Trade Idea Thread II

[rickrolled]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kxu893x

[Forte IV]

Just stop. That trade won't happen. Hawes is finally playing good and Barnes is having a career shooting year. No point in trading away both for a washed up Prince and a couple of trade exceptions.

[TucsonClip]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/RowanKavner/status/559958338117439488[/tweet]

Based on this ^

BOS gets: Seraphin, one of Sacramentos smaller contracts with (Wright TPE), 7.7 million TPE

WAS gets: Barnes with (Ariza TPE), 3.9 million TPE, cash from LAC

LAC gets: Prince, 5.3 million TPE, 3.4 million TPE

SAC gets: Hawes with (Terry TPE), BKN 2nd rounder 2016, minor TPE

Washington trades Seraphin in order not to pay luxury tax for Barnes, plus cash because he'd be out for a while but when he's back he is good as a bench player. Doubt they'd re-sign Seraphin, get something instead of nothing since Barnes is a team option next season and Pierce may opt out from his contract.

Clippers and Doc corrects the mistake they did by signing Hawes by only trading a 2nd round pick and getting a vet SF. In addition getting 2 large TPE's.

Boston sheds some costs and creates a larger TPE.

Sacramento wants frontocurt help and have been in rumours about willing to trade Stauskas.

Considering we have nearly 0 future assets to trade those TPE exceptions are no where near worth Hawes and Barnes.

[kylem4711]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kxu893x

any way we could get blake griffin in that trade for another TPE?

[Neddy]

Come on now Neddy, you're just assuming every time he underperforms it has to be tied to blazing, and I seriously doubt it's that direct of a correlation, if there is any at all. Are we gonna pretend that when he was tearing offenses apart a couple seasons ago he wasn't smoking? In any case, if his underwhelming performance was actually related to smoking, he shouldn't be treated in a different way than, say OJ Mayo when he was playing like sh*t cause he decided to get fat and come out of shape into the season.

I have a big issue with two of the things you say, one's assuming NBA players are there because they won the genetic lottery (blatantly false, you need to have the genes AND work your ass off like few people in the world do), and another is feelin entitled to tell someone how to live their life just because you paid a $50 ticket to watch a basketball game.

dude you know i love every each poster in this clipper forum other than the purple and piss converts, but i have to make another rebuttal.

a very large group among us try their best and hardest every and each day, regardless what they do.

some are students putting away 8 hours a day in lecture halls with another 8 hours studying what they were lectured on at their graduate/professional school every day. ( your typical medical / dental / pharmacy / or math and science phD program kids)

some are our firemen, policemen, mailmen, or soldiers who live every waking hour to serve others.

of all sports, basketball is the most genetically biased sport. we all grew up with great ballers on the black top ( at least among those from say, southern cal where the weather permits such) who gave at least 6 to 8 hours every day playing ball, and are great at it. but i have known some of the best PGs who are 5-1 vietnamese, some of the best PFs who were 5-11 samoan, some of the best centers of all time outdoor who were 6-2 latino. no matter how much work these guys put in, they had zero chance from the get go to the pros.

Gilbert Arenas came from my high school, although he was much younger and came around after i was long gone, but I knew coach Levin even if he has forgotten about me after all these years, and also i do know that Gilbert was already bigger and stronger than everybody at his position in high school because I knew the kids he had to beat out to make the team. it's not much of a competition when a 6-4 PG is going against 5.6 at the same position. I am not saying Gilbert didn't put in the work, but i certainly know a ton of people who put in as much as he did or those who put in twice but couldn't make it.

I believe baseball is a game of repetition. you don't have to throw 90 mph fastball or be capable to clear the field as a slugger, you can be a scrappy leadoff hitter as a middle infielder if you put your work into it and you are not a complete athletic moron.

you can be a big guy with a ton of heart and practice from every dusk til dawn to make yourself a pro level guard or a tight end.

but no matter how much you work on your game, if you are a 6-2 center or 5-1 PG, you don't have a shot.

and frankly, I don't know if coach levin was thrilled with Gilert Arena's work ethic from what i heard.

again, not saying these guys simply make it with their genes, but they surely don't have to put in as much as those who are already so much genetically inferior.

this is no different than a guy with a two digit IQ trying to hang with a kid who is a mensa member. one simply does not have what it takes regardless how much he puts his work in it. a high IQ guy with just an above average work ethic can beat a below average gifted child with the best work ethic. i have seen this over and over again and know that everyone is not equal from their given set of nature.


