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NBA Salary Cap & The Nets

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NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#1 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 18, 2015 12:43 pm


The NBA has sent a new set of salary cap projections to all 30 teams.

For the 2015-16 season, the cap is projected at $67.1 million with the tax at $81.6 million.

For the 2016-17 season, the cap is projected at $89 million with the tax at $108 million.

For the 2017-18 season, the cap is projected to reach $108 million with the tax at $127 million.


This should be a fun thread for us :nod: Lets discuss.

-So it looks like for next season, we'll have to shed about 7 mil to get under the tax. Could stretching Deron a season early get it done?

-This is assuming that Thad and Brook don't opt out. If they opt out, the Nets will be under the tax, but **** ed royally competitively since Lopez is literally our best player.

-If Lopez does opt out...do you resign him? Looking at the cap projections, resigning him may end up being a drop in the bucket if the cap will rise to 108.

Nets have no draft pick, but will have cap space and lots of money. Hm...what to do, what to do..
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#2 » by Prokorov » Sat Apr 18, 2015 2:45 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:

The NBA has sent a new set of salary cap projections to all 30 teams.

For the 2015-16 season, the cap is projected at $67.1 million with the tax at $81.6 million.

For the 2016-17 season, the cap is projected at $89 million with the tax at $108 million.

For the 2017-18 season, the cap is projected to reach $108 million with the tax at $127 million.


This should be a fun thread for us :nod: Lets discuss.

-So it looks like for next season, we'll have to shed about 7 mil to get under the tax. Could stretching Deron a season early get it done?


yes but that would be unwise. if we stretch him in the offseason or anytime during next season we have to pay him for 5 years, if we do it at the end of the season it is 3 years and at a lower cost.

-This is assuming that Thad and Brook don't opt out. If they opt out, the Nets will be under the tax, but **** ed royally competitively since Lopez is literally our best player.


we need to think future next season, not to compete. im not saying tank and finding a way to get the 8 seed again and keep the PO streak alive would be good. but the focus should be 110% on getting the cap right and accumulating assets. idealy thad opts out, brook opts in, and we move brook at the deadline

if both opt in, we could get under the cap by trading jack for 3M in salary and 3M in ungrauanteed money or cap space and then not bringing mirza back.

-If Lopez does opt out...do you resign him? Looking at the cap projections, resigning him may end up being a drop in the bucket if the cap will rise to 108.


No. Max contracts are tied to the cap. the cap goes up the cost of a max deal goes up. and we need to make sure we have enough to give 3 max deals. Keep in mind, we dont need to sign 3 max guys, that could be signing 2 and trading cap space for a third. etc. it keeps our option open. unless brook wants to tak 3/24 i wouldnt extend him.

unless you think brook can be the 2nd best player on a championship team i dont think you can sign him unless its MLE type money, which he would be dumb tot ake cause he'd get more elsewhere

Nets have no draft pick, but will have cap space and lots of money. Hm...what to do, what to do..
[/quote]

I think the play with that cap space is to find a star under contract to trade for. someone will have blaoted deals and want space. some star will become unhappy and want out. cap space will be a big part of those deals. Also, i love the diea of handing calipari enough money to get 3 max guys, fi indeed he would come here. i think that would be the best possible scenario.

i dont want to reboot this team with a similar team. for me extending lopez has us looking something like:

Conley Gordon Bogs Horford/Love Lopez

thats a better version of what we have now... but i dont think thats a team that makes you a contender. unless durant came, and i think there is a much better chance of durant coming if lopez isnt here and you can tell durant he can play with 2 other stars of his choosing
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#3 » by Swav718 » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:10 pm

We better hurry up and extend Lopez now because if he have another season like how he played recently, he will definitely get 20+ mill a year. That's a lot of cap space to work with next year and the year after.

We can sign maybe 2 good players for 15+ million each after joe expires. and another max guy the season after
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#4 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:07 pm

Here's the thing, if you have nothing here, Durant is not coming. The idea that you can lure a star with just cap space and promises of getting guys he'd want to play with is a dangerous game to play.

