TKF's keys to the victory / PS game 2

Post #41 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 8:32 am

Trade Gallinari. Lee has made him expendable.

supergallinari · Post #42 » by **supergallinari** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 8:36 am

duetta wrote:Trade Gallinari. Lee has made him expendable.

Post #43 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 8:39 am

supergallinari wrote:
duetta wrote:Trade Gallinari. Lee has made him expendable.

Yep. I'm tired of hearing people value players who have never got it done in the NBA over guys who get better every year. Potential is for losers.

Post #44 » by **GONYK** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 9:07 am

duetta wrote:Trade Gallinari. Lee has made him expendable.

Post of the year

Post #45 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 10:05 am

GONYK wrote:Post of the year

My memory ain't what it used to be, but aren't you the expert who told us that Andrew Bynum wasn't going to become anything, because you saw him play in High School.

Big C · Post #46 » by **Big C** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 10:54 am

optimusADL wrote:Send Lee to Charlotte for Augustine.

Larry Brown is no fan of Lee. Remember Brown did not want to play Lee and made a comment that Lee is no starter in this league. So I doubt he would want Lee now. Magoo is about defense not offense.

Clyde2 · Post #47 » by **Clyde2** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:25 pm

atlnyk wrote:Sometimes I don't understand our fans. Some are forever complaining that we never get good draft choices. Then we draft D. Lee and W. Chandler just to hear both of their names repeatedly mentioned in trade suggestions. Put either on Portland and they have the good sense to develop them and grow with them. Why can't we show any patience and develop our youngsters? David lee, Chandler, and Robinson are clearly developing well. Sometimes I think they could walk on water and that still would not be enough, but we want to trade for someone else's young player. I wouldn't trade any of them unless I'm getting all-star talent in return. Enough already, you can start to understand why people feel you can't rebuild in New York. We need to learn how to value our young players the way virtually every other team in the NBA does. At least coach D seems to do so.

Very well said.

ElMatatan · Post #48 » by **ElMatatan** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:31 pm

This thread starter so nice but then it became a mess with the trade lee, Q, Gallinari........lol...

seriously, if one of this guys has a great game next game you guys are going to be all up on top of the bandwagon, just like you guys did with Duhon......so just cut the whole trading players just because they have not play well..

TKF · Post #49 » by **TKF** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:53 pm

duetta wrote:
GONYK wrote:Post of the year

My memory ain't what it used to be, but aren't you the expert who told us that Andrew Bynum wasn't going to become anything, because you saw him play in High School.

Honestly quite a few people were not that high on bynum. As a seven footer with some skill, he slipped quite a bit. If most execs and scouts thought he would be this good, he would not have slipped. I don't think gony is the only one here.

TdoubleE · Post #50 » by **TdoubleE** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 3:44 pm

So we are back on the trade Lee bandwagon after 2 preseason games in which he was argueably the best player on the team?

If that french pastry Diaw could hold his own at the 5 under this system, I'm sure Lee can do the same.

The ship has sailed for Augustin, I wanted him as bad as the next person. Walsh had a chance to get him and decided to go with cock-boy. Let it go.

Post #51 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:13 pm

TKF wrote:Honestly quite a few people were not that high on bynum. As a seven footer with some skill, he slipped quite a bit. If most execs and scouts thought he would be this good, he would not have slipped. I don't think gony is the only one here.

That might be. But my point is that players who develop are IMHO worth infinitely more than players who represent potential.

After what we've witnessed this pre-season, I cannot imagine anyone not wanting to keep Lee - certainly at a reasonable salary. That we should move Lee, a player who improves a different component of his game every off-season, and trade him either to open up a slot for a totally unproven talent (who may well suffer from Kiki Vandeweghe-like back issues), and that we should further trade him for unproven talents who we can only hope become as good as Lee is on the path to becoming, is mind boggling to me.

Big C · Post #52 » by **Big C** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:19 pm

The Knicks want to keep Lee for the right price. Lee wants to stay if he gets his money. The question is do you think Lee is worth 55 to 60 mil or 50 mil? If Lee gets 60 mil plus then you are saying Lee is going to be a Knicks starter for years to come.

TKF · Post #53 » by **TKF** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:22 pm

duetta wrote:
TKF wrote:Honestly quite a few people were not that high on bynum. As a seven footer with some skill, he slipped quite a bit. If most execs and scouts thought he would be this good, he would not have slipped. I don't think gony is the only one here.

