Am I the only one that's ok with letting Klay/Draymond ride it out

[svart]

if steph is ok with it then episodes like the chair-kicking in ORL were lebron-level farce.

i guess he still really believes that he can win with klay and dray

so will will have the #HeBelieves years

sadly, i don't believe.

I think a leader is always going to say he believes in who he's currently rolling with.. but if you look at how he acted on-court this season, he was never like that previously. And he played with James Wiseman and Kelly Oubre at the same time for half a season, which doesnt *necessarily* justify kicking a puppy, I'm just saying I'd have some level of understanding if he did it

So for him to have some of the reactions he did to long time teammates.. his actions and words just arent lining up

I really hope you're right.

[azwfan]

if steph is ok with it then episodes like the chair-kicking in ORL were lebron-level farce.

i guess he still really believes that he can win with klay and dray

so will will have the #HeBelieves years

sadly, i don't believe.

I think a leader is always going to say he believes in who he's currently rolling with.. but if you look at how he acted on-court this season, he was never like that previously. And he played with James Wiseman and Kelly Oubre at the same time for half a season, which doesnt *necessarily* justify kicking a puppy, I'm just saying I'd have some level of understanding if he did it

So for him to have some of the reactions he did to long time teammates.. his actions and words just arent lining up

If Klay gets re-signed, we can pretty confidently infer that at least Curry (if not more of the org) believes they need him to win. They will not resign him without Curry’s blessing (as with Draymond).

If Klay isnt back, we cant pretty much infer that Curry doesnt believe he’s gonna help us win (depending on how much Klay gets elsewhere).

They arent bringing him back nor letting him walk without Curry’s blessing.

All that said, Curry (and the vets in general) havent exactly been great at armchair roster construction so maybe we should do the opposite of what he wants.

[RUN-TJM]

I want Klay to retire.

Watching him play at the moment kills me. I love him and appreciate the joy his play has brought me but he is so broken I’d rather him retire than play for someone else.

[Impuniti]

i guess he still really believes that he can win with klay and dray

so will will have the #HeBelieves years

sadly, i don't believe.

I think a leader is always going to say he believes in who he's currently rolling with.. but if you look at how he acted on-court this season, he was never like that previously. And he played with James Wiseman and Kelly Oubre at the same time for half a season, which doesnt *necessarily* justify kicking a puppy, I'm just saying I'd have some level of understanding if he did it

So for him to have some of the reactions he did to long time teammates.. his actions and words just arent lining up

If Klay gets re-signed, we can pretty confidently infer that at least Curry (if not more of the org) believes they need him to win. They will not resign him without Curry’s blessing (as with Draymond).

If Klay isnt back, we cant pretty much infer that Curry doesnt believe he’s gonna help us win (depending on how much Klay gets elsewhere).

They arent bringing him back nor letting him walk without Curry’s blessing.

All that said, Curry (and the vets in general) havent exactly been great at armchair roster construction so maybe we should do the opposite of what he wants.

Letting players completely run the team is what small loser FO do. I just have to burst laughing imagining these guys, especially Draymond telling Guardiola, Sir Alex or Jupp Heynckess what should be happening in roster construction or how a team is built. Even Steph would get told to STFU and get back to playing the game.

Players should be kept in the loop what's happening and hear them out on their thoughts, then you do what's best for the team. This organization clearly doesn't know how to do that.

[Onus]

I want Klay to retire.

Watching him play at the moment kills me. I love him and appreciate the joy his play has brought me but he is so broken I’d rather him retire than play for someone else.

He probably should retire but why retire when someone is willing to pay you 20+M/year

[Chris Porter's Hair]

Dray is still a legit NBA player. If he can keep his tough guy clown act in check, then why not ride it?

Klay OTOH is barely hanging on as an NBA player. Kerr, Steph, Dray, and the Ws FO are all publicly saying positive things at this time, but behind the scenes they are certainly going to let Klay test the market, and deep down the FO probably hopes he takes an offer somewhere else. I'm not sure there's a real market around the league for Klay. Klay's D abandoned him with the injuries. And without his elite shooting, there's really nothing left of value.

