Tor/Atl - Marvin Gaye Williams for Andrea Bargnani

Ruhiel · Post #1 » by **Ruhiel** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 8:39 pm

In an attempt to appease Hawks' fans desire for a center that can coexist with the frontline tandem of Josh Smith and Al Horford...

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3umuq6m

Hawks Reasons
- we don't need a "Defensive Anchor" to play center. If you actually watch games, you can see that Bargnani is a good enough post defender. His help D is terrible, but guys like (6'9.75)Horford and Smith (6'8.25) can always cover any mistakes.

-gives us a frontline length of 7'0+7'0.75+7'3

If post defense is all you want, then Varejao would be great, but the Hawks still lack scoring with him.

Basically post defense AND scoring.

Raptors Reasons
if you check their board, they don't like Bargnani

What say you T & T board?

Post #2 » by **Hassassin** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 9:25 pm

No. Toronto needs more in return. Bargnani, despite all the **** he gets, is still more accomplished than Williams.

Ruhiel · Post #3 » by **Ruhiel** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 9:45 pm

Be more specific. Mike Bibby is more accomplished than Williams.
Would you prefer him for $8 million? I think not.
Might or might not the trade proposal fix any of TOR's roster problems?

Post #4 » by **Hassassin** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 9:51 pm

Bargnani has accomplished more than Williams in his career, despite have one less of NBA experience under his belt. He's not an ideal fit, but I'd want Bargnani at his current rate than Williams on his contract.

Williams doesn't do anything. Try again.

EDIT: Toronto would be better off giving James Johnson more minutes at 3.

HomieOmey · Post #5 » by **HomieOmey** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 9:52 pm

It just makes no sense to pay Kleiza and Marvin while basically giving up on James Johnson (who would be the odd man out). Without Kleiza included, I don't even consider this deal. Call it bias, but I'd much rather hope that at least one of James Johnson or Bargnani proves not trading for Marvin was a good idea. Bargs is already better and James Johnson still has some drops of potential to be an ok starter.

Post #6 » by **Trader_Joe** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 9:55 pm

I can't see Atlanta further increasing their payroll like this when they have no depth at all whatsoever. In a newer and more restrictive CBA I see a team like Atlanta having to make some hard choices.

7-Day Dray · Post #7 » by **7-Day Dray** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 10:09 pm

Marvin Williams is a player (along with Boris Diaw, Josh Childress among others) that Atlanta has underutilized. He can shoot, straight-line slash, offensive rebounds and post up but the Coach is content with letting his just spot up for mid-range jumpers or score in transition. He's more than he's shown with the Hawks, he can be a legit 2nd or 3rd option, instead of the 5th option he currently is. Not an All-Star, but a solid player and a good mismatch.

Ruhiel · Post #8 » by **Ruhiel** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 10:09 pm

Trader_Joe wrote:I can't see Atlanta further increasing their payroll like this when they have no depth at all whatsoever*. In a newer and more restrictive CBA I see a team like Atlanta having to make some hard choices.

*Thank you. On the other hand I'll beat other Hawks compatriots to the punch by calling you a "hater".

Post #9 » by **Trader_Joe** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 10:14 pm

Ruhiel wrote:
Trader_Joe wrote:I can't see Atlanta further increasing their payroll like this when they have no depth at all whatsoever*. In a newer and more restrictive CBA I see a team like Atlanta having to make some hard choices.

*Thank you. On the other hand I'll beat other Hawks compatriots to the punch by calling you a "hater".

Atlanta hasn't had depth for some time.. right now they look like this...

Hinrich / Teague
JJ
M.Williams /Sy (who?)
Smith / Rolle (who?)
Hoford / Pachullia

For ~$66m

They need depth badly, but I don't think they will be able to spend much money to do so.

Blkbrd671 · Post #10 » by **Blkbrd671** » Wed Sep 7, 2011 11:07 pm

I hate bargs, but he's worth more than Marvin Willams

Jase · Post #11 » by **Jase** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 2:30 am

AB's value is much higher than Williams'. Just because Raps fans aren't sold on him, it doesn't mean they unload him for pennies on the dollar.

Ruhiel · Post #12 » by **Ruhiel** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 4:22 am

7-Day Dray wrote:Marvin Williams is a player (along with Boris Diaw, Josh Childress among others) that Atlanta has underutilized. He can shoot, straight-line slash, offensive rebounds and post up but the Coach is content with letting his just spot up for mid-range jumpers or score in transition. He's more than he's shown with the Hawks, he can be a legit 2nd or 3rd option, instead of the 5th option he currently is. Not an All-Star, but a solid player and a good mismatch.

+1 I'm working on a edit of the Celtics game to see where he gets his shot but he's surprising me. A comparison I've always liked was a less coordinated Rudy Gay.

He has some good volume scorer qualities, but that straight line drive and coordination means he can only drive past and post up smaller players consistently.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVslNUOpxTw
Since we overcommitted to Joe at the starting 2G.
To me that means ATL needs another power3 and play Marvin off the bench with that guy.

Saciid11 · Post #13 » by **Saciid11** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 4:45 am

I have been the biggest anti Bargnani ever and I say no to this deal, because we can get much better deal for Bargnani, besides we already have young small forward in James johnson and potential pretty high pick in 2012 ( Barnes, Quincy, GilChrist, Adonis Thomas, etc) ... How about this ..

Bargnani + Ed Davis + future 1rd pick top 10 protected

For

Al Horton + Zaza Pachula + future 2nd round

Blkbrd671 · Post #14 » by **Blkbrd671** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 4:55 am

^Horford and Al next to valanc. would be redundant

WhatsaTDot · Post #15 » by **WhatsaTDot** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 4:58 am

You got Al Horford confused with Tim Horton. Silly canuck.

BTW,

Blkbrd671 wrote:^Horford and Al next to valanc. would be redundant

Are Horford and Al two different people?

Post #16 » by **loserX** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 5:06 am

WhatsaTDot wrote:You got Al Horford confused with Tim Horton. Silly canuck.

BTW,
Blkbrd671 wrote:^Horford and Al next to valanc. would be redundant

Are Horford and Al two different people?

No. So it would be REALLY redundant.

Blkbrd671 · Post #17 » by **Blkbrd671** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 5:16 am

i was correcting who he was talking about, apparently comma's do help. and lol to ^

Parataxis · Post #18 » by **Parataxis** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 5:27 am

Is there a 1st coming Toronto's way that you forgot to mention?

Ruhiel · Post #19 » by **Ruhiel** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 5:39 am

Parataxis wrote:Is there a 1st coming Toronto's way that you forgot to mention?

oi vey

Post #20 » by **Mr Swagtastic** » Thu Sep 8, 2011 6:36 pm

Parataxis wrote:Is there a 1st coming Toronto's way that you forgot to mention?

Yeah that would be the only reason why I would move Bargs for Williams right now. Williams has his faults like Bargs but I think I would keep what we have with our current team. James Johnson has looked pretty decent in his limited mins and this season should be a wash for a top 5 pick for a wing.

Marvin may need a change of scenery and all that but I wouldn't want that place to be Toronto right now.