Desperate Times

[B-King]

Well, I keep racking my brain to see what crazy move that could possibly up the needle on the team's competitiveness. Plus I don't see any realistic moves where we over pay and get that much better. So for me, the move is to make a high risk trade without dipping too much into the future assets for a rebuild.

I can't believe that I am actually posting this:

Chris Paul, Kevon Looney, Protected 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons

* Also sign Kevin Porter Jr.

Simmons epitomizes everything I hate in an entitled athlete and yet here we are. He has a unique skill set, but can any team get him to be on the court. He would be very intriguing on the floor for the Warriors. The Nets are in absolutely terrible shape and need to dump ballast for a ground zero rebuild.

KPJ gives us some more athleticism and scoring off the bench. Forget the morale character, we need players.

[whatisacenter]

Well, I keep racking my brain to see what crazy move that could possibly up the needle on the team's competitiveness. Plus I don't see any realistic moves where we over pay and get that much better. So for me, the move is to make a high risk trade without dipping too much into the future assets for a rebuild.

I can't believe that I am actually posting this:

Chris Paul, Kevon Looney, Protected 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons

* Also sign Kevin Porter Jr.

Simmons epitomizes everything I hate in an entitled athlete and yet here we are. He has a unique skill set, but can any team get him to be on the court. He would be very intriguing on the floor for the Warriors. The Nets are in absolutely terrible shape and need to dump ballast for a ground zero rebuild.

KPJ gives us some more athleticism and scoring off the bench. Forget the morale character, we need players.

If Simmons had a chance to stay on the court I would entertain the idea but at this point I have about as much of a chance of playing in the NBA as he does.

KPJ is an easy no for me.

[Onus]

Well, I keep racking my brain to see what crazy move that could possibly up the needle on the team's competitiveness. Plus I don't see any realistic moves where we over pay and get that much better. So for me, the move is to make a high risk trade without dipping too much into the future assets for a rebuild.

I can't believe that I am actually posting this:

Chris Paul, Kevon Looney, Protected 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons

* Also sign Kevin Porter Jr.

Simmons epitomizes everything I hate in an entitled athlete and yet here we are. He has a unique skill set, but can any team get him to be on the court. He would be very intriguing on the floor for the Warriors. The Nets are in absolutely terrible shape and need to dump ballast for a ground zero rebuild.

KPJ gives us some more athleticism and scoring off the bench. Forget the morale character, we need players.

Giving up a 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons is wild. Let alone giving them a get out of jail free card in CP3 on top of it all.

KPJ no thanks.

[whatisacenter]

Well, I keep racking my brain to see what crazy move that could possibly up the needle on the team's competitiveness. Plus I don't see any realistic moves where we over pay and get that much better. So for me, the move is to make a high risk trade without dipping too much into the future assets for a rebuild.

I can't believe that I am actually posting this:

Chris Paul, Kevon Looney, Protected 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons

* Also sign Kevin Porter Jr.

Simmons epitomizes everything I hate in an entitled athlete and yet here we are. He has a unique skill set, but can any team get him to be on the court. He would be very intriguing on the floor for the Warriors. The Nets are in absolutely terrible shape and need to dump ballast for a ground zero rebuild.

KPJ gives us some more athleticism and scoring off the bench. Forget the morale character, we need players.

Giving up a 1st and a 2nd for Ben Simmons is wild. Let alone giving them a get out of jail free card in CP3 on top of it all.

KPJ no thanks.

LOL, I didn’t even factor in the fact the Dubs were giving up picks…Brooklyn couldn’t say, yes, fast enough to that offer!

[CDM_Stats]

I love the idea of kicking the tires on Ben Simmons, but its based on the premise that we'd be buying super low, thus negating any risk other than salary, when acquiring him. Throwing in picks really mucks that up.. if he's available, I'd imagine that adding in a SRP would be about the peak of the value we should offer. And even then, its probably not necessary

As for KPJ - signing him or Miles Bridges would be enough for me to tune out. I was really unmotivated to buy tickets when #40 was playing here. So bringing in another like him would make me question if spending time/money on this team is worth it

[HiRez]

Yeah, Simmons is perennially interesting (yet always risky) but there's no way I'm sending out picks for him. No way. The Warriors cannot give up their future picks for a desperation move to win another championship and Simmons coming here has to have a > 80% chance of failure.

[floppymoose]

Ben Simmons is Jordan Poole: a team crippler. Not for the same reasons as Poole, but equally effective.

His only value is a 40 mil expiring… so he could be used in a teardown:

Simmons, someone young, pick
For
Dray, Wiggs

Then let Klay and CP walk

[KevinMcreynolds]

I think he might be the only player in the league less valuable than Poole. At least JP actually puts in the effort to put on a uniform and go out onto the court.

