MIN acquire G.Neal + 2nd for Mo + Daniels

[Feilong]

Is Neal requesting for a buyout? Is it smart to keep an upset Neal?

Although yesterday, Saunders dismissed any notion of that happening and called Neal different than other players on the roster.

"We have not entertained anything with a buyout. Neal's situation is this: Losing Mo, we wanted to bring back someone that had the ability to shoot. We wanted to bring back someone that had championship character. He (Neal) has that (championship character) from San Antonio, and we thought that someone would fill a role. He's different than the players that we have. I don't know, I can't guarantee how many minutes he's going to play, but I think we'll be able to use him in some capacity."

Saunders, later on, seemed to admire Neal's physical presence.
"He is strong defender and has the ability to shoot the ball from the perimeter. As I said, he's been in a championship. He knows really what it's all about."

[Crazy-Canuck]

If they keep neal, they should entertain the thought of sending lavine down to the dleague.

I think brown is more than capable of spot starting and backing up ricky.

[JimBreuer45]

So....we traded Brewer for nothing but a couple 2nd rounders ? This franchise is horrible.

yea pretty much. Kinda sucks we couldn't get at least one asset for Mo and Brewer

It's the nature of the beast, guys. Are Mo and Brew productive players? Yes. Would pretty much every (contending) team like to have them coming off the bench? Yes. So then they have a lot of value, right? Not as much as you'd think.

1.) Both will be FA's next year, so, whoever gets them is essentially getting rent-a-player. Neither are rent-a-players who are going to immediately put a team over the top. So, how much are YOU willing to give for that type a player? Would you give Lavine for him? Dieng? A first rounder? No, you wouldn't. So why do we expect other teams to give us their Lavines, Diengs or 1sr rounder?

2.) Wolves management did Brewer a solid. He signed here to play with a contender. We are not a contender. So, when he asked to be moved, they granted him his wish. Don't downplay the importance of this move. Other players see this. Players want to play for organizations like this. This was a goodwill gesture that may pay off next time the Wolves are negotiating with that FA you badly want.

3.) Were you okay with two players who would be gone after this year stealing the minutes of Bazz and Lavine? I WAS NOT! That reason alone was reason enough to get rid of them. On-the-job learning in the NBA is priceless. Look at how Bazz has developed in a HALF OF A YEAR because he was simply given the chance to play. Look how much Lavine has improved (still a long way to go) already. Keeping around guys who will leave in six months, simply because they are solid, at the expense of developing your future, is stupid.

[NewWolvesOrder]

^^^ this guy gets it. 2 other crybabies don't

[C.lupus]

So....we traded Brewer for nothing but a couple 2nd rounders ? This franchise is horrible.

yea pretty much. Kinda sucks we couldn't get at least one asset for Mo and Brewer

It's the nature of the beast, guys. Are Mo and Brew productive players? Yes. Would pretty much every (contending) team like to have them coming off the bench? Yes. So then they have a lot of value, right? Not as much as you'd think.

1.) Both will be FA's next year, so, whoever gets them is essentially getting rent-a-player. Neither are rent-a-players who are going to immediately put a team over the top. So, how much are YOU willing to give for that type a player? Would you give Lavine for him? Dieng? A first rounder? No, you wouldn't. So why do we expect other teams to give us their Lavines, Diengs or 1sr rounder?

2.) Wolves management did Brewer a solid. He signed here to play with a contender. We are not a contender. So, when he asked to be moved, they granted him his wish. Don't downplay the importance of this move. Other players see this. Players want to play for organizations like this. This was a goodwill gesture that may pay off next time the Wolves are negotiating with that FA you badly want.

3.) Were you okay with two players who would be gone after this year stealing the minutes of Bazz and Lavine? I WAS NOT! That reason alone was reason enough to get rid of them. On-the-job learning in the NBA is priceless. Look at how Bazz has developed in a HALF OF A YEAR because he was simply given the chance to play. Look how much Lavine has improved (still a long way to go) already. Keeping around guys who will leave in six months, simply because they are solid, at the expense of developing your future, is stupid.

This.

