Overly Complex NJ/NY/Utah

[Trader_Joe]

Utah
Boone, CDR, Najera, W.Chandler, Jeffries, Duhon, GS #1 (via NJ), 2010 + 2012 NY #2, $3m(NY), NJ TE, NY TE
~19.5 in incoming salary
for
Boozer, Korver, Hapring, NY #1
~24 in outgoing salary

D. Williams / Duhon / Price
W.Chandler / CJ Miles / CDR
AK-47 / Jeffries
Milsap / Najera / Fesenko
Okur / Boone / Kofous
+
GS #1 via NJ
2010 NY #2

-slashes payroll (73m in payroll, ~14m in savings with tax)
-gets an athletic wing that can score, which they haven't had in years
-gets an excellent back-up PG, which they haven't had in years
-gets return for players that may not see much court time anyway


NY
2010 #1, Alston, Brewer, Hassell, Korver
for
Jeffries, Chandler, Duhon, $3m, 2010 + 2012 #2, TE

Alston / Douglas / Sessions (?)
Brewer / Hassell / Nate (?)
Gallinari / Korver
Hill / Harrington / Lee (?)
Darko / Curry

-gets their pick back
-saves 2010 money


NJ
Boozer, Harpring
for
GS#1, Alston, Najera, Hassell, Boone, CDR, TE

Harris / Dooling
Lee / T.Williams
Hayes / Simmons / Harpring
Boozer / Yi / Swat
Lopez / Battie

[ecuhus1981]

Utah isn't giving Boozer, Brewer and the NY 1st for anything less than an All-NBA 1st-teamer. CERTAINLY not this menagerie of *bleh*, regardless of the financial incentive.

NY gets rid of Jared AND gets their pick back??? Dream on.

I don't think NJN can slide a Najera dump into acquiring a player of Boozer's caliber. And I don't think our FO is willing to give CDR for a probable one-year rental of Carlos.

[Trader_Joe]

Utah isn't giving Boozer, Brewer and the NY 1st for anything less than an All-NBA 1st-teamer. CERTAINLY not this menagerie of *bleh*, regardless of the financial incentive.

NY gets rid of Jared AND gets their pick back??? Dream on.

I don't think NJN can slide a Najera dump into acquiring a player of Boozer's caliber. And I don't think our FO is willing to give CDR for a probable one-year rental of Carlos.

I didn't know Brewer really had that much worth, but I'm sure he could taken out or substitued with CJ Miles.

The way I looked at it from NY's perspective.

Chandler = 2010 #1
NY could be a decent team in the East if they make some good signings (Lee, Sessions, Nate, etc.) The pick will probably be lottery but it may be more in the 10-14 range. Thata being said Chandler is a pretty good return for a late lotto pick.

Duhon = Alston
Jeffries, $3m, #2, TE = Hassell, Korver, Brewer

I really don't see Utah being a 2010 player destianation, so really JJ's extra year isn't that bad for Utah, considering all the savings and incentive.


The way I looked at from Utah's perspective:

Korver, Harpring, Brewer = Jeffries, $3m, NY #2, TPE
Boozer = CDR, GS #1, Najera, Duhon, Boone, TPE
NY #1 = Chandler


From NJ's perspective:
Harpring = Hassell
Boozer = CDR, GS #1, Najera, Boone, Alston, TPE

Sure Boozer could be a rental, but he only costs NJ one real piece (CDR), while shedding more 2010 salary (Najera). NJ could then resign Boozer if wanted and still go for another max FA.

Harris
Lee / T.Williams
FA*
Boozer / Yi
Lopez
+
2010 NJ #1
2010 DAL #1

* = LBJ, Wade, JJ, Gay, Roy, or simply trade for someone with a massive TPE

[Preludepunk27]

I could see this as a possible deadline deal, but before the season I don't think the Nets would EVER do this. We're giving up 2 young guys, a first round pick and expirings. That's a lot to give up for a guy that may not resign. I don't even think we'd do it at the deadline but it would have a better chance then is all I'm saying. The organization is still high on Yi as our starting PF of the future. They expect him to make strides this season. If by the deadline they didn't think that was ever going to become a reality, I could see this happening, but I wouldn't really be happy about it.

