San Antonio Spurs: Trae Young

[jayu70]

Full rebuild…

To Magic: Murray + Capela + Bogdanovic

To Spurs: Trae + Hunter + WCJ + #17 (Kings 1st via Hawks)

To Hawks:
+Black
+Sochan
+Jett
+K. Johnson
+Graham
+#3 (Spurs 1st)
+#7 (Raps 1st via Spurs)
+3x best of: 25 Hawks, Spurs, Magic, Bulls, Nuggets (worst to Spurs, 2nd worst to Magic)
+26 Spurs 1st
+25 and 27 Hawks 1st, 26 Hawks swap (all returned via Spurs)
+Huge TPEs and cap savings

Hawks aren’t going full scorched earth this offseason.
If they were, they would be tanking right now for the best available pick in the 2024 draft.

[Hoppy1]

Full rebuild…

To Magic: Murray + Capela + Bogdanovic

To Spurs: Trae + Hunter + WCJ + #17 (Kings 1st via Hawks)

To Hawks:
+Black
+Sochan
+Jett
+K. Johnson
+Graham
+#3 (Spurs 1st)
+#7 (Raps 1st via Spurs)
+3x best of: 25 Hawks, Spurs, Magic, Bulls, Nuggets (worst to Spurs, 2nd worst to Magic)
+26 Spurs 1st
+25 and 27 Hawks 1st, 26 Hawks swap (all returned via Spurs)
+Huge TPEs and cap savings

If I am the Spurs, I am not giving both lottery picks up this year. You can have the better unless one of Topic/Risacher is still available.

[OriAr]

Full rebuild…

To Magic: Murray + Capela + Bogdanovic

To Spurs: Trae + Hunter + WCJ + #17 (Kings 1st via Hawks)

To Hawks:
+Black
+Sochan
+Jett
+K. Johnson
+Graham
+#3 (Spurs 1st)
+#7 (Raps 1st via Spurs)
+3x best of: 25 Hawks, Spurs, Magic, Bulls, Nuggets (worst to Spurs, 2nd worst to Magic)
+26 Spurs 1st
+25 and 27 Hawks 1st, 26 Hawks swap (all returned via Spurs)
+Huge TPEs and cap savings

If I am the Spurs, I am not giving both lottery picks up this year. You can have the better unless one of Topic/Risacher is still available.

If Trae is traded no need for Topic.

For the record, I reckon the package is something like giving Atlanta their picks back + Chicago 25 pick + Charlotte's FRP which will never be conveyed + Keldon + Sochan.
3 FRPs + 2 SRPs + reversing a swap + A solid prospect in Sochan + salary filler in Keldon.

[Wolveswin]

Well you are both breaking it down wrong and belittling players in to exaggerate your claim. It is…

#3
#7 for #17 SWAP
25 Hawks 1st returned
25 Spurs SWAP
26 Spurs 1st
26 Hawks SWAP returned
27 Hawks 1st returned

In draft capital that = 4x 1sts + 3x Swaps

In players that = K. Johnson + Sochan + Graham

FOR

Young + WCJ + Hunter

Mitchell got 3x 1sts + 2x Swaps + #14 just drafted
Sexton + Markkanen

I think my trade value is spot on. Trae (and WCJ) get a little more than just Mitchell.

That's RIDICULOUS you're counting number of picks and completely disregarding their potential. It's likely NONE of the Cavs picks (Mitchell trade) or Minnesota picks (Gobert trade) end up in the lottery, just this years' Spurs picks #3 + #7 are worth MORE than all of the Cavs / TWolves picks combined. Also, trading down from #7 to #17 is HUGE and I would much rather have Sochan and Keldon than Hunter and WCJ at their current contracts. The Spurs would be commiting suicide by doing something like this.

Ok, now you are just going overboard. 2024 draft picks (in a known weak draft) being worth more than 3x unprotected and swap(s) is just being silly.

Sure can Spurs push to pay less? Ok. If none of the other warchest teams want Trae - then ok. Take out the 26 Spurs 1st. Or probably better, Spurs can keep a 24 1st (not do 7 for 17 swap). Hawks don’t need 3x 1sts in 24 draft.

[wemby]

Ok, now you are just going overboard. 2024 draft picks (in a known weak draft) being worth more than 3x unprotected and swap(s) is just being silly.

Sure can Spurs push to pay less? Ok. If none of the other warchest teams want Trae - then ok. Take out the 26 Spurs 1st. Or probably better, Spurs can keep a 24 1st (not do 7 for 17 swap). Hawks don’t need 3x 1sts in 24 draft.

