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Identity crisis?

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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#201 » by Klomp » Sun Oct 1, 2023 6:31 pm

TimberKat wrote:It's about PG of the future, his age, and salary.
For me, just about every trade I mentioned, I always say keep him if possible. I wish he is 3 years younger.

At least for now, it seems we are OK not dumping major resources into the position. The more I think about it, the more I believe Milton and/or Alexander-Walker will serve as "bridge PGs" after Conley. Everyone cries that Connelly hasn't addressed the backup PG/PG of the future position, but I believe he has...even if it's not in the way the general public wants.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#202 » by Klomp » Tue Nov 7, 2023 12:49 am

Read on Twitter
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#203 » by Baseline81 » Tue Nov 7, 2023 1:02 am

Klomp wrote:
Read on Twitter

Hilarious he admitted to not having an identity last year.

I suppose we should be thankful he worked on that going into the season. Now how about on the other side of the ball?

Please note these are basic things a coach should first be implementing.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#204 » by TimberKat » Tue Nov 7, 2023 4:24 pm

Article on the Athletic - "Anthony Edwards, Rudy Gobert and the dawning of a dominant Timberwolves defense"

That is the new identity. Keep it up and Gobert is going to be Defense All NBA first team. Towns seems to be the one with Identity Crisis but do want to give him credit for playing better defense this year.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#205 » by Colbinii » Tue Nov 7, 2023 4:48 pm

Baseline81 wrote:
Klomp wrote:
Read on Twitter

Hilarious he admitted to not having an identity last year.


Injured Gobert, D'Angelo Russell and Towns leading the locker room.

Yeah, I can see why the team didn't grab onto an identity last season, especially because D'Angelo Russell treats Defense like Elon treats his employees.

I suppose we should be thankful he worked on that going into the season. Now how about on the other side of the ball?


It takes players to buy in in order to get the locker room, starting from the leaders [Gobert, ANT and Towns].

When your best players aren't buying in, why would anyone else buy in?

Please note these are basic things a coach should first be implementing.


You don't think Finch tried to implement an identity?
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#206 » by Baseline81 » Tue Nov 7, 2023 5:53 pm

Colbinii wrote:You don't think Finch tried to implement an identity?

It was a rarity to see Finch pull a player for not doing what he asked.

And based on the Wolves' record against the bottom teams in the league last season, Finch and the players were not on the same page.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#207 » by Klomp » Tue Nov 7, 2023 8:02 pm

Baseline81 wrote:
Colbinii wrote:You don't think Finch tried to implement an identity?

It was a rarity to see Finch pull a player for not doing what he asked.

And based on the Wolves' record against the bottom teams in the league last season, Finch and the players were not on the same page.

This is not junior high. There are a lot more factors and variables in play as an NBA coach.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#208 » by minimus » Wed Nov 15, 2023 8:54 am

So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#209 » by KGdaBom » Wed Nov 15, 2023 12:19 pm

minimus wrote:So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.

Shake had a couple of huge plays to help complete our comeback. Good game for Shake last night.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#210 » by TimberKat » Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:06 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
minimus wrote:So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.

Shake had a couple of huge plays to help complete our comeback. Good game for Shake last night.

Yes, we are one comboguard away. I hope LAC keep losing and trade for Westbrook. His salary matches. We just need him drive and kick. Milton is a good spot up shooter but can't create.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#211 » by Note30 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:21 pm

TimberKat wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
minimus wrote:So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.

Shake had a couple of huge plays to help complete our comeback. Good game for Shake last night.

Yes, we are one comboguard away. I hope LAC keep losing and trade for Westbrook. His salary matches. We just need him drive and kick. Milton is a good spot up shooter but can't create.


We can keep dreaming. At his contract Westbrook is arguably one of the best dollar for dollar value you can get at point guard.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#212 » by TimberKat » Wed Nov 15, 2023 5:54 pm

Note30 wrote:
TimberKat wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Shake had a couple of huge plays to help complete our comeback. Good game for Shake last night.

Yes, we are one comboguard away. I hope LAC keep losing and trade for Westbrook. His salary matches. We just need him drive and kick. Milton is a good spot up shooter but can't create.


We can keep dreaming. At his contract Westbrook is arguably one of the best dollar for dollar value you can get at point guard.

