Orlando Magic say “Let’s make a deal”.

[theBigLip]

I’m not sure which Cade post to respond to.

No way Pistons are trading Cade. Period. Especially for spare parts. Great young player, seems to have fully recovered from his leg issue, getting better all the time in spite of an extremely young roster around him. He’s going to be an AllStar sooner than later.

Pistons need to get some shooters around him and not just trade him and restart the rebuild.

[louc1970]

What could Orlando offer to get Garland? I don't see much that Cleveland would want outside F. Wagner.

This. Hence my initial post.

Black, Anthony, pure Cap space, all their 1st (and the Den 2025 1st).
I think Black, 2024 1st (#16), and a 2025 1st (Doable with them having Den pick)... is a pretty good starting package. Add in another 2027 1st with protections, and I dont see how another team beats that offer.

Now, the Cavs may not like the structure of the package being weighted towards prospects/picks, but that can simply be alleviated by a 3rd team.

I don’t see Cleveland moving off of Garland unless they get the needed SF they cover.
They already guard saturated with Mitchell, Strus, LaVert.

[louc1970]

Or. Let it marinate mate…thread turned out just like it started. Boom. Mind blown right. Offers for Garland with top 3 players (Banchero, Wagner, Suggs) off the Magic table.

But that's not on the OP is it? Your post served no purpose except to lecture the OP. Let's refrain from that in the future. Right? Didn't you get angry at me for pointing out how unrealistic all your deals were? But I listened to you and decided you were right. Not my place to question those deals. If the board wants to discuss them they should be allowed to.

So let this one go mate.

Your definition of lectures and angry are much different than mine. If OP saw my post as lecturing - I will delete.

I have thick skin and take everything on discussion boards as just a differing opinion.
I have certainly read much worse directed at me.

My point of the original is simply what is the best PG Orlando could get to pair with their top 3 players.

The PG does not need to be a superstar but a complimentary piece to those Orlando 3.

Also it need not be those 3 PGs I mentioned. There may be better pieces that work.

[louc1970]

I don’t think Vassell would be in the trade - not that Cade isn’t worth it. But, idea would be to partner up Vassell and Cade with Wemby PLUS Pistons would want more picks in exchange.

#4 (2024 Spurs 1st)
Sochan
Jones or Graham (expiring filler)
Best 2x of 2025 1sts (Hawks, Spurs, Bulls)

FOR

Cade + Filler

Pistons would get two top 5 picks in 2024, and 3x 1sts in better 2025 draft (probably a top 3 in own 1st and top 10 from Spurs plus a mid 1st).

So...you think SAS should hold back all of its good players while adding a potential max young guy? Interesting. Ironic and interesting.

Yeah. This.

Spurs can't find a better (gettable) player to put next ro Wemby imo than Cade. They also can't expect to have him and not give up Vassell.

Like even all the talk of Trae, he isn't as good an option as Cade would and could be. They'd still have e tons of other stuff to use to build around those 2. Also, Sochan stays and fits well with Wemby. Even more so now that he isn't foolishly playing PG.

Spurs would need to make sure Cunningham will resign prior to selling the future (picks).

[Wolveswin]

So...you think SAS should hold back all of its good players while adding a potential max young guy? Interesting. Ironic and interesting.

Hmmmm, I think #4 overall and Sochan are some pretty good starters. Way better than #16 and WCJ. Just saying. (And are you really trying to compare what Cavs would desire/require in trade compared to Pistons…apple meet orange).

Sochan and the #4 pick in a mid draft isn't cutting the deal for Cade. Not even close imo. That's something that can be used to get Simons. Cade has all NBA potential....and Detroit needs actual stuff to part with him.

I think you missed some important words and part of the offer.

[NotACat]

I can't see Orlando breaking up Suggs, Franz, and Banchero for a player. With that in mind, I don't think they have the assets to get someone like Trae or Garland, but they could swing for a disgruntled Donovan Mitchell - it would be a risk because it could be a one season rental, but that should bring the asking price down to what the Magic are willing to offer.

If not, I think Sexton is their best bet. Size is a weakness, but he'll buy in, play hard, and space the floor well.

[Slim Charless]

Hmmmm, I think #4 overall and Sochan are some pretty good starters. Way better than #16 and WCJ. Just saying. (And are you really trying to compare what Cavs would desire/require in trade compared to Pistons…apple meet orange).

