Game 72: Warriors @ Magic 4:00 PM PDT

[Crazy-Canuck]

This team can't be a good defensive team without dray. We played well defensively vs a bigger more athletic team because gp2 and moody gave us great defense from the 3/4 spot. Take them out and replace with 30+ minutes of jk, and it's a different story.

Bring in Isaac or simmons? Who are more pf than c. What to do with tjd? With jk? If u trade Wiggins to move jk to 3, defense is going to suffer. Tjd is becoming a factor on the boards and shotblocker. It's basically a mess that having dray play c has covered up. We know that the best path to success is by having versatile defenders around steph and we only have 4 of them on the roster each with their own limitations (dray, wiggs, gp2, and moody).

[superunknown]

Dray absolutely deserved that ejection. Why is this even a dispute.

He challenged the officiating early to set the tone. The magic were just bullying and getting soft calls early. After that 1st tech (which I had no problems with him getting), the message was sent. He needed to leave it alone after that.. Instead he just doubled down and couldn't control himself.

all correct on dray, but when are they gonna finally start to talk about this shite?
the level of officiating has becoming worse and worse every year, there's no consistency amongst the same game and teams in the same game. what were those 2 calls at the beginning of the game? def not fauls. and even if they were, why banchero got the call and steph on the other hand doesn't get it?
everyone talking about green in that instance but the reality is this ain't even basketball anymore. no one understands anymore what is travelling, palming, offensive faul, clear path, faul on a shooting motion, etc. why players like doncic or young or fox cannot be whispered on but others can be held? it's a joke. and that clown of silver and the officiating high-ranks should be called out and answer about this once for all.

[Crazy-Canuck]

Dray absolutely deserved that ejection. Why is this even a dispute.

He challenged the officiating early to set the tone. The magic were just bullying and getting soft calls early. After that 1st tech (which I had no problems with him getting), the message was sent. He needed to leave it alone after that.. Instead he just doubled down and couldn't control himself.

all correct on dray, but when are they gonna finally start to talk about this shite?
the level of officiating has becoming worse and worse every year, there's no consistency amongst the same game and teams in the same game. what were those 2 calls at the beginning of the game? def not fauls. and even if they were, why banchero got the call and steph on the other hand doesn't get it?
everyone talking about green in that instance but the reality is this ain't even basketball anymore. no one understands anymore what is travelling, palming, offensive faul, clear path, faul on a shooting motion, etc. why players like doncic or young or fox cannot be whispered on but others can be held? it's a joke. and that clown of silver and the officiating high-ranks should be called out and answer about this once for all.

But dray is the type that would find fault with something else. There will always be something else.

Take 25% of drays aggression and inject that into wiggins, you might have a top 5 nba player. Take 25% of wiggins chillness and inject that into draymond, he'd still be a top 20 player right now.

[GSWFan1994]

Ben Simmons games played, last 5 seasons:

57
58
0 (holdout + back injury)
42
15

He had like what, 3 back surgeries now? And there are still people wanting to trade for him?

Come on folks, this isn't fantasy, where your "idea" of a player trumps what that player actually brings to the court.

[Onus]

This team can't be a good defensive team without dray. We played well defensively vs a bigger more athletic team because gp2 and moody gave us great defense from the 3/4 spot. Take them out and replace with 30+ minutes of jk, and it's a different story.

Bring in Isaac or simmons? Who are more pf than c. What to do with tjd? With jk? If u trade Wiggins to move jk to 3, defense is going to suffer. Tjd is becoming a factor on the boards and shotblocker. It's basically a mess that having dray play c has covered up. We know that the best path to success is by having versatile defenders around steph and we only have 4 of them on the roster each with their own limitations (dray, wiggs, gp2, and moody).

We really just don't have a lot of good defensive options. A lot of 1 way players who aren't really great at that 1 way thing.

Im still on the trade JK wagon.

[Onus]

2nd/3rd option Wiggins can be a force on both sides. He's not ideal, but it's probably the best we have.

I made this point in after the Miami game even though I thought it was so obvious. Wiggins, when he plays with real force, is a complete game-changer for this squad. He can cover up so many mistakes/bad games that it is almost criminal how little effort he put into this season. Last night's game was his best of the season and it wasn't exactly a 30pt triple double or the highlight tape of a DPOY. He was playing the way mikal bridges plays every game. Last night, that meant that JK's absence, Dray's early ejection and the poor shooting/defense/shot selection from Steph DID NOT MATTER. We went into Orl and took the best defense in the league since the all-star break to the woodshed. IF this wiggins shows up for the last ten games, I like our chances of getting the 8 seed. Big if, of course, but the last two games indicate he may be waking up.

3 of last 4 games, his touches hovered near 60 as opposed to the 30 he usually gets. He also got plays run for him early in the possession. Podz and cp3 minutes got limited minutes, so wiggins brought the ball up more. Those are the exceptions, not the norm. Once the team is full again, I expect kerr to have him standing at the 3 pt line (which wiggins will embrace), so steph, klay, and jk can get theirs. That's been our normal offense this year.

Is JK's presence eating into Wiggins touches? Cuz they run a lot of the same actions for the 2 of them, but JK isn't the spacer that Wiggins is.

