Time to face facts - Warriors are not underachieving.

[whatisacenter]

Clearly a lot of posters share a particular set of basketball strategy criticisms of Kerr, and can articulate some level of statistical support for those arguments. I would be REALLY curious if any Kerr advocates can articulate and support what it is that he is actually adding on the positive side of the balance sheet right now? Not in the past. We all know the track record and all include that in the calculus to whatever degree we see fit. But what's is the present case in favor of Kerr in terms of what he's adding to the quality of basketball being played? I'm actually open to being convinced because in all likely reality, he's not going anywhere for at least 2 years. I'd rather not find those years torturous so can someone help convince me to have faith?

I'm more of a Kerr-basher basher myself than an advocate. My only words of optimism for you is that it could be worse.

I have more of a problem with the roster than the coach and have to come to terms with watching Draymond for 3 years.

[ILOVEIT]

Draymond has done incredible things for this franchise.

But I'm still tired of him and would love, as a fan, to see a new chapter.

[wco81]

They're not going to get a lot back even if they decided to blow it up.

Can they even get say two FRPs for Curry which could become top 5 picks? He's signed for the next two years at $55.8 and $59.6 million. So the Warriors would have to take a lot of contracts back, probably bad contracts which are longer in duration.

The team won't be able to bottom out and turn its own picks into top 5 lottery picks until Curry is gone. He will be a UFA in summer of 2026 unless he's extended or traded away. Again, I think his intention is to play longer than that. So he will be up for another extension after he's turned 38.

Next two seasons, unless he falls off a cliff, which could happen with a serious injury possibly, the Warriors will be around a .500 team.

I don't know their draft picks the next 2-5 seasons but unlikely to get high lottery picks in the 2024 to 2026 drafts.

To reset the franchise, they need probably 3 or 4 top 5 picks, unless they hit on a mid first rounder big, something like Jalen Williams at #12 by OKC. In fact SGA himself was a mid first rounder, as was Kawhi Leonard, but it took them about 4 seasons before they became MVP-level players. Certainly when they were drafted, they were not projected as such.

So you really need high picks, which was the case for Lebron, KD, Embiid, Tatum who was #2 or #3. Curry was #7 and he became MVP after 5 or 6 seasons?

JK's ceiling is probably like the 3rd best player on a contender. So the Warriors have to draft and develop or trade for 2 players who would be better, like multiple all-stars, even all-NBA.

They may not get such players while JK is with the Warriors. In fact, they may not get such players for decades. Warriors have a long record of futility, as do other franchises, which draft in the top 7 of the lottery for a few years and still don't get too far.

With the CBA designed to weaken the teams which have accumulated the biggest payrolls, it's highly unlikely that Warriors can improve the team enough for the next 2-3 seasons, unless they trade away all their FRPs and even then it's unlikely.

So it will likely be a long 2-3 years before they can even think about starting to rebuild. All you can do is appreciate how well we've had it for about the past decade and hope it won't be another 40 years before the team wins another title.

[bicycle]

They're not going to get a lot back even if they decided to blow it up.

Can they even get say two FRPs for Curry which could become top 5 picks? He's signed for the next two years at $55.8 and $59.6 million. So the Warriors would have to take a lot of contracts back, probably bad contracts which are longer in duration.

Joe Lacob once said he'd rather trade a guy a year too early than a year too late, referring to exactly this problem. At the time I think he was just posturing for negotiations with Draymond and Klay, but it applies to Steph too. This year's trade deadline was probably the year too early mark. A year too late is next summer. People got mad at me earlier this season when I said I wouldn't be mad if they traded Steph, but we're just not going to be a contender anymore during his time so all he's doing here now is selling tickets and mentoring 21 year olds.

[ILOVEIT]

They're not going to get a lot back even if they decided to blow it up.

Can they even get say two FRPs for Curry which could become top 5 picks? He's signed for the next two years at $55.8 and $59.6 million. So the Warriors would have to take a lot of contracts back, probably bad contracts which are longer in duration.

