Cousins becomes a Bad Boy

[Soulyss]

I love Cousin's game, but I suspect he's 3 years and a wake-up call from being a team guy in the right place (Kind of like what happened to Sheed on the Pistons). This is an overpay since I consider Drummond a near even talent.

[cammac]

Any team that get Cousins will likely over pay

Not sure what you mean. When a team trades a superstar under some duress is basically always an underpay--Barkley, Shaq, CP3, Harden, D12, etc. It's almost axiomatic that you're going to get a lot less immediate talent when you give up a top-15 player. (Hence doing 'well' in a superstar trade is getting some solid young players and a decent starter.)

You are under the assumption that SAC is under duress in moving Cousins and even if they were multiple teams would be bidding jacking up the price. Plus gutting your team for a talent isn't a wise move.

[HotelVitale]

Cousins' eFG is 47% - which is lousy for a center. There's no getting around that.

Wow, yeah, there's plenty of getting around it. First, for centers eFG% is basically just FG% since very few shoot 3s (eFG is just FG + .5 3pt/FGA). Since DMC draws so many fouls it's only fair to look at TS%. There DMC is behind some catch-and-dunk centers like Chandler, DeAndre, Mozgov, etc. But his 55% is within about a percentage point of any center who can create consistently on his own--Horford, Duncan, Lopez, Monroe, Bosh, Gasol, Nene.

And Cousins destroys other centers in volume so much that it would more than make up for being a percentage pt below them. Bosh, Al Jefferson, Kanter, and B Lopez are the only guys that peak their heads over 25% usage--and Cousins is more than 7% higher than any of them at over 34%. That's higher, by the way, than any of Shaq's career numbers (which were usually around 29-32%)

When you consider that DMC has never played with a decent passing PG (or passing wing) that can get him consistent easy buckets, and that he still might be broken of a dumb habit of taking pull up 18 footers, there's no argument that DMC's efficiency is 'lousy.'

[kurtis48239]

No way from det,would much rather keep what we have than give all that up for cousins.Not to mention we are starting to look like a team that fits and are aquiring depth.

[Texas Chuck]

I love Cousin's game, but I suspect he's 3 years and a wake-up call from being a team guy in the right place (Kind of like what happened to Sheed on the Pistons). This is an overpay since I consider Drummond a near even talent.

yeah Drummond isn't a near talent at all tho. Just really not at all. Boogie has his issues no doubt, and he still hasn't totally put it all together, but there is no question his talent level is several tiers above Drummond.

[Laimbeer]

Props to Piston and King fans for keeping it civil in a thread about star players going on for five days now.

[nate33]

Cousins is #16 in PPS with not many #1 options ahead of him.

Points per shot is an extremely misleading statistic that is all but worthless as a practical means of evaluating a player. The problem is that it doesn't factor the shot attempt that generated free throw attempts. Free throws therefore get you points without counting as shot attempts.

It also fails to capture Cousins' horrific turnover rate.

The bottom line is that, by any reasonable measure, Cousins isn't a very efficient scorer. Clearly some of that is due to teammates, usage rate, and due to his overall shot selection. He may well be a much better scorer in a different setting.

[old rem]

I don't think it's likely that Sacramento gets this much value for Cousins. If it was just Drummond plus a 2016 1st for Cousins, it would be about right.

Cousins is >> Drum and also, more upside. Of course.. the tricky part... Cousins,Drummond? Either might escape as a FA. And /or cost a lot.

[Kings2013]

this thread has covered a lot of ground

We aren't looking to move Cousins. We had a great starting lineup for a lot of last year and are building on it. A lot of our fanbase thinks Cuz can be top 5, and are reasonably confident in him remaining long term. If Cousins gets moved it will be in the last year most likely. Detroit is not going to offer a package like that (we aren't moving him now) for that duration if Drummond and Johnson continue to show well and Drummond is re-signing

I think both teams fanbase's and I'm guessing FOs value their assets, which all teams fanbases should

[beb0p]

The point is - If you're a GM, that's not the way you evaluate whether or not to trade a teenager. Stanley Johnson has a ton of talent. You don't just say - He's a backup, so he's not that important to the franchise.

That is EXACTLY one of the things a GM evaluates a young player - how he fits on the team?. NO one is saying Johnson doesn't have talent, but his position clashes with the personnel on the Kings.

