Magic(2-5) @ Pistons(1-8)

thelead · Post #391 » by **thelead** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:58 am

Malik Starks wrote:
SmiteaDwight wrote:We needed Meer's penetration and passing tonight. If we can stay Healthy we'll be better than people expected.

If the so called experts were objective they would already see this team is pretty good. We've played a pretty brutal schedule, look at our losses:

Two losses to a very good Brooklyn team, One loss to an undefeated Knicks team (including wins over Miami, and San Antonio), one loss to a Memphis team that is looking like the best team in Western Conference. The only loss you can point to has been Minnesota, and they aren't half bad either.

And our 3 wins come against the 4-5 Nuggets, 4-5 Suns, and 1-9 Pistons. What's your point?

J the Drafter · Post #392 » by **J the Drafter** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:02 am

thelead wrote: I'm still pissed we couldn't put one great scorer around that defensive monster.

Who'd you have in mind? Wade? Kobe? (I suppose we could have gotten Ellis or the like if we'd still had Gortat to trade, I'll grant you that.) We had multiple 20+ per game scorers around Howard, even if Lewis largely spotted up. It's not Jameer's fault he got injured in 2009, and Carter was very effective for most of his stay here, even if he wasn't driving for layups all game.

Malik Starks · Post #393 » by **Malik Starks** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:03 am

thelead wrote:
Malik Starks wrote:
SmiteaDwight wrote:We needed Meer's penetration and passing tonight. If we can stay Healthy we'll be better than people expected.

If the so called experts were objective they would already see this team is pretty good. We've played a pretty brutal schedule, look at our losses:

Two losses to a very good Brooklyn team, One loss to an undefeated Knicks team (including wins over Miami, and San Antonio), one loss to a Memphis team that is looking like the best team in Western Conference. The only loss you can point to has been Minnesota, and they aren't half bad either.

And our 3 wins come against the 4-5 Nuggets, 4-5 Suns, and 1-9 Pistons. What's your point?

True enough, but we were missing our starting PG in all the losses. I've always believed this is a good team when healthy, not world beaters but pretty good. My point is the losses have come against some of the best teams in the NBA right now.

OrlandO · Post #394 » by **OrlandO** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:14 am

Jameer in two games - 8.5 assists, 1.5 turnovers. His assists were up last season when Dwight left, too.

thelead · Post #395 » by **thelead** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:15 am

J the Drafter wrote:
thelead wrote: I'm still pissed we couldn't put one great scorer around that defensive monster.

Who'd you have in mind? Wade? Kobe? (I suppose we could have gotten Ellis or the like if we'd still had Gortat to trade, I'll grant you that.) We had multiple 20+ per game scorers around Howard, even if Lewis largely spotted up. It's not Jameer's fault he got injured in 2009, and Carter was very effective for most of his stay here, even if he wasn't driving for layups all game.

I said "great" not "good" (ie Lewis and Carter do not fall into the great scorer category). We had one under contract the year we drafted Dwight... just sayin'.

thelead · Post #396 » by **thelead** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:24 am

OrlandO wrote:Jameer in two games - 8.5 assists, 1.5 turnovers. His assists were up last season when Dwight left, too.

Trying to feed Dwight in the post is a turnover nightmare that even LA is experiencing. The turnovers were not his fault it was the system's. Let's see if he can keep up the 8.5 assists though since it has only been 2 games. I don't think he can maintain that number with this roster (although I may be wrong due to the fluidity of the offense). The question that remains to be answered is how our offense will fair against great defenses.

KillMonger · Post #397 » by **KillMonger** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:35 am

I know it's early but take it with a grain of salt. What Vuc is doing isn't too bad

now considering Marc is playing 6 more minutes the numbers are somewhat similar. Got to appreciate that at the very least Vuc is contributing. Has a long way to go to be any REAL comparison to Marc Gasol but through 8 or so games he's been comparable

OrlandO · Post #398 » by **OrlandO** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:51 am

thelead wrote:
OrlandO wrote:Jameer in two games - 8.5 assists, 1.5 turnovers. His assists were up last season when Dwight left, too.