PS - the last time i remember having a decent seat for 50 bucks was when the clips were playing at the sports arena ( the bleachers were like 7 bucks at the game time or sometimes even free if you were lucky enough to grab some of DTS' tax write off special donations, but Im talking the floor level seats) or the old school Oakland games in the last millennium. nowadays those floor level seats cost some pretty penny.

[QRich3]

dude you know i love every each poster in this clipper forum other than the purple and piss converts, but i have to make another rebuttal.

a very large group among us try their best and hardest every and each day, regardless what they do.

some are students putting away 8 hours a day in lecture halls with another 8 hours studying what they were lectured on at their graduate/professional school every day. ( your typical medical / dental / pharmacy / or math and science phD program kids)

some are our firemen, policemen, mailmen, or soldiers who live every waking hour to serve others.

of all sports, basketball is the most genetically biased sport. we all grew up with great ballers on the black top ( at least among those from say, southern cal where the weather permits such) who gave at least 6 to 8 hours every day playing ball, and are great at it. but i have known some of the best PGs who are 5-1 vietnamese, some of the best PFs who were 5-11 samoan, some of the best centers of all time outdoor who were 6-2 latino. no matter how much work these guys put in, they had zero chance from the get go to the pros.

Gilbert Arenas came from my high school, although he was much younger and came around after i was long gone, but I knew coach Levin even if he has forgotten about me after all these years, and also i do know that Gilbert was already bigger and stronger than everybody at his position in high school because I knew the kids he had to beat out to make the team. it's not much of a competition when a 6-4 PG is going against 5.6 at the same position. I am not saying Gilbert didn't put in the work, but i certainly know a ton of people who put in as much as he did or those who put in twice but couldn't make it.

I believe baseball is a game of repetition. you don't have to throw 90 mph fastball or be capable to clear the field as a slugger, you can be a scrappy leadoff hitter as a middle infielder if you put your work into it and you are not a complete athletic moron.

you can be a big guy with a ton of heart and practice from every dusk til dawn to make yourself a pro level guard or a tight end.

but no matter how much you work on your game, if you are a 6-2 center or 5-1 PG, you don't have a shot.

and frankly, I don't know if coach levin was thrilled with Gilert Arena's work ethic from what i heard.

again, not saying these guys simply make it with their genes, but they surely don't have to put in as much as those who are already so much genetically inferior.

this is no different than a guy with a two digit IQ trying to hang with a kid who is a mensa member. one simply does not have what it takes regardless how much he puts his work in it. a high IQ guy with just an above average work ethic can beat a below average gifted child with the best work ethic. i have seen this over and over again and know that everyone is not equal from their given set of nature.


PS - the last time i remember having a decent seat for 50 bucks was when the clips were playing at the sports arena ( the bleachers were like 7 bucks at the game time or sometimes even free if you were lucky enough to grab some of DTS' tax write off special donations, but Im talking the floor level seats) or the old school Oakland games in the last millennium. nowadays those floor level seats cost some pretty penny.

It's all good, we can love each other as fellow Clipper fans and still disagree strongly on many subjects, that's what forums are for We're still gonna be virtually toasting, drunk on our asses, when (NOT IF, WHEN) the Clippers finally give us a championship some day

Of course there's a lot of people in the world working hard, but we're talking about being the very elite in the world at a profession that mostly everybody would love to have. That takes a special kind of effort, as much natural talent as some guys can have. And I get your point about basketball being the most genetically biased sport, and I agree that if you're 5'3'' it doesn't matter how hard you work. But still, you can be 6'10'' and very talented at playing the game, there's still A LOT of people like you trying their best to be an NBA player all around the world. You're not gonna make it to the NBA, hell you're not even gonna make it to any good foreign professional league, unless you're a bball maniac.