A couple weeks ago I was thinking that after testing the FA waters, he'd be back at around 2/24. Now after last night's 0-10 sh*t show, his market price may be so low that Klay actually contemplates retirement instead. That would be best for the Ws FO and the fans, but I'm not sure Klay's aligned with that. Some players are content just getting paid to exercise and play ball, even if it means being a bit player a la late Vince Carter or Jeff Green.

This was my first thought. It confuses the question a bit to act like Draymond and Klay are in the same boat. If we part ways with Draymond because of shenanigans, I could be fine with that, but I feel very confident we'd become a worse team and it would take a pretty significant rebuild to turn us into a different team that could win again. Klay on the other hand... I've loved the guy, and I appreciate all he's done. But if the nav broke in his car and he had just failed to show up for all our games, I'm not 100% confident we would have been worse last season. And even if we would have, I don't think it is at all out of the question we could have replaced him and rolled onward.

Even if there was a conscious decision that we were just going to ride these 3 guys into the sunset, knowing it would probably mean no more titles, I could live with that. But at this point, from a basketball perspective, Klay is a replaceable part. Draymond is a critical piece of how we do what we do, and not really replaceable. Crazy, but irreplaceable.

[azwfan]

I think a leader is always going to say he believes in who he's currently rolling with.. but if you look at how he acted on-court this season, he was never like that previously. And he played with James Wiseman and Kelly Oubre at the same time for half a season, which doesnt *necessarily* justify kicking a puppy, I'm just saying I'd have some level of understanding if he did it

So for him to have some of the reactions he did to long time teammates.. his actions and words just arent lining up

If Klay gets re-signed, we can pretty confidently infer that at least Curry (if not more of the org) believes they need him to win. They will not resign him without Curry’s blessing (as with Draymond).

If Klay isnt back, we cant pretty much infer that Curry doesnt believe he’s gonna help us win (depending on how much Klay gets elsewhere).

They arent bringing him back nor letting him walk without Curry’s blessing.

All that said, Curry (and the vets in general) havent exactly been great at armchair roster construction so maybe we should do the opposite of what he wants.

Letting players completely run the team is what small loser FO do. I just have to burst laughing imagining these guys, especially Draymond telling Guardiola, Sir Alex or Jupp Heynckess what should be happening in roster construction or how a team is built. Even Steph would get told to STFU and get back to playing the game.

Players should be kept in the loop what's happening and hear them out on their thoughts, then you do what's best for the team. This organization clearly doesn't know how to do that.

There is a difference between getting the blessing of your best player and “letting the players run the team”.

But agree with the sentiment. It just is the most logical conclusion. If the Duns gone wild comes up to Curry and tells him they are planning to move on from Klay, and Curry starts throwing his mouthpiece and kicking chairs, they are at the very least going to talk with Curry till he’s okay with it.

If Curry really wants Klay gone, he’s going to let it be known to the FO. And the FO is gonna listen. Its just logical. One does not commit large sums of money to an individual that your best player, the face of the franchise, and the most accomplished player in franchise history doesnt want around.

[azwfan]

Dray is still a legit NBA player. If he can keep his tough guy clown act in check, then why not ride it?

Klay OTOH is barely hanging on as an NBA player. Kerr, Steph, Dray, and the Ws FO are all publicly saying positive things at this time, but behind the scenes they are certainly going to let Klay test the market, and deep down the FO probably hopes he takes an offer somewhere else. I'm not sure there's a real market around the league for Klay. Klay's D abandoned him with the injuries. And without his elite shooting, there's really nothing left of value.

A couple weeks ago I was thinking that after testing the FA waters, he'd be back at around 2/24. Now after last night's 0-10 sh*t show, his market price may be so low that Klay actually contemplates retirement instead. That would be best for the Ws FO and the fans, but I'm not sure Klay's aligned with that. Some players are content just getting paid to exercise and play ball, even if it means being a bit player a la late Vince Carter or Jeff Green.