Also, if the Nets are god awful next year on top of not having their own lottery pick, that looks even worse.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#5 » by Prokorov » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:58 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:Here's the thing, if you have nothing here, Durant is not coming. The idea that you can lure a star with just cap space and promises of getting guys he'd want to play with is a dangerous game to play.

Also, if the Nets are god awful next year on top of not having their own lottery pick, that looks even worse.


the lure is that he can play with whomever he decides.... you want to talk about dangerous"? dangerous is hopinh he is willing to come to play with a role player like thad and an oft injured underachiever in Brook.

i cant imagine a Thad-Lopez front court is not something durant is going to be excited about. especially when that offseason is loaded with elite free agent bigs... most of whom are outstanding defensively

Now if you tell him he can bring in Love and Dwight or Horford and Noah... it gets interesting. either way, it is really dumb to not keep money open for 3 max spots.

and the notion that you have "nothing here" being a bad thing is misguided as well. its not "nothing" its a blank canvas. "nothing" would be a bunch of money tied into mediocure to bad players aging bums, and guys ready to retire.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#6 » by MrDollarBills » Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:17 pm

I'm not saying to tie money into anyone, all I'm saying is that believing that an empty roster and promises are enough to lure a guy like Durant is not very prudent. Keeping the max spots open is fine, I just don't think a guy like Durant will be tempted by a team that has nothing in place. Lebron went to Miami because of Wade and the ability to also bring Bosh along. He then went to Cleveland because of Kyrie and the ability to bring in another max player.

The Knicks had a ton of cap room a few summers ago and ended up having to sign Amare Stoudemire to an uninsured contract because they got rebuffed by everyone else. All I'm saying is, it's not that simple.

I'd be willing to wager that the Nets end up with none of the big time players in 2016. We won't be the only ones with cap space. Letting Lopez walk or trading him for cap room and clearing out everything may not work the way you want it.

Also, regarding a "blank canvas" being an asset. It is an asset. To us, the fans it is an asset. To the front office, it is an asset. To a big time player who wants to win championships, it looks like you have an empty roster.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#7 » by Prokorov » Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:09 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:I'm not saying to tie money into anyone, all I'm saying is that believing that an empty roster and promises are enough to lure a guy like Durant is not very prudent. Keeping the max spots open is fine, I just don't think a guy like Durant will be tempted by a team that has nothing in place. Lebron went to Miami because of Wade and the ability to also bring Bosh along. He then went to Cleveland because of Kyrie and the ability to bring in another max player.


Wade was a free agent, and if miami didnt have enough to get all 3, it doesnt happen. and durant certainly isnt hitching his wagon to an often injured 1 way guy like lopez who will likely be coming off 2 lsoing seasons (last year and this year). if we had someone like anthony davis or cousins, or some stud sure. but thats not the case.

also, you bash the knicks for only getting amare, but they ended up landing carmello which they wouldnt be able to do if they didnt have the cap space and rookies/1 year expirings. they damn near ended up with Chris Paul/Carmello/Stat/Chandler when paul listed the knicks/lakers/clippers as teams he'd go to.

it didnt materialize with paul, but you need to leave your options open for that sort of thing. you dont miss out on chances at superstars like that to have brook lopez of the world on your team

The Knicks had a ton of cap room a few summers ago and ended up having to sign Amare Stoudemire to an uninsured contract because they got rebuffed by everyone else. All I'm saying is, it's not that simple.


Do you think the knicks would have got lebron if they had someone like brook lopez under contract? no. and then they would be stuck with amare and brook having even less flexibility. lebron didnt take NY's cap money, but he wouldnt have taken it even if they had a player there under contract because he would rather go team up with 2 other guys.