And welcome to the board!

[BlackOutBuzz]

Although yesterday, Saunders dismissed any notion of that happening and called Neal different than other players on the roster.

"We have not entertained anything with a buyout. Neal's situation is this: Losing Mo, we wanted to bring back someone that had the ability to shoot. We wanted to bring back someone that had championship character. He (Neal) has that (championship character) from San Antonio, and we thought that someone would fill a role. He's different than the players that we have. I don't know, I can't guarantee how many minutes he's going to play, but I think we'll be able to use him in some capacity."

Saunders, later on, seemed to admire Neal's physical presence.
"He is strong defender and has the ability to shoot the ball from the perimeter. As I said, he's been in a championship. He knows really what it's all about."

Oh man, the first bolded part sounds a lot like Clifford's rationale for playing Neal over guys like Hairston, Taylor, and until recently Henderson. He's been bad for a few months now, but hopefully he regains his touch for you guys (should you keep him).

He was good for us last season and came out the gates well this year, but then just completely fell apart. Even so, Clifford's affinity for guys with "championship pedigree" kept him in the rotation.

The second bolded area...I got nothin. He's a shooter, but far from 3&D. Just a bad defensive player, can shoot the hell out of the ball (though not recently), but no defense.

He's also not a PG. He can create for himself if he has the ball, but not usually for anyone else. We had hoped he'd step up with Walker and Pargo out, but no dice.

[Basti]

Like others around here, I had hoped Mo had a slightly higher value league-wise. That contract he's currently on is a huge steal. But then again, it expires soon. No team would give significant assets for that I guess, especially without bird rights.

Anyway, since this was obviously a move to open up a roster spot and save money (wouldn't mind if Neal was bought out since I want Brown to get back up minutes now) this trade is at least neutral to me, maybe slightly positive depending on how Payne works out here.

With that being said, thank you Mo. As I had said here after he was signed I hadn't really been much of a fan of his. But your stint here, while rather short, was much better than I expected. I wish you the best of luck for your future endeavors.

[Worm Guts]

So....we traded Brewer for nothing but a couple 2nd rounders ? This franchise is horrible.

yea pretty much. Kinda sucks we couldn't get at least one asset for Mo and Brewer

It's the nature of the beast, guys. Are Mo and Brew productive players? Yes. Would pretty much every (contending) team like to have them coming off the bench? Yes. So then they have a lot of value, right? Not as much as you'd think.

1.) Both will be FA's next year, so, whoever gets them is essentially getting rent-a-player. Neither are rent-a-players who are going to immediately put a team over the top. So, how much are YOU willing to give for that type a player? Would you give Lavine for him? Dieng? A first rounder? No, you wouldn't. So why do we expect other teams to give us their Lavines, Diengs or 1sr rounder?

2.) Wolves management did Brewer a solid. He signed here to play with a contender. We are not a contender. So, when he asked to be moved, they granted him his wish. Don't downplay the importance of this move. Other players see this. Players want to play for organizations like this. This was a goodwill gesture that may pay off next time the Wolves are negotiating with that FA you badly want.

3.) Were you okay with two players who would be gone after this year stealing the minutes of Bazz and Lavine? I WAS NOT! That reason alone was reason enough to get rid of them. On-the-job learning in the NBA is priceless. Look at how Bazz has developed in a HALF OF A YEAR because he was simply given the chance to play. Look how much Lavine has improved (still a long way to go) already. Keeping around guys who will leave in six months, simply because they are solid, at the expense of developing your future, is stupid.

Honestly, I'm not sure what people would expect for Williams and Brewer. They're not good.

[Foye]

yea pretty much. Kinda sucks we couldn't get at least one asset for Mo and Brewer

It's the nature of the beast, guys. Are Mo and Brew productive players? Yes. Would pretty much every (contending) team like to have them coming off the bench? Yes. So then they have a lot of value, right? Not as much as you'd think.

1.) Both will be FA's next year, so, whoever gets them is essentially getting rent-a-player. Neither are rent-a-players who are going to immediately put a team over the top. So, how much are YOU willing to give for that type a player? Would you give Lavine for him? Dieng? A first rounder? No, you wouldn't. So why do we expect other teams to give us their Lavines, Diengs or 1sr rounder?

