Kevin Love; and the art of roster building in the NBA

2thehoopand1 · Post #441 » by **2thehoopand1** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:31 am

LA is where he mostly likely will end up. I had to hear this from every laker fan I know for three seasons now.

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ak7 · Post #442 » by **ak7** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:33 am

2thehoopand1 wrote:LA is where he mostly likely will end up. I had to hear this from every laker fan I know for three seasons now.

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Your sig is missing 4 heat logos... What happened?!?

2thehoopand1 · Post #443 » by **2thehoopand1** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:34 am

LakeShowAK7 wrote:
2thehoopand1 wrote:LA is where he mostly likely will end up. I had to hear this from every laker fan I know for three seasons now.

Sent from my iPad using RealGM Forums

Your sig is missing 4 heat logos... What happened?!?

How quaint

Jajwanda · Post #444 » by **Jajwanda** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:31 pm

So Boston is offering 7 and 17, L.A. is offering 7, and Golden State both Thompson and Lee. Perhaps L.A. is willing to take on more cash than the other teams are willing to take on.

For example. Boston's 17 might not be worth as much as say L.A. taking on a bad deal and Golden State already is trying to flip Thompson to get 7 to trade. David Lee is not really a positive value with that contract. Perhaps things are a little closer than REALGM would have you believe.

Let's look a the GS offer that would have gone through to Minnesota- It was Thompson switched for the 7, a future 1st, and David Lee (a big contract that perhaps Minnesota does not want)
Boston- Most likely Jeff Green (perhaps they get something to give an expiring to swap with Minnesota), 17, and 6
L.A. - Nash and the 7th overall, plus a future 1st (Way future 1st)

You have to ask yourself does G.S. want David Lee and his contract? Would they prefer to just start say Julius Randle off as a rookie and then have that cap room to get a better player than David Lee? That would make L.A.'s offer very comparable to G.S.

Then Boston. The 6 and 17. Perhaps L.A> can do better than just an expiring plus the pick, perhaps they can find a way to use their cap room to get a player of greater value there? Something like taking on Boozer and getting the 19, then flipping Boozer plus the 7 to Minnesota to get Love.

I'm not saying L.A. will get Love, I just don't think the current offers that other teams have is all that impressive.

TylersLakers · Post #445 » by **TylersLakers** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:56 pm

Little update:

That’s also the sense of two NBA executives, who speaking to the Journal Times, suggested that they believe Love will end up with the Los Angeles Lakers despite the fact that many believe the Golden State Warriors are in the lead to acquire his services.

“Two NBA executives, when asked where they thought Minnesota star forward Kevin Love would end up, said the Los Angeles Lakers,” says Gery Woelfel, “even though Golden State appears to be the front-runners for his services.”

http://fansided.com/2014/06/22/nba-rumo ... es/#!2fQHU

DEEP3CL · Post #446 » by **DEEP3CL** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:26 pm

Been thinking about this drama the last few days, this stuff has been all over the joint. First is was just Minny and Golden St, then Minny and Boston....then K.Love is strolling around Boston and hanging with Rondo. Now it's a supposed 3 team trade. Oh yeah and Golden St front office is at an impasse on dealing Klay.

All we really know is that Minny wants high picks and players not deep into deals. Common sense says it should be Boston that they deal with seeing as they have much more to offer than anybody else.

So why hasn't this trade went down yet ?

Frankly I don't even know how the Lakers get tangled in this anyway, we're not as liquid in assets as Boston, not loaded with a talented young gun like the Warriors who can also fork over their 1st rounder and future ones for that matter.

So again why hasn't this trade went down yet ?

One reason is because this is all on the Wolves, getting gun shy and can't pull the trigger. As for the Warriors they can't figure out what it is they even want to give up and just seem down right indecisive. Meanwhile the Lakers are fine either way, we can keep our pick and fill a need or trade it to GS for Klay if they're serious about wanting Love.

Bottom line the longer this goes into the summer, the chances increase for Minny to mess this up. Again the Lakers are fine either way.