I'd be willing to wager that the Nets end up with none of the big time players in 2016. We won't be the only ones with cap space. Letting Lopez walk or trading him for cap room and clearing out everything may not work the way you want it.


there is no scenario where "it doesnt work out the way i want it to". we could miss out one very FA and we would still have the cap space. we could then go with 1 year deals for guys, trade our cap spaces for assets and young players, and wait to strike on the next star that wants out and just try again the following year in another great FA class. (westbrook)

Also, regarding a "blank canvas" being an asset. It is an asset. To us, the fans it is an asset. To the front office, it is an asset. To a big time player who wants to win championships, it looks like you have an empty roster.


no to a big time player it looks like somewhere he can bring 2 of his star buddies. thats what players do these days, find someplace they like and try to get 3 or 4 of them in one spot.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#8 » by NyCeEvO » Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:09 am

Prokorov wrote:No. Max contracts are tied to the cap. the cap goes up the cost of a max deal goes up.

I don't think that's the case. Do you have any proof that happens as you transition from one CBA to the next?

The maximum amount that you can offer to a player is limited to a certain percentage of the cap at the time a player is signed to a contract. Once the max allotment is determined and the contract is signed, I don't think there's a clause that says that their salary adjusts given an increase the salary cap.

Hence the reason why LBJ is taking a 2-yr deal with CLE rather than just signing for the max. If his percentage was going to increase anyway, it wouldn't make sense for him to a 2yr deal over a 4-yr guaranteed contract.

Considering the contracts are guaranteed (not just in payment but also in amounts allotted) I've never seen any literature which suggests that it's guaranteed to a relative amount of the cap on a yearly basis.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#9 » by MrDollarBills » Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:21 am

That's why I'm saying, signing Brook to a deal won't kill the Nets.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#10 » by NyCeEvO » Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:25 pm

Prokorov wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:Here's the thing, if you have nothing here, Durant is not coming. The idea that you can lure a star with just cap space and promises of getting guys he'd want to play with is a dangerous game to play.

Also, if the Nets are god awful next year on top of not having their own lottery pick, that looks even worse.


the lure is that he can play with whomever he decides.... you want to talk about dangerous"? dangerous is hopinh he is willing to come to play with a role player like thad and an oft injured underachiever in Brook.

i cant imagine a Thad-Lopez front court is not something durant is going to be excited about. especially when that offseason is loaded with elite free agent bigs... most of whom are outstanding defensively

Now if you tell him he can bring in Love and Dwight or Horford and Noah... it gets interesting. either way, it is really dumb to not keep money open for 3 max spots.

and the notion that you have "nothing here" being a bad thing is misguided as well. its not "nothing" its a blank canvas. "nothing" would be a bunch of money tied into mediocure to bad players aging bums, and guys ready to retire.

I think there is merit to both sides of the argument.

MDB is right to talk about the Nets having nothing. A blank canvas has never allured a player. The only player of recent memory willing to sign first and asks questions later was Amaré and that was mainly because no one was willing to give him the max contract the Knicks gave him. He wasn't worried about coming along with another player. He was going to the Knicks no matter what.

Flashback to 2010 and the multiple cap space deal was the same thing we offered to MIA's Big 3. We had a new arena, a new owner along with Jay-Z (LBJ's idol) committed to spending big money, and almost nothing on the books. Miami had virtually nothing except for the HUGE factor that Wade was recruiting Bosh and LBJ to play with him. So in reality while MIA had nothing cap wise, they really had a superstar with a vested interested lobbying for another superstar to come and dominate the league together.

At the time of 2010 free agency, ESPN outlined how much cap space or max contract space teams had (if they renounced the rights of as many FA players they had). http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page ... ree-agency

Here are the teams listed with the most contract space (MCS):
2.06 MCS —— NY Knicks
1.81 MCS —— NJ Nets
1.76 MCS —— CHI Bulls
1.67 MCS (2.64 MCS if Wade left) —— MIA Heat
1.02 MCS —— LAC Clippers

The Heat had considerably less money than us and the Knicks but they had a superstar player who really wasn't going to leave helping them attract talent. That side of the deal cannot be undervalued.