2.) Wolves management did Brewer a solid. He signed here to play with a contender. We are not a contender. So, when he asked to be moved, they granted him his wish. Don't downplay the importance of this move. Other players see this. Players want to play for organizations like this. This was a goodwill gesture that may pay off next time the Wolves are negotiating with that FA you badly want.

3.) Were you okay with two players who would be gone after this year stealing the minutes of Bazz and Lavine? I WAS NOT! That reason alone was reason enough to get rid of them. On-the-job learning in the NBA is priceless. Look at how Bazz has developed in a HALF OF A YEAR because he was simply given the chance to play. Look how much Lavine has improved (still a long way to go) already. Keeping around guys who will leave in six months, simply because they are solid, at the expense of developing your future, is stupid.

Honestly, I'm not sure what people would expect for Williams and Brewer. They're not good.

They are solid veteran players. If you can't get a good deal keep them around as we want to compete next season. Mo was very positive about Minnesota. Entirely possible he would've resigned on same conditions.

You can't have 10 22 y/o or younger players on the roster if you want to compete.
Wiggins/Shabazz/LaVine/Bennett and the upcoming first. That's enough young players on the roster already. No need to get even more of them.

Ideally you would try to convert all assets besides Rubio/Wiggins/2015 1st into one additional high caliber player.

[Worm Guts]

They are solid veteran players. If you can't get a good deal keep them around as we want to compete next season. Mo was very positive about Minnesota. Entirely possible he would've resigned on same conditions.

You can't have 10 22 y/o or younger players on the roster if you want to compete.
Wiggins/Shabazz/LaVine/Bennett and the upcoming first. That's enough young players on the roster already. No need to get even more of them.

They're serviceable rotation players at best. Williams can re-sign with Minnesota at the end of the season if there's mutual interest, trading him doesn't change that.
As far as Brewer goes, there was a glut at the wing. No reason to pay Brewer when you have Wiggins, Shabazz, Martin and Lavine.

[JimBreuer45]

Well, Brewer asked to be traded, so he wasn't resigning.

That leaves Mo. I doubt the 33yr old (next year) would've resigned. I imagine management had a pretty good idea about what Mo wanted to do next year. I'm sure if he'd had told them he'd love to stay with an 11-40 team for $2mil per, they'd have kept him. And, if they really want him, or he really wants to be here, there is still a chance to strike a deal for next year. This year is over. Why not see what we have w/ our young backups and give them experience?

At the end of the day, having Mo or not having Mo next year won't matter a lick. Again, nice player? Yep. Difference maker? Nah.

[Foye]

Well, Brewer asked to be traded, so he wasn't resigning.

That leaves Mo. I doubt the 33yr old (next year) would've resigned. I imagine management had a pretty good idea about what Mo wanted to do next year. I'm sure if he'd had told them he'd love to stay with an 11-40 team for $2mil per, they'd have kept him. And, if they really want him, or he really wants to be here, there is still a chance to strike a deal for next year. This year is over. Why not see what we have w/ our young backups and give them experience?

At the end of the day, having Mo or not having Mo next year won't matter a lick. Again, nice player? Yep. Difference maker? Nah.

Pretty sure Brewer was under contract for next season.

Regarding backup PG position...which backup PGs do we even have now? Nobody. It's pretty clear that LaVine is a SG. He can't run an offense, turns it over plenty and can't defend opposing PGs either.

[Worm Guts]

Well, Brewer asked to be traded, so he wasn't resigning.

That leaves Mo. I doubt the 33yr old (next year) would've resigned. I imagine management had a pretty good idea about what Mo wanted to do next year. I'm sure if he'd had told them he'd love to stay with an 11-40 team for $2mil per, they'd have kept him. And, if they really want him, or he really wants to be here, there is still a chance to strike a deal for next year. This year is over. Why not see what we have w/ our young backups and give them experience?

At the end of the day, having Mo or not having Mo next year won't matter a lick. Again, nice player? Yep. Difference maker? Nah.

