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LAL @ DEN, season opener

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TimeisIllmatic
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#41 » by TimeisIllmatic » Thu Oct 26, 2023 4:52 am

PedroFlu wrote:
Godfather13 wrote:
TimeisIllmatic wrote:Welp, I will definitely eat crow on my prediction. I noticed this team still has a lot of the same issues as last year:

-Playing too many guys
-Giving up 2nd chance points
-Taking too many quick contested shots
-D'Lo turning the ball over crazy (he wasn't the only one)
-AD disappearing in the 2nd half of games

Positives:
Taurean Prince looks exactly like what we expected


Yeah man. The rebounding was driving me crazy last night. Just unacceptable with such a massive size & athleticism advantage. I put this one on Ham, cos it's plagued us all through his time and he hasn't taken any action to correct it.


As long as LeBron is the starting PF, team might have trouble rebounding the ball. LeBron really needs to rest instead of boxing out, so he can produce in the offensive end. I think this problem will simply linger throughout the season. In big games/playoffs it should improve. Also AD spends too much energy when chasing out rebounds


Good point regarding LeBron needing to save his energy. AD and Bron will have to pace themselves throughout the season which means we need more production from D'Lo and Reaves on a consistent basis.
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#42 » by PedroFlu » Thu Oct 26, 2023 2:41 pm

Godfather13 wrote:
PedroFlu wrote:
Agree with basically everything. I'll add a big worry: Vincent. Schroeder was a dog defensively, and I think it's clear the starting team is in dire lack of perimeter defense - I don't think Prince can do it. I thought it would improve with Vincent, but it didn't look like it at all. Offensively, he was very tentatively.

All in all, Gabe Vincent is key to this team alleged depth. If he's gonna be a shy average player, Lakers will be in big problem. They actually need him a lot both on perimeter defense and offensive production from the bench.

I'd also like to emphasize the worry with Rui. Guy sleepwalks to a lot of games, and should be another integral part of the team nucleus. He actually played like this during last RS, not sure he can sustain stg similar to his playoff intensity after getting the bag.

DLO is what he is. I expect him to play better vs worse teams. He is the clearest point of improvement in a trade, if possible.

All in all, Denver is clear cut the best team on talent alone. I hope guys can develop during the season, but the fact is DLO is who he always has been, Vincent is unknown quantity, Rui has been nonchalant for most of his career. Maybe this is simply a 3-10 team in a very strong West, and improvement may happen only upon trading.


I've enjoyed DLo adding the wrinkle of defense this season, and don't wanna jump on his ass so soon, but I'm basically in agreement about your thoughts to consolidate some of the lower end talent for a high level post season role player.

I mean all the depth talk is great, but you're just not fielding a 12-14 man rotation in the playoffs, and if Lebron indeed leaves to follow Bronny, this might be our last real shot at a chip, till some other star/s roll into LA.

I'd love to get my hands on guys like Kuz or Caruso - who get the system > can play elite defense and passable offense.

PedroFlu wrote:LBJ is great news. BTW, AD is not a 30 ppg player. Also cant be the defensive cornerstone of the team while carrying main offensive duties. He just doesn't have the motor - actually no player has it. Let him excert his power on the defensive end (specially with so many slow players in the starting lineup, with poor perimeter defense) and be a 17-18ppg guy. That's when the Lakers REALLY need their guards to step up and put up points on the borad.


That's fair about AD, but if he's on the floor, he can't just stand in one corner at the perimeter. He has very little gravity there & mucks up the lane for everyone else. It's essential that he keeps cutting and rolling at all times so the offense doesn't grind to a halt, since his defender is actively helping opposing teams to go 5 on 4.

PedroFlu wrote:Finally, I like the idea of benching DLO and starting LeBron on point with Reaves, Prince, Vanderbilt and AD. Really improves defense on the starting unit, takes Vincent away from PG duties on the second team and gives a scoring punch to the bench (Rui probably cant be relied upon that).

Oh, and I just imagine if we could have kept Schroder instead of Vincent (they make almost the same salary) and retaining Walker as the go-to scorer from the bench (making 2M only with the Nets - probably didnt stay because of Ham's lack of trust in him).

Schroeder - Skywalker - Prince - Rui - Wood/Hayes - that would be a deep team.


That's interesting. I love the idea of a flexible starting lineup and minutes overall for different players, based on matchups.

Dennis wasn't very good last year. Think a lot of us have his image imprinted in our mind from the 2020-21 season, when he was amazing at POA. I'm happy with Gabe - better playmaker and shooter, while being a reasonably decent POA. He's not stopping elite guards, but neither was Dennis, when we got burnt alive by all 3 primary guards we faced in the playoffs.


Just found this:

Read on Twitter
?s=46&t=YQnZyfnx7VlfNBbYDR3Cxg

Why no trying LeBron as the de facto PG, benching DLo?

I think Vando won't return that soon. So we'd have:

LBJ - Reaves - Prince - Rui - AD

Dlo - Vincent - Cam/Max - Wood - Hayes
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#43 » by stan francisco » Thu Oct 26, 2023 4:34 pm

See sig.
NBA titles since the merger: LAL 11, CHI 6, SAS 5, BOS 5, GSW 4.
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#44 » by Godfather13 » Thu Oct 26, 2023 7:52 pm

Showtime:Part2 wrote:Still in disbelief we more or less chose jhs over Kristaps porzingis this offseason

Jesus.. fr?? :banghead: :banghead:
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#45 » by Godfather13 » Thu Oct 26, 2023 8:12 pm

PedroFlu wrote:
Just found this:

Read on Twitter
?s=46&t=YQnZyfnx7VlfNBbYDR3Cxg

Why no trying LeBron as the de facto PG, benching DLo?