Even the most lazy NBA players, you talk about Arenas, some guys talk about our own Jamal Crawford who's said he doesn't work on his game over the summer, even those naturally gifted guys are obsessed with basketball in an unhealthy way, and have spent many hours of every week of their lives doing repetitive drills, working out until exhaustion, etc. My point is, you don't take that away because someone decides he likes to spend his free time smoking weed. Even if it affects their performance (I don't think it's necessarily the case here), you don't treat him differently from Artest drinking Hennessy at halftime, or Felton not taking care of his conditioning. Not in 2015.

My point about the $50 ticket was about the classic fan stance of "oh he gets paid millions to play a game, he has no right to complain" (and from what I've read from you here, I don't think you fit this profile but I still wanted to make that point), that's a very dangerous territory and brings back really bad memories of another era. They make millions because they've worked hard to be in that position, and the fact that any fan saying that hasn't been able to find that success doesn't take anything away from their accomplishments. It's very dangerous behavior to try to police people's lives on the grounds of them having a great job and earning a lot of money. Specially when most of those people having that job are of a certain social background, as NBA players are.

[Neddy]

dude you know i love every each poster in this clipper forum other than the purple and piss converts, but i have to make another rebuttal.

a very large group among us try their best and hardest every and each day, regardless what they do.

some are students putting away 8 hours a day in lecture halls with another 8 hours studying what they were lectured on at their graduate/professional school every day. ( your typical medical / dental / pharmacy / or math and science phD program kids)

some are our firemen, policemen, mailmen, or soldiers who live every waking hour to serve others.

of all sports, basketball is the most genetically biased sport. we all grew up with great ballers on the black top ( at least among those from say, southern cal where the weather permits such) who gave at least 6 to 8 hours every day playing ball, and are great at it. but i have known some of the best PGs who are 5-1 vietnamese, some of the best PFs who were 5-11 samoan, some of the best centers of all time outdoor who were 6-2 latino. no matter how much work these guys put in, they had zero chance from the get go to the pros.

Gilbert Arenas came from my high school, although he was much younger and came around after i was long gone, but I knew coach Levin even if he has forgotten about me after all these years, and also i do know that Gilbert was already bigger and stronger than everybody at his position in high school because I knew the kids he had to beat out to make the team. it's not much of a competition when a 6-4 PG is going against 5.6 at the same position. I am not saying Gilbert didn't put in the work, but i certainly know a ton of people who put in as much as he did or those who put in twice but couldn't make it.

I believe baseball is a game of repetition. you don't have to throw 90 mph fastball or be capable to clear the field as a slugger, you can be a scrappy leadoff hitter as a middle infielder if you put your work into it and you are not a complete athletic moron.

you can be a big guy with a ton of heart and practice from every dusk til dawn to make yourself a pro level guard or a tight end.

but no matter how much you work on your game, if you are a 6-2 center or 5-1 PG, you don't have a shot.

and frankly, I don't know if coach levin was thrilled with Gilert Arena's work ethic from what i heard.

again, not saying these guys simply make it with their genes, but they surely don't have to put in as much as those who are already so much genetically inferior.

this is no different than a guy with a two digit IQ trying to hang with a kid who is a mensa member. one simply does not have what it takes regardless how much he puts his work in it. a high IQ guy with just an above average work ethic can beat a below average gifted child with the best work ethic. i have seen this over and over again and know that everyone is not equal from their given set of nature.


PS - the last time i remember having a decent seat for 50 bucks was when the clips were playing at the sports arena ( the bleachers were like 7 bucks at the game time or sometimes even free if you were lucky enough to grab some of DTS' tax write off special donations, but Im talking the floor level seats) or the old school Oakland games in the last millennium. nowadays those floor level seats cost some pretty penny.

It's all good, we can love each other as fellow Clipper fans and still disagree strongly on many subjects, that's what forums are for We're still gonna be virtually toasting, drunk on our asses, when (NOT IF, WHEN) the Clippers finally give us a championship some day

Of course there's a lot of people in the world working hard, but we're talking about being the very elite in the world at a profession that mostly everybody would love to have. That takes a special kind of effort, as much natural talent as some guys can have. And I get your point about basketball being the most genetically biased sport, and I agree that if you're 5'3'' it doesn't matter how hard you work. But still, you can be 6'10'' and very talented at playing the game, there's still A LOT of people like you trying their best to be an NBA player all around the world. You're not gonna make it to the NBA, hell you're not even gonna make it to any good foreign professional league, unless you're a bball maniac.