The team won't be able to bottom out and turn its own picks into top 5 lottery picks until Curry is gone. He will be a UFA in summer of 2026 unless he's extended or traded away. Again, I think his intention is to play longer than that. So he will be up for another extension after he's turned 38.

Next two seasons, unless he falls off a cliff, which could happen with a serious injury possibly, the Warriors will be around a .500 team.

I don't know their draft picks the next 2-5 seasons but unlikely to get high lottery picks in the 2024 to 2026 drafts.

To reset the franchise, they need probably 3 or 4 top 5 picks, unless they hit on a mid first rounder big, something like Jalen Williams at #12 by OKC. In fact SGA himself was a mid first rounder, as was Kawhi Leonard, but it took them about 4 seasons before they became MVP-level players. Certainly when they were drafted, they were not projected as such.

So you really need high picks, which was the case for Lebron, KD, Embiid, Tatum who was #2 or #3. Curry was #7 and he became MVP after 5 or 6 seasons?

JK's ceiling is probably like the 3rd best player on a contender. So the Warriors have to draft and develop or trade for 2 players who would be better, like multiple all-stars, even all-NBA.

They may not get such players while JK is with the Warriors. In fact, they may not get such players for decades. Warriors have a long record of futility, as do other franchises, which draft in the top 7 of the lottery for a few years and still don't get too far.

With the CBA designed to weaken the teams which have accumulated the biggest payrolls, it's highly unlikely that Warriors can improve the team enough for the next 2-3 seasons, unless they trade away all their FRPs and even then it's unlikely.

So it will likely be a long 2-3 years before they can even think about starting to rebuild. All you can do is appreciate how well we've had it for about the past decade and hope it won't be another 40 years before the team wins another title.

Huh....I think a team like New York or Charlote would sell the farm to get Curry.

Dallas would take Wiggins and his cap space for a FRP.

That's at least three so far.

Draymond would nab another FRP from teams like Bucks, Lakers, Philly.

That's 4.

In two years....Warriors won't get crap for any of these guys. That's the point. Blow it up this Summer!

[floppymoose]

Joe Lacob once said he'd rather trade a guy a year too early than a year too late, referring to exactly this problem. At the time I think he was just posturing for negotiations with Draymond and Klay, but it applies to Steph too.

Last July:

“Certainly we’d like Steph, Draymond and Klay to retire as Warriors,” Lacob said. That’s my goal, our goal, and I think it’s a good likelihood that’ll happen.”

[sonnyhill]

They're not going to get a lot back even if they decided to blow it up.

Can they even get say two FRPs for Curry which could become top 5 picks? He's signed for the next two years at $55.8 and $59.6 million. So the Warriors would have to take a lot of contracts back, probably bad contracts which are longer in duration.

The team won't be able to bottom out and turn its own picks into top 5 lottery picks until Curry is gone. He will be a UFA in summer of 2026 unless he's extended or traded away. Again, I think his intention is to play longer than that. So he will be up for another extension after he's turned 38.

Next two seasons, unless he falls off a cliff, which could happen with a serious injury possibly, the Warriors will be around a .500 team.

I don't know their draft picks the next 2-5 seasons but unlikely to get high lottery picks in the 2024 to 2026 drafts.

To reset the franchise, they need probably 3 or 4 top 5 picks, unless they hit on a mid first rounder big, something like Jalen Williams at #12 by OKC. In fact SGA himself was a mid first rounder, as was Kawhi Leonard, but it took them about 4 seasons before they became MVP-level players. Certainly when they were drafted, they were not projected as such.

So you really need high picks, which was the case for Lebron, KD, Embiid, Tatum who was #2 or #3. Curry was #7 and he became MVP after 5 or 6 seasons?

JK's ceiling is probably like the 3rd best player on a contender. So the Warriors have to draft and develop or trade for 2 players who would be better, like multiple all-stars, even all-NBA.

They may not get such players while JK is with the Warriors. In fact, they may not get such players for decades. Warriors have a long record of futility, as do other franchises, which draft in the top 7 of the lottery for a few years and still don't get too far.

