Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Horst to Detroit rumor

[Matches Malone]

I'd very much welcome them taking fliers on guys like Pat Williams and seeing if they can unearth his potential, over continuing to chase veterans that are closer to retirement than being difference makers for the team. And it definitely beats mortgaging tons of future assets for non-difference maker vets *cough* Crowder *cough*.

[raferfenix]

Targeting Jae Crowder as the latest failed attempt to replace PJ is a black mark on Horst’s track record.

We needed to trade those seconds for someone useful.

[Ron Swanson]

Maybe he's better suited in a series against the Knicks or Celtics, but yeah, Crowder still being a largely invisible 10-15 minute guy for the 2nd straight postseason is certainly not what you had in mind when we acquired him. His days as a 16-game player might be done.

[German Athens]

I really think it’s as simple as: your best 5-man lineup should probably consist of your 5 highest paid players, or near enough to it.

Our best 5-man lineup will almost assuredly be Giannis at the 5 in a small-ball look.

Instead, we’ve often been relying on 1-2 minimum players to fill the gaps in those lineups, and there’s a reason they’re available for the minimum.

[paulpressey25]

I'm not down on Dame. He's a point machine. And he still has the opportunity to keep pouring it on the Pacers.

But as you look at the decisions made over the past 12-months, in retrospect, I'd personally rescind them if I could.

Bud >> Doc (Bud is Sloan or a young Pop, Doc is sort of George Karl)

Jrue, Grayson, 2029 unprotected 1st, 2028 and 2030 pick swaps > Dame

I get all the problems we had with Jrue, especially in the playoffs. But watching that uncontested layup line to the rim last night got me to thinking about Big Dog. He'd put up 34 points and people would go crazy at the Bark Board. But a Cedric Ceballos would get 36 on him and we'd lose.

At this moment, I'd rather be riding with Jrue, Grayson and probably a different damn good player we could have gotten with those pick and salary space assets.

[Ron Swanson]

Sorry PP. I can't imagine how much more hopeless it would be looking right now with Jrue and Grayson out there brick-laying instead of Dame carrying us to a 1-1 series tie. Not like he'd be doing any better of a job on Haliburton than Pat Bev has done. We're not as deep as Boston and can't afford Jrue doing his usual 3-of-10 from the field for 9-points and 7 assists while still winning by double digits.

[DingleJerry]

Yea I'd say that lay up line had more to do with our wing issues than Dame. Now, if we somehow could've had Jrue next to Dame that would've been ideal.

What's killing us is no wing athleticism. And then on O Khris can't handle the ball vs ball pressure anymore so with Dame having a double anytime he touches the ball you're left with Pat handling the ball and he's obviously not good enough at it. This again would be helped if there was a wing (most can dribble well these days) with athleticism to pick up that slack and take advantage of the space. Instead, in spite of what they're doing to Dame they can belly up all our other guys and none can beat them to the hoop. Flip to when we're on D, every guy out there can attack them in the space created by having to force the ball out of Halliburtons hands.

Think the post last page summed it up well. I think all the Dame haters can calm down and see he's still good and you probably have 2 years left to give it a go with him. But the roster has to be re-tooled around him and Giannis. Getting him so late after you'd gotten a 2 gaurd who fit better with Jrue put them behind the 8 ball. Its gonna suck for Giannis and fans but Khris and Brook likely have to swapped. And count me in on the plan a roster around Giannis at the 5 as your closing or primary lineup.

[tydett]

Sorry PP. I can't imagine how much more hopeless it would be looking right now with Jrue and Grayson out there brick-laying instead of Dame carrying us to a 1-1 series tie. Not like he'd be doing any better of a job on Haliburton than Pat Bev has done. We're not as deep as Boston and can't afford Jrue doing his usual 3-of-10 from the field for 9-points and 7 assists while still winning by double digits.

Especially knowing we'd be resigning Jrue for $35 mil and Grayson for $20 mil for 3 more years of the same result.

[raferfenix]

Especially knowing we'd be resigning Jrue for $35 mil and Grayson for $20 mil for 3 more years of the same result.

And then Giannis asks out.

[BUCKnation]

Sorry PP. I can't imagine how much more hopeless it would be looking right now with Jrue and Grayson out there brick-laying instead of Dame carrying us to a 1-1 series tie. Not like he'd be doing any better of a job on Haliburton than Pat Bev has done. We're not as deep as Boston and can't afford Jrue doing his usual 3-of-10 from the field for 9-points and 7 assists while still winning by double digits.

