Knicks ADD 2010 Salary?!?!?!

[ecuhus1981]

Trade ID# 5394202

New York Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Andre Iguodala, Gilbert Arenas, Mike James
Outgoing Players: Eddy Curry, Cuttino Mobley, Jared Jeffries, Jordan Hill, Wilson Chandler
NYK upgrades their core while maintaining max FA capspace (assuming the '10 cap > $52mil).
Arenas, Robinson, Iguodala, Gallinari, Lee
Duhon, Douglas, Hughes, Harrington, Milicic


Philadelphia Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Eddy Curry, Jordan Hill, Antawn Jamison
Outgoing Players: Elton Brand, Andre Iguodala
PHI gets financial relief, a better fit at PF and a recent lottery bigman.
Williams, Iverson, Young, Jamison, Dalembert
Holiday, Green, Kapono, Speights, Hill


Washington Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Cuttino Mobley, Jared Jeffries, Wilson Chandler, Elton Brand
Outgoing Players: Gilbert Arenas, Antawn Jamison, Mike James
WAS upgrades its interior D, and nabs a young SF so the Wizards can deal Caron for a PG.
Foye, Butler, Chandler, Brand, Haywood
Boykins, Young, Miller, Blatche, McGee

[bringinhinkie]

LOL

ok isiah

[Relentless88]

NY gives up Hill/Chandler to take on Arenas?

Knicks decline, even if they are getting Iggy and getting rid of Curry/Jeffries
I can't see anyone taking on Arenas as this point, with impending jail time.

[dilbert719]

I honestly can't imagine anyone doing this. The Sixers would never want to trade Iguodala to the Knicks, and if we're trading Brand, why in the world are we taking on a contract running past 2011? The Knicks don't want to take on 2010 salary, no matter what, even if it does get rid of Curry and Jeffries. The Wiz also need to rebuild following the Arenas disaster, which they do by... trading for Elton Brand?

Simply doesn't make sense. The Knicks do this in half a heartbeat if they have strong evidence that they can void Gil's contract, but that's irrelevant because Philly and Washington's part of this cannot be salvaged.

[jowglenn]

i really love the jeffries/curry for arenas concept.. but everything else is too complicated

[ecuhus1981]

Let's break this deal down for discussion.

To make a blanket statement that the Knick will not take on a penny in 2010 salary is short-sighted, to say the least. Sure, they have carefully crafted their plan to make a splash in the FA talent pool this summer. But right now, they have max FA capspace, plus $9mil. This deal only chews up that $9mil, while leaving enough room to sing a max FA.

That $9mil isn't likely to land them another big-time star, so they harness that to bring in two guys that WILL attract the superstar they seek. Arenas' reputation has taken a huge hit in the court of public opinion, but I was reading an article last week saying that his image hasn't been tarnished with fellow NBA stars. Also, for the record (no pun intended!), Gil accepted a plea bargain that the DA would seek no more than 6 months in prison; realistically, he gets 30 days, or possibly just parole and a hefty fine. His "impending jail time" is more of a PR issue than an on-court issue. And d719, Gil's deal almost certainly isn't getting voided. But I don't imagine NYK fans would be too choked up to have ANOTHER $17.7mil in '10 capspace open up IF they could void him. That would be enough to offer another max deal. So, either way, it's a winning scenario for the Knicks IMO.

Bottom line, I think the Knicks would be far better off competing with, say, Arenas-Iguodala-James-Gallinari-Lee (MLE) than Felton ($7mil/year)-Chandler-James-Gallinari-Lee.

[ecuhus1981]

i really love the jeffries/curry for arenas concept.. but everything else is too complicated

That's a valid point, but without the incentive of AI2, a bona fide star with no baggage, the deal takes on an awfully similar tone to the NYK deals of the late 90's. I'd like to hear NYK fans' opinion on your suggestion, though...

[KnicksManiac]

Not as bad as other Knicks fans are saying but how would they sign Lee after that? You said MLE in your post above but there is no chance in hell Lee takes the MLE when he's probably going to be an all-star this season, averaging 19, 11, and 4.

[NetsForce]

The deal is too good for the Knicks to pass up. Arenas won't be serving 5 years in prison at most you're looking at 5-6 months which depending on how speedily the court system goes could allow him to return in time for training camp.

[Rockazoids]

As a NY fan I say not to a deal like this. With cap room you can do so much more.
Echus or Netforce would you do Devin Harris & Bobby Simmons for Arenas ?
or Hassell,Dooling & Harris for Arenas?

[dilbert719]

Let's break this deal down for discussion.

To make a blanket statement that the Knick will not take on a penny in 2010 salary is short-sighted, to say the least. Sure, they have carefully crafted their plan to make a splash in the FA talent pool this summer. But right now, they have max FA capspace, plus $9mil. This deal only chews up that $9mil, while leaving enough room to sing a max FA.

