Jarrett Allen for Brandon Ingram

DowJones · Post #1 » by **DowJones** » Mon May 13, 2024 10:31 pm

I know New Orleans has liked Allen for a few years now. I know Cleveland desperately needs a SF. Would this kind of deal make sense for both sides? Cleveland would need to add Niang or LeVert for salary purposes. Would Ingram agree to an extension as part of the trade? I would assume Cleveland would have to give him whatever the maximum is they could give him in a scenario like this. The Cavs don't have much in the way of draft capital to trade, so Allen for Ingram would need to be the heart of this deal.

Malapropism · Post #2 » by **Malapropism** » Mon May 13, 2024 10:36 pm

It'd be odd for NO to say they want to prioritize spacing around Zion, then put him next to Allen.

Euphonetiks · Post #3 » by **Euphonetiks** » Mon May 13, 2024 11:18 pm

In Will Guillory’s Athletic article with Mike Scotto, they specifically mentioned Allen as not being enough to get Ingram.

As a Pels fan, I don’t like the fit of Zion-Herb-Allen for spacing purposes and prefer not to trade Ingram for a Center, but Griff has poked around Allen before so who knows.

MessiahUjiri · Post #4 » by **MessiahUjiri** » Tue May 14, 2024 2:07 am

To be honest, NOP are screwed. They need a defensive C, ur they will be scared about spacing issues since Zion and Herb aren’t great shooters.

Zion is not someone you should plan a franchise around. A smart contrarian GM would sell high on him.

NYG · Post #5 » by **NYG** » Tue May 14, 2024 2:11 am

Euphonetiks wrote:In Will Guillory’s Athletic article with Mike Scotto, they specifically mentioned Allen as not being enough to get Ingram.

As a Pels fan, I don’t like the fit of Zion-Herb-Allen for spacing purposes and prefer not to trade Ingram for a Center, but Griff has poked around Allen before so who knows.

Ingram to Cavs
Murray to Pels
Allen to Hawks

LarsV8 · Post #6 » by **LarsV8** » Tue May 14, 2024 2:16 am

Houston would be interested in Allen.

toooskies · Post #7 » by **toooskies** » Tue May 14, 2024 2:23 am

Euphonetiks wrote:In Will Guillory’s Athletic article with Mike Scotto, they specifically mentioned Allen as not being enough to get Ingram.

As a Pels fan, I don’t like the fit of Zion-Herb-Allen for spacing purposes and prefer not to trade Ingram for a Center, but Griff has poked around Allen before so who knows.

Allen is a more recent all-star with a better postseason performance this year with a better contract and fits better for NOP. Allen not being enough is delusion.

Jon1798 · Post #8 » by **Jon1798** » Tue May 14, 2024 2:23 am

Herb shot 42% from three, what are yall talking about? And this would be replacing BI with Trey Murphy, a drastic change in both 3PT percentage and attempts. Along with CJ, that’s a ton of shooting. Allen still isn’t the perfect perfect fit, but he’s a good player that would provide everything else but shooting. I think creation is a much bigger issue.

Euphonetiks · Post #9 » by **Euphonetiks** » Tue May 14, 2024 3:05 am

toooskies wrote:
Euphonetiks wrote:In Will Guillory’s Athletic article with Mike Scotto, they specifically mentioned Allen as not being enough to get Ingram.

As a Pels fan, I don’t like the fit of Zion-Herb-Allen for spacing purposes and prefer not to trade Ingram for a Center, but Griff has poked around Allen before so who knows.

Allen is a more recent all-star with a better postseason performance this year with a better contract and fits better for NOP. Allen not being enough is delusion.

Allen not being enough for Ingram is from Scotto and Guillory. It’s also not delusional considering Allen is a non-spacing big while Ingram is a wing that can score at 3 levels. Agree to disagree about Allen’s fit with Zion.

Euphonetiks · Post #10 » by **Euphonetiks** » Tue May 14, 2024 3:10 am

Jon1798 wrote:Herb shot 42% from three, what are yall talking about? And this would be replacing BI with Trey Murphy, a drastic change in both 3PT percentage and attempts. Along with CJ, that’s a ton of shooting. Allen still isn’t the perfect perfect fit, but he’s a good player that would provide everything else but shooting. I think creation is a much bigger issue.

Herb shot 42%, but on only 3.6 attempts per game on mostly open shots from the corner. We had the 6th ranked defense with Jonas/Larry at C this year. I’d much rather pair Zion with a big who doesn’t live in the paint on offense.

Post #11 » by **jbk1234** » Tue May 14, 2024 5:35 am

Euphonetiks wrote:
toooskies wrote:
Euphonetiks wrote:In Will Guillory’s Athletic article with Mike Scotto, they specifically mentioned Allen as not being enough to get Ingram.

As a Pels fan, I don’t like the fit of Zion-Herb-Allen for spacing purposes and prefer not to trade Ingram for a Center, but Griff has poked around Allen before so who knows.