At the same time, Lopez is no Wade. A near-prime Wade asking another star to play in a tax-free, warm weather city is a pretty attractive offer and one that should be a winning situation as long as Wade and said free agent stay healthy. Lopez is no guarantee to remain healthy, there's state tax in NY, it's not a warm-weather city, and Lopez isn't one of the top 5 players in the league.

2010 is the only time where we've seen teams have room for more than just one star and the teams with more cap space struck out because MIA had a superstar recruiting players. At the same time, Lopez doesn't hold as much influence as Wade & Riley did.

Personally, I think the completely blank slate approach won't work since 1) star players rarely leave their teams and 2) if they do leave, it's almost always to go to a better situation where they can win. Without a superstar recruiting for us, I don't see 2-3 stars abandoning their former teams and trying to create a superteam with the Nets. It's much more assuring to go already team on the rise with a front office that knows how to win. 2010 is the closest parallel situation we have and yet there are still so many differences between that situation and the 2016 situation that it's hard to say that it will play out the same way. I see pros and cons for both sides.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#11 » by Prokorov » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:58 pm

it comes down to 2 things and 2 things only:

1) Do you think Brook can be the #2 player on a championship contending team. if you think he can, you extend him, if you dont think he can, you dont extend him.

2) Do you think Lopez can lure a superstar to play here. if you think he does you extend him, if you dont think he can then you dont.

Those are really the only 2 factors. I think #1 is a pretty concrete "no". #2 i think is a bit less clear but in my opinion I can't see a superstar wanting to play with lopez over having the pure cap space to have 2 other max guys try and sign with him.

the other factor is most of the big free agents are bigs. You basically take Howard, Horford, Gasol, Noah out of the equation by extending lopez.
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Re: Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#12 » by Paradise » Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:20 pm

Prokorov wrote:the other factor is most of the big free agents are bigs. You basically take Howard, Horford, Gasol, Noah out of the equation by extending lopez.


How is Horford out of the equation? He's not a Center.
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Re: Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#13 » by Prokorov » Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:23 pm

Paradise wrote:
Prokorov wrote:the other factor is most of the big free agents are bigs. You basically take Howard, Horford, Gasol, Noah out of the equation by extending lopez.


How is Horford out of the equation? He's not a Center.


how is he not a center?

70 of 76 games started this year was at center, the other 6 at forward were due to injuries to others

434 of 492 career games started are at center.

Statistically he is immenstly better at C, and better in almost every category.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#14 » by MrDollarBills » Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:17 pm

Prokorov wrote:it comes down to 2 things and 2 things only:

1) Do you think Brook can be the #2 player on a championship contending team. if you think he can, you extend him, if you dont think he can, you dont extend him.

2) Do you think Lopez can lure a superstar to play here. if you think he does you extend him, if you dont think he can then you dont.

Those are really the only 2 factors. I think #1 is a pretty concrete "no". #2 i think is a bit less clear but in my opinion I can't see a superstar wanting to play with lopez over having the pure cap space to have 2 other max guys try and sign with him.

the other factor is most of the big free agents are bigs. You basically take Howard, Horford, Gasol, Noah out of the equation by extending lopez.


1)No. But if your plan was to have three max slots, signing Lopez seems like a no brainer especially if you sign him to a deal that will be pennies when the cap rises to 100 mil.

2)No. But there hasn't been one time in history where an empty roster has lured a superstar player to a team. Like stated above, Amare only went to the Knicks because they were the only dumbasses willing to sign him to a deal that couldn't be insured.

I honestly don't see us getting any of those names. Maybe Horford. Howard will not be worth a max deal. Either way, we need to have something work with to build a team with talent and depth. I know you don't like Brook, but letting him walk for nothing or having an empty roster going into 2016 FA could blow up in our faces.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#15 » by Prokorov » Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:32 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:1)No. But if your plan was to have three max slots, signing Lopez seems like a no brainer especially if you sign him to a deal that will be pennies when the cap rises to 100 mil.


it wouldnt be "pennies". and the cap wont be at 100 million until the following season. it projects to be at 88 million in 16-17. the bottom line is this, we either habe enough for 3 max players, or we sign lopez. there isnt a scenario were both is possible. if it was, then sure, you sign lopez. having lopez at a "bargain" doesnt really matter if it wouldnt allow us to sign the same amount of players as we would without him.

there are better bigs who will be available then brook, id rather taking my chances signing one of them then singing brook. i prefer a risk of getting or not getting one of the top bigs then taking the risk of signing lopez and having him be injured or risk him not become an elite top 15 player.

