Now were stuck with Randolph

[richardhutnik]

This isn't even about Zach's talent. If it was about talent alone, Zach could fetch a lot.

This is about dumping Zach's off-court stuff. What happens if/when he gets into another off court problem? Few teams are willing to touch him now as it is. If the reports were accurate, Walsh had the opportunity to subtract him outright, get a 2nd rounder and the trade exception, which in itself would've given way more flexibility in signings or trades than Zach can probably ever play himself into with his bloated contract. This was a chance to trade him without having to match dollars coming back. Donnie better have a better deal in the works.

Isn't Zach hosting a party soon at a nightclub?

And if Zach does NOT get in trouble, then what?

- Rich

[NYKBaller]

its mid july you guys have no patience

[BBALLER4FR]

This isn't even about Zach's talent. If it was about talent alone, Zach could fetch a lot.

This is about dumping Zach's off-court stuff. What happens if/when he gets into another off court problem? Few teams are willing to touch him now as it is. If the reports were accurate, Walsh had the opportunity to subtract him outright, get a 2nd rounder and the trade exception, which in itself would've given way more flexibility in signings or trades than Zach can probably ever play himself into with his bloated contract. This was a chance to trade him without having to match dollars coming back. Donnie better have a better deal in the works.

Isn't Zach hosting a party soon at a nightclub?

And if Zach does NOT get in trouble, then what?

- Rich

Then we pretend Hardaway 10's post never happened and instead keep posting that ever so entertaining clip of Z-bo airballing. That's what being a hardcore, realist Knick fan is all about.

slash greenfont

[GONYK]

Uh... One question that has yet to be asked...

Why does this rule out the trade for Randolph? The Clippers STILL have enough cap space to absorb most of Randolph's contract after signing Baron and trading for Camby.

They were $30 million under the cap without those two moves, which means that with Baron's starting salary of $11.5 million, and Camby's $8 million, they only have to trade us a small amount of salary to fit Randolph's contract in as well - Tim Thomas' contract would work well.

And before anyone suggests that Tim Thomas wouldn't be wanted back, remember that he played under D'Antoni in Phoenix, and Donnie Walsh would have nothing against him. Plus, his contract expires in 2010.

Also, I'd doubt that Donnie has been shopping Randolph, had absolutely no takers except for the Clippers, and yet he turned down their deal anyway. I'm sure there have been other teams willing to trade for him, or Walsh wouldn't have turned down the only offer he had.

With a front line of Camby/Thornton/Kaman why would the Clips want Zack Randolph?

Now the Clips can offer a package of Mobley, Tim Thomas, Gordan or draft picks for Vince Carter or Redd.

I like how you say it like acquiring either of those players would be a good thing

[XcalibuR]

Shh...don't try and distract people with your petty logic and reason! Hate is the only thing that makes sense in this situation. People on messageboards ALWAYS know better than someone who has been a top 5 GM in this league for over 15 years

Top 5? I thought you needed to win a few championships or executives of the year to get ranked that high?

Name me 5 better. Ill give you West and Colangelo.[/quote]

Spurs GM RC Buford, although he was given his position from Popvich who was also a GM. (you can count them as one GM if you want, but they helped built the Spurs dynasty). Jerry Krause who built the Chicago Bulls dynasty.

Then you add in a bunch of debatable like

Geoff Petrie
Joe Dumars
Bryan Colangelo (I assume you meant Jerry)
Don Nelson
Carrol Dawson
Bob Bass
Thorn (drafted Jordan)

all of them built winning teams too, with guys like Dawson, Dumars part of championship teams (which is whats most important).

[NYK_UNLV]

We have TWO YEARS for Randolph to increase his value or for another team to screw up and desperately need him. If the Knicks make some sort of improvement this year (and there is no where to go but up) and the course of next year. Zach Randolph will have substantial value, much more than he does currently. People are acting as if we would have been under the cap now. Perhaps it was a missed opportunity, but I doubt its the last, and it might not have been the best.

[GopherIt!]

IMHO, there are only 4 franchises left dumb enough to trade for Randolph. One of them is across the river and that ain't gonna happen. That leaves; Cleveland, Charlotte (if they lose Okafor) and Minnesota.