Post #447 » by **Kilroy** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:42 pm

I think the deal hasn't gone down yet because Minni knows they can have some combination of high first round picks so than can be a little choosy about which deal they take. It may be a draft night deal or one that comes right before the draft as more info comes out about who's picking who comes out...

Also, we only have rumors about what's being discussed... All of these deals may have a provision that Love signs an extension or long term contract before the picks are in play, and maybe Love isn't agreeing to that in Boston or GSW...

Who knows... It could be any combination of things. I would really love (pun intended) for Boston to miss out on Love and get royally screwed by their draft pick... While we get Love and LeBron and draft Embiid, who really just had a corn removed on his big toe...

But we won't know what happens at least for 4 more days and probably longer.

Marionettetc · Post #448 » by **Marionettetc** » Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:55 pm

I'm with you Deep, I'm sure we would all like to have Love but what do we really have to trade? And why isn't the deal happening?

I don't see him just going for the 7th pick, even if he was to demand a trade to the lakers. What am I missing here?

tviper · Post #449 » by **tviper** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:04 am

DEEP3CL wrote:Been thinking about this drama the last few days, this stuff has been all over the joint. First is was just Minny and Golden St, then Minny and Boston....then K.Love is strolling around Boston and hanging with Rondo. Now it's a supposed 3 team trade. Oh yeah and Golden St front office is at an impasse on dealing Klay.

All we really know is that Minny wants high picks and players not deep into deals. Common sense says it should be Boston that they deal with seeing as they have much more to offer than anybody else.

So why hasn't this trade went down yet ?

Frankly I don't even know how the Lakers get tangled in this anyway, we're not as liquid in assets as Boston, not loaded with a talented young gun like the Warriors who can also fork over their 1st rounder and future ones for that matter.

So again why hasn't this trade went down yet ?

One reason is because this is all on the Wolves, getting gun shy and can't pull the trigger. As for the Warriors they can't figure out what it is they even want to give up and just seem down right indecisive. Meanwhile the Lakers are fine either way, we can keep our pick and fill a need or trade it to GS for Klay if they're serious about wanting Love.

Bottom line the longer this goes into the summer, the chances increase for Minny to mess this up. Again the Lakers are fine either way.

1. We still haven't heard from KLove re: where he wants to play. this is a key aspect of the situation as teams are not giving up good assets for a 1 year rental;

2. LAL can't trade the pick; they can only draft a player for a team and trade him later per the Stepien rule

Get17 · Post #450 » by **Get17** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:27 am

Jajwanda wrote:So Boston is offering 7 and 17, L.A. is offering 7, and Golden State both Thompson and Lee. Perhaps L.A. is willing to take on more cash than the other teams are willing to take on.

For example. Boston's 17 might not be worth as much as say L.A. taking on a bad deal and Golden State already is trying to flip Thompson to get 7 to trade. David Lee is not really a positive value with that contract. Perhaps things are a little closer than REALGM would have you believe.

Let's look a the GS offer that would have gone through to Minnesota- It was Thompson switched for the 7, a future 1st, and David Lee (a big contract that perhaps Minnesota does not want)
Boston- Most likely Jeff Green (perhaps they get something to give an expiring to swap with Minnesota), 17, and 6
L.A. - Nash and the 7th overall, plus a future 1st (Way future 1st)

You have to ask yourself does G.S. want David Lee and his contract? Would they prefer to just start say Julius Randle off as a rookie and then have that cap room to get a better player than David Lee? That would make L.A.'s offer very comparable to G.S.

Then Boston. The 6 and 17. Perhaps L.A> can do better than just an expiring plus the pick, perhaps they can find a way to use their cap room to get a player of greater value there? Something like taking on Boozer and getting the 19, then flipping Boozer plus the 7 to Minnesota to get Love.

I'm not saying L.A. will get Love, I just don't think the current offers that other teams have is all that impressive.

You are right. LA has just as good of a shot if they offer up 22.5 mil in space. No contracts going back. Boston can only offer up 14 mil without sending back contracts or renouncing Bradley. GSW cannot offer up any space without mondo maneuvering.

