Game Thread : Australia vs. Argentina (Tuesday 9:15 CST)

[paul]

Ok so another crap performance, Bogut didn't play particularly well but man he had some help out there.....

By far and away the biggest problem the Aussies have is coaching staff, Goorjian has ABSOLUTELY no idea how to use Bogut to the point of comedy, he's more than happy to have his way below average guards jack the thing up all night, this all must feel very very familiar to Bogut.

Quick question Bucks fans - your a coach of a national team, your best player is a young 7 footer who is at his best in the low block and needs to be involved in the offense, after dying from the outside in your previous game you are now 5 minutes in to your next game and are down 10 after going approximately 0 for 10 on offense all from the perimeter. So, what do you do?

The answer if your name is Brian Goorjian is to take out your best player and replace him with a sof-as-butter perimeter shooting big so that he can also miss 3's. It's truly mind boggling and must be ridiculously frustrating to Bogut, the guy just looks angry. Hopefully Goorjian saw that later in the game when they went to Bogut in the post, even though he shot poorly suddenly they got some put backs and he made some very sweet assists to cutters. If he doesn't figure out he needs to use Bogut down low from here on in this tournament is officially over for Austalia.

Oh btw Patty Mills is a jet, and the fact that CJ Bruton is on that team above Aaron Bruce is surely some kind of crime against humanity. Some of the guys on the team, mainly Bruton and Barlow, need to realise they are not good players and stop hogging the freaking ball and jacking it up all night, Barlow went about 0-6 in the first with quite a few of them going straight over Bogut's head when he had strong position in the post.

[BuckFan25226]

Ok so another crap performance, Bogut didn't play particularly well but man he had some help out there.....

By far and away the biggest problem the Aussies have is coaching staff, Goorjian has ABSOLUTELY no idea how to use Bogut to the point of comedy, he's more than happy to have his way below average guards jack the thing up all night, this all must feel very very familiar to Bogut.

Quick question Bucks fans - your a coach of a national team, your best player is a young 7 footer who is at his best in the low block and needs to be involved in the offense, after dying from the outside in your previous game you are now 5 minutes in to your next game and are down 10 after going approximately 0 for 10 on offense all from the perimeter. So, what do you do?

The answer if your name is Brian Goorjian is to take out your best player and replace him with a sof-as-butter perimeter shooting big so that he can also miss 3's. It's truly mind boggling and must be ridiculously frustrating to Bogut, the guy just looks angry. Hopefully Goorjian saw that later in the game when they went to Bogut in the post, even though he shot poorly suddenly they got some put backs and he made some very sweet assists to cutters. If he doesn't figure out he needs to use Bogut down low from here on in this tournament is officially over for Austalia.

Oh btw Patty Mills is a jet, and the fact that CJ Bruton is on that team above Aaron Bruce is surely some kind of crime against humanity. Some of the guys on the team, mainly Bruton and Barlow, need to realise they are not good players and stop hogging the freaking ball and jacking it up all night, Barlow went about 0-6 in the first with quite a few of them going straight over Bogut's head when he had strong position in the post.

Use the big guy who can hit an open shot. Argentina did a great job of denying Bogut and keeping him out of the lane. Why would a good team, and good defensive team like Argentina allow a player to go to the only thing he has on offense? Which is on the low block with his back to the basket.

Australia just isn't a very good team. Argentina simply did a good job on Bogut. Also, Bogut missed at least 3 or 4 baby jump hooks in the lane when he did get good position.

[stellation]

Bogut looked amazingly stiff out there, I have to assume it was due to the ankle injury.

Patty Mills, Patty Mills. If there's a place in the NBA for TJ...

[midranger]

Poor Bogut.

He's played for like 5 coaches and none of them know how to use him. No guard he's ever played with has known how to use him. It's been this way for 5 years minus his sophomore year at Utah. 4 of 5 years of complete disappointment spanning college, NBA, and international play.