This was my first thought. It confuses the question a bit to act like Draymond and Klay are in the same boat. If we part ways with Draymond because of shenanigans, I could be fine with that, but I feel very confident we'd become a worse team and it would take a pretty significant rebuild to turn us into a different team that could win again. Klay on the other hand... I've loved the guy, and I appreciate all he's done. But if the nav broke in his car and he had just failed to show up for all our games, I'm not 100% confident we would have been worse last season. And even if we would have, I don't think it is at all out of the question we could have replaced him and rolled onward.

Even if there was a conscious decision that we were just going to ride these 3 guys into the sunset, knowing it would probably mean no more titles, I could live with that. But at this point, from a basketball perspective, Klay is a replaceable part. Draymond is a critical piece of how we do what we do, and not really replaceable. Crazy, but irreplaceable.

The dubs got bounced from the play-in as a relatively healthy team. Is maintaining how we do what we do really a priority? I think the dubs need to adjust at the core what they do.

Assuming the odds stay where they are, gsw will have their own pick next season, why not make the adjustment now? The worst that could happen is that they are a significantly worst team than the late lotto team they currently are.

I suppose if one believes theres a deal that can be made that vaults this team into contention, AND one thinks Draymond wont do what hes done the past 2 seasons, then i can see the logic in pushing in that direction. I just dont see it / believe it.

[Chris Porter's Hair]

Dray is still a legit NBA player. If he can keep his tough guy clown act in check, then why not ride it?

Klay OTOH is barely hanging on as an NBA player. Kerr, Steph, Dray, and the Ws FO are all publicly saying positive things at this time, but behind the scenes they are certainly going to let Klay test the market, and deep down the FO probably hopes he takes an offer somewhere else. I'm not sure there's a real market around the league for Klay. Klay's D abandoned him with the injuries. And without his elite shooting, there's really nothing left of value.

A couple weeks ago I was thinking that after testing the FA waters, he'd be back at around 2/24. Now after last night's 0-10 sh*t show, his market price may be so low that Klay actually contemplates retirement instead. That would be best for the Ws FO and the fans, but I'm not sure Klay's aligned with that. Some players are content just getting paid to exercise and play ball, even if it means being a bit player a la late Vince Carter or Jeff Green.

This was my first thought. It confuses the question a bit to act like Draymond and Klay are in the same boat. If we part ways with Draymond because of shenanigans, I could be fine with that, but I feel very confident we'd become a worse team and it would take a pretty significant rebuild to turn us into a different team that could win again. Klay on the other hand... I've loved the guy, and I appreciate all he's done. But if the nav broke in his car and he had just failed to show up for all our games, I'm not 100% confident we would have been worse last season. And even if we would have, I don't think it is at all out of the question we could have replaced him and rolled onward.

Even if there was a conscious decision that we were just going to ride these 3 guys into the sunset, knowing it would probably mean no more titles, I could live with that. But at this point, from a basketball perspective, Klay is a replaceable part. Draymond is a critical piece of how we do what we do, and not really replaceable. Crazy, but irreplaceable.

The dubs got bounced from the play-in as a relatively healthy team. Is maintaining how we do what we do really a priority? I think the dubs need to adjust at the core what they do.

Assuming the odds stay where they are, gsw will have their own pick next season, why not make the adjustment now? The worst that could happen is that they are a significantly worst team than the late lotto team they currently are.

I suppose if one believes theres a deal that can be made that vaults this team into contention, AND one thinks Draymond wont do what hes done the past 2 seasons, then i can see the logic in pushing in that direction. I just dont see it / believe it.

Really, we could do a lot of things, make a lot of choices, go in a lot of different directions. But if the choice is to try to build this team around a different system, I think it is extremely unlikely you work out the kinks and become competitive while Curry is still playing at this level. You could choose to do it anyway, it just depends what your overall goals are.

[azwfan]

This was my first thought. It confuses the question a bit to act like Draymond and Klay are in the same boat. If we part ways with Draymond because of shenanigans, I could be fine with that, but I feel very confident we'd become a worse team and it would take a pretty significant rebuild to turn us into a different team that could win again. Klay on the other hand... I've loved the guy, and I appreciate all he's done. But if the nav broke in his car and he had just failed to show up for all our games, I'm not 100% confident we would have been worse last season. And even if we would have, I don't think it is at all out of the question we could have replaced him and rolled onward.