I think Vando won't return that soon. So we'd have:

LBJ - Reaves - Prince - Rui - AD

Dlo - Vincent - Cam/Max - Wood - Hayes


He should be the default PG for at least 20 of his 30ish minutes IMO. It's his best quality, and we're deliberately taking Ls by not using him as such.

I like the concept of DLo/Reaves initiating against the bottom 70% of the league, but I have concerns against the better teams in the league on the defensive side and primary playmaking ability against real ball pressure. And both, rather all 3(including Gabe) should complement Lebron as off ball creators fairly well with their shooting, IQ & secondary playmaking.

None of them are capable enough of being your primary playmakers if you're serious about contending for a title - PERIOD!

And btw, you completely eliminated Gabe from your rotation there. Was that by design or accident?
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#46 » by Ball so hard » Thu Oct 26, 2023 11:14 pm

tamaraw08 wrote:
PedroFlu wrote:
Godfather13 wrote:


Oh, and I just imagine if we could have kept Schroder instead of Vincent (they make almost the same salary) and retaining Walker as the go-to scorer from the bench (making 2M only with the Nets - probably didnt stay because of Ham's lack of trust in him).

Schroeder - Skywalker - Prince - Rui - Wood/Hayes - that would be a deep team.


Murray averaged 32.5 pts, at 65TS% in the WCF vs the Lakers with Schroder and D'Lo's identical 126 DRTG which was really bad. Dennis also just averaged 7 pts/game at 45TS%.
Jamal on the other hand just averaged 21pts at 55TS% vs Miami. I'm not saying Vincent is a defensive stud but at least he was slightly productive at 11.4pts at 49.4TS%.
2 playoff years Dennis was pretty much a bust when the team needed him most, when they got eliminated by the Suns and last playoffs.


Those numbers are largely meaningless given the sample size. Also most individual defensive metrics are heavily influenced by team defense… we got swept, I’d guess no one on our team had great numbers. Miami is also one of the few teams that have a great system in which players regularly out perform expectations.
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#47 » by Ball so hard » Thu Oct 26, 2023 11:20 pm

Liam_Gallagher wrote:Rough night for Darvin Ham.

Rotations were horrible in the first half. At one point in the 1st Q, we had LBJ, AD and Austin all on the bench. Jaxon Hayes was in with Jokic on the bench. Felt like 2k automatic rotations. Cam Reddish should never be on the floor with Hayes, if at all. The rotation should EASILY be:

G - DLo | Gabe
G - Austin
F - LeBron | Prince
F - Vando | Rui
C - AD | Wood

Christie, Reddish and Hayes should only see the floor if LBJ or AD is injured/resting. Gabe Vincent should be getting all of the backup guard minutes, while Wood/Rui should be playing over 20 minutes easily. Vando should be around 12-17 depending on who we play. Prince can share some minutes with LeBron if need be, but I'm just done with the small lineups. Use size.


Agree with you. However, small ball is here to stay. I wish it weren’t the case. For a few years I’ve been saying I really don’t see the point of wasting resources on centers. It’s clear this coaching staff has little to no interest in playing a center.
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#48 » by tamaraw08 » Fri Oct 27, 2023 2:38 am

Ball so hard wrote:
tamaraw08 wrote:
PedroFlu wrote:


Murray averaged 32.5 pts, at 65TS% in the WCF vs the Lakers with Schroder and D'Lo's identical 126 DRTG which was really bad. Dennis also just averaged 7 pts/game at 45TS%.
Jamal on the other hand just averaged 21pts at 55TS% vs Miami. I'm not saying Vincent is a defensive stud but at least he was slightly productive at 11.4pts at 49.4TS%.
2 playoff years Dennis was pretty much a bust when the team needed him most, when they got eliminated by the Suns and last playoffs.


Those numbers are largely meaningless given the sample size. Also most individual defensive metrics are heavily influenced by team defense… we got swept, I’d guess no one on our team had great numbers. Miami is also one of the few teams that have a great system in which players regularly out perform expectations.

I don’t disagree. I was just replying to an insinuation that it’s a major mistake picking Vincent over Schroder. I just don’t think Dennis would have made a huge difference versus Denver because like you said, it’s probably more about using a much better scheme or system than just picking which players should play.
I thought putting a bigger guy like Prince on Murray while D’Lo hides guarding KCP was fine except the Lakers just didn’t properly react when Denver 1-2 picks to free up Jamal. Ham seemed unprepared on how to counteract those adjustments imo.
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#49 » by Ball so hard » Fri Oct 27, 2023 2:40 am

No game thread for the Suns game??
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Re: LAL @ DEN, season opener 

Post#50 » by Godfather13 » Fri Oct 27, 2023 6:27 pm

Ball so hard wrote:
tamaraw08 wrote:
PedroFlu wrote:


Murray averaged 32.5 pts, at 65TS% in the WCF vs the Lakers with Schroder and D'Lo's identical 126 DRTG which was really bad. Dennis also just averaged 7 pts/game at 45TS%.
Jamal on the other hand just averaged 21pts at 55TS% vs Miami. I'm not saying Vincent is a defensive stud but at least he was slightly productive at 11.4pts at 49.4TS%.
2 playoff years Dennis was pretty much a bust when the team needed him most, when they got eliminated by the Suns and last playoffs.


Those numbers are largely meaningless given the sample size. Also most individual defensive metrics are heavily influenced by team defense… we got swept, I’d guess no one on our team had great numbers. Miami is also one of the few teams that have a great system in which players regularly out perform expectations.

Since this is being aggregated in replies, I just wanna clarify that I didn't write any of this. Somebody used quotes on this, so it just shoes that the part at the top is incorrectly written by me.

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