[CDM_Stats]

Simmons doesnt play much but when he does, the impact is extremely positive. Even with him being mostly injured

PHI has never reached the peak it did when it had Simmons.. even trading Simmons for Harden made them worse. Saying only Poole is less valuable? lol cmon... do you know how many players in the league, no matter how well they are playing relative to who they are, would never be as impactful as Ben Simmons is, on average? He is the poster boy for rehabbing value, mainly because fans and media pundits have dragged him repeatedly to the point where its trendy to drag him.

Yet he remains one of the most prominent impact defenders. If a team could absorb his poor shooting, and he stays healthy, he can move the needle a lot. Look at other people who would cost (in trade value) the same, and I guarantee not a single one offers the same upside

If the Warriors did acquire him, it would need to be for CP3/GP2 or Looney (or something along those lines) and then stagger his minutes with Dray, as they should never share the court. It would also help if the team either convinced Simmons to play PF/C, or if the team got a perimeter big man. Getting him and playing him 15-20 as Dray's backup, keeping both fresher, is low risk/high upside

[vvoland]

Simmons doesnt play much but when he does, the impact is extremely positive. Even with him being mostly injured

PHI has never reached the peak it did when it had Simmons.. even trading Simmons for Harden made them worse. Saying only Poole is less valuable? lol cmon... do you know how many players in the league, no matter how well they are playing relative to who they are, would never be as impactful as Ben Simmons is, on average? He is the poster boy for rehabbing value, mainly because fans and media pundits have dragged him repeatedly to the point where its trendy to drag him.

Yet he remains one of the most prominent impact defenders. If a team could absorb his poor shooting, and he stays healthy, he can move the needle a lot. Look at other people who would cost (in trade value) the same, and I guarantee not a single one offers the same upside

If the Warriors did acquire him, it would need to be for CP3/GP2 or Looney (or something along those lines) and then stagger his minutes with Dray, as they should never share the court. It would also help if the team either convinced Simmons to play PF/C, or if the team got a perimeter big man. Getting him and playing him 15-20 as Dray's backup, keeping both fresher, is low risk/high upside

$40M/yr for that role seems a bit expensive. Especially for someone who's almost certainly not closing games. Even as a 1yr rental on an expiring it's a very expensive gamble, even if we get him for free; the opportunity cost is high. I agree he's been dragged so much he might be underrated. Then again, he seems like the least competitive person I've seen on the basketball court, going back to his time at LSU.

[CDM_Stats]

Simmons doesnt play much but when he does, the impact is extremely positive. Even with him being mostly injured

PHI has never reached the peak it did when it had Simmons.. even trading Simmons for Harden made them worse. Saying only Poole is less valuable? lol cmon... do you know how many players in the league, no matter how well they are playing relative to who they are, would never be as impactful as Ben Simmons is, on average? He is the poster boy for rehabbing value, mainly because fans and media pundits have dragged him repeatedly to the point where its trendy to drag him.

Yet he remains one of the most prominent impact defenders. If a team could absorb his poor shooting, and he stays healthy, he can move the needle a lot. Look at other people who would cost (in trade value) the same, and I guarantee not a single one offers the same upside

If the Warriors did acquire him, it would need to be for CP3/GP2 or Looney (or something along those lines) and then stagger his minutes with Dray, as they should never share the court. It would also help if the team either convinced Simmons to play PF/C, or if the team got a perimeter big man. Getting him and playing him 15-20 as Dray's backup, keeping both fresher, is low risk/high upside

$40M/yr for that role seems a bit expensive. Especially for someone who's almost certainly not closing games. Even as a 1yr rental on an expiring it's a very expensive gamble, even if we get him for free; the opportunity cost is high. I agree he's been dragged so much he might be underrated. Then again, he seems like the least competitive person I've seen on the basketball court, going back to his time at LSU.

To be fair, CP3 was (hopefully, I guess) earmarked to be a 30m guy who also wasn't closing. The salary is prohibitive but its why he could conceivably be gotten for almost nothing. Plus I'd rather get an expiring guy with as much upside as Simmons than a multi-year contract for someone with a better attitude or better injury history, but far less upside. Whether he costs 40, or if he was a vet min signing.. really shouldnt matter to fans. We're not in a place where capspace is going to do anything and if they are serious about not trading Kuminga, then the CP3 contract loses a lot of its luster

Plus I'm deathly scared that the Warriors will just pick up the option and play CP3.. and Simmons is way, way better for a rebuild than he is. A guy who doesnt shoot, elite defender, and who's downside is mostly that he's injured, which would open up more time for (presumably) younger players? Works for me.. **** Joe Lacob's wallet, spend that SF money

[TB]

I have no idea about the injury issues Simmons is dealing with, so that could change things. But if it's a desire issue, no better time to buy low on Simmons than when he's a 27 year old in a contract year for the first time since he was an Allstar.

