucked into Wemby.

The Hornets have yet to do anything with a healthy LaMelo.

The Blazers have drafted an equally flawed player as any on the Pistons in Scoot.


Really this question is will Cade/Duren/Ausar be around when the Pistons luck into drafting 'the' player or will Cade become close to that player?

Possibly.

I think Ivy is probably too flawed and doesn't have the skills over an overwhelming physical edge to stay long enough.


I think you guys are in a better situation than you think you are as i'd rather be the Pistons going forwards than say the Bulls.

I appreciate your perspective. So much of the team’s future success comes down to 3 things.

1. How the massive amount of cap space is managed this offseason (trades/ free agents)

2. How the high draft pick is utilized (who’s drafted or how it’s packaged and traded)

3. How the front office assess the current young players after one season under Monty (Is anyone traded? Is another year of development invested into everyone?)

I’m reserving my judgment until the offseason plays out.

If Weaver is making the decisions, I’m hoping he’s able to find another Jeremi Grant signing where the player outperforms his contract rather than just going after overpay mercenaries.

[buzzkilloton]

Hornets,Spurs,and Blazers will win a series before us. We've already been way surpassed by the teams that were tanking at the same time us such as Hou,OKC, and Orl. Only team we have a edge on winning a series sooner would be the Wizards.

Agree with you on Bulls and were in a better spot then the Wiz. Hornets landing Miller this year gives them the edge on us. Also we have a bad GM,coach,and owner so wouldnt count the Wiz or Bulls in being good before us somehow.


2020-no draft picks
2021-2 Green, 23 Garuba 24 J.Christopher *traded for Sengun pair of future 1st
2022-3 Smith 17 Eason
2023-4 Thompson 20 Whitmore

The Rockets are still owed stuff. They havent had a bunch more picks then us through the Weaver years. We had 3 first rounders in 2020(we owe a first rounder with protections for one of these trades) we also grabbed a extra lotto pick in 2022. I'm not looking up the Thunder but I assume they havent landed all their picks yet either.

Another poster a month ago did the same thing with the Magic and we have had similar or better draft capital so far. I imagine their still owed alot as well.

Thunder thats true they had SGA but they also offered SGA+pick for us in a trade. Also they found gems like Jalen Williams with late lotto pick.

Troy Weaver has had ample time to get it done. If you go look at the draft capital we've had its plenty. He had 3 first rounders in 2020 and missed talent like Hali,Bane,and Maxey(who many pistons fans in the draft thread wanted). Trying to compare us to other teams as "unlucky" is just blaming things on something you cant control. A great GM would have done better in this amount of time.

We turned Luke Kennard into a first rounder which some fans wanted to use on Maxey that year and we didnt. We were gifted Grant in FA due to Troy being friends with him in OKC only reason he came here over resigning with Den same money. We could of traded him earlier for more but we waited. I'd also argue we should of kept him but thats neither here or nor there. We got lucky with the BB trade and we didnt sell him the deadline where the league really wanted him and waiting a year and his value was less.

As I mentioned could of made trades like below. This is just a public one their are always trades fans dont hear about. Being this bad after all this time is unacceptable.

"Monday evening, Basketball News' Matt Babcock wrote “rumor has it that the Thunder offered the No. 6 pick and Shai Gilgeous-Alexander in exchange for No. 1 -- the Pistons declined.”

Another NBA insider is now backing up Babcock’s report.

Bleacher Report draft insider Jonathan Wasserman confirmed that he also was told that Sam Presti offered Gilgeous-Alexander to the Pistons."

https://www.si.com/nba/thunder/draft-coverage/report-oklahoma-city-offered-shai-gilgeous-alexander-for-no-1-pick

[Vampirate]

Hornets,Spurs,and Blazers will win a series before us. We've already been way surpassed by the teams that were tanking at the same time us such as Hou,OKC, and Orl. Only team we have a edge on winning a series sooner would be the Wizards.

Agree with you on Bulls and were in a better spot then the Wiz. Hornets landing Miller this year gives them the edge on us. Also we have a bad GM,coach,and owner so wouldnt count the Wiz or Bulls in being good before us somehow.


2020-no draft picks
2021-2 Green, 23 Garuba 24 J.Christopher *traded for Sengun pair of future 1st
2022-3 Smith 17 Eason
2023-4 Thompson 20 Whitmore

The Rockets are still owed stuff. They havent had a bunch more picks then us through the Weaver years. We had 3 first rounders in 2020(we owe a first rounder with protections for one of these trades) we also grabbed a extra lotto pick in 2022. I'm not looking up the Thunder but I assume they havent landed all their picks yet either.

Another poster a month ago did the same thing with the Magic and we have had similar or better draft capital so far. I imagine their still owed alot as well.

Thunder thats true they had SGA but they also offered SGA+pick for us in a trade. Also they found gems like Jalen Williams with late lotto pick.

Troy Weaver has had ample time to get it done. If you go look at the draft capital we've had its plenty. He had 3 first rounders in 2020 and missed talent like Hali,Bane,and Maxey(who many pistons fans in the draft thread wanted). Trying to compare us to other teams as "unlucky" is just blaming things on something you cant control. A great GM would have done better in this amount of time.

We turned Luke Kennard into a first rounder which some fans wanted to use on Maxey that year and we didnt. We were gifted Grant in FA due to Troy being friends with him in OKC only reason he came here over resigning with Den same money. We could of traded him earlier for more but we waited. I'd also argue we should of kept him but thats neither here or nor there. We got lucky with the BB trade and we didnt sell him the deadline where the league really wanted him and waiting a year and his value was less.

As I mentioned could of made trades like below. This is just a public one their are always trades fans dont hear about. Being this bad after all this time is unacceptable.

"Monday evening, Basketball News' Matt Babcock wrote “rumor has it that the Thunder offered the No. 6 pick and Shai Gilgeous-Alexander in exchange for No. 1 -- the Pistons declined.”

Another NBA insider is now backing up Babcock’s report.

Bleacher Report draft insider Jonathan Wasserman confirmed that he also was told that Sam Presti offered Gilgeous-Alexander to the Pistons."

https://www.si.com/nba/thunder/draft-coverage/report-oklahoma-city-offered-shai-gilgeous-alexander-for-no-1-pick

I'm not debating you should keep Weaver or anything, i'm saying as of now at least, you are not stuck.

Once you actually start winning up to .300-.400 which will eventually happen (just don't know when in terms of what year it happens) and your players are no longer are on rookie contracts that's when you start to enter mediocrity hell as it's harder to make significant moves and you are getting worse draft picks due to winning more.

You are not at that point yet though, and may draft a player to blow past that point. Time will tell.

[JennetteMcCurdy]

Here are the eighteen……

Cade
Ivey
Duren
Sasser
Stewart
Grimes
Wiseman
Umude
Thompson
Rhoden
Metu
Flynn
Fontecchio
Fournier
Gibson
Boeheim
TBJ
Evboumwan

Eighteen players, one series win. Survivor!