Your argument in the later post is so flawed too. We could wait for Boozer until next summer, move Najera at some point of the season and still have our solid young guys. I don't think the Nets would EVER buy boozer this high when we can sign him next summer and not lose a soul. Again, it makes more sense as a trade deadline deal, but it still doesn't make a lot of sense from our perspective.

[ecuhus1981]

Jeffries, $3m, #2, TE = Hassell, Korver, Brewer

This is where your proposal goes wrong-est. That package from NYK would not get them useless '10 expirings, let alone a useful one (Korver), and a partially guaranteed one (Hassell). THEN you add Brewer the equation, and it gets completely unrealistic.

Ronnie is Ariza, plus offense. All of the coaches at the Olympics tryout camp this summer said he was by far the best defender, and can score efficiently on his own when needed. CJ Miles is no slouch either. You're not doing Utah any favors by including Ronnie or CJ in this deal. Here's a handy quick reference guide on trade value:

Brewer > '10 NYK 1st > Wilson Chandler

Chandler isn't worth either one of these assets, let alone both, and Jeffries isn't worth expirings. The NYK side of this deal has FAIL written all over it.

FA destination or not, the Jazz WILL NOT absorb Jeffries. Are you serious? They give an All-Star bigman, an unprotected lotto pick and (as you've outlined) a swingman prospect, AND they have to absorb $12mil over the next two years for an 11th man? The least you could have done is managed to send Mobley's 80%-insured contract their way. This deal is a EXTREMELY far-fetched as a whole, but Jared is absolutely off the table in these discussions, and not in the good way.

For the record, NJ's side is fair-ish, but the Nets wouldn't give CDR, and Utah wouldn't take Najera in a Boozer deal.

[jazzfan1971]

:puke:

[hoops4life]

Wow, this is way off for Utah.

An Allstar PF, a young defensive starting SG/SF, two ~$6 mil expirings, and a potential top 5 pick for next year's draft for what?

For nothing absolutely nothing. Those players are all crap compared to what the Jazz are giving up.

Plus, the Jazz can't actually trade that NY pick because of the conditions on a pick they own MN.

[ecuhus1981]

Wow, this is way off for Utah.

An Allstar PF, a young defensive starting SG/SF, two ~$6 mil expirings, and a potential top 5 pick for next year's draft for what?

For nothing absolutely nothing. Those players are all crap compared to what the Jazz are giving up.

Plus, the Jazz can't actually trade that NY pick because of the conditions on a pick they own MN.

Oh yeah, you're right. I forgot about that.

/thread

[moocow007]

Jeffries, $3m, #2, TE = Hassell, Korver, Brewer

This is where your proposal goes wrong-est. That package from NYK would not get them useless '10 expirings, let alone a useful one (Korver), and a partially guaranteed one (Hassell). THEN you add Brewer the equation, and it gets completely unrealistic.

Ronnie is Ariza, plus offense. All of the coaches at the Olympics tryout camp this summer said he was by far the best defender, and can score efficiently on his own when needed. CJ Miles is no slouch either. You're not doing Utah any favors by including Ronnie or CJ in this deal. Here's a handy quick reference guide on trade value:

Brewer > '10 NYK 1st > Wilson Chandler

Chandler isn't worth either one of these assets, let alone both, and Jeffries isn't worth expirings. The NYK side of this deal has FAIL written all over it.

FA destination or not, the Jazz WILL NOT absorb Jeffries. Are you serious? They give an All-Star bigman, an unprotected lotto pick and (as you've outlined) a swingman prospect, AND they have to absorb $12mil over the next two years for an 11th man? The least you could have done is managed to send Mobley's 80%-insured contract their way. This deal is a EXTREMELY far-fetched as a whole, but Jared is absolutely off the table in these discussions, and not in the good way.

For the record, NJ's side is fair-ish, but the Nets wouldn't give CDR, and Utah wouldn't take Najera in a Boozer deal.