At what point do we just admit to ourselves that he's just not that good?

[stellation]

I'm not sure I'd say Bogut is sucking out there mid, he isn't dominating but he does look very stiff and injured- his better than average mobility as a 5 has always been one of his strengths and it does look impeded out there.

He isn't the only quality big not performing well on the Australian squad, David Andersen has been suffering from naught-but-setting-picks-itis. They went to him briefly in the low post in the second and we looked a lot better for it... then for some reason after the Australian's had pulled the lead back by 8 in the second, off the back of Andersen's play, Goorjian made wholesale changes. Andersen has won 3 Euroleague titles, including as a starter and easily one of the top 2 players on CSKA in their title win last year, he has one of the most beautiful low post games you will ever see and spends the majority of each game on the pine or setting picks for wings to miss 3s.

[Chapter29]

We don't need to admit he's not that good, because he is imo a good player. Regardless of what he did in this game. He is a glue guy type player that all good teams require. Maybe your 3rd best player and of course he is a C with actual size that are hard to come by. A tad bit of a disappointment given his pick, but beyond that I am happy with him.

I have no clue whether or not Bogut was used properly in this game or with his Nation team in general, but I will say that if you have an NBA player on your roster, he might just be your best bet to winning the game. You might want to figure out how to best utilize him.

Obviously Bogut didn't play well for whatever reason. I am not concerned in the slightest. Just stay healthy, get some rest when your team is done and get back to work.

[KingCammo]

Nah Chap, I prefer panacing and all out winging mid style. "Waa Waa Waa" is more predictable and easy.

[jerrod]

Nah Chap, I prefer panacing and all out winging mid style. "Waa Waa Waa" is more predictable and easy.

what did he say that wasn't true though?

i certainly haven't given up yet, but a lot of people can thrive in an absolutely 100% perfect situation

[KingCammo]

what did he say that wasn't true though?

i certainly haven't given up yet, but a lot of people can thrive in an absolutely 100% perfect situation

There's been a lot of truthful posts made about Mo Williams, but you and the rest of the Mo Nation are quite happy battling on with that one to the death. I'm also curious if mid even watched the game to be at liberty to comment. I wouldn't say Bogut sucked, 'average' is the best term to describe his game last night for a guy obviously playing in pain.

Any reasonable Bucks or Bogut fan isn't just blaming coaches, point guards or unlucky pairs of socks. Most of us have excepted him for what he is as Chap pointed out, only for the winging to ensue any time he has an average or bad game. Then again, the 'loyal' Bucks fans are pretty good at doing that to every Bucks player.

[midranger]

So the Bogut expectations have dropped to 7 points on 30% shooting against Fabricio Oberto is an average game?

Seriously.

Freshman year at Utah = Disappointing to a large extent
Olympics = Good
Sophomore year at Utah = Awesome
Rookie as Buck = Disappointing
International Play = Disappointing
Second year as Buck = Very disappointing
Third year as Buck = Disappointing
Olympics = Dreadful thus far

[jerrod]

somehow mo pops up in an australian game thread, weird. i don't get what you mean though, we argue different points about mo just like we do for all players. what that has to do with what we were talking about, i still don't know.

what about mid's statement required him to watch the game? you guys are the bogut experts and i saw a bunch of posts saying he wasn't being used correctly again. are there any coaches that know this secret?

[KingCammo]

So the Bogut expectations have dropped to 7 points on 30% shooting against Fabricio Oberto is an average game?

I guess you're going to conveniently miss the fact that he is playing on one foot, which was obvious;y effecting him to those actually watching. But Ok, so you're a boxscore watcher. That should tell you all you need to know about what actually transpired during the game. Well here's one for you, this player had this stat line yesterday in another game:

0 points (0/4), 4 rebounds, 4 assists, 5 TO's and 5 Steals. Good game or no?

[KingCammo]

what about mid's statement required him to watch the game? you guys are the bogut experts and i saw a bunch of posts saying he wasn't being used correctly again. are there any coaches that know this secret?