Even the most lazy NBA players, you talk about Arenas, some guys talk about our own Jamal Crawford who's said he doesn't work on his game over the summer, even those naturally gifted guys are obsessed with basketball in an unhealthy way, and have spent many hours of every week of their lives doing repetitive drills, working out until exhaustion, etc. My point is, you don't take that away because someone decides he likes to spend his free time smoking weed. Even if it affects their performance (I don't think it's necessarily the case here), you don't treat him differently from Artest drinking Hennessy at halftime, or Felton not taking care of his conditioning. Not in 2015.

My point about the $50 ticket was about the classic fan stance of "oh he gets paid millions to play a game, he has no right to complain" (and from what I've read from you here, I don't think you fit this profile but I still wanted to make that point), that's a very dangerous territory and brings back really bad memories of another era. They make millions because they've worked hard to be in that position, and the fact that any fan saying that hasn't been able to find that success doesn't take anything away from their accomplishments. It's very dangerous behavior to try to police people's lives on the grounds of them having a great job and earning a lot of money. Specially when most of those people having that job are of a certain social background, as NBA players are.

I hear what you are saying about individual rights of privacy, but just like when presidents get a blow job from some one other than his wife, he goes to a congressional hearing, being rich and powerful also comes with some territory of responsibility in the eyes of the public. people who are professionals as doctors, lawyers, public accountants in a small town can't afford a single public drunken stupor as he or she risks losing his or her business altogether or at least risk a major impact as the locals who are in lesser socio-economic groups hold those with perceived better educated, and higher income earning people to a higher standard. having said that, there is not a single honest doctor who earns more than the minimum waged pro athletes in north america among the four major sports. there isn't a lawyer who is more influential than your average pro athlete.

you brought a point which i feel very strongly about. the demographic of majority of the players who make up the NBA players union are minorities. I hate seeing Richard Sherman acting a damn fool on TV because i know he is a highly intelligent man who graduated with honors from Stanford university in 3 years when most in America takes 5 to graduate from any undergrad. Richard Sherman is closer to Steve Urkel than he is to Suge Knight. but making his living in tough persona driven NFL, he is portraying himself to be some tough street fella. i hate seeing this. in fact, i want those who make it out of the hood to carry themselves with dignity as Magic did, as Dr. J did, as Mohammed Ali did, as Marvin Hagler did, as Jackie Robinson did, and as Ernie Banks did. to some extend, dare i say, as i did. I am not asking anyone to be an Uncle Tom as some around my town had referred me as, a minority professional who flies the US flag everyday at my house. but these guys who make the big bucks must also know they reach a vast number of crowd and influence tens of thousands if not millions of children during their playing career. that is an enormous responsibility. Yes i agree that the parents should be the ones in charge of the children's access to what media outlet they are exposed to, but at the same time, in todays America where both parents work long hours just to make the ends meet, there isn't a full time parent to supervise this generation of children and often the TV and their sports heroes are the biggest role models they confide in.

I also know these athletes are kids themselves often from the very same broken homes the children i am referring to that the athletes influence, which is the reason why I also hate the current climate of NCAA monopoly of NBA labor supply. if NBA wants to package their next superstars not to be some kids from the south side of Chicago or from the Harlem, but rather be players so and so from the university of so and so, god damn it make them graduate. if they are letting players like John Wall and Eric Bledsoe's to come in after one and done, what have they really learned about life or academics, what personal growth or maturity did they retain? it's just a title for their pre-game announcements. it is to me, not only immoral but a rackaterring. if they are gonna let kids be one and done, let high school kids to be drafted also. a single year does not make much difference in terms of a persons physical or emotional growth. they want their products to be college educated, let them be educated and obtain their degrees. make them better human beings by mandating graduation and be equipped with their lives after sports. the current system is only for the packaging, and the content they are wrapping around is no better than without the facade they portray.

anywho, I also understand that we live in 2015 and not 1975. the days of "ask not what the country can do for you, but what you can do for the country" are long dead and belongs in nostalgia of the yesteryears. I wish the culture that we live in that are pop driven can change and be able to filter and discriminate class and value above what is hot and popular right now. but it is what it is. i hold Darryl Issa responsible for being the symbol of what is wrong with the lobbyist culture in America today, and I hold Mike Honda as what a true honest politician should be on a pedestal. but the vast majority of this nation does not even know neither of the names but almost everyone under the age 40 probably knows who Larry Sanders is and what kind of trouble he is under.