Yes, there is no way they can play Harden and Westbrook in the same back court. One of their big four has to move to the bench and replace with a defensive minded role player. Westbrook seems to be the odd man out. He can't go back to LAL. It's SAC, DEN, PHX or Twolves if he still wants to be relevant and keep making commercials.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#213 » by KGdaBom » Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:18 pm

TimberKat wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
minimus wrote:So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.

Shake had a couple of huge plays to help complete our comeback. Good game for Shake last night.

Yes, we are one comboguard away. I hope LAC keep losing and trade for Westbrook. His salary matches. We just need him drive and kick. Milton is a good spot up shooter but can't create.

I'm not going to accept that Shake can't create.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#214 » by TheZachAttack » Wed Nov 15, 2023 6:31 pm

minimus wrote:So our identity is defensive minded team. I have one question though:

- is Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype is what we are lacking at this point to get to next level in offense?

What I call Podziemski / Austin Reaves archetype - dynamic comboguard, three level scorer with passing skills. I hope Shake Milton is that guy, but he has been struggling mightily so far.


Yes, but I would say they actually need an Austin Reaves archetype and a Tyus Jones type of archetype. They lack ball handlers and lack a guard/wing outside of Ant who can get downhill at will.

Jmac and Shake aren't championship level in those roles and I think that relying on Conley to play 30 minutes a night over an entire season is a recipe for disaster if all of a sudden you're reliant on them two.

I think Jmac and Shake can get it done a lot of times decently enough in the regular season especially against average or below average teams but even then
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#215 » by Note30 » Wed Nov 15, 2023 9:08 pm

TimberKat wrote:
Note30 wrote:
TimberKat wrote:Yes, we are one comboguard away. I hope LAC keep losing and trade for Westbrook. His salary matches. We just need him drive and kick. Milton is a good spot up shooter but can't create.


We can keep dreaming. At his contract Westbrook is arguably one of the best dollar for dollar value you can get at point guard.

Yes, there is no way they can play Harden and Westbrook in the same back court. One of their big four has to move to the bench and replace with a defensive minded role player. Westbrook seems to be the odd man out. He can't go back to LAL. It's SAC, DEN, PHX or Twolves if he still wants to be relevant and keep making commercials.

Denver or Here start to look real good
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#216 » by Klomp » Wed Nov 15, 2023 10:49 pm

My gut feeling is that a trade will happen at the deadline to resolve backup guard, for example with Washington for Jones or Wright.
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Identity crisis? 

Post#217 » by minimus » Mon Dec 4, 2023 11:16 am

I will put some observations here. Please add yours.

Defense:
Read on Twitter

Minnesota Timberwolves defend the geometry of the court without fouling, but they don't care about rebounds.


Some stats to backup this statement (this season vs last season):

REB 45 (9th) > 41.9 (23rd)
PF 19.3 (12th) < 21.6 (29th = 2nd NBA worst)
OPP 3PT% 33.7%(4th) < 36.9 (24th)
OPP FG% 43.0 (1st) < 47.1%(11th)

some stats with starter/bench filter (this season vs last season):

starters REB 31,6(5th) > 29.8 (4th)
bench REB 13.4 (27th) > 12.1 (29th)

starter PF 13.1 (26th) < 13.9 (30th = NBA worst)
bench PF 6.2 (2nd) < 7.7 (10th)

And remember: this are stats with McDaniels playing only 11 of 19 games, and Edwards already missing to games.

First, we foul less. For instance Naz has 1.5 foul per game, last season he had 2.6. Anderson has 1.5, last season 2.0, Brown has only 0.8, he replaces Prince who had 2.3 (!!!).

Second,
Gobert is allowing just 49.2% shooting at the rim, one of the best marks in the league…but he’s contesting only 6.7 shots at that location. For a guy who almost always patrols the paint, that number is low. But opponents are once again legitimately terrified to shoot when Gobert looms. Gobert provides both rim protection and rim deterrence, a rarer combination than you might think.


Plus Gobert, Towns and Reid defend more in space, playing with more energy on perimeter. Reid and Towns often sprinting back in transition. It is something the we did not see very often last year.

And finally our bench is doing great job defensively - 7th DRtg in NBA

Offense:

I find last game very interesting: we were missing McDaniels and Edwards, and our three bigs put monster numbers. Gobert had season high 26 points including 7 dunks.