Even if there was a conscious decision that we were just going to ride these 3 guys into the sunset, knowing it would probably mean no more titles, I could live with that. But at this point, from a basketball perspective, Klay is a replaceable part. Draymond is a critical piece of how we do what we do, and not really replaceable. Crazy, but irreplaceable.

The dubs got bounced from the play-in as a relatively healthy team. Is maintaining how we do what we do really a priority? I think the dubs need to adjust at the core what they do.

Assuming the odds stay where they are, gsw will have their own pick next season, why not make the adjustment now? The worst that could happen is that they are a significantly worst team than the late lotto team they currently are.

I suppose if one believes theres a deal that can be made that vaults this team into contention, AND one thinks Draymond wont do what hes done the past 2 seasons, then i can see the logic in pushing in that direction. I just dont see it / believe it.

Really, we could do a lot of things, make a lot of choices, go in a lot of different directions. But if the choice is to try to build this team around a different system, I think it is extremely unlikely you work out the kinks and become competitive while Curry is still playing at this level. You could choose to do it anyway, it just depends what your overall goals are.

I think the days of Curry being the best player on a title team are over. Likely not even the best player on a contender. He’s just not consistent as he was.

So, if we can get someone better than Curry, sure lets do that. I just dont see that in the cards.

Watching the playoffs this weekend and it seemed to me that the dubs arent close to that level.

So since i dont see contention now as viable, I think its prudent to set our selves up for the future.

1) repair the culture (no more core players and living in the past)
2) adjust the system to not needing a phd in basketball iq in order to succeed.
3) acquire and develop more talent

That doesnt mean we NEED to slash and burn the old guard, but they definitely need a reality check. I simply dont trust Draymond to keep his emotions and ego in check long enough to not be a distraction and not be a poor influence on the guys hes supposed to be mentoring.

[Chris Porter's Hair]

The dubs got bounced from the play-in as a relatively healthy team. Is maintaining how we do what we do really a priority? I think the dubs need to adjust at the core what they do.

Assuming the odds stay where they are, gsw will have their own pick next season, why not make the adjustment now? The worst that could happen is that they are a significantly worst team than the late lotto team they currently are.

I suppose if one believes theres a deal that can be made that vaults this team into contention, AND one thinks Draymond wont do what hes done the past 2 seasons, then i can see the logic in pushing in that direction. I just dont see it / believe it.

Really, we could do a lot of things, make a lot of choices, go in a lot of different directions. But if the choice is to try to build this team around a different system, I think it is extremely unlikely you work out the kinks and become competitive while Curry is still playing at this level. You could choose to do it anyway, it just depends what your overall goals are.

I think the days of Curry being the best player on a title team are over. Likely not even the best player on a contender. He’s just not consistent as he was.

So, if we can get someone better than Curry, sure lets do that. I just dont see that in the cards.

Watching the playoffs this weekend and it seemed to me that the dubs arent close to that level.

So since i dont see contention now as viable, I think its prudent to set our selves up for the future.

1) repair the culture (no more core players and living in the past)
2) adjust the system to not needing a phd in basketball iq in order to succeed.
3) acquire and develop more talent

That doesnt mean we NEED to slash and burn the old guard, but they definitely need a reality check. I simply dont trust Draymond to keep his emotions and ego in check long enough to not be a distraction and not be a poor influence on the guys hes supposed to be mentoring.

That's all fair. I definitely think Curry could be the best player on a title team now, but it probably isn't this team heh Going into the play-in, my thinking was that we definitely weren't the best team in the league, probably not even top 3 to 5, but were good enough to scare or upset some better teams if all the cards fell right. But it would have taken a perfect storm for us to even think about a title.

If we decide that is what it is and we're going to start preparing for the next generation of contention, I'd probably be okay with that. Realistically if you go hard down that path, you'd probably be wise to move Curry, and that would make me sad. And if he didn't want to leave, I honestly might not even be okay with it.