If the Kings are to trade Cousin, there will be PLENTY of unproven talented youngsters offered up. I don't understand this thinking that it's either Stanley or bust!
.

If the Kings do end up trading Cousins for young players Rudy will be the next to go.

NOT if the Kings are getting someone like Drummond in return. Like I said, in that scenario the Kings are trying to rebuilt on the fly so Rudy definitely would NOT be going anywhere.


.

[Beam Me Up Foxy]

Value is good, just don't see the point for Detroit. Cousins doesn't guarantee them a playoff spot IMO.

In the East? I mean, this is the East we're talking about. Cousins on the Pistons automatically puts them in the top 5 in the east.

[Jkam31]

Value is good, just don't see the point for Detroit. Cousins doesn't guarantee them a playoff spot IMO.

In the East? I mean, this is the East we're talking about. Cousins on the Pistons automatically puts them in the top 5 in the east.

The big man in the east trying to guard Cousins with shooters surrounding him. Dude would put up video game numbers.



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[Laimbeer]

this thread has covered a lot of ground

We aren't looking to move Cousins. We had a great starting lineup for a lot of last year and are building on it. A lot of our fanbase thinks Cuz can be top 5, and are reasonably confident in him remaining long term. If Cousins gets moved it will be in the last year most likely. Detroit is not going to offer a package like that (we aren't moving him now) for that duration if Drummond and Johnson continue to show well and Drummond is re-signing

I think both teams fanbase's and I'm guessing FOs value their assets, which all teams fanbases should

Agree with this. Directionally, it doesn't make sense. Kings are win now and like Cousins as their centerpiece while the Pistons' core is younger and are building around Drummond, Johnson, Jackson, and perhaps KCP. I'd never say never, but Drummond is as unlikely a player as any to be traded yet we've had a thread rolling for a week on it.

If there's a "not going to be traded so no use in discussing it" group, he'd be in it.

[Ruzious]

this thread has covered a lot of ground

We aren't looking to move Cousins. We had a great starting lineup for a lot of last year and are building on it. A lot of our fanbase thinks Cuz can be top 5, and are reasonably confident in him remaining long term. If Cousins gets moved it will be in the last year most likely. Detroit is not going to offer a package like that (we aren't moving him now) for that duration if Drummond and Johnson continue to show well and Drummond is re-signing

I think both teams fanbase's and I'm guessing FOs value their assets, which all teams fanbases should

Agree with this. Directionally, it doesn't make sense. Kings are win now and like Cousins as their centerpiece while the Pistons' core is younger and are building around Drummond, Johnson, Jackson, and perhaps KCP. I'd never say never, but Drummond is as unlikely a player as any to be traded yet we've had a thread rolling for a week on it.

If there's a "not going to be traded so no use in discussing it" group, he'd be in it.

I agree with you on Detroit, but I can't see Sacramento as a win-now team - especially with the West as strong as it is - and as unproven as Divac is as a GM. I think with their ownership, front office, and coach - they have a combustible combination there - and anything could happen.

[Kings2013]

this thread has covered a lot of ground

We aren't looking to move Cousins. We had a great starting lineup for a lot of last year and are building on it. A lot of our fanbase thinks Cuz can be top 5, and are reasonably confident in him remaining long term. If Cousins gets moved it will be in the last year most likely. Detroit is not going to offer a package like that (we aren't moving him now) for that duration if Drummond and Johnson continue to show well and Drummond is re-signing

I think both teams fanbase's and I'm guessing FOs value their assets, which all teams fanbases should

Agree with this. Directionally, it doesn't make sense. Kings are win now and like Cousins as their centerpiece while the Pistons' core is younger and are building around Drummond, Johnson, Jackson, and perhaps KCP. I'd never say never, but Drummond is as unlikely a player as any to be traded yet we've had a thread rolling for a week on it.

If there's a "not going to be traded so no use in discussing it" group, he'd be in it.

I agree with you on Detroit, but I can't see Sacramento as a win-now team - especially with the West as strong as it is - and as unproven as Divac is as a GM. I think with their ownership, front office, and coach - they have a combustible combination there - and anything could happen.