Unprotected picks from playoff teams mean nothing. And a #3 or a #7 pick on a (supposedly) weak draft are MUCH, MUCH better than a pick in the late teens (which is where I'd have the Cavs) or mid 20s (which is where I'd have the TWolves) for the foreseeable future. You'd be hoping either one of them turns as good as the ones the Spurs already have right now. I mean, just look at what the "haul" that the Bucks paid for Jrue ended up being:

• unprotected picks in '25 and '27
• unprotected swaps in '24 and '26
• Bledsoe, George Hill, and a 2nd rounder

The 2 swaps will likely count for nothing, and the 2 picks will be in the 20s. If that's your idea of a "haul", the Spurs should much rather offer their own unprotected picks in '27/'29/'31 and swaps in '28/'30... that's going to end up fools' gold. But I'd have no problem giving that up rather than a #3 and #7 pick this year.

[Chinook]

Ok, now you are just going overboard. 2024 draft picks (in a known weak draft) being worth more than 3x unprotected and swap(s) is just being silly.

I don't think it's as silly as you suggest. This forum has a habit of reducing players and picks to numbers in a way that successful GMs really can't afford to. I don't know if 3 and 7 are "worth more" than Utah's war chest. I don't think that's really the right way of looking at it. The two have different uses. War chests are made to be traded away. They are currency. Current picks at the top of the lottery are meant to be used.

Utah literally can't offer comparable picks, and that might matter to real-life GMs who don't keep their jobs long term based on the size of their asset ledger but on the quality of their roster. They might be able to convince an owner to buy into the team's long-term position, but in terms of putting butts in seats and beginning to build something, unprotected picks years out don't have the same impact.

There's no way the Spurs would offer the package you're proposing, but there's not a single team that could offer a package like it either. OKC, Utah and some others can offer packages that are strong in other factors, and those might be appealing to front office in Atlanta or whatever other hypothetical city. For the Spurs, it's not a question of value as much as it is having a plan to move forward after the trade. They aren't served hampering themselves so thoroughly at this point, because they're still years from their franchise player developing to the point of being the centerpiece on a contending roster. They can't afford to give up what are possibly their last two early to mid lottery picks for flippantly.

[Wolveswin]

Ok, now you are just going overboard. 2024 draft picks (in a known weak draft) being worth more than 3x unprotected and swap(s) is just being silly.

I don't think it's as silly as you suggest. This forum has a habit of reducing players and picks to numbers in a way that successful GMs really can't afford to. I don't know if 3 and 7 are "worth more" than Utah's war chest. I don't think that's really the right way of looking at it. The two have different uses. War chests are made to be traded away. They are currency. Current picks at the top of the lottery are meant to be used.

Utah literally can't offer comparable picks, and that might matter to real-life GMs who don't keep their jobs long term based on the size of their asset ledger but on the quality of their roster. They might be able to convince an owner to buy into the team's long-term position, but in terms of putting butts in seats and beginning to build something, unprotected picks years out don't have the same impact.

There's no way the Spurs would offer the package you're proposing, but there's not a single team that could offer a package like it either. OKC, Utah and some others can offer packages that are strong in other factors, and those might be appealing to front office in Atlanta or whatever other hypothetical city. For the Spurs, it's not a question of value as much as it is having a plan to move forward after the trade. They aren't served hampering themselves so thoroughly at this point, because they're still years from their franchise player developing to the point of being the centerpiece on a contending roster. They can't afford to give up what are possibly their last two early to mid lottery picks for flippantly.

Nets can offer better. They have the most valued owed picks in the business. Owed picks are always better than picks from team acquiring star player who dilutes and devalues picks.

Trae to Spurs starts with all Hawks 1sts back. One or both of the 2024 1sts Spurs own (and some combo of swaps from 2x Hawks 1sts owned - because Hawks don’t need/want that many 24 1sts). Argue over the future owed 1sts, youth, and or filler Spurs need to add (which in my scenario included more value acquired than just Trae for Spurs). That is value to taste.

[Chinook]

Nets can offer better.

It depends on what teams want. The Nets do not have high draft picks.

Owed picks are always better than picks from team acquiring star player who dilutes and devalues picks.

You know what's even less likely to be diluted? Current picks in the top 10.

Trae to Spurs starts with all Hawks 1sts back. One or both of the 2024 1sts Spurs own (and some combo of swaps from 2x Hawks 1sts owned - because Hawks don’t need/want that many 24 1sts). Argue over the future owed 1sts, youth, and or filler Spurs need to add (which in my scenario included more value acquired than just Trae for Spurs). That is value to taste.

We don't know what the trade "starts with". If ATL is so desperate for their own picks back, they aren't going to be able to claim other teams are all that close to outbidding the Spurs. That's true too if they really want a win-now SF locked into a long-term deal or to control the near future of two team's drafts. That's "value to taste" -- actually what a team would value.

