PG: 2nd Seed Baby!

[DaGawd]

ticket prices for game 1… smh

[Deeeez Knicks]

ticket prices for game 1… smh

By comparison tickets starting at $46 for tonight’s sixer/heat game. Might be a lot of fans taking road trips for the away games.

[Chanel Bomber]

Screaming man would like to have a word with you...

Watch on YouTube

Even if I agree that Jokic is the better player on the better team but you make it sound like he's as bad of a defender as your binky Burks.

Brunson plays with effort on defense but he's still a negative defensively. It's not his fault per se, but the reality is that he's not a positive factor on defense. That's not insignificant when you assess a player's overall impact.

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson does the best he can on defense. Including by taking charges, which does of course matter.

But charges are isolated plays, and realistically only account for a very small percentage of defensive possessions (around 1%). What's his impact on the vast majority of defensive possessions where he doesn't end up drawing a charge?

Jalen doesn't have the length to be a switchable defender, or to consistently disrupt the passing lanes, or to contest shots, and he can get picked on in the post. This all matters, and on a more consistent basis than the odd charge.

He does his best, and him taking charges helps mitigate his flaws, but he's still overall a mediocre defender at best. Which isn't his fault.

[Clyde_Style]

Screaming man would like to have a word with you...

Watch on YouTube

Even if I agree that Jokic is the better player on the better team but you make it sound like he's as bad of a defender as your binky Burks.

Brunson plays with effort on defense but he's still a negative defensively. It's not his fault per se, but the reality is that he's not a positive factor on defense. That's not insignificant when you assess a player's overall impact.

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson's defense has gotten better later in this season. He's more noticeably getting up on guys on the perimeter and doing a better job of keeping them from turning the corner. Sure, he may not be a great man defender, but lately he has actually been decent.

The OG effect on our defense does generate better overall team help defense as long as everyone is on board and assisting on weak side switches. Brunson is doing his part.

He's still going to get beat and guys are going to turn the corner on him, but he is definitely getter better at it with the size and speed limitations he has. He is unguardable because of his disruptive movement patterns and elite footwork whereas raw defensive talent is more about lateral quickness which Brunson is only average at at best.

As long as the team as a whole is solid on defense he is not that much of a liability lately and occasionally he even shuts down his man. I'll settle for consistently average.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

[FrozenEnvelope]

ticket prices for game 1… smh

Paid $270 for 200s section for Game 1 and Game 7 (if needed obviously). Both are now over $400 and climbing. Get those tix early!

Although watching a game at Stout or another sports bar is also fun!

[Chanel Bomber]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

[stuporman]

Screaming man would like to have a word with you...

Watch on YouTube

Even if I agree that Jokic is the better player on the better team but you make it sound like he's as bad of a defender as your binky Burks.

Brunson plays with effort on defense but he's still a negative defensively. It's not his fault per se, but the reality is that he's not a positive factor on defense. That's not insignificant when you assess a player's overall impact.

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson does more than just take charges on defense now, the video is from one single game of examples where he makes a wide array of different types of positive defensive plays.

Also, if a player does something to fill a gap or make a rotation, doubles, helps or anything that results in something that doesn't turn up in statbox because a pass isn't made to a cutting player, or a player picks up their dribble and passes or stops a player from getting a good look so they pass how is it known in stats.

There are plenty of examples where nothing actually gets recorded in a box score and never makes it into counting stats or even metrics but are instances of plus defense.

So he is improving and it's getting harder to just take the 'his limitations makes him a minus defender' as gospel anymore, he may never be a plus defender but he makes plus defensive plays at times. How all the different 'metrics' or stats measure up may not be the full story,

[Woodsanity]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

I honestly believe Brunson offense > Tatum's offense + defense.

Too bad Tatum is going to get in because his team is stacked. Porzingis and Jrue are huge upgrades.

[Chanel Bomber]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

I honestly believe Brunson offense > Tatum's offense + defense.

Too bad Tatum is going to get in because his team is stacked. Porzingis and Jrue are huge upgrades.

That's an interesting take.

I think it's difficult to assess Tatum's true value on a team that is both so stacked and so successful.

I think it's fair to say he was able to play more loose and use less than 100% of his abilities, compared to a guy like Jalen who had to carry the team offensively for most of the season.

I think you can make the case for Brunson over Tatum for sure. I just think with Boston's record being what it is, Tatum is practically a shoo-in.