With the CBA designed to weaken the teams which have accumulated the biggest payrolls, it's highly unlikely that Warriors can improve the team enough for the next 2-3 seasons, unless they trade away all their FRPs and even then it's unlikely.

So it will likely be a long 2-3 years before they can even think about starting to rebuild. All you can do is appreciate how well we've had it for about the past decade and hope it won't be another 40 years before the team wins another title.

Huh....I think a team like New York or Charlote would sell the farm to get Curry.

Dallas would take Wiggins and his cap space for a FRP.

That's at least three so far.

Draymond would nab another FRP from teams like Bucks, Lakers, Philly.

That's 4.

In two years....Warriors won't get crap for any of these guys. That's the point. Blow it up this Summer!

Finally, an adult poster who is not viewing "Curry and the Collapsibles" through nostalgic and myopic rose-colored glasses.

Curry, Thompson, Green, Wiggins, Looney are all diminishing assets whose value only gets worse the longer that the team procrastinates in its dismantling.

[WarriorGM]

I can be as critical of this team as anyone but you guys are going overboard. Steph, Klay and Draymond weren't the reason for today's loss.

[Impuniti]

The Rockets have almost the same record as the Warriors, with no all stars (or ATG) and a much lower budget for their team (23) compared to the Warriors (1) while being in the same conference. For the people saying Kerr is not underachieving, what do you think about Ime?

[wco81]

The Rockets have almost the same record as the Warriors, with no all stars (or ATG) and a much lower budget for their team (23) compared to the Warriors (1) while being in the same conference. For the people saying Kerr is not underachieving, what do you think about Ime?

They're loaded with high lottery picks with very high ceilings.

They bottomed out after they traded away Harden.

Also notice, Udoka's teams have made two big jumps late in the season, first in his only season with the Celtics and now with the Rockets.

Whitmore has shown teams made a mistake not drafting him. That probably includes the Warriors. Podz has done much better than expectations but he doesn't have Whitmore's ceiling.


As far as whether this team gets into the play in or not, it doesn't matter, they weren't beating the Lakers. And even if they did, they weren't beating the #7 or #8 teams either. Then even if they got past that hurdle, they'd be playing OKC, Denver or Minnesota with KAT back.

[Impuniti]

The Rockets have almost the same record as the Warriors, with no all stars (or ATG) and a much lower budget for their team (23) compared to the Warriors (1) while being in the same conference. For the people saying Kerr is not underachieving, what do you think about Ime?

They're loaded with high lottery picks with very high ceilings.

They bottomed out after they traded away Harden.

Also notice, Udoka's teams have made two big jumps late in the season, first in his only season with the Celtics and now with the Rockets.

Whitmore has shown teams made a mistake not drafting him. That probably includes the Warriors. Podz has done much better than expectations but he doesn't have Whitmore's ceiling.


As far as whether this team gets into the play in or not, it doesn't matter, they weren't beating the Lakers. And even if they did, they weren't beating the #7 or #8 teams either. Then even if they got past that hurdle, they'd be playing OKC, Denver or Minnesota with KAT back.

I guess it's about different perspectives, but I'd rather have a team bow out in the 2nd round in 6 games than not even make 10th in a conference with Steph Curry and the highest wage bill in the league. This would give young guys like JK, TJD, Tide, + Moody. If this team attempts to acquire more talented role players this summer, there's more incentive in them joining a team that needs a few pieces to compete (how it could be perceived) rather than a team that couldn't make the playin despite having the highest wage bill in the league and plays embarrassing favoritism to their old, washed up egotistical players.

[wco81]

Well the game management of Curry shows that Kerr doesn't prioritize it. Maybe the organization doesn't either.

Because they're unlikely to survive the play in game unless the Lakers rise to a higher seed.

[Impuniti]

Well the game management of Curry shows that Kerr doesn't prioritize it. Maybe the organization doesn't either.

Because they're unlikely to survive the play in game unless the Lakers rise to a higher seed.

What does Kerr actually prioritize right now, I'd love to know because I genuinely have no idea.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

This is who they are.