Even if the Spurs want Young, they don't have to deal with the Hawks this off-season. They can move onto a new star or wait to see if it blows up with Young's new team (which if it's Brooklyn is very possible). Trae can exit his contract in two years, and the Spurs will probably just be getting to the point where they can use him then. I'm not saying the Spurs should pull an Ainge or that they have all this leverage. I am saying the Hawks aren't going to be able to name their price with the Spurs, because they aren't in a position where they can reasonably say any price is worth it.

[Hoppy1]

If I am the Spurs, I am not giving both lottery picks up this year. You can have the better unless one of Topic/Risacher is still available.

If Trae is traded no need for Topic.

For the record, I reckon the package is something like giving Atlanta their picks back + Chicago 25 pick + Charlotte's FRP which will never be conveyed + Keldon + Sochan.
3 FRPs + 2 SRPs + reversing a swap + A solid prospect in Sochan + salary filler in Keldon.

which is one of the reasons early on I mentioned waiting to see who is available. As crazy as it sounds, if Risacher and/or Topic are available to the Spurs, I would consider not doing any trade.
A scenario where the Spurs pick up Risacher and Filpowski would make me hesitant to offer all of the before picks/players. Not that think either player is better than Young (they aren't), but those 2 players fit needs and style that compliment Wemby.
Spurs with so many rookie contracts can over spend for a Holiday for a 3 more years to lead the young players.

[OriAr]

If I am the Spurs, I am not giving both lottery picks up this year. You can have the better unless one of Topic/Risacher is still available.

If Trae is traded no need for Topic.

For the record, I reckon the package is something like giving Atlanta their picks back + Chicago 25 pick + Charlotte's FRP which will never be conveyed + Keldon + Sochan.
3 FRPs + 2 SRPs + reversing a swap + A solid prospect in Sochan + salary filler in Keldon.

which is one of the reasons early on I mentioned waiting to see who is available. As crazy as it sounds, if Risacher and/or Topic are available to the Spurs, I would consider not doing any trade.
A scenario where the Spurs pick up Risacher and Filpowski would make me hesitant to offer all of the before picks/players. Not that think either player is better than Young (they aren't), but those 2 players fit needs and style that compliment Wemby.
Spurs with so many rookie contracts can over spend for a Holiday for a 3 more years to lead the young players.

Would Holiday sign at Spurs? I figure he either opts in on his PO or he signs with Boston for more years and less $$$ per year.
I don't think Risacher has much to do with what they are doing with PG, he's a 3&D SF who'd improve Spurs' weakest line up spot significantly.
And if Trae is available for a reasonable price, you simply gotta do this if you are San Antonio, he's far better than any PG in the draft (duh) and quite frankly he's far better than their ceilings too, passing over Trae for Topic would be insane decision making that would make me question the Spurs FO heavily, even if Topic fulfils his potential (Not a small if given his shooting struggles) he's not gonna be nearly as good as Trae.

[Hoppy1]

If Trae is traded no need for Topic.

For the record, I reckon the package is something like giving Atlanta their picks back + Chicago 25 pick + Charlotte's FRP which will never be conveyed + Keldon + Sochan.
3 FRPs + 2 SRPs + reversing a swap + A solid prospect in Sochan + salary filler in Keldon.

which is one of the reasons early on I mentioned waiting to see who is available. As crazy as it sounds, if Risacher and/or Topic are available to the Spurs, I would consider not doing any trade.
A scenario where the Spurs pick up Risacher and Filpowski would make me hesitant to offer all of the before picks/players. Not that think either player is better than Young (they aren't), but those 2 players fit needs and style that compliment Wemby.
Spurs with so many rookie contracts can over spend for a Holiday for a 3 more years to lead the young players.

Would Holiday sign at Spurs? I figure he either opts in on his PO or he signs with Boston for more years and less $$$ per year.
I don't think Risacher has much to do with what they are doing with PG, he's a 3&D SF who'd improve Spurs' weakest line up spot significantly.
And if Trae is available for a reasonable price, you simply gotta do this if you are San Antonio, he's far better than any PG in the draft (duh) and quite frankly he's far better than their ceilings too, passing over Trae for Topic would be insane decision making that would make me question the Spurs FO heavily, even if Topic fulfils his potential (Not a small if given his shooting struggles) he's not gonna be nearly as good as Trae.

For me it is more of can I get Risacher. He is a great complementary player to Wemby. And if I can get him, can I find a PG that will simply run the team and play defense. SA will not need a PG looking to get 20 pts a game, just a controlled player who can make the right decisions.
SA has the chance to build around Wemby with the 2 picks. Looking for defensive presence that can rebound and floor general.
Then once the ingredients bake, that team will be competing with OKC.