If we decide we're going to forestall that effort a few years, I'm okay with that too. The only part of it I might not be okay with is letting Klay continue to play on in the delusion that he's the same guy he was 3 or 4 years ago, and he just needs to put up some more shots to get in rhythm. If we lose a few, we lose a few. If we lose a few because we're just doing dumb stuff, that gets frustrating to watch. Similarly, if Draymond keeps doing stuff that makes it embarrassing to be a fan of the team or harms the development of the young guys, I'm not okay with that. Your reality check comment is spot on.

[TB]

Here is a question for everyone... how would you feel with this offseason that assumes we 1) don't have any big trades materialize, 2) stick with the core, 3) stick with Kuminga/Moody since no trades work out, 4) get under the lux tax

- Re-sign Klay to 2/24
- Let CP3 walk
- Restructure GP2 to 2/12
- Waive Looney (3m still on books)
- Sign Goga to 2/24
- Sign Kris Dunn to 2/10
- min for Lester, Gui, Garuba

This would put us right under the Lux Tax with the following depth chart:

Steph / Podz / Dunn
Wiggins / GP2 / Quinones
Kuminga / Klay
Dray / Moody / Santos
Goga / Trayce / Garuba

This is essentially my "best case of the worst case" scenario. I think this team can be a top 6 seed if Steph/Dray are healthy.

[Onus]

Here is a question for everyone... how would you feel with this offseason that assumes we 1) don't have any big trades materialize, 2) stick with the core, 3) stick with Kuminga/Moody since no trades work out, 4) get under the lux tax

- Re-sign Klay to 2/24
- Let CP3 walk
- Restructure GP2 to 2/12
- Waive Looney (3m still on books)
- Sign Goga to 2/24
- Sign Kris Dunn to 2/10
- min for Lester, Gui, Garuba

This would put us right under the Lux Tax with the following depth chart:

Steph / Podz / Dunn
Wiggins / GP2 / Quinones
Kuminga / Klay
Dray / Moody / Santos
Goga / Trayce / Garuba

This is essentially my "best case of the worst case" scenario. I think this team can be a top 6 seed if Steph/Dray are healthy.

That starting lineup most likely doesn't work. which means we spend all year trying to find a working rotation again. Have no faith in Kerr being able to do that. There's no stretch big that we can play.

Also why would Dunn sign here to be a 3rd string pg when he can just sign with the jazz again to be the back up pg?

[TB]

Here is a question for everyone... how would you feel with this offseason that assumes we 1) don't have any big trades materialize, 2) stick with the core, 3) stick with Kuminga/Moody since no trades work out, 4) get under the lux tax

- Re-sign Klay to 2/24
- Let CP3 walk
- Restructure GP2 to 2/12
- Waive Looney (3m still on books)
- Sign Goga to 2/24
- Sign Kris Dunn to 2/10
- min for Lester, Gui, Garuba

This would put us right under the Lux Tax with the following depth chart:

Steph / Podz / Dunn
Wiggins / GP2 / Quinones
Kuminga / Klay
Dray / Moody / Santos
Goga / Trayce / Garuba

This is essentially my "best case of the worst case" scenario. I think this team can be a top 6 seed if Steph/Dray are healthy.

That starting lineup most likely doesn't work. which means we spend all year trying to find a working rotation again. Have no faith in Kerr being able to do that. There's no stretch big that we can play.

Also why would Dunn sign here to be a 3rd string pg when he can just sign with the jazz again to be the back up pg?

Ya the first point is sort of the issue with any lineup that involves keeping Dray and Kuminga...

Dunn I put there but sort of assume he'd play with Podz a lot. Even could play with Steph. In this scenario he'd be getting more than minimum salary to play for a better team than the Jazz (in theory).

[azwfan]

Here is a question for everyone... how would you feel with this offseason that assumes we 1) don't have any big trades materialize, 2) stick with the core, 3) stick with Kuminga/Moody since no trades work out, 4) get under the lux tax

- Re-sign Klay to 2/24
- Let CP3 walk
- Restructure GP2 to 2/12
- Waive Looney (3m still on books)
- Sign Goga to 2/24
- Sign Kris Dunn to 2/10
- min for Lester, Gui, Garuba

This would put us right under the Lux Tax with the following depth chart:

Steph / Podz / Dunn
Wiggins / GP2 / Quinones
Kuminga / Klay
Dray / Moody / Santos
Goga / Trayce / Garuba

This is essentially my "best case of the worst case" scenario. I think this team can be a top 6 seed if Steph/Dray are healthy.