Do you penalize the guy who won 60+ games with better help, or the guy who won 50 games with more adverse circumstances? Both seem unfair in principle, but ultimately the voters will have to make that call.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

It's tough to argue with those guys. I think what Brunson has done in the later half of the season is at least getting really close to at what SGA and Luka have done this year though.

I would also say Brunson has had a better season then Giannis from a team perspective.

Tatum has a pretty stacked team as wood pointed out. Overall Brunson is way more important to the Knicks. Tough to knock Tatum for having a really good team though

It's at least great just to have Brunson in the conversation among the best players in the league. But just due to not having as long of a track record and breaking out a little later he may not get the benefit of the doubt over those guys. A great playoff run and following it up with another great season can really cement his place

[drekwins]

ticket prices for game 1… smh

By comparison tickets starting at $46 for tonight’s sixer/heat game. Might be a lot of fans taking road trips for the away games.

I'm considering a flight down to Miami if they beat Philly

[Chanel Bomber]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

It's tough to argue with those guys. I think what Brunson has done in the later half of the season is at least getting really close to at what SGA and Luka have done this year though.

I would also say Brunson has had a better season then Giannis from a team perspective.

Tatum has a pretty stacked team as wood pointed out. Overall Brunson is way more important to the Knicks. Tough to knock Tatum for having a really good team though

It's at least great just to have Brunson in the conversation among the best players in the league. But just due to not having as long of a track record and breaking out a little later he may not get the benefit of the doubt over those guys. A great playoff run and following it up with another great season can really cement his place

Agreed, I think it's a fantastic development for the franchise, and one that helps further rid of the stench that was associated with it for so long. It's a blessing for the image of the franchise.

Melo felt somewhat similar in 2012-13 but he'd made a lot of enemies with his regrettable Lin comments, and he was never the leader that Brunson is. He would polarize moreso than federate. It also turned out to be ephemeral, whereas Brunson's season feels more replicable, also because of the structure around him. Nevertheless, him becoming one the marquee players in the league that season elevated the stature of the franchise in the eyes of basketball players and the greater public, albeit briefly.

You're also right about the NBA needing to see more, and sometimes being a year behind, especially for overachievers who weren't drafted high. There was certainly a case to be made for Brunson to make the All-Star game and the All-NBA 3rd team last year for instance.

I hope he makes first team over Giannis too, but - as you also seem to believe - it may be just too early for that, sadly. Second team would be an incredible achievement anyway.

[Clyde_Style]

This is our culture now

Read on Twitter

?s=61&t=oWAQ5JzX5AK-44v89eypvw

Yet Chanel has gravy guzzling Luka over this warrior. Terrible

Gravy Guzzler!

[Clyde_Style]

I doubt Mitch can make toast for himself

Mitch thinks you make popcorn by lifting sofa cushions

[dakomish23]

Brunson def a lock for top 5 MVP voting but he’s also got a real shot all NBA 1st team. Insane season from the best PG since Clyde

A good sign - both Windy & Bontemps said they voted Brunson top 5 in MVP & all NBA 1st team.

[Clyde_Style]

Brunson is kinda like Curry on defense. Undersized but plays smart and hustles to where he is not that much of a liability especially in terms of his position…the charges are a big plus. Not to say he can’t get picked on, but he will at least battle. At that position, not many pgs are switchable onto big wings or even good defenders either

The awards are mostly based around offense anyway. Jokic, Harden, Curry, Nash, Iverson, Dirk have all won mvps.

Brunson won’t win mvp this year, but defense really shouldn’t exclude him from being a first team all nba player. It sounds like he won’t make first team all nba. I think that’ll mostly be due to name recognition and rep over the body of work and impact this season.

I agree that being a mediocre defender shouldn't exclude you from winning MVP.

But if you're a worse defender than your competitors for MVP, I'd expect you to be a superior offensive force (see Dirk, Curry and Harden's MVP campaigns).

But while he's an explosive offensive player, and one of the best engines in the NBA, I just don't think Brunson is a better offensive player than Jokic, SGA or Doncic. They're all more efficient than Brunson (not that it's the only factor, and there are mitigating circumstances for Jalen), and Jokic/Doncic are generational playmakers to top it off.

And that's where the lack of defensive impact costs him.

Agreed with your last paragraph btw.

It's tough to argue with those guys. I think what Brunson has done in the later half of the season is at least getting really close to at what SGA and Luka have done this year though.

I would also say Brunson has had a better season then Giannis from a team perspective.

