around the nba part 5

[ibraheim718]

The current Nuggets weren't a 17 win team the year before either. Let's not pretend they were starting from the same place.

And I think a WCF appearance trumps slightly more regular season success.

Do you think this Knicks team is better than that Nuggets teams... as it sits right now?

That's not really relevant to the what that poster was trying to say with his baseless stat.

Agree to that, and I'll answer you

I'm just asking you straight up. What the other two guys are saying is Denver didn't really suffer when they traded Melo which I agree with... I used to be of the thinking that we were going to have an advantage because I used to view Melo as more of a big game performer... but that hasn't happened since he's been in NY except for the 1 game against Boston where he played a pretty much flawless game.

The other younger players on Denver at the very least still have the room to grow into big game performers where for us we need our guy to get back to who he was that 1 year in Denver where his team actually went deep into the playoffs.

[rockmanslim]

@ESPNStatsInfo: Melo was traded on this date 2yrs ago. Since then, the Nuggets are 6th (.616) & the Knicks are 10th (.566) in win pct

Hmmm

YAY! Stats without context!

Men lie, women lie, numbers don't lie

Lies, damned lies, and statistics

[GONYK]

I'm just asking you straight up. What the other two guys are saying is Denver didn't really suffer when they traded Melo which I agree with... I used to be of the thinking that we were going to have an advantage because I used to view Melo as more of a big game performer... but that hasn't happened since he's been in NY except for the 1 game against Boston where he played a pretty much flawless game.

The other younger players on Denver at the very least still have the room to grow into big game performers where for us we need our guy to get back to who he was that 1 year in Denver where his team actually went deep into the playoffs.

Denver got depth, we traded it away. They also weren't coached by D'Antoni.

This is the first season where we had any sort of bench really, and even then only sort of.

This is what I'm saying. The context is important. Can't just say that Melo is a cancer or whatever because of some %'s.

I will always take a team with a prime time player over a team without one, all things considered. I think the Nuggs and the Knicks are about equal, with Melo being the tie breaker.

They play with more effort and cohesion though. I'll give you that. I don't lay that entirely at Melo's feet though.

[Thugger HBC]

Is both teams better with Melo or without? That is the only question at hand.

Prior to the trade, Denver had won more games % .659 in his last full season there...WCF appearance, although they are still doing well.

Previous to Melo..... the Knicks were 2 games above .500, helping reach two playoff appearance the team had not reach in quite a few years prior....while currently posting a record the team hasn't had in a decade.

[GONYK]

Is both teams better with Melo or without? That is the only question at hand.

Prior to the trade, Denver had won more games % .659 in his last full season there...WCF appearance, although they are still doing well.

Previous to Melo..... the Knicks were 2 games above .500, helping reach two playoff appearance the team had not reach in quite a few years prior....while currently posting a record the team hasn't had in a decade.

Bingo.

To compare the new Nuggets to the new Knicks is a slanted stat.

All that matters is the new Knicks vs. old Knicks and the new Nuggs vs. the old Nuggs.

[ibraheim718]

I'm just asking you straight up. What the other two guys are saying is Denver didn't really suffer when they traded Melo which I agree with... I used to be of the thinking that we were going to have an advantage because I used to view Melo as more of a big game performer... but that hasn't happened since he's been in NY except for the 1 game against Boston where he played a pretty much flawless game.

The other younger players on Denver at the very least still have the room to grow into big game performers where for us we need our guy to get back to who he was that 1 year in Denver where his team actually went deep into the playoffs.

Denver got depth, we traded it away. They also weren't coached by D'Antoni.

This is the first season where we had any sort of bench really, and even then only sort of.

This is what I'm saying. The context is important. Can't just say that Melo is a cancer or whatever because of some %'s.

I will always take a team with a prime time player over a team without one, all things considered. I think the Nuggs and the Knicks are about equal, with Melo being the tie breaker.

They play with more effort and cohesion though. I'll give you that. I don't lay that entirely at Melo's feet though.

I don't think he's a cancer... I've always thought he needed to reinvent himself though... I banked everything on New York City being the place that would inspire him to do that.. I'm on record saying that. I haven't seen it yet and I've been let down to the fullest extent. All I've seen from an on the court standpoint is that he's become a better 3pt shooter... that's it. I also think it's impossible to reinvent yourself.. much less the team reinvent themselves and the way they play the game in the middle of the season.. it has to be done in the off season. The coach can help the team approach the game differently.. but I have zero confidence this coach can do that.

[GONYK]

I'm just asking you straight up. What the other two guys are saying is Denver didn't really suffer when they traded Melo which I agree with... I used to be of the thinking that we were going to have an advantage because I used to view Melo as more of a big game performer... but that hasn't happened since he's been in NY except for the 1 game against Boston where he played a pretty much flawless game.

The other younger players on Denver at the very least still have the room to grow into big game performers where for us we need our guy to get back to who he was that 1 year in Denver where his team actually went deep into the playoffs.

Denver got depth, we traded it away. They also weren't coached by D'Antoni.

This is the first season where we had any sort of bench really, and even then only sort of.

This is what I'm saying. The context is important. Can't just say that Melo is a cancer or whatever because of some %'s.

I will always take a team with a prime time player over a team without one, all things considered. I think the Nuggs and the Knicks are about equal, with Melo being the tie breaker.

They play with more effort and cohesion though. I'll give you that. I don't lay that entirely at Melo's feet though.

I don't think he's a cancer... I've always thought he needed to reinvent himself though... I banked everything on New York City being the place that would inspire him to do that.. I'm on record saying that. I haven't seen it yet and I've been let down to the fullest extent. All I've seen from an on the court standpoint is that he's become a better 3pt shooter... that's it. I also think it's impossible to reinvent yourself.. much less the team reinvent themselves and the way they play the game in the middle of the season.. it has to be done in the off season. The coach can help the team approach the game differently.. but I have zero confidence this coach can do that.