Read on Twitter


I found it interesting because against CHA what we lacked in terms of Edwards creativity and ISO game, we got from offensive execution, playing through our bigs, through strengths. We have much more structure than last year.


Read on Twitter


And this structure allows to three bigs work: Gobert as rim runner, Towns as second star, Reid as 6th man, bench scorer. Edwards has shown progress in offense as passer, and mid range shooter - his two weaknesses last season. NAW has been shooting well from mid range.

Read on Twitter


Problems/Improvements areas::

First, our bench has been mediocre in offense at best.3PT% 33.3%(24th), 23th Ortg, 27th in AST:TO ration (1.51) We basically play bench with two bad shooters in Anderson and Milton.

Second, our second best signing McDaniels has not showed his full potential as defender and scorer yet. We need him to play bigger role if we want to achieve bigger goals

Third, Conley has been playing at elite level. He is a perfect fit here. But when should create some depth behind him, we cant play 36 yo veteran every game, every clutch.

Some early conclusions::

When I think about MIN being #1 team in West I remind myself two things:

First, we are a top team, despite having two bad shooters in bench unit (Anderson and Milton). What I am learning for it? Maybe we will be okay if we replace Milton with an average shooter. I mean Anderson, Brown and NAW is a defensive minded unit, adding someone like Delon Wright might be beneficial because he is a big guard (and Finch wanted another big guard in rotation when we signed Milton). However, we can not absolutely afford trading Anderson now because of combination of his defense, playmaking and decision making skills.

I am also thinking that if next year Jaylen Clarke can hit threes with league average accuracy, he would fit as 9th man in rotation. Also I am thinking that if Moore could have been that 3&D with some passing skills, he would be already in rotation. Just imagine potential of this roster with a couple good rookies from draft. Imagine this defensive minded roster with an elite 3pt shooter from the bench.

Second, we are a top team, despite having only one big trio working. Gobert-Ant-Towns are our present. But I truly believe that McDaniels has potential to be our third star. As crazy as it sounds, MIN might have second big trio of Ant-Reid-McDaniels that can be developed. Some think that Gobert and Towns are redundant, but I believe that this year after Towns emergency as second star, our young players have a structure around that allows them to be developed in winning environment. I can see how McDaniels mid range shooting alone might be a huge addition to our offense as we become more versatile, more unpredictable, offering out coaching staff more room for creativity.

Finally, as 15th December approaches I can see next 10 days very interesting. If we survive as #1 team in West, I can see us getting much better when Edwards, McDaniels and McLaughlin gets back, while rest of guys gaining more chemistry together. We need whole pack in 2nd half in December when we play vs DAL, IND, MIA, PHI, LAL, SAC, OKC, DAL, LAL. We will know much more about this team by January, 1st 2024. I like Troy Brown performance in last games, because I can see how he can fit as member of bench unit once all starters are healthy: Reid-Anderson-Brown-NAW is a solid bench unit. Everything that TC can add to this by using our limited resources is a plus. But hopefully we dont need to rush things in second half of season.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#218 » by minimus » Mon Dec 11, 2023 11:55 am

Next 10 games will tell a lot about our team.

23 Thu, Dec 14, 2023 8:30p @ Dallas Mavericks
24 Sat, Dec 16, 2023 8:00p Indiana Pacers
25 Mon, Dec 18, 2023 7:30p @ Miami Heat
26 Wed, Dec 20, 2023 7:00p @ Philadelphia 76ers
27 Thu, Dec 21, 2023 9:00p Los Angeles Lakers
28 Sat, Dec 23, 2023 10:00p @ Sacramento Kings
29 Tue, Dec 26, 2023 8:00p @ Oklahoma City Thunder
30 Thu, Dec 28, 2023 8:00p Dallas Mavericks
31 Sat, Dec 30, 2023 8:00p Los Angeles Lakers

Here is couple my thoughts.

First, with or without Edwards this MIN team is based on defense. I assume that Edwards will be out or rusty next 3-5 games, but if McDaniels is back our defense should be able to produce on daily basis. A this point it is very important stretch, but our players should do something out of their mind, on the contrary they should execute and work hard in defense.