This. I know he rolled his ankle last night, but Grayson had his best ever season and is a complete non-factor for the Suns so far in the postseason and I don't think Jrue is doing much to stop Siakam (assuming Bev would even be on the team and guarding Hali). He could probably help take away his dribble, but we've seen him get cooked repeatedly by bigger guys.

I've been saying this whole season that I don't regret the trade at all, but the roster construction around it was lacking, although tbf it was completed so late in the offseason.

If anything, games 1/2 have given me more confidence in Dame and the potential next year when Horst can have a full offseason to retool.

[CharityStripe34]

We're about two seasons too late in trading Brook when he had good value as a rim protector and floor spacer. He works hard but he's also two years older, with a back surgery as well, and is a very matchup specific player. Regardless of what happens in the next two weeks, this team needs some athletes to pair with Freak and Dame. It's quite possible Brook and maybe even Khris get quietly shopped.

Also sucks they've yet to hit on a diamond-in-the-rough young player (possibly Green and Ajax?) that looks like a playoff contributor.

[MickeyDavis]

Brook's back surgery/durability is not an issue. He's played 78 and 79 games the past 2 years. Averaging over 30 minutes per game, something he hadn't done since 2016-17

[yb90]

We're about two seasons too late in trading Brook when he had good value as a rim protector and floor spacer. He works hard but he's also two years older, with a back surgery as well, and is a very matchup specific player. Regardless of what happens in the next two weeks, this team needs some athletes to pair with Freak and Dame. It's quite possible Brook and maybe even Khris get quietly shopped.

Also sucks they've yet to hit on a diamond-in-the-rough young player (possibly Green and Ajax?) that looks like a playoff contributor.

I think Brooke is still valuable to a team with better perimeter defenders and on a one year deal he could make a lot of sense for OKC, NOP, and GSW.

[paulpressey25]

Especially knowing we'd be resigning Jrue for $35 mil and Grayson for $20 mil for 3 more years of the same result.

And then Giannis asks out.

I get it. Bud/Griffin and Dame moves had to be done to get Giannis to sign the extension. And Giannis is a great guy, and the franchise. So no arguments.

But in hindsight, Giannis likely was wrong.

ETA: Remember, that trade wasn't just about Jrue and Grayson. It's about salary and picks that could have gone somewhere else for another good player.

[Wonka]

Brook's back surgery/durability is not an issue. He's played 78 and 79 games the past 2 years. Averaging over 30 minutes per game, something he hadn't done since 2016-17

His durability isn’t an issue, but his lack of foot speed and having to scheme around that is an issue.

[paulpressey25]

His durability isn’t an issue, but his lack of foot speed and having to scheme around that is an issue.

We've known for the last four years that Brook is a platoon player. And when we had PJ, it was the perfect compliment. And we've let PJ slip away, and all options to replace him have failed.

[raferfenix]

But in hindsight, Giannis likely was wrong.

Curious to see how much DeJounte Murray ultimately goes for.

Flanking him and Jrue might be the biggest what if we’ll debate for years to come.

[CharityStripe34]

Brook's back surgery/durability is not an issue. He's played 78 and 79 games the past 2 years. Averaging over 30 minutes per game, something he hadn't done since 2016-17

My only gripe is that he's a matchup specific player and gets played off the floor in the playoffs against the Miami's and Boston's of the world. Very good rim protector and can hit outside shots but is vulnerable against the good teams and coaches that can space the Bucks out. Jrue's anemic offense and Lopez getting abused in the pick-and-pop game against Horford and Grant F'n Williams cost us that Boston series two years ago. In a series that was winnable even without Khris.

[Ron Swanson]

He signed immediately after we traded for Dame. There continues to be absolutely nothing to indicate that firing Bud and/or hiring Griffin was a sticking point in Giannis signing the extension. Yes, I'm sure everyone was extremely frustrated after getting bounced by Miami, but if the front office actually trusted their own process and not made personnel decisions entirely based on this constant fear of Giannis someday leaving, we'd be in a much better spot from a coaching and organizational stability standpoint.

[CharityStripe34]

Agreed, I think Giannis would've been fine if they kept Bud and still went after Dame.

Now the point is getting closer and closer to having to make the tough choice to start the soft reset/retool around Giannis and Dame. Assuming this season ends within the next 2-3 weeks of course.