I agree with you for the most part.

It's just that we're having an entirely different conversation than the one I was engaged in with the other posters.

[KnicksGod]

@ESPNStatsInfo: Melo was traded on this date 2yrs ago. Since then, the Nuggets are 6th (.616) & the Knicks are 10th (.566) in win pct

Hmmm

What happens when you remove the bad record under Mike D'Antoni who sucks as a coach?

About even I suspect.

[rockmanslim]

DeJuan Blair's agent is named Happy Walters

[Capn'O]

Comparing records is a bit meh as both teams required some tinkering post trade.

Acquiring Melo SHOULD pay us more dividends in the near term. If the Nuggets get farther than the Knicks in the playoffs this season I'm going to be royally pissed as they're the team with more flexibility moving forward. Making a trade of that magnitude when the team is already on an upward trajectory should result in a contender.

We canned MDA, We got some ball handlers. We got that interior presence and shooters. Melo got the role as top dog. If you believe the papers, the team even made moves at his behest.

The Knicks went "win now." We should be better NOW.

No excuses.

[Capn'O]

DeJuan Blair's agent is named Happy Walters

Stat's too. And he should be happy. He's managing nearly $150 million in contracts annually

[god shammgod]

great. haven't see this argument in a while. bring back the professor of ts percentage while you're at it. really make my day.

[Thugger HBC]

Comparing records is a bit meh as both teams required some tinkering post trade.

Acquiring Melo SHOULD pay us more dividends in the near term. If the Nuggets get farther than the Knicks in the playoffs this season I'm going to be royally pissed as they're the team with more flexibility moving forward. Making a trade of that magnitude when the team is already on an upward trajectory should result in a contender.

We canned MDA, We got some ball handlers. We got that interior presence and shooters. Melo got the role as top dog. If you believe the papers, the team even made moves at his behest.

The Knicks went "win now." We should be better NOW.

No excuses.

Honestly, I'd like to see Denver make the WCF again without Melo, that's what they did the last full year they had him.

[KnicksGod]

great. haven't see this argument in a while. bring back the professor of ts percentage while you're at it. really make my day.

He's drowning in a sea of TS% I'm sure.

[ibraheim718]

Honestly, I'd like to see Denver make the WCF again without Melo, that's what they did the last full year they had him.

How many of the players on that WCF team are still on the team? They went all in... blew a bunch of cash on personnel... it didn't work and they were done spending money... Their star got restless and wanted a change and they did the best they could. Out of all the possible scenarios... you know like comparing them to Orlando, Atlanta, Utah, New Orleans... teams that traded their franchise player they're arguably in the best shape.

[Capn'O]

Comparing records is a bit meh as both teams required some tinkering post trade.

Acquiring Melo SHOULD pay us more dividends in the near term. If the Nuggets get farther than the Knicks in the playoffs this season I'm going to be royally pissed as they're the team with more flexibility moving forward. Making a trade of that magnitude when the team is already on an upward trajectory should result in a contender.

We canned MDA, We got some ball handlers. We got that interior presence and shooters. Melo got the role as top dog. If you believe the papers, the team even made moves at his behest.

The Knicks went "win now." We should be better NOW.

No excuses.

Honestly, I'd like to see Denver make the WCF again without Melo, that's what they did the last full year they had him.

As a fan of the NBA? Hell yeah!

As a fan of the Knicks

But for the most part, I like how Denver has built and I like how they play. Still a lil' confused about Javale over Nene but it's hard to argue with that team's recent success. Koufos has played will.

[ibraheim718]

]

As a fan of the NBA? Hell yeah!

As a fan of the Knicks

But for the most part, I like how Denver has built and I like how they play. Still a lil' confused about Javale over Nene but it's hard to argue with that team's recent success. Koufos has played will.

You'd give Uriji at the very least a B+ for the job he's done so far wouldn't you?

[Thugger HBC]

Comparing records is a bit meh as both teams required some tinkering post trade.

Acquiring Melo SHOULD pay us more dividends in the near term. If the Nuggets get farther than the Knicks in the playoffs this season I'm going to be royally pissed as they're the team with more flexibility moving forward. Making a trade of that magnitude when the team is already on an upward trajectory should result in a contender.

We canned MDA, We got some ball handlers. We got that interior presence and shooters. Melo got the role as top dog. If you believe the papers, the team even made moves at his behest.

The Knicks went "win now." We should be better NOW.

No excuses.

Honestly, I'd like to see Denver make the WCF again without Melo, that's what they did the last full year they had him.

As a fan of the NBA? Hell yeah!

As a fan of the Knicks

But for the most part, I like how Denver has built and I like how they play. Still a lil' confused about Javale over Nene but it's hard to argue with that team's recent success. Koufos has played will.

It really has nothing to do with the Knicks, that's the thing I've yet to understand.

What Denver does is totally irrelevant to the Knicks....unless they met in the finals.

[ibraheim718]

You can't change history man... what Denver and Houston do will always at least symbolically have something to do with the Knicks. Sucks... but that's the way it will always be hence the stat the other guy posted that was tweeted.

[Capn'O]

]

As a fan of the NBA? Hell yeah!

As a fan of the Knicks

But for the most part, I like how Denver has built and I like how they play. Still a lil' confused about Javale over Nene but it's hard to argue with that team's recent success. Koufos has played will.

You'd give Uriji at the very least a B+ for the job he's done so far wouldn't you?

A-... A if not for the caveat I just mentioned. He has done a great job keeping competitive while completely rebuilding.

Denver's return on the Melo trade was fantastic, though, and I'm still flummoxed as to why the Wolves played the role that they did. They're the team that really got hosed.