So you're conveniently going to ignore the posts that said he was crap, obviously hampered by injury etc.? Most aussie posters agree that the only shining light was Mills, who is probably better than Mo

[icat2000]

what about mid's statement required him to watch the game? you guys are the bogut experts and i saw a bunch of posts saying he wasn't being used correctly again. are there any coaches that know this secret?

So you're conveniently going to ignore the posts that said he was crap, obviously hampered by injury etc.? Most aussie posters agree that the only shining light was Mills, who is probably better than Mo

+1

I love how Mills drives to the basket.

[jerrod]

i didn't say anything relating only to that game

i said that you guys keep complaining about him not being used right by a list of coaches that grows larger year after year

you're talking about mo again, why? having an add attack?

[midranger]

You know what the main part of the box score told me Bogut had a bad game? The final score.

You can put up crap stats while doing little things to help your team win. Putting up crap stats in a blowout loss? That's different.

We should expect Bogut to be one of the best players in this tourney not on the USA team. Yet the guy doesn't appear to be in the top-3 on team Austrailia.

[KingCammo]

i said that you guys keep complaining about him not being used right by a list of coaches that grows larger year after year

And I said, that any reasonable fan isn't just blaming coaches, but a combination of factors that include Bogut himself.

you're talking about mo again, why? having an add attack?

Did you miss the emoticon? Lighten up sweety.

[jerrod]

i said that you guys keep complaining about him not being used right by a list of coaches that grows larger year after year

And I said, that any reasonable fan isn't just blaming coaches, but a combination of factors that include Bogut himself.

you're talking about mo again, why? having an add attack?

Did you miss the emoticon? Lighten up sweety.

you can put all the little smileys you want, if mid had mentioned mo you'd be tripping yourself screaming MO NATION!!!!!

people are blaming the injury too, which is valid for these games but this isn't only about these games. it's just hard to believe that all these people are somehow able to get themselves hired for high level coaching jobs yet can't solve the enigma that is how to use andrew bogut effectively.

[boknoy]

Obviously Bogut didn't play well for whatever reason. I am not concerned in the slightest. Just stay healthy, get some rest when your team is done and get back to work.

Bogut learns on how to handle his words on every interviews, all nice now.. professionalism.

but i agree, the fire isnt there anymore. we can tell the big difference from his previous performances in world world under19 tournament where he's MVP and in Athens Olympics.

we have to understands the fellow playing with ankle injury that he's got a big future much more than playing for Australia. signing for multimillion $$$ contract is very rare opportunity and Andrew is treasuring it respecting it.

of course we'll wonder the likes of Ginobili who has the ability to maintain his game and effectiveness. well, Ginobili started playing in Euroleague with the same FIBA Zone rules and playing under Popovich system in NBA.

On Australia's 2 consecutive loses, i can only say that they are too much on team work plays. they have some talents in there with Newley and Ingles who can create their own shots or can slash through the traffic. But those players have been molded too in the same system of too much passing, consuming time to look for an open man. certainly they can play tough defense but scoring is still their problem.
you cannot blame Goorjian alone who himself an american and american trained but submitted already to australian basketball coaching system. im not saying that its a bad system, its just too much exaggerating on team work plays.
and replacing Goorjian is not an overnight adjustment, it will will be the whole system that will involve the AIS as well.

now, for australia to perform better for next olympics in London, they need to build the team around with motivated and inspiring inspired players like Patrick Mills. Mills has an inspiration in him thinking his mates wayback home and he's lovin it and having fun out of it.

Many of the successful Olympians comes from a humble beginnings with the exception of NBA players and other multi-million dollars funded athletes.

Its just frustrating when you have players like Newley, Ingles even David Barlow and Mark Worthington, Redhage that can really score.

[midranger]

If bashing Mo makes you feel better about how badly Andrew Bogut sucks at basketball, by all means continue.