Depending on minutes distribution, I see this as a worse team than last season.
‘24 Curry > ‘25 Curry
‘24 Dray > ‘25 Dray
Who knows with Klay
Who knows with Wiggins
Who knows with GP2

Kuminga, Moody, TJD, and Podz i would expect improvement but no idea on the degree of improvement… nor how many minutes.

I like that there is some more size (Goga), but the team lacks shooting especially in the front court.

[azwfan]

A good thing about getting Goga would be the nickname potential when he inevitably arrives in the boards doghouse. Lady Goga seems too perfect.

[Onus]

Here is a question for everyone... how would you feel with this offseason that assumes we 1) don't have any big trades materialize, 2) stick with the core, 3) stick with Kuminga/Moody since no trades work out, 4) get under the lux tax

- Re-sign Klay to 2/24
- Let CP3 walk
- Restructure GP2 to 2/12
- Waive Looney (3m still on books)
- Sign Goga to 2/24
- Sign Kris Dunn to 2/10
- min for Lester, Gui, Garuba

This would put us right under the Lux Tax with the following depth chart:

Steph / Podz / Dunn
Wiggins / GP2 / Quinones
Kuminga / Klay
Dray / Moody / Santos
Goga / Trayce / Garuba

This is essentially my "best case of the worst case" scenario. I think this team can be a top 6 seed if Steph/Dray are healthy.

That starting lineup most likely doesn't work. which means we spend all year trying to find a working rotation again. Have no faith in Kerr being able to do that. There's no stretch big that we can play.

Also why would Dunn sign here to be a 3rd string pg when he can just sign with the jazz again to be the back up pg?

Ya the first point is sort of the issue with any lineup that involves keeping Dray and Kuminga...

Dunn I put there but sort of assume he'd play with Podz a lot. Even could play with Steph. In this scenario he'd be getting more than minimum salary to play for a better team than the Jazz (in theory).

I agree in theory Dunn could play with either but that just means we most likely play small again. Something like Dunn/Podz/GP2/Klay/TJD. And I'd really want to see what Moody/Gui can do

[azwfan]

That starting lineup most likely doesn't work. which means we spend all year trying to find a working rotation again. Have no faith in Kerr being able to do that. There's no stretch big that we can play.

Also why would Dunn sign here to be a 3rd string pg when he can just sign with the jazz again to be the back up pg?

Ya the first point is sort of the issue with any lineup that involves keeping Dray and Kuminga...

Dunn I put there but sort of assume he'd play with Podz a lot. Even could play with Steph. In this scenario he'd be getting more than minimum salary to play for a better team than the Jazz (in theory).

I agree in theory Dunn could play with either but that just means we most likely play small again. Something like Dunn/Podz/GP2/Klay/TJD. And I'd really want to see what Moody/Gui can do

Kerr: “Ok, Gui replaces TJD then”

[Maxthirty]

It’s weird to see supposed “fans” acting like Klay and Draymond are at all alike. Draymond is still playing great. Klay otoh… not so much. I still think he has value in the league but he needs to accept a different role. One where he passes more than he shoots.

Also, Steph and Draymond aren’t being separated unless Steph explicitly says so. I doubt that happens.

[TB]

It’s weird to see supposed “fans” acting like Klay and Draymond are at all alike. Draymond is still playing great. Klay otoh… not so much. I still think he has value in the league but he needs to accept a different role. One where he passes more than he shoots.

Also, Steph and Draymond aren’t being separated unless Steph explicitly says so. I doubt that happens.

Klay will never pass up shots. Kerr just needs to put him in a bench microwave scorer role where he is sat back down if he isn't shooting well. If he is shooting well, great, play him 25+ minutes and let him go wild.

If Kerr isn't able to do that, they need to let Klay sign somewhere else. Dubs cannot go another year with Steph/Klay starting together... its too much of a defensive disaster.