2)No. But there hasn't been one time in history where an empty roster has lured a superstar player to a team. Like stated above, Amare only went to the Knicks because they were the only dumbasses willing to sign him to a deal that couldn't be insured.


and when in history has a star free agent joined an injury prone player who has played on losing/underachieving teams his entire career? its not like brook is someone guys would be lining up to play

I honestly don't see us getting any of those names. Maybe Horford. Howard will not be worth a max deal. Either way, we need to have something work with to build a team with talent and depth. I know you don't like Brook, but letting him walk for nothing or having an empty roster going into 2016 FA could blow up in our faces.


howard would be more worth a max deal then lopez. he has been an absolute beast and insane force. have you watched any of that series? same last year.

cap space is FAR less likely to blow up in your face. you always have flexibility with cap space. if you can sign players, you can trade for them. you can trade your cap space to aquire young players and first round picks. on the flip side, singing oft injured players who have underachieved and been inconsistent CAN blow up in your face, as it has here for us the past few seasons.

This has NOTHING to do with not liking lopez. even if you love lopez it doesnt make sense to extend him. for example, trader joe, one of the bigger if not biggest lopez supporters on this site, thinks we shouldnt extend lopez. this is after brooks surge. the guy has lopez in his avatar and has fought me tooth and nail onlopez for years.

its about flexibility. if you extend brook, you are basically saying he will be a top 15 player who can be a #2 on a title team. and that doesnt include the injury risk. there are better bigs, bigs who are outstanding defenders available.

you also keep harping too much on free agents. you dont just have to use cap space on free agents. it is super valuable via trade. look at how philly this year and cleveland the years prior stockpiled picks and young players by using their cap space. stars who want out of small markets come into play as well. you dont just need to sign guys,

Also, the "history" of max stars singing as free agents is insanely small. it really wasnt even an option until the past 3-5 years once the CBa started making drastic changes and the salary cap started sky rocketing. we do know that during that time stars have tried to team up, and guys have tried to fore their way to big markets
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#16 » by MGrand15 » Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:48 pm

I don't really buy luring a star in with no one on the roster. Hasn't really happened IIRC. I think players value franchises that seem competent, have a system, and have good players on them. I think clearing everyone out and banking on signing multiple stars is a recipe for ending up with absolutely nothing. With our lack of draft picks, I'm not sure we can afford to do that. That's a strategy you use when you have young and upcoming guys who don't take up much cap but have potential in the eyes of the league.

I don't see the team being ballsy enough to let Lopez walk. He's 100% going to opt out. After starting the year off horribly, he ended it by playing great. He has major health concerns. There's no way he doesn't lock up a contract with as much money and as many years as possible. It's just not happening. It all depends on what type of interest he gets around the league and whether he's interested in staying in Brooklyn. We're literally a joke in the eyes of the media and we've been one nearly every year Brook has been a Net. He might want to get away from that. If he does enjoy being a Net, I see him staying. I think that's most likely.

I also think Thad is going to opt out. He also finished the year off playing much better than he did in Minnesota. He could easily argue that this is the type of player he is when surrounded by an actual NBA team. He's not getting any younger and as an undersized 4 who depends on speed and athleticism, it wouldn't surprise me if he was also looking for one last big long term deal. There's a chance he gambles on himself and waits for the cap to rise.