CP3/Loon for Simmons and the Suns 2025 1st round pick.

[vvoland]

Simmons doesnt play much but when he does, the impact is extremely positive. Even with him being mostly injured

PHI has never reached the peak it did when it had Simmons.. even trading Simmons for Harden made them worse. Saying only Poole is less valuable? lol cmon... do you know how many players in the league, no matter how well they are playing relative to who they are, would never be as impactful as Ben Simmons is, on average? He is the poster boy for rehabbing value, mainly because fans and media pundits have dragged him repeatedly to the point where its trendy to drag him.

Yet he remains one of the most prominent impact defenders. If a team could absorb his poor shooting, and he stays healthy, he can move the needle a lot. Look at other people who would cost (in trade value) the same, and I guarantee not a single one offers the same upside

If the Warriors did acquire him, it would need to be for CP3/GP2 or Looney (or something along those lines) and then stagger his minutes with Dray, as they should never share the court. It would also help if the team either convinced Simmons to play PF/C, or if the team got a perimeter big man. Getting him and playing him 15-20 as Dray's backup, keeping both fresher, is low risk/high upside

$40M/yr for that role seems a bit expensive. Especially for someone who's almost certainly not closing games. Even as a 1yr rental on an expiring it's a very expensive gamble, even if we get him for free; the opportunity cost is high. I agree he's been dragged so much he might be underrated. Then again, he seems like the least competitive person I've seen on the basketball court, going back to his time at LSU.

To be fair, CP3 was (hopefully, I guess) earmarked to be a 30m guy who also wasn't closing. The salary is prohibitive but its why he could conceivably be gotten for almost nothing. Plus I'd rather get an expiring guy with as much upside as Simmons than a multi-year contract for someone with a better attitude or better injury history, but far less upside. Whether he costs 40, or if he was a vet min signing.. really shouldnt matter to fans. We're not in a place where capspace is going to do anything and if they are serious about not trading Kuminga, then the CP3 contract loses a lot of its luster

Plus I'm deathly scared that the Warriors will just pick up the option and play CP3.. and Simmons is way, way better for a rebuild than he is. A guy who doesnt shoot, elite defender, and who's downside is mostly that he's injured, which would open up more time for (presumably) younger players? Works for me.. **** Joe Lacob's wallet, spend that SF money

I could care less about Lacob's money - especially when i read team's revenue was north of 800 million in 21-22. It's about the opportunity cost. If we bring in simmons and his 40M, what are we leaving on the table? That's before we get to the "no aggregation" rule for 2nd apron teams. To be honest, I'd rather get under the tax and use the MLE on someone than gamble on simmons. His health, lack of interest in basketball (perceived, granted), and the fact that you can't play him next to Dray are all factors that move me off the simmons track.

I know you've heard this from me before but I'd rather try and get a stretch 5. Turner is the one I want most, take that for data! In all seriousness, he'd be hard to get so... maybe brook lopez? Kick the tires on Jalen Smith?

I wonder how much Portland would want for grant or ayton. Neither are world-beaters and ayton is a running joke in the league - the exact type of player that probably won't cost much and may benefit from playing next to dray and steph. Bad contract but just one year left after next season at about 35M/yr.

[B-King]

$40M/yr for that role seems a bit expensive. Especially for someone who's almost certainly not closing games. Even as a 1yr rental on an expiring it's a very expensive gamble, even if we get him for free; the opportunity cost is high. I agree he's been dragged so much he might be underrated. Then again, he seems like the least competitive person I've seen on the basketball court, going back to his time at LSU.

To be fair, CP3 was (hopefully, I guess) earmarked to be a 30m guy who also wasn't closing. The salary is prohibitive but its why he could conceivably be gotten for almost nothing. Plus I'd rather get an expiring guy with as much upside as Simmons than a multi-year contract for someone with a better attitude or better injury history, but far less upside. Whether he costs 40, or if he was a vet min signing.. really shouldnt matter to fans. We're not in a place where capspace is going to do anything and if they are serious about not trading Kuminga, then the CP3 contract loses a lot of its luster

Plus I'm deathly scared that the Warriors will just pick up the option and play CP3.. and Simmons is way, way better for a rebuild than he is. A guy who doesnt shoot, elite defender, and who's downside is mostly that he's injured, which would open up more time for (presumably) younger players? Works for me.. **** Joe Lacob's wallet, spend that SF money

I could care less about Lacob's money - especially when i read team's revenue was north of 800 million in 21-22. It's about the opportunity cost. If we bring in simmons and his 40M, what are we leaving on the table? That's before we get to the "no aggregation" rule for 2nd apron teams. To be honest, I'd rather get under the tax and use the MLE on someone than gamble on simmons. His health, lack of interest in basketball (perceived, granted), and the fact that you can't play him next to Dray are all factors that move me off the simmons track.