That $9mil isn't likely to land them another big-time star, so they harness that to bring in two guys that WILL attract the superstar they seek. Arenas' reputation has taken a huge hit in the court of public opinion, but I was reading an article last week saying that his image hasn't been tarnished with fellow NBA stars. Also, for the record (no pun intended!), Gil accepted a plea bargain that the DA would seek no more than 6 months in prison; realistically, he gets 30 days, or possibly just parole and a hefty fine. His "impending jail time" is more of a PR issue than an on-court issue. And d719, Gil's deal almost certainly isn't getting voided. But I don't imagine NYK fans would be too choked up to have ANOTHER $17.7mil in '10 capspace open up IF they could void him. That would be enough to offer another max deal. So, either way, it's a winning scenario for the Knicks IMO.

Bottom line, I think the Knicks would be far better off competing with, say, Arenas-Iguodala-James-Gallinari-Lee (MLE) than Felton ($7mil/year)-Chandler-James-Gallinari-Lee.

It's worth noting that you're breaking the deal down from the Knicks' perspective, without addressing the perspectives of the other two teams, who as I mentioned would scuttle this deal anyway.

However, I will grant that IF the Knicks cannot clear the cap space to sign two max FAs, which has been their stated goal all along, then it is worthwhile to add quality players like Iguodala and Arenas (presuming Arenas doesn't get the book thrown at him like Plaxico Burress did, to make an example of him.)

Anyway, back to the issue close to my heart, that being the Sixers' take on this. Using Iguodala to move Elton Brand isn't a slam dunk among Sixers fans, but I'm one who's willing to consider it. However, the problem is that if we're moving Iggy to clear Brand, we need to actually clear his contract, and if we're not getting that money off the books immediately, getting realistic value for Iguodala back. Turning his contract into Antawn Jamison's doesn't help with either our best scenario, which is getting back straight expirings, or our second-best option, which is adding exclusively 2011 expirings and watching as Dalembert, Green, Kapono, and the players who filled the Brand/Iguodala salary slots vanish in time for us to really rebuild.

Adding Curry in a deal like this? Sure thing. He sucks monstrously, but he disappears when we need him to. Hell, Philly's actually a reasonable destination for Jeffries, too, because again, 2011. Jamison, though, for all he's a nice player, he expires in 2012, and he's not going to help us enough on the court to overcome that. Include Cleveland in this, and spin him off for Ilgauskas and a 1st, and you have something here. But Jamison coming to Philly runs counter to everything we need to do.

As a NY fan I say not to a deal like this. With cap room you can do so much more.
Echus or Netforce would you do Devin Harris & Bobby Simmons for Arenas ?
or Hassell,Dooling & Harris for Arenas?

Rockazoids, I'm not a Nets fan, but I do want to point out that you're comparing the nets trading Devin Harris for Gil Arenas to NY trading Eddy Curry and Jared Jeffries. Chandler and Hill are alright players, but everything leaving New York in this deal, combined, doesn't have the value of Devin Harris. For that matter, if it wasn't for the amount of money and risk you're taking on with Arenas, everything New York's trading in this deal doesn't have the value of Andre Iguodala, either.

[Rockazoids]

dilbert I just don't see NY paying 30M in 2010/11 & 32.8M in 2011/12 for them. That's a
isiah move. I'll take Chandler, Hill, Lee & someone else with that kind of money.
And Lets not act Harris is all that. He's a PG that drives to the paint to get fouls,but his
body can't take it. Not a good fit.

[NetsForce]

^ To be fair at least Harris isn't a tweener SF-PF who's back is breaking down from taking so many 3's ^

[Rockazoids]

^ To be fair at least Harris isn't a tweener SF-PF who's back is breaking down from taking so many 3's ^

Damm hurt your feeling hun? I'm not trying to down Harris, he plays like Maggette
but don't have the body for it.
And Gallo back is fine,hitting all them 3's is loosing the back up.

[ecuhus1981]

dilbert I just don't see NY paying 30M in 2010/11 & 32.8M in 2011/12 for them. That's a
isiah move. I'll take Chandler, Hill, Lee & someone else with that kind of money.
And Lets not act Harris is all that. He's a PG that drives to the paint to get fouls,but his
body can't take it. Not a good fit.

dilbert hit on the salient points of why your argument isn't really similar to this trade, but let me go one step further and describe why I didn't make New Jersey the center of this deal.

I was thinking about a deal that is very similar to this one; it would have sent T-Will, Humphries, Simmons and Jamison to PHI, while WAS would have gotten Brand, Harris and Battie. The problem is that the Nets cannot pull off such a trade AND maintain enough capspace to sign a max FA, unless the cap somehow actually INCREASED about $1mil next summer (very slim odds).