Sochan and the #4 pick in a mid draft isn't cutting the deal for Cade. Not even close imo. That's something that can be used to get Simons. Cade has all NBA potential....and Detroit needs actual stuff to part with him.

I think you missed some important words and part of the offer.

No I didn't. Read back through the thread, I think I actually quoted you earlier and said that I'm not 100% sure that Sochan would start for Detroit. Think about it:

Duren/Stewart/Thompson and let's say for the sake of argument they draft Zaccharie Risacher as they are in dire need of shooting.

Who of those guys besides the rook does Sochan beat? At best they are adding to an already overloaded front court.

Sochan isn't really needed as much as Vassell would be. Some Pistons fans can chime in if they feel I'm wrong here.

[BlazersBroncos]

Sochan and the #4 pick in a mid draft isn't cutting the deal for Cade. Not even close imo. That's something that can be used to get Simons. Cade has all NBA potential....and Detroit needs actual stuff to part with him.

I think you missed some important words and part of the offer.

No I didn't. Read back through the thread, I think I actually quoted you earlier and said that I'm not 100% sure that Sochan would start for Detroit. Think about it:

Duren/Stewart/Thompson and let's say for the sake of argument they draft Zaccharie Risacher as they are in dire need of shooting.

Who of those guys besides the rook does Sochan beat? At best they are adding to an already overloaded front court.

Sochan isn't really needed as much as Vassell would be. Some Pistons fans can chime in if they feel I'm wrong here.

I think Sochan starts over Stewart - not a believer that Isaiah is a starting caliber guy. Now, Jeremy isnt there either but he is 2 years younger, can guard up a spot (From PF to SF) really well and has some playmaking (IDK if you want a PF/C combo w/ as little playmaking as Stewart / Duren).

Stewart is best as the 1st big off the bench IMO - really he should be cashed in as his true value is on a contender not as a rebuild guy IMO.

[Slim Charless]

Sochan and the #4 pick in a mid draft isn't cutting the deal for Cade. Not even close imo. That's something that can be used to get Simons. Cade has all NBA potential....and Detroit needs actual stuff to part with him.

I think you missed some important words and part of the offer.

No I didn't. Read back through the thread, I think I actually quoted you earlier and said that I'm not 100% sure that Sochan would start for Detroit. Think about it:

Duren/Stewart/Thompson and let's say for the sake of argument they draft Zaccharie Risacher as they are in dire need of shooting.

Who of those guys besides the rook does Sochan beat? At best they are adding to an already overloaded front court.

Sochan isn't really needed as much as Vassell would be. Some Pistons fans can chime in if they feel I'm wrong here.

Maybe. I agree that he isn't a permanent starter but that's where the Frenchman comes in. If Detroit selects him, they do so with the plan that he's their PF of the future. He can spreads the floor for the other guys.

Also, you brougt up another point as to why Sochan isnt needed as much. Since Detroit has their Thompson they have their elite potential defender and since neither him nor Sochan is really a shooter that means you can't play both at the same time.

Face it, Vassell is the best choice for Detroit. By far too I'll add. Only question is whether the Spurs would value the Wemby/Cade combo over Vassell and whoever this yrs pick gets them. I think Wemby needs high level players that are ready and complament his game now .

[Slim Charless]

That's weird. I quoted you and the link went to me lol.

[orlando_joe]

You can can pick who you want to make the deal fair, but Orlando wants a very good to great PG.
The only caveat - you cannot have Banchero, F. Wagner, or Suggs.

So Atlanta, what do you want for Murray?
Portland, offers for Simons?
Memphis, interested in moving Snart?

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

[JRoy]

You can can pick who you want to make the deal fair, but Orlando wants a very good to great PG.
The only caveat - you cannot have Banchero, F. Wagner, or Suggs.

So Atlanta, what do you want for Murray?
Portland, offers for Simons?
Memphis, interested in moving Snart?

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

[orlando_joe]

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

well ji played 58 this yr and brogdon 39...and isaac is 5 yrs younger has more impact ..and makes over 25% less money..and could be part of future...brogdon ticks not one of those boxes ...for me..i mean he is a ingles upgrade but you can get those guys in fa...not many isaac type in fa ..heck i hope they extend him ..with 25-50% guaranteed money..lol

[JRoy]

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

well ji played 58 this yr and brogdon 39...and isaac is 5 yrs younger has more impact ..and makes over 25% less money..and could be part of future...brogdon ticks not one of those boxes ...for me..i mean he is a ingles upgrade but you can get those guys in fa...not many isaac type in fa ..heck i hope they extend him ..with 25-50% guaranteed money..lol

Context matters.