I can see Sacramento as a win now team. Cousins and Gay, who have been together less than two years, led a formidable starting lineup for a lot of last year with one of the worst benches in the league. The bench is now IMO strong. On paper we can do something. If Rondo pans out, which our FO believes, the team will win. But our two main players are in their primes, and we are trying to build around them "win now"

[Ruzious]

Agree with this. Directionally, it doesn't make sense. Kings are win now and like Cousins as their centerpiece while the Pistons' core is younger and are building around Drummond, Johnson, Jackson, and perhaps KCP. I'd never say never, but Drummond is as unlikely a player as any to be traded yet we've had a thread rolling for a week on it.

If there's a "not going to be traded so no use in discussing it" group, he'd be in it.

I agree with you on Detroit, but I can't see Sacramento as a win-now team - especially with the West as strong as it is - and as unproven as Divac is as a GM. I think with their ownership, front office, and coach - they have a combustible combination there - and anything could happen.

I can see Sacramento as a win now team. Cousins and Gay, who have been together less than two years, led a formidable starting lineup for a lot of last year with one of the worst benches in the league. The bench is now IMO strong. On paper we can do something. If Rondo pans out, which our FO believes, the team will win. But our two main players are in their primes, and we are trying to build around them "win now"

I'm not a big Rudy Gay fan. He puts up big scoring numbers, but most years he's been another player with inefficient offensive numbers. And between he and Cousins, there's a lot of turnovers. Rondo should help some with that. I like Rondo, but I don't think he's the player he used to be, and it's harder and harder to play with PGs lacking shooting range. In the East, Sac would compete for a playoff spot, but in the West - I'd be surprised.

[Kings2013]

I agree with you on Detroit, but I can't see Sacramento as a win-now team - especially with the West as strong as it is - and as unproven as Divac is as a GM. I think with their ownership, front office, and coach - they have a combustible combination there - and anything could happen.

I can see Sacramento as a win now team. Cousins and Gay, who have been together less than two years, led a formidable starting lineup for a lot of last year with one of the worst benches in the league. The bench is now IMO strong. On paper we can do something. If Rondo pans out, which our FO believes, the team will win. But our two main players are in their primes, and we are trying to build around them "win now"

I'm not a big Rudy Gay fan. He puts up big scoring numbers, but most years he's been another player with inefficient offensive numbers. And between he and Cousins, there's a lot of turnovers. Rondo should help some with that. I like Rondo, but I don't think he's the player he used to be, and it's harder and harder to play with PGs lacking shooting range. In the East, Sac would compete for a playoff spot, but in the West - I'd be surprised.

They'd do more than compete if the Wizards regularly get to the second round. Cousins,Gay,WCS,Collison,Rondo,Koufos,Belinelli, McLemore, Casspi etc IMO is better on paper than the Wizards put out

[Ruzious]

I can see Sacramento as a win now team. Cousins and Gay, who have been together less than two years, led a formidable starting lineup for a lot of last year with one of the worst benches in the league. The bench is now IMO strong. On paper we can do something. If Rondo pans out, which our FO believes, the team will win. But our two main players are in their primes, and we are trying to build around them "win now"

I'm not a big Rudy Gay fan. He puts up big scoring numbers, but most years he's been another player with inefficient offensive numbers. And between he and Cousins, there's a lot of turnovers. Rondo should help some with that. I like Rondo, but I don't think he's the player he used to be, and it's harder and harder to play with PGs lacking shooting range. In the East, Sac would compete for a playoff spot, but in the West - I'd be surprised.

They'd do more than compete if the Wizards regularly get to the second round. Cousins,Gay,WCS,Collison,Rondo,Koufos,Belinelli, McLemore, Casspi etc IMO is better on paper than the Wizards put out

Hey, count me in if you think the Wiz are overrated - I'd agree. I'd still favor the Wiz slightly over Sac. (those team abbreviations might be unfortunate.)

[Dame Lizard]

OP's trade has good value for both sides imo, but I don't see either side making the trade imo, particularly detroit.

[ThumbsUpBaby]

This is an overpay.

Andre Drummond is a top 10 C in the league right now.
Stanley Johnson is a top prospect right now.
Brandon Jennings is currently one of the top 6th man right now.

I get that DeMarcus Cousins has superstar potential, and is easily a top 15 player, but I wouldn't trade 2 of my best players for him. He's just not worth it.