Second, I expect a pattern in offense, when lack of Edwards ISO and elite shotmaking in offense will be mitigated by execution and discipline. It was like game with CHA, when Gobert, Towns and Reid trio had 77 pts. Or MEM game, when Brown made open threes.

Finally, I wonder how we match IND offense. They are open to trade our slow paced offense to their fast paced, high octane offense. They actually might give up all two points from Gobert and Towns, if after scoring basket our bigs wont be able to be back in transition. With Anderson struggling mightily from 3pt, McLaughlin getting back from injury I have my concerns. At the moment we make runs when great defensive possessions are followed by by 3pt makes, transition points etc. But IND is so atypical.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#219 » by winforlose » Mon Dec 11, 2023 2:36 pm

minimus wrote:Next 10 games will tell a lot about our team.

23 Thu, Dec 14, 2023 8:30p @ Dallas Mavericks
24 Sat, Dec 16, 2023 8:00p Indiana Pacers
25 Mon, Dec 18, 2023 7:30p @ Miami Heat
26 Wed, Dec 20, 2023 7:00p @ Philadelphia 76ers
27 Thu, Dec 21, 2023 9:00p Los Angeles Lakers
28 Sat, Dec 23, 2023 10:00p @ Sacramento Kings
29 Tue, Dec 26, 2023 8:00p @ Oklahoma City Thunder
30 Thu, Dec 28, 2023 8:00p Dallas Mavericks
31 Sat, Dec 30, 2023 8:00p Los Angeles Lakers

Here is couple my thoughts.

First, with oк without Edwards this MIN team is based on defense. I assume that Edwards will be out or rusty next 3-5 games, but if McDaniels is back our defense should be able to produce on daily basis. A this point it is very important stretch, but our players should do something out of their mind, on the contrary they should execute and work hard in defense.

Second, I expect a pattern in offense, when lack of Edwards ISO and elite shotmaking in offense will be mitigated by execution and discipline. It was like game with CHA, when Gobert, Towns and Reid trio had 77 pts. Or MEM game, when Brown made open threes.

Finally, I wonder how we match IND offense. They are open to trade our slow paced offense to their fast paced, high octane offense. They actually might give up all two points from Gobert and Towns, if after scoring basket our bigs wont be able to be back in transition. With Anderson struggling mightily from 3pt, McLaughlin getting back from injury I have my concerns. At the moment we make runs when great defensive possessions are followed by by 3pt makes, transition points etc. But IND is so atypical.


There are a lot of good points here. Before I address them, I would suggest adding at least five more games as those are all tough as well.

1. Ant is more than an offensive player. He has become a solid on ball and scheme defender. Even crazier is that he is an emerging shot blocker. Missing Ant or having a slow/stiff injured Ant, is not just a blow to our offense. Also, even if Jaden is back in 3-4 games (not at all clear as he just started individual on court activity about 5-6 days ago,) that is still 3-4 games without our two starting wings.

2. Transition defense is a weakness as was proven in Charlotte. But, when playing teams with above .500 records and star power, guys like KAT come alive. They run harder, shoot better, rebound more aggressively, and generally speaking want it more. For better or worse this explains last years disastrous record against bad teams. Indy is by no means a bad team. It is gonna be a fun game.

3. Our identity is not always consistent with our desired identity. Finch wants us to be the team that owns the paint on both ends. He wants to tell opposing teams to beat us from the mid range and semi contested 3 (at least a run out.) He wants us on offense to be able to drive and kick or PNR and get to the basket. Having Rudy defend in space is more proof of concept (for the playoffs,) than the overall goal. Either way, Rudy has so much defensive effect and Karl/Ant so much offensive gravity, that we can control the paint. At that point it comes down to a shooting contest. We lost to the Kings and the Hawks because they outshot us. But we won most of our other games, because our perimeter defense was just good enough, and our shooting was just good enough to out perform them.
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Re: Identity crisis? 

Post#220 » by Guest84 » Tue Dec 12, 2023 3:35 pm

Going forward, I think Finch needs to incorporate Jaden into the offense more. If he’s expected to be our third guy then he can’t go through a whole game with inconsistent touches.

However, there’s still the question about whether or not Jaden has more to unlock than he’s shown…can he be more than just a solid defender?? I’m hoping the answer is yes…

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