Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas - Bucks deny Pistons to talk to Horst

[randy84]

The issue is that this team is extremely top heavy, so as your top three guys get hurt you are relying on scrubs that you signed to league minimums, unproven rookies, or buy outs guys that other teams didn't want. This is not a recipe for success. The Celtics, Knicks, Nuggets, and even the Pacers are doing well because they have an actual bench.

Teams like the Suns, Bucks, and Lakers are sitting home right now because they are too top heavy with no bench.

[JayMKE]

I can buy that maybe the team needed to make that trade to get Giannis to sign the extension but subbing Dame & Griffin/Doc in place of Jrue & Bud definitely didn’t make the team better while depleting what little flexibility & assets the team had to essentially nothing.

So you can argue that the Bucks used their flexibility and assets to keep Giannis which according to your earlier posts, is the only thing that matters.

Yeah you can argue that if you believe in the theory that Giannis was only going to sign an extension if we fired Bud and traded for Dame but that of course is completely speculatory and excuses Dame not being the impact player everybody expected him to be while being too old and paid too much.

If the team stuck the course with Jrue/Bud its hard imagining the results would have been worse in terms of record or end result, saying they’d lose in 4 or 5 games or coping about Jrue/Grayson are doing on other teams in totally different roles seems like splitting hairs and cope.

[WeMajor34]

Ishbia is reportedly shopping their first this year to upgrade Phoenix’s roster.

I could see Horst doing the same thing. A trade I always go back to is the 76ers getting Melton for a first in the ‘22 draft. Depending on who’s in the draft at our spot, I could see Horst getting desperate for a vet.

I think we need to use at least one of our picks this year on someone who can meaningfully contribute next year. It’s a big summer for Horst (or his replacement) and it starts at the draft.

[RogerMurdock]

not wanting to answer a reporter's question for "not subscribing to the pod" is totally valid

Am I living on another planet or is this just an insane take?

I'm not one to criticize players - they work hard and get emotional. If they have a bad game or the team loses, fine. It's sports. But man, Pat Bev went off the deep end last night. Bobby talks about front runners? There you go.

Honestly, I know it would be difficult to do in the moment, but I'm a little disappointed that the reporter who asked Pat the next question, along with everyone else, didn't just leave. Sorry dude, go retire and do your dumb podcast (and yes, I've watched it - it's just Rone pumping Bev up and Bev spitting word salad).

[midranger]

I can buy that maybe the team needed to make that trade to get Giannis to sign the extension but subbing Dame & Griffin/Doc in place of Jrue & Bud definitely didn’t make the team better while depleting what little flexibility & assets the team had to essentially nothing.

So you can argue that the Bucks used their flexibility and assets to keep Giannis which according to your earlier posts, is the only thing that matters.

Yeah you can argue that if you believe in the theory that Giannis was only going to sign an extension if we fired Bud and traded for Dame but that of course is completely speculatory and excuses Dame not being the impact player everybody expected him to be while being too old and paid too much.

If the team stuck the course with Jrue/Bud its hard imagining the results would have been worse in terms of record or end result, saying they’d lose in 4 or 5 games or coping about Jrue/Grayson are doing on other teams in totally different roles seems like splitting hairs and cope.

I mean, we have the direct evidence of what happened last year with Bud, Jrue, and Grayson. Worse, more embarrassing, more panicked loss than this year (with more Giannis, btw).

It was over man. People need to come to grips with that. Game 5 last year ended the era. Done. Period. Just no coming back from that disaster. Everyone in the crowd knew it silently leaving Fiserv. Needed a retool then. Still need it now.

[FrieAaron]

Miami last year was way better than this Indy team

[raferfenix]

Khris proved he’s still a killer in the playoffs.

But devil’s advocate…sell high?

Would take a ton to even consider and whether we’d do it or not I could see some serious offers out there now.

[midranger]

Y’all can hang on to whatever you want. Last year’s playoff performance crapping our pants in every 4th quarter was 10x worse than this year’s completely limping undermanned, but heart filled battle.

It’s hard to overstate how bad last year’s playoff performance was. Not sure what lead to it, but it was definitely a 1-2-3 Cancun moment for bud and the team. (Yes I recall Bud’s tragedy, but the issue were there before that happened. And really for years dating back to Atlanta)

[fansinceforever]

So you can argue that the Bucks used their flexibility and assets to keep Giannis which according to your earlier posts, is the only thing that matters.

Yeah you can argue that if you believe in the theory that Giannis was only going to sign an extension if we fired Bud and traded for Dame but that of course is completely speculatory and excuses Dame not being the impact player everybody expected him to be while being too old and paid too much.

If the team stuck the course with Jrue/Bud its hard imagining the results would have been worse in terms of record or end result, saying they’d lose in 4 or 5 games or coping about Jrue/Grayson are doing on other teams in totally different roles seems like splitting hairs and cope.

I mean, we have the direct evidence of what happened last year with Bud, Jrue, and Grayson. Worse, more embarrassing, more panicked loss than this year (with more Giannis, btw).

It was over man. People need to come to grips with that. Game 5 last year ended the era. Done. Period. Just no coming back from that disaster. Everyone in the crowd knew it silently leaving Fiserv. Needed a retool then. Still need it now.

Amen. We're a year overdue.

[Ron Swanson]

How about "nothing can be gleaned from a series with your two best players out/hobbled" and leave it at that? Did Game 5 really swing so many emotional pendulums and trick people into thinking we were gonna win two straight with no Giannis and Dame basically on crutches?