That might be. But my point is that players who develop are IMHO worth infinitely more than players who represent potential.

After what we've witnessed this pre-season, I cannot imagine anyone not wanting to keep Lee - certainly at a reasonable salary. That we should move Lee, a player who improves a different component of his game every off-season, and trade him either to open up a slot for a totally unproven talent (who may well suffer from Kiki Vandeweghe-like back issues), and that we should further trade him for unproven talents who we can only hope become as good as Lee is on the path to becoming, is mind boggling to me.

I see your point, but this is why I say keep both. See how gallanari develops, we spent a #6 pick on the kid, we owe ourselves that much. And if he pans out to be what we hope and lee continues to improve, we then have what we call "good problems".

Post #54 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:24 pm

The key is to signing him to a deal that leaves him attractive to other teams. Comparable forwards have signed deals fairly recently, and they should be the model. Somewhere in the $8-$10 million a season range over multiple years, with an ETO on Lee's end might be attractive enough to get the deal done. Perhaps the inclusion of the ETO (and knowledge of Walsh 2010 plan) will convince Lee to give the team a hometown discount.

Post #55 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:31 pm

TKF wrote:I see your point, but this is why I say keep both. See how gallanari develops, we spent a #6 pick on the kid, we owe ourselves that much. And if he pans out to be what we hope and lee continues to improve, we then have what we call "good problems".

My comment was a response to turning on the computer in the middle of the night, after Lee's breakout performance as a shooter, and seeing multiple posters calling for Lee to be traded for guys who never played a game in the NBA. I'd trade Lee for Biederins, for instance. I'd trade Lee for a better fitting part. But I'm not trading him for players who have everything to prove.

Post #56 » by **KnicksGod** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:34 pm

Wilson C shot only 4-11 last night but in 23 minutes, you can see that this guy can fill up the stat sheet:

8 points, 7 rebounds (2 offensive), 4 assists, 2 steals, 1 block.

stuporman · Post #57 » by **stuporman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:39 pm

So the Knicks now have two players who are double doubles which is nearly unheard of in this day and age on the same team and some people want to trade Lee, the cheaper of the two. Plus someone wants to trade him for a non-proven guard? Passing guards are much easier to come by than double double big men who have a jumpshot, which Lee now seems to possess. Wouldn't be easier to find a defensive big man who blocks shots for 20-25mins a game? The Knicks will be able to find a taker for Curry if he shows anything this year he's not grossly overpaid by NBA bigmen standards. For as bad of a GM Isiah was I can see he's light years ahead of some of the numbnuts who post on this board.

stuporman · Post #58 » by **stuporman** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:42 pm

KnicksGod wrote:Wilson C shot only 4-11 last night but in 23 minutes, you can see that this guy can fill up the stat sheet:

8 points, 7 rebounds (2 offensive), 4 assists, 2 steals, 1 block.

I'd actually say that he could be a double double guy with 30 mins a game eventually. Along with a couple ticks in every other box, too.

GuyverADL · Post #59 » by **GuyverADL** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:57 pm

duetta wrote:
TKF wrote:I see your point, but this is why I say keep both. See how gallanari develops, we spent a #6 pick on the kid, we owe ourselves that much. And if he pans out to be what we hope and lee continues to improve, we then have what we call "good problems".

My comment was a response to turning on the computer in the middle of the night, after Lee's breakout performance as a shooter, and seeing multiple posters calling for Lee to be traded for guys who never played a game in the NBA. I'd trade Lee for Biederins, for instance. I'd trade Lee for a better fitting part. But I'm not trading him for players who have everything to prove.

Frye also had a sweet jumper. :roll:

Fact is Lee doesnt play any D and has only been knocking down open shots.

This style of play is going to inflate his stats because we are going to be bricking more shots and giving him more attempts at grabbing boards.

If we actually knocked down shots his rebounds would be way lower.

I like Lee but is he really worth 9-10 million a year for 5-6 years.

Gallinari has shown he can pass and shoot efficiently.

We need to sell high like Chicago did to us. We need to beat another team over the head for Lee.

Post #60 » by **duetta** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 5:04 pm

optimusADL wrote:Frye also had a sweet jumper.

Fact is Lee doesnt play any D and has only been knocking down open shots.

Don't even think about comparing Frye to Lee. Don't even think about it. You have got to be one of the most negative, depressing posters on this board.

Imagine if Isiah had followed your advice and traded Lee for the mighty Darko?