You gotta be kidding. What exactly has Brewer done that makes him better than Chandler? Wait, let me guess, if we take all of Brewer's positives, none of his negatives, while taking Chandler's negatives, none of his positives right? A lot easier to get easy shots with Deron Williams setting things up perfectly for you than a half season of Chris Duhon followed by Nate Robinson trying to imitate a starting PG for the 2nd half of the season. If Chandler had Deron Williams setting things up for him his stats would be even better than it was. It's one thing to say that the Jazz wouldn't do this but to say that Brewer is better than a 1st that you have absolutely no idea where it's going to be which is better than Chandler is nuts.

[yougottoloveitbaby]

LMAO are you kidding?
I don't get why so many people think the Jazz are as dumb as some teams.
They have had ONE losing season in 25 years, you don't do that by having
management like New York (not to be pointing fingers ,but)
Their not going to make a completely Stupid trade. It would be better to
pay the tax one year and keep Boozer, having a real shot (if injuries don't kill them again)
and let him walk for nothing next year than suffer through 95% of these trade
ideas on this board.
And THAT is why there has been no trade yet.

[old rem]

Utah isn't giving Boozer, Brewer and the NY 1st for anything less than an All-NBA 1st-teamer. CERTAINLY not this menagerie of *bleh*, regardless of the financial incentive.

NY gets rid of Jared AND gets their pick back??? Dream on.

I don't think NJN can slide a Najera dump into acquiring a player of Boozer's caliber. And I don't think our FO is willing to give CDR for a probable one-year rental of Carlos.

+1

[vincecarter4pres]

Trenton Hassell is fully guaranteed...

[Trader_Joe]

LMAO are you kidding?
I don't get why so many people think the Jazz are as dumb as some teams.
They have had ONE losing season in 25 years, you don't do that by having
management like New York (not to be pointing fingers ,but)
Their not going to make a completely Stupid trade. It would be better to
pay the tax one year and keep Boozer, having a real shot (if injuries don't kill them again)
and let him walk for nothing next year than suffer through 95% of these trade
ideas on this board.
And THAT is why there has been no trade yet.

So would you rather have nothing than:

CDR
Najera
Jeffries
GS #1 (via NJ)
2010 NY #2
$3m(NY)
NJ TE
NY TE

?

And considering you would be over the cap anyway, it's not as though you can get another FA for Boozer's lost salary.

[JDubJazz]

LMAO are you kidding?
I don't get why so many people think the Jazz are as dumb as some teams.
They have had ONE losing season in 25 years, you don't do that by having
management like New York (not to be pointing fingers ,but)
Their not going to make a completely Stupid trade. It would be better to
pay the tax one year and keep Boozer, having a real shot (if injuries don't kill them again)
and let him walk for nothing next year than suffer through 95% of these trade
ideas on this board.
And THAT is why there has been no trade yet.

So would you rather have nothing than:

CDR
Najera
Jeffries
GS #1 (via NJ)
2010 NY #2
$3m(NY)
NJ TE
NY TE

?

And considering you would be over the cap anyway, it's not as though you can get another FA for Boozer's lost salary.

Actually, yeah, nothing is better than that steaming pile of a trade. Nothing is especially better than that when you consider we aren't losing our starting 2 (Brewer) and a potential high lotto pick. The Jazz are much better off paying the tax for one year and letting Booz walk (or limp) away after the season than taking on all that dreck.

[Rockazoids]

Jeffries, $3m, #2, TE = Hassell, Korver, Brewer

This is where your proposal goes wrong-est. That package from NYK would not get them useless '10 expirings, let alone a useful one (Korver), and a partially guaranteed one (Hassell). THEN you add Brewer the equation, and it gets completely unrealistic.

Ronnie is Ariza, plus offense. All of the coaches at the Olympics tryout camp this summer said he was by far the best defender, and can score efficiently on his own when needed. CJ Miles is no slouch either. You're not doing Utah any favors by including Ronnie or CJ in this deal. Here's a handy quick reference guide on trade value:

Brewer > '10 NYK 1st > Wilson Chandler

Chandler isn't worth either one of these assets, let alone both, and Jeffries isn't worth expirings. The NYK side of this deal has FAIL written all over it.