Im sorry for this long rant. i've had a long tiring week and didn't drink for a month until in last couple of days to ease the stress of the work load lately. perhaps i am ranting a bit, but I do mean every word.

good night, mate.

[QRich3]

I hear what you are saying about individual rights of privacy, but just like when presidents get a blow job from some one other than his wife, he goes to a congressional hearing, being rich and powerful also comes with some territory of responsibility in the eyes of the public. people who are professionals as doctors, lawyers, public accountants in a small town can't afford a single public drunken stupor as he or she risks losing his or her business altogether or at least risk a major impact as the locals who are in lesser socio-economic groups hold those with perceived better educated, and higher income earning people to a higher standard. having said that, there is not a single honest doctor who earns more than the minimum waged pro athletes in north america among the four major sports. there isn't a lawyer who is more influential than your average pro athlete.

Yeah, I get that this is how it works and it is what it is, but unlike politics, athletes don't choose to put their lives in the spotlight. Yeah, they choose to be entertainers, but their private lives don't come into that. Barkley's "I'm not a role model" commercial comes to mind. Politicians on the other hand, make a career from selling their personal values.

But yeah, I fully agree with the rest of your rant, and I guess what I have a problem with is what you mention about putting way too much responsibility on kids who didn't ask of it or are not really prepared for it. It's unfair to ask of every Larry Sanders or Richard Sherman to be Muhammad Ali or Jackie Robinson since they're once in a generation characters. It'd be great, but it's unfair to ask that of 20 year old kids who, even if they've been to college, lots haven't had the best role models themselves.

It's a delicate situation, and definitely not a black/white situation, but in Sanders case, I fully side with him when league officials try to make him a scapegoat for "kids watch what happens when you smoke weed".

Have a good day my brother.

[Forte IV]

What happened to this thread

[Neddy]

I hear what you are saying about individual rights of privacy, but just like when presidents get a blow job from some one other than his wife, he goes to a congressional hearing, being rich and powerful also comes with some territory of responsibility in the eyes of the public. people who are professionals as doctors, lawyers, public accountants in a small town can't afford a single public drunken stupor as he or she risks losing his or her business altogether or at least risk a major impact as the locals who are in lesser socio-economic groups hold those with perceived better educated, and higher income earning people to a higher standard. having said that, there is not a single honest doctor who earns more than the minimum waged pro athletes in north america among the four major sports. there isn't a lawyer who is more influential than your average pro athlete.

Yeah, I get that this is how it works and it is what it is, but unlike politics, athletes don't choose to put their lives in the spotlight. Yeah, they choose to be entertainers, but their private lives don't come into that. Barkley's "I'm not a role model" commercial comes to mind. Politicians on the other hand, make a career from selling their personal values.

But yeah, I fully agree with the rest of your rant, and I guess what I have a problem with is what you mention about putting way too much responsibility on kids who didn't ask of it or are not really prepared for it. It's unfair to ask of every Larry Sanders or Richard Sherman to be Muhammad Ali or Jackie Robinson since they're once in a generation characters. It'd be great, but it's unfair to ask that of 20 year old kids who, even if they've been to college, lots haven't had the best role models themselves.

It's a delicate situation, and definitely not a black/white situation, but in Sanders case, I fully side with him when league officials try to make him a scapegoat for "kids watch what happens when you smoke weed".

Have a good day my brother.

you are right about these kids not having much role models themselves. and you are also correct that guys like Ali or Robinson are once in a generation characters. can't ask everyone else to emulate the best among us.
i guess the quote i seem to gravitate towards is not one of a politician or a philosopher, but from the Spiderman.

