Why isn't John Hammond fired?

Limca · Post #1 » by **Limca** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:29 am

I don't understand. Hammonds records is a pathetic 189-227. You all have documented his awful trading skills. (The Tobias trade being the absolute worst). How can a gm have a "win now" mandate for 6 years have such a garbage record with rapidly dwindling attendance and not get fired??? Instead he gets rewarded with a big contract extension? Huh? For all of kohls faults he has always canned disappointing performing executives (Harris 1 and 2, grunfeld etc). But why does kohl cling to Hammond? Does Hammond have dirt on him? Does Hammond have any special relationships with anyone in the front office? Or is kohl just become too senile?? What is going on!?

Baddy Chuck · Post #2 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:30 am

Madtown · Post #3 » by **Madtown** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:35 am

Baddy Chuck wrote:Perfect 100% accurate response

/thread

emunney · Post #4 » by **emunney** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:00 am

CLASSIC JENNINGS GIF

Come on, Mike, you gotta stretch for that one.

emunney · Post #5 » by **emunney** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:03 am

I think the real reason Hammond hasn't been fired is that his draft picks seem to be perpetually on the verge of great things. The emergence of Larry and the promise of Henson got him his extension. Yanni is saving his ass right now.

breakchains · Post #6 » by **breakchains** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:08 am

My guess is that Hammond was actually against the Tobias trade, which was probably put forth by someone else in the FO and Hammond was too weak to kill it. In the end, he was proven right, and Kohl felt bad and thought Hammond might not be so bad after all.

Wooderson · Post #7 » by **Wooderson** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:11 am

The East being so atrocious is the reason he got an extension. The Bucks were comfortably in the 8th spot and almost a playoff lock by the end of January last year. And that's all Kohl cares about.

If Philly had kept Iggy/Vucevic/Harkless, they make the playoffs over the Bucks last year and Hammond is canned at some point imo. Amazing really.

Post #8 » by **paulpressey25** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:13 am

breakchains wrote:My guess is that Hammond was actually against the Tobias trade, which was probably put forth by someone else in the FO and Hammond was too weak to kill it. In the end, he was proven right, and Kohl felt bad and thought Hammond might not be so bad after all.

I've heard Hammond was for the Tobias trade and that's why Morway was brought in after the season. By the way, Hammond got his three year extension one month BEFORE the Tobias trade.

In any event, I'm just done with all the speculative **** about who was for what trade and what move. Was it Hammond, Morway, Babcock, Derrick Lutz, etc. who made deal X?

At the end of the day, Hammond has the TITLE of GM. The team is 5-17 after six-years of his work.

Time to go.

Madtown · Post #9 » by **Madtown** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:16 am

paulpressey25 wrote:
breakchains wrote:My guess is that Hammond was actually against the Tobias trade, which was probably put forth by someone else in the FO and Hammond was too weak to kill it. In the end, he was proven right, and Kohl felt bad and thought Hammond might not be so bad after all.

I've heard Hammond was for the Tobias trade and that's why Morway was brought in after the season. By the way, Hammond got his three year extension one month BEFORE the Tobias trade.

In any event, I'm just done with all the speculative **** about who was for what trade and what move. Was it Hammond, Morway, Babcock, Derrick Lutz, etc. who made deal X?

At the end of the day, Hammond has the TITLE of GM. The team is 5-17 after six-years of his work.

Time to go.

Interesting.... :noway:

SkilesTheLimit · Post #10 » by **SkilesTheLimit** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:16 am

emunney wrote:CLASSIC JENNINGS GIF

Come on, Mike, you gotta stretch for that one.

Court vision and adept passing. He's the black Steve Nash.

This is classic.

Kerb Hohl · Post #11 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:19 am

He hasn't been fired because we are still waiting 3-4 more years for the mess that Larry Harris left him to clear up.

SkilesTheLimit · Post #12 » by **SkilesTheLimit** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:32 am

I have said it before about Hammond. It's very possible that he knows the game of basketball very well and has a keen eye for talent. He's proven that in his draft selections. At the same time, he's too nice and a model employee that allows his bosses (ie. Kohl and cronies) to dictate player acquisition at times even if he disagrees. He complies because he wants to keep his job and collect his paycheck as an NBA GM. Think about it, there's a reason POR was rumored to covet him before hiring Olshey (and why former Asst. GM Weltman was seen as a keen exec around the league).

It's also plausible that he has captain'd the ship and made these bad signings/trades himself, at which point my theory is debunked. One thing I find odd is bringing in Morway. if the organization was truly happy with Hammond, they would not have "stole" (as Kohl put it) a big name former GM to look over his shoulder...

bizarro · Post #13 » by **bizarro** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:37 am

breakchains wrote:My guess is that Hammond was actually against the Tobias trade, which was probably put forth by someone else in the FO and Hammond was too weak to kill it. In the end, he was proven right, and Kohl felt bad and thought Hammond might not be so bad after all.