While I realize Kevin McHale's reputation precedes him the Wolves FO has people to keep him in check now. Their last four trades have all been very solid. The Knicks need to do what the Wolves did when they dumped a pair of team cancer's in Mark Blount and Ricky Davis for what has somehow turned into Mike Miller, R Carney, N Pekovic and two future #1 picks. If you would have told me last year that the Wolves FO could shine those two turds and turn them into gold, I'd have told you your nuts. You guys got a good GM now so hopefully you'll figure out a way to do the same.

[enivel]

Obviously Walsh knows better than we all do what Zach's value is around the league. So maybe he has some other options lined up. I'm waiting til the offseason is over before evaluating how Walsh handled this. If we manage to move Zach anyway than it was the right move to ask for more from the Clips. If not (or if we have to squander other assets) then I'll say that Walsh effed up.

I agree in principle but better yet, let's wait until July 2010 to find out if it was the right move. If we're stuck with Randolph and it screws up our chance of landing LeBron or another top guy that summer, then Walsh's refusal to just dump Randolph will look bad. Until then, questioning Walsh's decisions is silly.

I'm pretty confident he'll find some way to get rid of Randolph in the next 24 months. This was not a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, it happens every year when a team has cap room and can't get a quality free agent to bite. It'll happen next summer, mark my words. Plus there are still two trade deadlines between now and our target date when playoff-bound teams will be aching to fill holes on their club.

Lots and lots of hands yet to be played. Everyone needs to relax.

The game''s chess, not checkers.

[Big Dawg]

Obviously Walsh knows better than we all do what Zach's value is around the league. So maybe he has some other options lined up. I'm waiting til the offseason is over before evaluating how Walsh handled this. If we manage to move Zach anyway than it was the right move to ask for more from the Clips. If not (or if we have to squander other assets) then I'll say that Walsh effed up.

I agree in principle but better yet, let's wait until July 2010 to find out if it was the right move. If we're stuck with Randolph and it screws up our chance of landing LeBron or another top guy that summer, then Walsh's refusal to just dump Randolph will look bad. Until then, questioning Walsh's decisions is silly.

I'm pretty confident he'll find some way to get rid of Randolph in the next 24 months. This was not a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, it happens every year when a team has cap room and can't get a quality free agent to bite. It'll happen next summer, mark my words. Plus there are still two trade deadlines between now and our target date when playoff-bound teams will be aching to fill holes on their club.

Lots and lots of hands yet to be played. Everyone needs to relax.

The game''s chess, not checkers.

It is already the wrong move! Randolph being here means less minutes for Lee and Galinari. And you better pray that D'antoni can figure out a way to get Curry and Randolph to Co-exist or we are stuck with two turds with deflated value. Remeber there are at least two contracts that need to be moved in order to be significantly under the cap.

[hoodie©]

-----------------
PG - Baron Davis
SG • Eric Gordon
SF • Al Thornton
PF • Chris Kaman
C • Marcus Camby
------------------

[SoCal Knicks]

I think most of you guys need to relax. I am not a big fan of Zbo at all and I want him gone as much as the next Knicks fan. But most of you guys are willing to make a rash decision and deal ZBO for a second round pick is an IT move (which is a wrong type of move). I'm cool with hanging onto ZBO for the right move, an expiring deal with a draft pick, till 2010 rolls around. Did any of you guys realize this... What if we keep ZBO until 2010 and use him in a package to trade for one of the coveted free agents (Wade, Bosh, King James, etc.). I'm sure that teams wont sit pat and let their star walk without getting anything of value in return. ZBO's Fat expiring paired with a few draft picks or Wilson Chandler, N8, The Big Cock, Lee (if he is still here), our next years lottery pick, will be really enticing in 2010.

Overall people need to be patient... I trust a man who has been a GM for many years to make the right decision. I fully understand why you guys want to see change right now, but lets all understand... we are a bad team right now, but we are headed in the right direction. PATIENTS IS THE KEY!!!

[J9Starks3]

Its a very slim chance of happening...but what if the Clips did this in order to turn around and trade us Camby for Randolph?