Pretty sure Brewer was under contract for next season.

Regarding backup PG position...which backup PGs do we even have now? Nobody. It's pretty clear that LaVine is a SG. He can't run an offense, turns it over plenty and can't defend opposing PGs either.

Brewer had a player option. He could have opted out and signed elsewhere.

Right now our backup PGs are Lavine and Lorenzo Brown. We'll most likely be in the market for a backup PG this offseason. Whoever plays it now isn't that important.

[JimBreuer45]

Newton said, when Brewer was traded that he "would've" opted out next year to join a contender. So, again, he's not even in the discussion.

Mo Williams was and still will be a free agent next year. Even if the Wolves were 100% sure that they were resigning him, it's still smart to get a 2nd for him, a player like Neal who has a NBA career 10ppg average and clear up a spot for Lavine/Brown and now Neal.

I'm way more into watching a player like Lavine or Brown develop, or, watching how a guy like Neal fits in, instead of watching a soon-to-be 33 year old play out the last few months of his contract. If Williams was a difference maker we wouldn't have been awful while he was logging big minutes and then suddenly win 3 in a row when Ricky returned.

Who are out backup PG's? Neal, Lavine and Brown. You may view Lavine as a SG, but he's spent 95% of his NBA career at PG.

[Foye]

Newton said, when Brewer was traded that he "would've" opted out next year to join a contender. So, again, he's not even in the discussion.

Mo Williams was and still will be a free agent next year. Even if the Wolves were 100% sure that they were resigning him, it's still smart to get a 2nd for him, a player like Neal who has a NBA career 10ppg average and clear up a spot for Lavine/Brown and now Neal.

I'm way more into watching a player like Lavine or Brown develop, or, watching how a guy like Neal fits in, instead of watching a soon-to-be 33 year old play out the last few months of his contract. If Williams was a difference maker we wouldn't have been awful while he was logging big minutes and then suddenly win 3 in a row when Ricky returned.

Who are out backup PG's? Neal, Lavine and Brown. You may view Lavine as a SG, but he's spent 95% of his NBA career at PG.

What are you going to do with that 2nd rounder? 2nd rounders are basically useless unless they are among the first 5 or so in the 2nd round and you want to lock up a European guy who wouldn't come over under the Rookie scale (like Pekovic for example).

Neal? By your definition he will bolt to a contender come offseason. So basically you trade Mo Williams who at least knew the plays Flip wants to run for a couple games of a 30 y/o backup combo guard for the remainder of the season and a useless pick.

[C.lupus]

I thought you wanted to tank. What's the problem?

[Foye]

I thought you wanted to tank. What's the problem?

Of course I want to tank. But I also want to compete next season. No reason to give away solid vets for bags of donuts.

[JimBreuer45]

We didn't give away MO for next season. We still have the same opportunity to sign him next year now, that we did 2 days ago.

What good is a 2nd rounder? Well, for one it's another pick. If not used for that it can be used as a trading piece if we get into contention sometime in the next couple of years (see: Houston, Charlotte).

[JimBreuer45]

And remember, we have no idea about talks btw Mo and Newton and/or Flip. Maybe they agreed to talk this offseason? Maybe Mo told them he wouldn't return for all the gold in Alaska? Maybe theyou don't even WANT Mo back?

Again, it's not like Mo was leading us to win after win while Ricky was hurt. We didn't trade Wilt Chamberlain here.

[C.lupus]

I thought you wanted to tank. What's the problem?

Of course I want to tank. But I also want to compete next season. No reason to give away solid vets for bags of donuts.

I think this trade has very little impact on competing next year. Mo is an expiring, Neal is an expiring. I don't think either was/is in Flip's plans after this season. Flip did get a 2nd, saved a little bit of cash next year, and opened up a spot for Payne, who I do think will contribute. And taking it a step further, Payne may make Bennett expendable saving even more cap space for free agency (or they may be duo for the future). Overall, it's pretty meh but I'm not really upset about, even though I wanted to keep Mo.

But fwiw, my wife is probably more pissed about it than you so there is that.