"with great power, comes great responsibility"

LOL

[Neddy]

What happened to this thread

I got drunk and went on a rant-a-thon.

you know the drill

[QRich3]

What happened to this thread

I got drunk and went on a rant-a-thon.

you know the drill

I think Doc scared the sh*t out of us and no one wants us to ever trade anything anymore, in case we get fleeced again

[LACtdom]

Can anyone tell me what our likely options are in terms of salary? Where are we now compared to the cap? My understanding is we need to trade a player and get two players back (assuming we trade Jamal or Barnes) or we will be short staffed on the wings?

[ejftw]

Can we bring back Jumpin James Singleton on a 10-day deal?

[LACtdom]

Serious question guys.
With a lot of fans choosing sides between JJ and Jamal it got me thinking that maybe the best thing would be to trade both.
We all know the problems with Jamal.
JJ always has injury concerns and if he missed a couple of playoff games it may result in an early exit for us.

Does anyone think we should include them both in a package for a starting SG and SF, for example Afflalo + Chandler from Denver (Obviously we would have to give up more than just those two) or Bradley + Green from Boston, etc.

[Neddy]

Serious question guys.
With a lot of fans choosing sides between JJ and Jamal it got me thinking that maybe the best thing would be to trade both.
We all know the problems with Jamal.
JJ always has injury concerns and if he missed a couple of playoff games it may result in an early exit for us.

Does anyone think we should include them both in a package for a starting SG and SF, for example Afflalo + Chandler from Denver (Obviously we would have to give up more than just those two) or Bradley + Green from Boston, etc.

If you were the GM for Denver who is in rebuilding mode once again, the last thing I would think you want would be two aging vets with long term commitments where one is a well known chucker with no defense and second with some defense and great spot up shooter yet is injury prone and have t rex arms. only way both of these guys get traded is either we trade down significantly in value or both go in separate deals to contenders or wanna be contenders looking for shooters. I don't see it happening either way.

frankly, now i am at a place where i think we are gonna ride this JJ + Jamal show all the way to a ship or a total crashtestdummy ride.

[LACtdom]

Serious question guys.
With a lot of fans choosing sides between JJ and Jamal it got me thinking that maybe the best thing would be to trade both.
We all know the problems with Jamal.
JJ always has injury concerns and if he missed a couple of playoff games it may result in an early exit for us.

Does anyone think we should include them both in a package for a starting SG and SF, for example Afflalo + Chandler from Denver (Obviously we would have to give up more than just those two) or Bradley + Green from Boston, etc.

If you were the GM for Denver who is in rebuilding mode once again, the last thing I would think you want would be two aging vets with long term commitments where one is a well known chucker with no defense and second with some defense and great spot up shooter yet is injury prone and have t rex arms. only way both of these guys get traded is either we trade down significantly in value or both go in separate deals to contenders or wanna be contenders looking for shooters. I don't see it happening either way.

frankly, now i am at a place where i think we are gonna ride this JJ + Jamal show all the way to a ship or a total crashtestdummy ride.

Yeah I agree that Doc seems like he wants to keep both of them. I guess it was just wishful thinking on my part. I still hope to see a trade before the trade deadline.

[mattd13]

my thoughts are this. I think jj has been healthy this year and hopefully this back thing will go away soon. this team is also just one injury away from a disaster but everyone knows that. that's the nba. as for trades I agree with lac. Jamal's value has gone down. he is not playing well and at 34 there is no upside. I think doc is happy with jj and would not trade him. I would like to see some kind of trade but I just do not see anything that would help much.

[Wammy Giveaway]

The only players I could see untouchable are Paul, Griffin, Jordan, Barnes, Turkoglu, Big Baby Davis, and Doc's son. Jones is untouchable by default due to him being a 10-day contract guy.

If the rest of the players were made available, the total value package comes out to five players worth of $19.5 million. However, the only way they can get a small forward of any significance is to include DJ in all trade talks, something Doc doesn't want to do because he loves him so much and he's Griffin's best friend. Doc's love for his guys make it impossible for him to make front office decisions. The trade for Austin has already put him on the hot seat. Don't get me wrong, Austin's doing alright, but shades of nepotism and favoritism are still intact.

[LACtdom]

With the rumours of Amare Stoudemire possibly requesting a buyout, do you think there would be any chance we could get him? He would be a nice servicable big off the bench. Also, a big reason why I want him so much is purely because I don't want another team in the West being stronger by getting him.