[Crazy-Canuck]

I made this point in after the Miami game even though I thought it was so obvious. Wiggins, when he plays with real force, is a complete game-changer for this squad. He can cover up so many mistakes/bad games that it is almost criminal how little effort he put into this season. Last night's game was his best of the season and it wasn't exactly a 30pt triple double or the highlight tape of a DPOY. He was playing the way mikal bridges plays every game. Last night, that meant that JK's absence, Dray's early ejection and the poor shooting/defense/shot selection from Steph DID NOT MATTER. We went into Orl and took the best defense in the league since the all-star break to the woodshed. IF this wiggins shows up for the last ten games, I like our chances of getting the 8 seed. Big if, of course, but the last two games indicate he may be waking up.

3 of last 4 games, his touches hovered near 60 as opposed to the 30 he usually gets. He also got plays run for him early in the possession. Podz and cp3 minutes got limited minutes, so wiggins brought the ball up more. Those are the exceptions, not the norm. Once the team is full again, I expect kerr to have him standing at the 3 pt line (which wiggins will embrace), so steph, klay, and jk can get theirs. That's been our normal offense this year.

Is JK's presence eating into Wiggins touches? Cuz they run a lot of the same actions for the 2 of them, but JK isn't the spacer that Wiggins is.

Not really. Jk is second on usg and touches, but he doesn't really get the same action other than head tap. Wiggins is better with the ball than jk and jk is the better finisher right now. Wiggins has been eating off ball screens and inverterted screens early in the offense. Abd is being used as the secondary ball handler. Now add klay who is looking to get that big extension.

Imo, the bigger problem is that podz and cp3 aren't ball movers. Being able to pass isn't the same as being a ball mover. Both guys will pound the ball rather than make a quick pass. (Steph mentioned the 0.5 second rule). They are 2 of the 3 highest for seconds per touch. And if those guys start getting 30 minutes and the plays are designed for steph, klay, and jk. Wiggs gets drowned out, now add his passivity. That's how you get 2022 efficiency with a 50% drop in volume.

Since the AS break (ignoring start of season because he didn't deserve touches). Excluding the end of the bench guys.

5th in minutes
4th in points
7th in touches
2nd in points per touch
4th in efg
3rd in ts
4th in usg
And he is shooting 50/40/80 (he's actually outshooting steph and klay)

His efficiency is actually better than in 2022. It's the volume. I don't think it's a coincidence that a drop in podz and cp3 minutes as created an uptick in wiggins' volume.

[Onus]

on another note, how did we always lose in Orlando. From all the fan cameras, it seems like it's another home game in Orlando. So many warriors (Curry) jerseys.

[Crazy-Canuck]

on another note, how did we always lose in Orlando. From all the fan cameras, it seems like it's another home game in Orlando. So many warriors (Curry) jerseys.

Nightclubs in Miami. I wouldn't be surprised if dray was hungover and just didn't want to play.

[Onus]

3 of last 4 games, his touches hovered near 60 as opposed to the 30 he usually gets. He also got plays run for him early in the possession. Podz and cp3 minutes got limited minutes, so wiggins brought the ball up more. Those are the exceptions, not the norm. Once the team is full again, I expect kerr to have him standing at the 3 pt line (which wiggins will embrace), so steph, klay, and jk can get theirs. That's been our normal offense this year.

Is JK's presence eating into Wiggins touches? Cuz they run a lot of the same actions for the 2 of them, but JK isn't the spacer that Wiggins is.

Not really. Jk is second on usg and touches, but he doesn't really get the same action other than head tap. Wiggins is better with the ball than jk and jk is the better finisher right now. Wiggins has been eating off ball screens and inverterted screens early in the offense. Abd is being used as the secondary ball handler. Now add klay who is looking to get that big extension.

Imo, the bigger problem is that podz and cp3 aren't ball movers. Being able to pass isn't the same as being a ball mover. Both guys will pound the ball rather than make a quick pass. (Steph mentioned the 0.5 second rule). They are 2 of the 3 highest per second per touch. And if those guys start getting 30 minutes and the plays are designed for steph, klay, and cp3. Wiggs gets drowned out, now add his passivity. That's how you get 2022 efficiency with a 50% drop in volume.

Since the AS break (ignoring start of season because he didn't deserve touches). Excluding the end of the bench guys.

5th in minutes
4th in points
7th in touches
2nd in points per touch
4th in efg
3rd in ts
4th in usg
And he is shooting 50/40/80 (he's actually outshooting steph and klay)

His efficiency is actually better than in 2022. It's the volume. I don't think it's a coincidence that a drop in podz and cp3 minutes as created an uptick in wiggins' volume.

Yea but most of wiggins touches aren't coming from passes. This game he did so much initiating with the ball in his hands. It's not like the ball was finding him. The ball started in his hands. How many ball screens did Wiggs get this game. In the 4th qtr.

Obviously it's the volume, but the volume is being soaked up by JK's emergence and becoming the defacto 2nd option. Sure it doesn't help that CP3 needs the ball in his hands. BP is always driving rather than shooting. But that's not how wiggins gets "aggressive" that's how he gets spot up opportunities. When Wiggins gets aggressive it's when he's posting up mismatches, it's when he has the ball in his hands and attacking mismatches, its when he gets ball screens. All those actions are being given to JK.

[EvanZ]

Of course when Wiggins was coming off the bench I don't recall him getting these actions either regardless of JK being on the floor with him. If he had shown this kind of aggression when he was coming off the bench we probably would have won some more games.