Even if stretching Deron is "only" 8 mil a year for 3 years - I'm not sure I want to do that. We got ourselves into this mess by ignoring the future and letting the "Future Nets" deal with the problems. I would do what I can to try and trade him or just let him flat expire. Unless his deal is actively blocking us from a DONE deal. Admittedly, I haven't looked too far into the future nor have I looked into the stretch provision rules much.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#17 » by Prokorov » Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:57 pm

MGrand15 wrote:I don't really buy luring a star in with no one on the roster. Hasn't really happened IIRC. I think players value franchises that seem competent, have a system, and have good players on them.


1) as mentioned, how long has stars going to empty rosters even been a possiblity. before the CBA of the past 4-5 yars free agent mvoement in that fashion wasnt even really all that possible.

2) even if we keep brook we wouldnt have a competent franchise witha s ystem and good players

I think clearing everyone out and banking on signing multiple stars is a recipe for ending up with absolutely nothing. With our lack of draft picks, I'm not sure we can afford to do that. That's a strategy you use when you have young and upcoming guys who don't take up much cap but have potential in the eyes of the league.


you cant end up with nothing. if no one signs with you then you still have cap space. that cap space doesnt need to be used on free agents. you mention no draft picks. you can trade cap space for draft picks. you can rebuild multiple ways with cap space. dont just need to sign people

I also think Thad is going to opt out. He also finished the year off playing much better than he did in Minnesota. He could easily argue that this is the type of player he is when surrounded by an actual NBA team. He's not getting any younger and as an undersized 4 who depends on speed and athleticism, it wouldn't surprise me if he was also looking for one last big long term deal. There's a chance he gambles on himself and waits for the cap to rise.


there is little chance thad opts out. he wont top 10m in free agency, and if he is waiting for the cap to rise he would be smarter to wait to 16-17 when it will be a projected 88m as opposed to 15-16 when it is a projected 67m

Even if stretching Deron is "only" 8 mil a year for 3 years - I'm not sure I want to do that. We got ourselves into this mess by ignoring the future and letting the "Future Nets" deal with the problems. I would do what I can to try and trade him or just let him flat expire. Unless his deal is actively blocking us from a DONE deal. Admittedly, I haven't looked too far into the future nor have I looked into the stretch provision rules much.


not stretching dwill IS ignoring the future. if we go with your plan, extend brook and not stretch dwill, that would leave us with just 30m in cap room. thats enough for 1 max guy if you want to go cheap everywhere else with role players.

basically you are saying a core of dwill + lopez + MAX GUY + average or worse role guys is going to be much better then what we have now. that seems pretty crazy
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#18 » by MrDollarBills » Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:06 am

We'll agree to disagree on this one Prok, stars aren't running to play on empty rosters, but I will say that you are correct regarding trades and capspace.
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#19 » by Prokorov » Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:52 am

NyCeEvO wrote:
Prokorov wrote:No. Max contracts are tied to the cap. the cap goes up the cost of a max deal goes up.

I don't think that's the case. Do you have any proof that happens as you transition from one CBA to the next?

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm
Maximum salries are calculated by a percentage of the salary cap and how long you have been in the league. for instance a player wit 5 years experience would get a max contract at:

25% of the salary cap + 17.5% raises annuallly

since it is a percentage of the cap it is tied to the cap, the more the cap raises, the more max contracts raise. can that change in the next CBA? sure, but its been that way for several CBA's dating back to 1998 and the plasyers certainly wont want that to change

players already under contract dont have their contracts increase, it is only for players who sign new deals. maybe thats the confusion for you?

either way, if we signed lopez to 16M+ we couldnt afford 3 max deals with the projected cap in 16-17. 3 max deals in 16-17 would be between 64M and 75M depending on the years of service of the guys we sign. we can only sign 3 max players if we stretch dwill and dont bring anyone back besides the rookie deals and bogs
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Re: NBA Salary Cap & The Nets 

Post#20 » by Prokorov » Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:53 am

MrDollarBills wrote:We'll agree to disagree on this one Prok, stars aren't running to play on empty rosters, but I will say that you are correct regarding trades and capspace.


fair enough.... i'll add stars also arent running to play with players like lopez.

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