I know you've heard this from me before but I'd rather try and get a stretch 5. Turner is the one I want most, take that for data! In all seriousness, he'd be hard to get so... maybe brook lopez? Kick the tires on Jalen Smith?

I wonder how much Portland would want for grant or ayton. Neither are world-beaters and ayton is a running joke in the league - the exact type of player that probably won't cost much and may benefit from playing next to dray and steph. Bad contract but just one year left after next season at about 35M/yr.

I totally get the disdain for Simmons. I hate myself for even entertaining the thought of trading for him. The Nets are in such a total hole, we could probably get him for just the expiring contract and Looney's partial guarantee. It is a an extremely high risk play with a small chance at high reward.

[WarriorGM]

Before the drama that saw Simmons sent to the Nets this trade would have been a no brainer. The team should go for it but I get the feeling Lacob really really wants to get under the apron and avoid the repeater tax.

[Twinkie defense]

I''m a big fan of Ben Simmons' game. My only worry is can he lace 'em up on a regular basis? But Warriors seem like maybe the best franchise in terms of their ability to rehabilitate players with injuries (physical and/or mental).

[thunderdunk]

Simmons is a cancer. A guy with both physical and mental red flags. And he can't shoot, which makes him unplayable in clutch time. He is absolutely the last person anyone would ever want as a teammate. Likewise, Ayton isn't the solution to anything. Ask PHX or Portland. The Dubs will not become contenders by trading for either of those guys, and both have salaries that dwarf their contributions. Look at OKC or the Pacers as teams to model -- young guys with skills and heart. I want more young guys with a "desperate" urge to get better -- not overpaid castoffs.

[CDM_Stats]

Simmons is a cancer because he didnt get along with the very successful and famously level-headed Joel Embiid? lol its cartoonish how people perceive this guy

He can't do 2 whole things: shoot, and stay healthy (back issues - long term concern). That's it. Great creator/passer, great defender, great rebounder. Fits perfectly with the team, realistic in terms of value. But yeah why would we want castoffs that have failed with increased expectations as the #1 pick? I guess I'd believe in it more if we had one specific example of it working really well with this exact team in the past few years. But only then would I think its worth looking into

[thunderdunk]

Simmons is a cancer because he didn't get along with the very successful and famously level-headed Joel Embiid? lol its cartoonish how people perceive this guy

He can't do 2 whole things: shoot, and stay healthy (back issues - long term concern). That's it. Great creator/passer, great defender, great rebounder. Fits perfectly with the team, realistic in terms of value. But yeah why would we want castoffs that have failed with increased expectations as the #1 pick? I guess I'd believe in it more if we had one specific example of it working really well with this exact team in the past few years. But only then would I think its worth looking into

Wiggins got a bad rap for not carrying the franchise on his shoulders in MN. But Simmons literally had such an emotional breakdown that he refused to even hold onto the ball at the end of playoff games for fear that he'd have to shoot free throws. Then he got traded to the Nets, and pretty much decided not to play for them at all, due to a combination of mental/emotional and physical issues. All while making $40M/year. It speaks volumes that Kelly Oubre was able to shine in this years playoffs for the Sixers. LOL is right.

[Old_Blue]

Simmons is a cancer because he didn't get along with the very successful and famously level-headed Joel Embiid? lol its cartoonish how people perceive this guy

He can't do 2 whole things: shoot, and stay healthy (back issues - long term concern). That's it. Great creator/passer, great defender, great rebounder. Fits perfectly with the team, realistic in terms of value. But yeah why would we want castoffs that have failed with increased expectations as the #1 pick? I guess I'd believe in it more if we had one specific example of it working really well with this exact team in the past few years. But only then would I think its worth looking into

Wiggins got a bad rap for not carrying the franchise on his shoulders in MN. But Simmons literally had such an emotional breakdown that he refused to even hold onto the ball at the end of playoff games for fear that he'd have to shoot free throws. Then he got traded to the Nets, and pretty much decided not to play for them at all, due to a combination of mental/emotional and physical issues. All while making $40M/year. It speaks volumes that Kelly Oubre was able to shine in this years playoffs for the Sixers. LOL is right.

I just take it for granted that people even contemplating trading for Simmons have a hidden agenda of sabotaging the team. We've seen guys get the yips in baseball. We've seen guys in all sports need a few sessions with a sports psychologist. Simmons is in a whole other league - a true space cadet if there ever was one.