Only thing anyone should be sure of at this point is that you finally need to move on from the Brook/Bobby front court. Whether it's one of or both guys, you can't have $30+ mil invested in personnel that is incredibly matchup dependent and play the same position as your superstar.

[RogerMurdock]

By the way, Bobby is a total front runner, too, so the fact that he criticized Indy for being that is pretty darn funny. He plays great when the Bucks are winning and getting the home crowd riled up, but then he can't deal with being on the road and the crowd hating him.

That said, I like him and want him to return to the Bucks.

[MickeyDavis]

I realize we are in win now mode as long as Giannis is here. But I really don't want to trade away any more firsts. We have no firsts or have pick swaps for the next several years.

[raferfenix]

How about "nothing can be gleaned from a series with your two best players out/hobbled" and leave it at that? Did Game 5 really swing so many emotional pendulums and trick people into thinking we were gonna win two straight with no Giannis and Dame basically on crutches?

Only thing anyone should be sure of at this point is that you finally need to move on from the Brook/Bobby front court. Whether it's one of or both guys, you can't have $30+ mil invested in personnel that is incredibly matchup dependent and play the same position as your superstar.

You actually identified a few key things to glean:

1. Middleton is a killer who kept us in this series by sheer force of will. He can be a top offensive option but you need to keep him in bubble wrap for the regular season. Khris also doesn’t play D but rebounded pretty well, could be best as a tweener forward if not small ball 4 on teams than can accommodate

2. Bobby is a starting caliber 4 who doesn’t play D. Lopez plays D but isn’t a good fit next to Bobby. Both should have solid value, and especially if we keep Middleton, dear god do we need another athlete in the front court.

3. Even while all these guys were in their prime we needed PJ to have enough versatility and D to win a chip. Crowder is just the latest lol failure to recreate that. Time to try something new.

[German Athens]

While we’ve been mostly pondering perimeter defense at the 2-spot this year, I think maybe the more important personnel question this off-season is the small-ball 4 (Aaron Gordon like).

Ideally we find someone who has enough size/strength to actually bang against 4’s while quick enough to guard on the perimeter.

The problem is that mold is harder to find than a two-way 2-guard. Khris will probably end up being our small ball 4 moving forward, but if we could find someone who fits the mold, it would still be worth it to grab him due to the defensive versatility added. For instance, Gordon would be able to start at the 3 or the 4, depending on matchups.

Whatever it looks like, we need to come up with a coherent Giannis-at-the-5 lineup that isn’t reliant on minimum signings to fill the gaps.

[rayallenscalves]

not wanting to answer a reporter's question for "not subscribing to the pod" is totally valid

Am I living on another planet or is this just an insane take?

I'm not one to criticize players - they work hard and get emotional. If they have a bad game or the team, loses, fine. It's sports. But man, Pat Bev went off the deep end last night. Bobby talks about front runners? There you go.

Honestly, I know it would be difficult to do in the moment, but I'm a little disappointed that the reporter who asked Pat the next question, along with everyone else, didn't just leave. Sorry dude, go retire and do your dumb podcast (and yes, I've watched it - it's just Rone pumping Bev up and Bev spitting word salad).

I think the last 24 hours have given a good indication of why Pat Bev can't stick on a team for longer than a year.

[rayallenscalves]

I realize we are in win now mode as long as Giannis is here. But I really don't want to trade away any more firsts. We have no firsts or have pick swaps for the next several years.

Agreed. This team desperately needs youth ... and a coaching staff who can develop the youths ... and a coach who will actually play the youths.

[raferfenix]

I realize we are in win now mode as long as Giannis is here. But I really don't want to trade away any more firsts. We have no firsts or have pick swaps for the next several years.

Bucks held their powder and let our draft assets accrue just long enough to get Dame instead of using fewer picks on the likes of FVV or Bojan deadline before last.

This offseason we could trade our first (after we make it), 1 future first, and 1 swap if that's right?

I care less about our 2024 pick since we know where it is in the draft but we could seriously regret not controlling those picks in the years when Giannis is in a retirement home.

[raferfenix]

Pat Bev outplaying Jrue matters way more to me than anything he does off the court.

Hell if him being obnoxious means we have a greater likelihood of keeping him on the cheap all the better!

[SirChurros]

I don't really know what you do from here. You probably keep Giannis/Khris/Dame and make some other moves but, man, I'd be lying if I didn't think our window had nothing but a small crack left open. It's just really discouraging that our star players keep getting hit with injuries when it matters most.

Not sure at what point, "if healthy," gets old.

[WeMajor34]

How about "nothing can be gleaned from a series with your two best players out/hobbled" and leave it at that? Did Game 5 really swing so many emotional pendulums and trick people into thinking we were gonna win two straight with no Giannis and Dame basically on crutches?

Only thing anyone should be sure of at this point is that you finally need to move on from the Brook/Bobby front court. Whether it's one of or both guys, you can't have $30+ mil invested in personnel that is incredibly matchup dependent and play the same position as your superstar.

Totally agree here. I think Brook is more valuable to a startup-young team like Orlando or Houston than he is to us right now.

Same goes with Bobby. A middling team could use and probably start him.

Getting bigs who can slide their feet on defense and not be so ground-bound will hopefully be a focus this summer. I love Bobby and Brook but I think their time in Milwaukee may be up.