Allen is a more recent all-star with a better postseason performance this year with a better contract and fits better for NOP. Allen not being enough is delusion.

Allen not being enough for Ingram is from Scotto and Guillory. It’s also not delusional considering Allen is a non-spacing big while Ingram is a wing that can score at 3 levels. Agree to disagree about Allen’s fit with Zion.

Saying you don't like the fit is understandable, but I seriously doubt either Scotto or Guillory have a good read on what Ingram's trade value is coming off the series he just had on an expiring contract with max type expectations.

I personally would be disappointed if we dealt Allen for Ingram. We don't win the first 2 games against Orlando without him, and it looks like we won't make it past Boston with him out of commission.

YayBasketball · Post #12 » by **YayBasketball** » Tue May 14, 2024 5:53 am

I wonder how trade possibilities could change if Pels made Herb available for upgrades and better fit. Sure, he's awesome in so many ways and great culture guy, but if Dyson can replace his role with more upside for creation, they could sell high on Herb.

Skin · Post #13 » by **Skin** » Tue May 14, 2024 6:32 am

Ingram certainly more valuable than this. Even if he's expiring.

One_and_Done · Post #14 » by **One_and_Done** » Tue May 14, 2024 11:22 am

Malapropism wrote:It'd be odd for NO to say they want to prioritize spacing around Zion, then put him next to Allen.

This.

mcfly1204 · Post #15 » by **mcfly1204** » Tue May 14, 2024 11:28 am

Value looks about right, especially when you factor in contracts and health. Agree with the concerns around fit in NO however, they'd be better off with a couple of years of someone like Lopez.

BK_2020 · Post #16 » by **BK_2020** » Tue May 14, 2024 11:49 am

Euphonetiks wrote:
Jon1798 wrote:Herb shot 42% from three, what are yall talking about? And this would be replacing BI with Trey Murphy, a drastic change in both 3PT percentage and attempts. Along with CJ, that’s a ton of shooting. Allen still isn’t the perfect perfect fit, but he’s a good player that would provide everything else but shooting. I think creation is a much bigger issue.

Herb shot 42%, but on only 3.6 attempts per game on mostly open shots from the corner. We had the 6th ranked defense with Jonas/Larry at C this year. I’d much rather pair Zion with a big who doesn’t live in the paint on offense.

There's just so few bigs who are realistically available who are capable, not even good, from the three and also aren't downright horrible. The market is WCJ and that's really it, and it's a stretch to say WCJ can shoot.

toooskies · Post #17 » by **toooskies** » Tue May 14, 2024 12:16 pm

BK_2020 wrote:
Euphonetiks wrote:
Jon1798 wrote:Herb shot 42% from three, what are yall talking about? And this would be replacing BI with Trey Murphy, a drastic change in both 3PT percentage and attempts. Along with CJ, that’s a ton of shooting. Allen still isn’t the perfect perfect fit, but he’s a good player that would provide everything else but shooting. I think creation is a much bigger issue.

Herb shot 42%, but on only 3.6 attempts per game on mostly open shots from the corner. We had the 6th ranked defense with Jonas/Larry at C this year. I’d much rather pair Zion with a big who doesn’t live in the paint on offense.

There's just so few bigs who are realistically available who are capable, not even good, from the three and also aren't downright horrible. The market is WCJ and that's really it, and it's a stretch to say WCJ can shoot.

This, and you definitely can't count on it showing up in the playoffs.

Skybox · Post #18 » by **Skybox** » Tue May 14, 2024 12:23 pm

I like this and I think Jarrett Allen, for what he is, is actually a better player...then when you consider the cap situation when Ingram demands a max...on a team with Garland, Mobley and Mitchell...problem.

If Mitchell were to demand a move out...this makes a lot of sense, basketball-wise. Garland, Mobley, and Ingram is a well-matched core and, if CLE doesn't wait too long, they could bring back some serious assets for Mitchell.

HadAnEffectHere · Post #19 » by **HadAnEffectHere** » Tue May 14, 2024 1:19 pm

I think we're moving into an era where 32%ish three point spotup shooters just aren't guarded because half-court offense is too efficient to care about those shots. So there's only like 5 centers in the entire league that have the gravity you need on offense for Zion.

Jokic
Embiid
Wemby
Chet
Porzingis

And the Pels can get 0 of those guys.

So I'm not sure what the Pels do about their center situation.

Every center in the NBA other than those five guys is a bad fit with Zion, idk.

toooskies · Post #20 » by **toooskies** » Tue May 14, 2024 1:30 pm

Skybox wrote:I like this and I think Jarrett Allen, for what he is, is actually a better player...then when you consider the cap situation when Ingram demands a max...on a team with Garland, Mobley and Mitchell...problem.

If Mitchell were to demand a move out...this makes a lot of sense, basketball-wise. Garland, Mobley, and Ingram is a well-matched core and, if CLE doesn't wait too long, they could bring back some serious assets for Mitchell.

I don't think any of Garland/Mobley/Ingram is going to be the best player on a contender.