One, the contracts not involved in that hypothetical deal on our payroll that extend past 2010 (Yi/Brook/Lee/CDR) chew up far more capspace than the remaining guys on NYK's roster after the OP's deal (Gallo/Douglas). Two, we own our 2010 pick; that's not a bad thing of course, but 1st-round picks have cap holds, so depending on where we pick you can add $2.5 - 4.5mil to our 2010 payroll. Lastly, the league mandates that any team that has under 11 players under contract is assessed a $500K roster hold for cap purposes.

So, to answer your basic question, the doctor would have happily taken some of his own medicine, IF we were in the same cap situation as the Knicks. But we're not, and since the deal would ruin the chance to sign a max FA, the Nets are better off not even doing this one. The Knicks, on the other hand, would be foolish to pass iMO. Your "Chandler, Hill, Lee and someone else" argument is flawed. If Lee signs with NYK, he eats up most if not all of that $9mil over and above the max FA room you have (which you would STILL have after this deal). There would be no "someone else". You cannot honestly prefer Curry/Jeffries/(Lee)/Chandler/Hill over Arenas and Iguodala, can you???

P.S. d719, I will break down the deal for the other two teams. I just need some time.

[moocow007]

Trade ID# 5394202

New York Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Andre Iguodala, Gilbert Arenas, Mike James
Outgoing Players: Eddy Curry, Cuttino Mobley, Jared Jeffries, Jordan Hill, Wilson Chandler
NYK upgrades their core while maintaining max FA capspace (assuming the '10 cap > $52mil).
Arenas, Robinson, Iguodala, Gallinari, Lee
Duhon, Douglas, Hughes, Harrington, Milicic


Philadelphia Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Eddy Curry, Jordan Hill, Antawn Jamison
Outgoing Players: Elton Brand, Andre Iguodala
PHI gets financial relief, a better fit at PF and a recent lottery bigman.
Williams, Iverson, Young, Jamison, Dalembert
Holiday, Green, Kapono, Speights, Hill


Washington Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Cuttino Mobley, Jared Jeffries, Wilson Chandler, Elton Brand
Outgoing Players: Gilbert Arenas, Antawn Jamison, Mike James
WAS upgrades its interior D, and nabs a young SF so the Wizards can deal Caron for a PG.
Foye, Butler, Chandler, Brand, Haywood
Boykins, Young, Miller, Blatche, McGee

Why would the Knicks want to help the Nets get Lebron James (by eliminating themselves from the chase) and bring Stephon Marbury II to NY again?

[moocow007]

The deal is too good for the Knicks to pass up. Arenas won't be serving 5 years in prison at most you're looking at 5-6 months which depending on how speedily the court system goes could allow him to return in time for training camp.

That's exactly what we thought when we traded for Marbury.

[ecuhus1981]

moocow007, I don't know how you could have misunderstood, as I have stated several times in this thread: the Knicks do NOT eliminate themselves from the LeBron sweepstakes with this deal. They still would have enough capspace to sign a max FA.

As for your Marbury comment, THAT'S what I was thinking when jowglenn made his comment. The difference is Iguodala, whose acquisition for '11 expirings and spare prospects would be anything but an Isaiah move.

[moocow007]

Let's break this deal down for discussion.

To make a blanket statement that the Knick will not take on a penny in 2010 salary is short-sighted, to say the least. Sure, they have carefully crafted their plan to make a splash in the FA talent pool this summer. But right now, they have max FA capspace, plus $9mil. This deal only chews up that $9mil, while leaving enough room to sing a max FA.

That $9mil isn't likely to land them another big-time star, so they harness that to bring in two guys that WILL attract the superstar they seek. Arenas' reputation has taken a huge hit in the court of public opinion, but I was reading an article last week saying that his image hasn't been tarnished with fellow NBA stars. Also, for the record (no pun intended!), Gil accepted a plea bargain that the DA would seek no more than 6 months in prison; realistically, he gets 30 days, or possibly just parole and a hefty fine. His "impending jail time" is more of a PR issue than an on-court issue. And d719, Gil's deal almost certainly isn't getting voided. But I don't imagine NYK fans would be too choked up to have ANOTHER $17.7mil in '10 capspace open up IF they could void him. That would be enough to offer another max deal. So, either way, it's a winning scenario for the Knicks IMO.

Bottom line, I think the Knicks would be far better off competing with, say, Arenas-Iguodala-James-Gallinari-Lee (MLE) than Felton ($7mil/year)-Chandler-James-Gallinari-Lee.

Do they really have enough money left after this for James? If so, then yeah, it may be worth a look so I take what I said previously back.

[Bac2Basics]

In which parallel universe do you image that anyone would trade for Gilbert Arenas right now?