Tatum has a pretty stacked team as wood pointed out. Overall Brunson is way more important to the Knicks. Tough to knock Tatum for having a really good team though

It's at least great just to have Brunson in the conversation among the best players in the league. But just due to not having as long of a track record and breaking out a little later he may not get the benefit of the doubt over those guys. A great playoff run and following it up with another great season can really cement his place

Comparing Tatum to Brunson is like comparing

This

To This

[Zenzibar]

Brunson plays with effort on defense but he's still a negative defensively. It's not his fault per se, but the reality is that he's not a positive factor on defense. That's not insignificant when you assess a player's overall impact.

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson does the best he can on defense. Including by taking charges, which does of course matter.

But charges are isolated plays, and realistically only account for a very small percentage of defensive possessions (around 1%). What's his impact on the vast majority of defensive possessions where he doesn't end up drawing a charge?

Jalen doesn't have the length to be a switchable defender, or to consistently disrupt the passing lanes, or to contest shots, and he can get picked on in the post. This all matters, and on a more consistent basis than the odd charge.

He does his best, and him taking charges helps mitigate his flaws, but he's still overall a mediocre defender at best. Which isn't his fault.

That's valid. But how many times have you've seen Brunson get taken advantage of this season on isolation? The Knicks are not a switching defense, they fight to stay with their assignments.

Sure, OG is an elite isolation defender, but NY's defense does as good as Golden State did at hiding Steph during their heydays. Noone says that Curry is a bad defender, am I right?

[Zenzibar]

Brunson plays with effort on defense but he's still a negative defensively. It's not his fault per se, but the reality is that he's not a positive factor on defense. That's not insignificant when you assess a player's overall impact.

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson does more than just take charges on defense now, the video is from one single game of examples where he makes a wide array of different types of positive defensive plays.

Also, if a player does something to fill a gap or make a rotation, doubles, helps or anything that results in something that doesn't turn up in statbox because a pass isn't made to a cutting player, or a player picks up their dribble and passes or stops a player from getting a good look so they pass how is it known in stats.

There are plenty of examples where nothing actually gets recorded in a box score and never makes it into counting stats or even metrics but are instances of plus defense.

So he is improving and it's getting harder to just take the 'his limitations makes him a minus defender' as gospel anymore, he may never be a plus defender but he makes plus defensive plays at times. How all the different 'metrics' or stats measure up may not be the full story,

100%

Jalen Brunson is playing with a top 3-5 defensive team, so he must be contributing mightily,

[Chanel Bomber]

Brunson, was 2nd in the league in taking charges and if you don't appreciate the impact and value that brings to the defense then that's on you.

Taking charges changes momentum and is an excellent example of elite help defense. There is nothing about Jalen Brunson's game that is insignificant.

Brunson does the best he can on defense. Including by taking charges, which does of course matter.

But charges are isolated plays, and realistically only account for a very small percentage of defensive possessions (around 1%). What's his impact on the vast majority of defensive possessions where he doesn't end up drawing a charge?

Jalen doesn't have the length to be a switchable defender, or to consistently disrupt the passing lanes, or to contest shots, and he can get picked on in the post. This all matters, and on a more consistent basis than the odd charge.

He does his best, and him taking charges helps mitigate his flaws, but he's still overall a mediocre defender at best. Which isn't his fault.

That's valid. But how many times have you've seen Brunson get taken advantage of this season on isolation? The Knicks are not a switching defense, they fight to stay with their assignments.

Sure, OG is an elite isolation defender, but NY's defense does as good as Golden State did at hiding Steph during their heydays. Noone says that Curry is a bad defender, am I right?

Curry was a mediocre defender in his prime, and the weak point of Golden State's otherwise historically great defense. That's one of the two reasons the Cavs put him in practically every action in the 2016 Finals imo (the other being to cause fatigue). And it certainly contributed to their loss. Curry improved a lot defensively afterwards to the point where he became a solid defender. But he was always taller than Brunson.

I just don't think Brunson is a plus defender, and most advanced defensive metrics, which are quite sound and generally produce credible results, paint him essentially as mediocre at best. That matches my eye test. I've seen him get burnt on many occasions, and the reality's that his physical limitations do prevent him from contesting shots and from providing significant help defense besides the occasional charge.

I don't mean that as a criticism of Brunson by the way. He pulls his weight on defense - he's committed, he plays hard, and the fact that he takes so many charges relatively speaking shows his eagerness to contribute. I have no complaints about his game whatsoever. It's just hard to be a plus defender as a small guard and I think he's proof of that. But I do expect him to get better under Thibs.