FA destination or not, the Jazz WILL NOT absorb Jeffries. Are you serious? They give an All-Star bigman, an unprotected lotto pick and (as you've outlined) a swingman prospect, AND they have to absorb $12mil over the next two years for an 11th man? The least you could have done is managed to send Mobley's 80%-insured contract their way. This deal is a EXTREMELY far-fetched as a whole, but Jared is absolutely off the table in these discussions, and not in the good way.

For the record, NJ's side is fair-ish, but the Nets wouldn't give CDR, and Utah wouldn't take Najera in a Boozer deal.

You gotta be kidding. What exactly has Brewer done that makes him better than Chandler? Wait, let me guess, if we take all of Brewer's positives, none of his negatives, while taking Chandler's negatives, none of his positives right? A lot easier to get easy shots with Deron Williams setting things up perfectly for you than a half season of Chris Duhon followed by Nate Robinson trying to imitate a starting PG for the 2nd half of the season. If Chandler had Deron Williams setting things up for him his stats would be even better than it was. It's one thing to say that the Jazz wouldn't do this but to say that Brewer is better than a 1st that you have absolutely no idea where it's going to be which is better than Chandler is nuts.

Well said Moocow007
as for the trade being a NY fan I'm used to missing out on draft pick. Chandler is a keeper. No deal.

[Trader_Joe]

Modified... Brewer was removed, replaced with CJ Miles who has an extra year, and NY adds another #2.

Boozer
Korver
Hapring
CJ Miles
NY #1

for

Chandler
CDR
Duhon
Boone
Najera
Jeffries
GS #1
2010 NY #2
2012 NY #2
TPE NY
TPE NJ
$3m

That actually seems like a great return, and this line-up looks much better than this season's line-up, IMO.

D. Williams / Duhon / Maynor
W.Chandler / Brewer / Price
AK-47 / Jeffries / CDR
Milsap / Najera / Fesenko
Okur / Boone / Kofous
+
GS #1 via NJ
2010 NY #2
2012 NY #2

[Preludepunk27]

Dude the Jazz would NEVER EVER EVER get that kind of package for that package. Knicks and Nets would not be interested in Boozer unless we were totally fisting the Jazz for the fact we can both sign him outright next summer and keep what we have.

/ thread

[hoops4life]

Trader Joe, you are totally missing the point. You can add as many 2nd rounders as you want and it won't work.

Yes the Jazz would much rather let Boozer, Harpring, and Korver walk for nothing and save roughly $20 million in cap space than take on stuff that they don't need and actually cripples them even more.

[Trader_Joe]

Trader Joe, you are totally missing the point. You can add as many 2nd rounders as you want and it won't work.

Yes the Jazz would much rather let Boozer, Harpring, and Korver walk for nothing and save roughly $20 million in cap space than take on stuff that they don't need and actually cripples them even more.

Except the Jazz will not have $20m in cap space.

Next year they are on the books for over $55m for 7 players already w/o Boozer, Korver, Hapring. Mainly that's just Ak, Deron, Okur and Milsap.

From this deal, they are left with in 2010:

2010 #2 - 500k
CDR - 0.9
Najera - 2.8m
JJ - 6.9
Chandler - 2.1

for 13m

+
GS #1
2012 NY #2
2 TPE

2010 with trade
D. Williams / Maynor / Price
W.Chandler / Brewer? / #2
AK-47 / Jeffries / CDR
Milsap / Najera / UTA #1
Okur / Koufos? / #2


2010 w/o trade =

D. Williams / Maynor / Price
NY #1 / Brewer?
AK-47 / Miles
Milsap / Utah #1
Okur / Koufos? / #2

You save about 10m by not doing the trade in 2010, but are still over the cap with a lot of gaps to fill.

[daddyfivestar]

2010 w/o trade =

D. Williams / Maynor / Price
NY #1 / Brewer?
AK-47 / Miles
Milsap / Utah #1
Okur / Koufos? / #2

You save about 10m by not doing the trade in 2010, but are still over the cap with a lot of gaps to fill.

That's where the Lakers and Bulls jump in and complete the Hinrich, Boozer three-way
which gives Utah 13 players right at 69-70 mil in 2010 (ie one deal from being under the tax)

Deron/Price/(Maynor)
Brewer/Maynor
AK/Miles
Millsap/TyThomas/Suton
Okur/Koufos
NY#1, Utah#1