They are smallish - older - slower at key positions and relying on three 21 year olds to get them into the play in.

Curry can flurry and it won't matter. Klay can have a big day every ten days and it won't matter. Cp is ancient. Draymond is nowhere near what he once was...and can do the Draymond thing about 15 minutes a game.

There is so much young talent in the league and the Warriors are just an old team hanging onto past glory.

Better to tank at this point, rest Curry, and take a run at FA this off season and REALLY consider blowing this up.

warriors good games look so much better than Warriors bad games. Which version of the Warriors are what the Warriors are?

Warriors can be good when Curry is good but like the Warriors team ver good Curry is a lot better than mediocre to good Curry.
Good Warriors win a play in game. Bad Warriors get blown out in aplay in game.

Inconsistent Warriors lose 4 games to 3 in a playoff series.

I wish I could take 10 years off of Curry, Klay and and Dray and make Looney healthy and roll with them Kuminga, Wiggins, Trayce, and Podz, Moody and Quinoes a a 7 foot 300 pound center to be named later and roll with that group for the next 10 years. But father time is going to turn us into a 30 win team and you will probably miss Draymond.

You can’t rplace Draymond with Kelly Oubre.

[KevinMcreynolds]

Well the game management of Curry shows that Kerr doesn't prioritize it. Maybe the organization doesn't either.

Because they're unlikely to survive the play in game unless the Lakers rise to a higher seed.

What does Kerr actually prioritize right now, I'd love to know because I genuinely have no idea.

his priority is the vets, always the vets

[Crazy-Canuck]

When jk and/or klay miss games or get less than 30 minutes, we are like 17-8 since the break. Seems like a rotation issue more than anything.

[watch1958]

Warriors have been lousy against the West. Their win streaks were against the Eastern teams. If they can’t sweep the next three they haven’t learned anything.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Draymond has done incredible things for this franchise.

But I'm still tired of him and would love, as a fan, to see a new chapter.

How will you feel about Draymond and the current Warriors after a decade of 30 win teams?

The only teams since the 3 point line that have won a championship with a new group of players in less than 20 years after their last championship are the Lakers. And the 2004 Pistons. Spurs changed most of their players between 1999 and 2014 but they still had Duncan.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

This is who they are.

They are smallish - older - slower at key positions and relying on three 21 year olds to get them into the play in.

Curry can flurry and it won't matter. Klay can have a big day every ten days and it won't matter. Cp is ancient. Draymond is nowhere near what he once was...and can do the Draymond thing about 15 minutes a game.

There is so much young talent in the league and the Warriors are just an old team hanging onto past glory.

Better to tank at this point, rest Curry, and take a run at FA this off season and REALLY consider blowing this up.

warriors good games look so much better than Warriors bad games. Which version of the Warriors are what the Warriors are?

Warriors can be good when Curry is good but like the Warriors team ver good Curry is a lot better than mediocre to good Curry.
Good Warriors win a play in game. Bad Warriors get blown out in aplay in game.

Inconsistent Warriors lose 4 games to 3 in a playoff series.

I wish I could take 10 years off of Curry, Klay and and Dray and make Looney healthy and roll with them Kuminga, Wiggins, Trayce, and Podz, Moody and Quinoes a a 7 foot 300 pound center to be named later and roll with that group for the next 10 years. But father time is going to turn us into a 30 win team and you will probably miss Draymond.

You can’t rplace Draymond with Kelly Oubre.

[Crazy-Canuck]

Wiggins is the X factor again. When hes good or Kerr gives him 30 minutes, the team has been elite (Obviously ignoring his horrid start). The problem is that we need him to be more aggressive, but kerr wants him to do it as the 4th or 5th option. Hes buried behind klay, jk, and podz right now. It goes back to kerrs insistence of playing 3 and 4 guard line ups where the guys who defend and rebound (Wiggs, Moody, even gp2) sit. Weve seen it all year. Play defense, dont play 3 guards at a time, and we win games. Its actually that simple. And when poor defenders play more than 30 minutes, we lose more than we win.