I know for a fact John Hammond was against the Tobias trade. It was a mandate from on high. I've said it before and I'll say it again: That's on Kohl and cronies. That is not on Hammond.

Kerb Hohl · Post #14 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:37 am

The results ended up similar but Harris at least convinced Herb to allow/had rumored splash deals. I hated every move that Bone made. I at least had some hope in some of LH's moves like the CV trade.

I saw all I needed to see in acquisition #1. Trading for RJ was all I needed to see that he was relatively clueless.

Post #15 » by **paulpressey25** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:40 am

SkilesTheLimit wrote:It's very possible that he knows the game of basketball very well and has a keen eye for talent. He's proven that in his draft selections.

Again, I think this may or may not be true.

Potsie pick- disaster

Jennings pick - He wanted Johnny Flynn and passed on Holiday and Lawson. Was that a good pick four years later?

Sanders - great pick.

Tobias - nice pick, but Faried and a few other guys went after Tobias. Besides, what GM thinks it a good value proposition to drop from 7 to 19 in the draft in order to get Stephen Jackson? How poorly do you have to understand the NBA draft to not know that drop from 7 to 19 is huge?

Giannis - Dave Babcock and our Italian scout found this guy.

jakecronus8 · Post #16 » by **jakecronus8** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:45 am

bizarro · Post #17 » by **bizarro** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:46 am

I take a bit of a different angle re: the Morway hiring. I think Hammond was completely on board with the hiring and, actually, may have pushed for it. Kohl pushed the Redick trade. It was mandated to Hammond to get it done and Hennigan was able to pry Tobias out of it and Kohl gave the go ahead. I don't know if it's been discussed here at length, but Morway was originally more that statistical man in Indiana than anything else. He wasn't the guy pulling the trigger on trades etc. I honestly think Hammond is still around because Kohl and his clunker war chest of VP's know they've repeatedly shat their own bed by demanding one thing and realizing, after the decision, they've by and large been terrible choices. The Tobias backlash was the final straw. And, I propose, Hammond wanted more clout in the room. Morway has a reputation. He's very adept at analyzing and providing information for a GM to pursue certain avenues and make decisions accordingly. It's largely known Morway has always been a Mayo guy as well. Lo and behold, he gets the most money and signs here. I don't conjecture any of this as a pass for Hammond - he's still the one finding deals and proposing them to Kohl and crew. BUT, I do propose things may actually be changing if he has another bird in the nest that speaks the same language.

My two cents.

theFireBlanket · Post #18 » by **theFireBlanket** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:46 am

paulpressey25 wrote:
SkilesTheLimit wrote:It's very possible that he knows the game of basketball very well and has a keen eye for talent. He's proven that in his draft selections.

Again, I think this may or may not be true.

Potsie pick- disaster

Jennings pick - He wanted Johnny Flynn and passed on Holiday and Lawson. Was that a good pick four years later?

Sanders - great pick.

Tobias - nice pick, but Faried and a few other guys went after Tobias. Besides, what GM thinks it a good value proposition to drop from 7 to 19 in the draft in order to get Stephen Jackson? How poorly do you have to understand the NBA draft to not know that drop from 7 to 19 is huge?

Giannis - Dave Babcock and our Italian scout found this guy.

What? Bulls---.

You forgot Henson.

Max Green · Post #19 » by **Max Green** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:47 am

bizarro wrote:
breakchains wrote:My guess is that Hammond was actually against the Tobias trade, which was probably put forth by someone else in the FO and Hammond was too weak to kill it. In the end, he was proven right, and Kohl felt bad and thought Hammond might not be so bad after all.

I know for a fact John Hammond was against the Tobias trade. It was a mandate from on high. I've said it before and I'll say it again: That's on Kohl and cronies. That is not on Hammond.

How do you know for a fact Hammond was against the Tobias trade? He's the one who pulled the Trigger. I'm pretty sure Kohl didn't call up Hennigan in Orlando asking for JJ Redick. He traded Tobias because he the Coaching staff undersold how good he really was, and that he thought he was getting Josh Smith to go a long with Redick.

andonewheel · Post #20 » by **andonewheel** » Fri Dec 13, 2013 5:48 am

I think Kohl likes the fact that he can boss Hammond around and meddle, and I think that is why he gave him the 3 year extension. The wheels really fell off after that point, and I think Kohl is unwilling to fire Hammond so quickly after giving him an extension because that would reflect poorly on Kohl's decision making.