Because he was just traded, he can only be retraded in a 1 for 1 deal. Zach for Camby would work. That would satisfy all parties. The Clips essentially get Randolph for a 2nd rounder and the Knicks get a player of value for Randolph who expires before 2010 free agency...

maybe? probably not....

[duetta]

PATIENTS IS THE KEY!!!

Another season of Eddy and Zack together will leave us all mental PATIENTS.

[Flaming Mo]

Being stuck with him is not a bad thing at. If we really had to give up Randolph for a 2nd rounder that would have sucked. Obviously Walsh is going to make sure that we have cap space for 2010. we dont have to get rid of Zach right now. We have so much time its not even funny. Walsh will come around.

Well, but this is the prize you have to pay for Isiah's madness and insane deals. It's too bad a chance to unload Zach is gone but what can we do, Walsh can't bow down now to every joke of a deal just because Isiah left the team with a lot of bad apples.

[SoCal Knicks]

PATIENTS IS THE KEY!!!

Another season of Eddy and Zack together will leave us all mental PATIENTS.

Well... we are Knicks fans so I guess we are seen as mental PATIENTS around the league. But I'm cool with it.

[aveboogie7]

Shh...don't try and distract people with your petty logic and reason! Hate is the only thing that makes sense in this situation. People on messageboards ALWAYS know better than someone who has been a top 5 GM in this league for over 15 years

Top 5? I thought you needed to win a few championships or executives of the year to get ranked that high?

Name me 5 better. Ill give you West and Colangelo.

Spurs GM RC Buford, although he was given his position from Popvich who was also a GM. (you can count them as one GM if you want, but they helped built the Spurs dynasty). Jerry Krause who built the Chicago Bulls dynasty.

Then you add in a bunch of debatable like

Geoff Petrie
Joe Dumars
Bryan Colangelo (I assume you meant Jerry)
Don Nelson
Carrol Dawson
Bob Bass
Thorn (drafted Jordan)

all of them built winning teams too, with guys like Dawson, Dumars part of championship teams (which is whats most important).[/quote]

Ernie Grunfeld - extremely underrated guy for what he did with the Knicks and is doing with the Wizards.
Kevin O'Connor - Utah

You also have to begin factoring in some of the current crop of "new school" GM's

Sam Presti - Seattle
Kevin Pritchard - Portland (kinda hard to say he's not doing an awesome job in a short time)
Mitch Kupchak - LA Lakers (drafted Bynum, Farmar, traded for Gasol, could end up with Artest)

[douggood]

Its a very slim chance of happening...but what if the Clips did this in order to turn around and trade us Camby for Randolph?

Because he was just traded, he can only be retraded in a 1 for 1 deal. Zach for Camby would work. That would satisfy all parties. The Clips essentially get Randolph for a 2nd rounder and the Knicks get a player of value for Randolph who expires before 2010 free agency...

maybe? probably not....

I dont see why clipps do this. Kaman was a 18/12 player last season for 3 months without brand. And financially why take Zach large contract. The clippers as it stands right now are gonna be a player in the 2010 market.

[chitownsports4ever]

Saying that you are stuck with Randolph gives the indication that somehow you have some inside info and are privy to all the facts when you are not . I have a strong feeling that Walsh has no problem dumping Randolph if thats what he wanted to do but in the end its what you have to take back but hes not gonna bail them out and GIVE THEM a 27 yr old productive PF for nothing.I dont know how anyone gets upset at him for that .Some of you cried for change ,for patience and tact and now that you have it you find that you really fall in line with isiahs willing and dealing ways . You gotta show some patience.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Horrible non move by Walsh. He gambled trying to get more and it didnt pay off. Now we are stuck with Zach for the time being. I dont think we're going to get a better deal for Zach then what was offered. That was a great deal considering. I doubt anyone is going to give up a 1st rounder or any decent young prospect unless we are taking back long term salaries. That woulda been such a good deal for the Knicks...

[jayknicks]

Considering what? Regardless of whether he's considered selfish..he's still an asset..and you don't just dump assets..money isn't an issue here and its not 2010. He can only improve his tradeability by remaining on the team..he can't get any worse, in terms of value, than he already is..and a lot of it has to do w/ the leadership last yr.