7 + 22.5 mil space for Love and Martin. ((I know they don't want KevMart but if that is all it takes to get Love))

That immediately moves Minny's guaranteed salaries from 70 ish to 50 ish, including #7 and #13 they'd have to fill PF and SG, such as Randle and Harris.

I think pure cap space and 7 is better than Boston's 6 plus overpaid Green or blah Sullinger and they couldnt take Martin off of Minny's books. Pure cap space and 7 is equal to or better than no pick this year from GSW and 30 mill of Lee just to get ahold of Klay.

I think LA is in the driver's seat if they make a 'no contract back' offer. Yes Martin's future money hurts the longer term plan but they could keep him two years concurrent with Kobe and then he's an expiring they might be able to use in summer '16 in some wheel-deal.

Get17 · Post #451 » by **Get17** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:30 am

tviper wrote:2. LAL can't trade the pick; they can only draft a player for a team and trade him later per the Stepien rule

This has to be written why? Everyone knows that. The hypothesis in all of this and with all the other mumbo jumbo is the teams agree on who to pick, so Minny tells LA to pick Randle or Vonleh or Gordon or whomever the covet that won't be there at 13.

turk3d · Post #452 » by **turk3d** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:41 am

See my post on the trade board which has a 3-way deal where you guys wind up with Love which involves GS. See what you think.

Get17 · Post #453 » by **Get17** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:51 am

I like it because it doesn't put Martin on LA, but offered up 30 mil in cap relief to Minny in reply along with 7. We'll see what the masses say.

tviper · Post #454 » by **tviper** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:14 am

Get17 wrote:
tviper wrote:2. LAL can't trade the pick; they can only draft a player for a team and trade him later per the Stepien rule

This has to be written why? Everyone knows that. The hypothesis in all of this and with all the other mumbo jumbo is the teams agree on who to pick, so Minny tells LA to pick Randle or Vonleh or Gordon or whomever the covet that won't be there at 13.

the quote that I was responding to queried why the trade wasn't completed yet. that is one of the reasons.

Jajwanda · Post #455 » by **Jajwanda** » Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:51 am

There's also another twist on this which would basically be L.A. offering up 7 and then taking on Boozer in a deal while sending Chicago's 16 or 19 that they gain from taking on that contract. It would be expiring 7 and 16, plus perhaps taking on Martin's deal. Now if Love resigns it's a good deal. Otherwise you just wasted the 7.

DEEP3CL · Post #456 » by **DEEP3CL** » Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:53 am

tviper wrote:
2. LAL can't trade the pick; they can only draft a player for a team and trade him later per the Stepien rule

Yeah I knew we couldn't trade it, Minny would have to identify a player they would want then we'd draft and trade that player.

leeprettyp · Post #457 » by **leeprettyp** » Fri Jun 27, 2014 12:34 am

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Chris_Broussard/status/482320117410570240[/tweet]

leeprettyp · Post #458 » by **leeprettyp** » Fri Jun 27, 2014 12:36 am

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Chris_Broussard/status/482320117410570240[/tweet]

CodyB_ · Post #459 » by **CodyB_** » Fri Jun 27, 2014 2:21 am

I would like to say that Kevin Love is a very talented player. But if teams go giving him the max, and start building around the guy, that team will never win a championship. The guy is good at a lot of little things, but he is deficient in the defensive category, he won't be a go to guy on the block and he isn't a big finisher on the pick and roll.

He effects the game similar to, say, Al Jefferson, Shareef Abdul Rahim, Juwan Howard or someone similar. They can put a non contending team on the map stats wise, but they won't make their team that much better, or will them to win in the crucial moments.

CodyB_ · Post #460 » by **CodyB_** » Fri Jun 27, 2014 2:21 am

I would like to say that Kevin Love is a very talented player. But if teams go giving him the max, and start building around the guy, that team will never win a championship. The guy is good at a lot of little things, but he is deficient in the defensive category, he won't be a go to guy on the block and he isn't a big finisher on the pick and roll.

He effects the game similar to, say, Al Jefferson, Shareef Abdul Rahim, Juwan Howard or someone similar. They can put a non contending team on the map stats wise, but they won't make their team that much better, or will them to win in the crucial moments.