Brogdon playing for a team that is clearly tanking, JI for a playoff team and looking for a new contract.

I hope they both enjoy long (and healthier!) careers than they have to this point but I wouldn’t count on it.

[Astaluego]

We will see this year, but Herro has not exactly been essential in the Heat's careers in recent years...and I think he would fit really well in the Magic..

WCJ+? for Herro

[orlando_joe]

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

well ji played 58 this yr and brogdon 39...and isaac is 5 yrs younger has more impact ..and makes over 25% less money..and could be part of future...brogdon ticks not one of those boxes ...for me..i mean he is a ingles upgrade but you can get those guys in fa...not many isaac type in fa ..heck i hope they extend him ..with 25-50% guaranteed money..lol

Context matters.

Brogdon playing for a team that is clearly tanking, JI for a playoff team and looking for a new contract.

I hope they both enjoy long (and healthier!) careers than they have to this point but I wouldn’t count on it.

ji has a yr left same as brogdon?..me to..i just hope isaac is on magic..and why i said 25% guaranteed

[Slim Charless]

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

This yr is the most games JI has played in.....his entire career since the pre-bubble? We're all happy that he is finally having an impact, but I can make a case that the Magic should sell high on him now. If he reverts to old Isaac then they'll miss this chance they can get to grab someone legit and dependable that be there for years.

Now, that someone is NOT Brogdon. Hence my sell high point I think Orlando can get better, and they should. I get why Magic fans would disagree, but I can't really trust him going forward with his long, long, longggggggggg history of injuries.

Sell high. While you can.

[jredsaz]

You can can pick who you want to make the deal fair, but Orlando wants a very good to great PG.
The only caveat - you cannot have Banchero, F. Wagner, or Suggs.

So Atlanta, what do you want for Murray?
Portland, offers for Simons?
Memphis, interested in moving Snart?

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

Never gunna give him up! I was wondering how Magic fans would value Isaac after he finally played some games. I valued him as a flyer level asset going back to Portland. I value Brogdon as a flyer level guy plus. Dudes with these injury histories definitely should not be untouchable lol. But I get not wanting to move one injury issue for another.

[jredsaz]

magic for sure would not give isaac straight up for brogdon and yes i am 100% sure of that...lol......and do not even think have interest in a guy that plays 50 games and makes 20 mill at his age should and could only get worse...they would just sign a fa if can not trade for better fit

I like JI. It is strange you mention Brogdons 50 games a year but do not mention Isaacs 30 games a year.

This yr is the most games JI has played in.....his entire career since the pre-bubble? We're all happy that he is finally having an impact, but I can make a case that the Magic should sell high on him now. If he reverts to old Isaac then they'll miss this chance they can get to grab someone legit and dependable that be there for years.

Now, that someone is NOT Brogdon. Hence my sell high point I think Orlando can get better, and they should. I get why Magic fans would disagree, but I can't really trust him going forward with his long, long, longggggggggg history of injuries.

Sell high. While you can.

I get Isaac played well in limited minutes and games this season but what kind of value do you think he has? Legit and dependable isn’t Isaac. Isaac is the sprinkle of value on top of whatever it takes to bring the Magic legit and dependable.

[jredsaz]

You can can pick who you want to make the deal fair, but Orlando wants a very good to great PG.
The only caveat - you cannot have Banchero, F. Wagner, or Suggs.

So Atlanta, what do you want for Murray?
Portland, offers for Simons?
Memphis, interested in moving Snart?

I’d opt for a good vet player on a short term contract. Malcom Brogdon is a guy I would target. Magic have Black, Suggs and Anthony. They don’t need more youth. The injury issue is always prevalent with Brogdon but his skill set, cost and one year contract make him an excellent fit.

Magic receive Brogdon
Blazers receive Issac, Houstan, maybe a second

Your pitch for Brogdon makes a lot of sense…until you mention Isaac. He’s the best defender in the NBA…his injury issues have marked his career but now he’s just too impactful to move in a package for less than a star.

That notwithstanding, other than Suggs, imo, ORL doesn’t have any guards that have shown enough upside to work around. Black and Howard are certainly intriguing but ORL is ready for a win-now guard that can put up points. Brogdon would be a win, but I hope they aim higher (even if they have to empty their stash of picks.

He is their only tradable asset. I guess they could take Brogdon into space and keep Isaac if nothing else of value is available in FA which looks kinda likely.