Trying to feed Dwight in the post is a turnover nightmare that even LA is experiencing. The turnovers were not his fault it was the system's. Let's see if he can keep up the 8.5 assists though since it has only been 2 games. I don't think he can maintain that number with this roster (although I may be wrong due to the fluidity of the offense). The question that remains to be answered is how our offense will fair against great defenses.

I will be thrilled if he can average 7 assists with slightly less than 2 turns a game. It looks like we face losing teams next week, but the week after that we play boston, san antonio and brooklyn. Could experience the best and worst weeks of the season in just two weeks. I just hope we remain competitive against the better teams. It's one thing to lose during a rebuild, it's another to get completely blown off the floor and embarrassed.

OrlandO · Post #399 » by **OrlandO** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:57 am

Bobby Ray wrote:I know it's early but take it with a grain of salt. What Vuc is doing isn't too bad

now considering Marc is playing 6 more minutes the numbers are somewhat similar. Got to appreciate that at the very least Vuc is contributing. Has a long way to go to be any REAL comparison to Marc Gasol but through 8 or so games he's been comparable

Nice side-by-side. If you take away the two games where Niko played less than 18 minutes each, then his pts and rebounds go up even more. Let's just say he's had a double double in 5 of the 6 games where he's played more than 18 minutes.

OrlandO · Post #400 » by **OrlandO** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:13 am

Tonight was a good win. The pistons are not that good, but they're also not as bad as their record indicates. They blew out the sixers in the previous game... OKC had to outscore them 30-17 in the 4th to win by two the game before that... and they also have a couple one-possession losses against losing teams. They gave us a pretty good fight tonight as well and I don't consider us the worst team in the league. I also think that entire organization gets off on playing competitively against us due to all the times they ruined our dreams in the playoffs.

PeePee la Fritz · Post #401 » by **PeePee la Fritz** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:31 am

thelead wrote:
J the Drafter wrote:
thelead wrote: I'm still pissed we couldn't put one great scorer around that defensive monster.

Who'd you have in mind? Wade? Kobe? (I suppose we could have gotten Ellis or the like if we'd still had Gortat to trade, I'll grant you that.) We had multiple 20+ per game scorers around Howard, even if Lewis largely spotted up. It's not Jameer's fault he got injured in 2009, and Carter was very effective for most of his stay here, even if he wasn't driving for layups all game.

I said "great" not "good" (ie Lewis and Carter do not fall into the great scorer category). We had one under contract the year we drafted Dwight... just sayin'.

You mean the idiot that demanded Orlando draft Okafor over Howard, and pouted and cited irreconcilable differences because Wisebroad didn't call him to wish him a happy birthday? I'm sorry, there is no way you convince me that Dwight with T-Mac wins a title. McGrady is way too mentally weak to ever win a championship as the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd option

J the Drafter · Post #402 » by **J the Drafter** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:56 am

PeePee la Fritz wrote:You mean the idiot that demanded Orlando draft Okafor over Howard, and pouted and cited irreconcilable differences because Wisebroad didn't call him to wish him a happy birthday? I'm sorry, there is no way you convince me that Dwight with T-Mac wins a title. McGrady is way too mentally weak to ever win a championship as the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd option

McGrady's pouting doesn't make any less effective as a player.

PeePee la Fritz · Post #403 » by **PeePee la Fritz** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:23 am

J the Drafter wrote:
PeePee la Fritz wrote:You mean the idiot that demanded Orlando draft Okafor over Howard, and pouted and cited irreconcilable differences because Wisebroad didn't call him to wish him a happy birthday? I'm sorry, there is no way you convince me that Dwight with T-Mac wins a title. McGrady is way too mentally weak to ever win a championship as the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd option

McGrady's pouting doesn't make any less effective as a player.

3-1 up against the Pistons and you don't win the series. Championship caliber players DO NOT let that happen. That team would contend every year with T-Mac and Dwight, but it would never win. You need mental toughness to win a title, and those are 2 players that just don't have it

PeePee la Fritz · Post #404 » by **PeePee la Fritz** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:24 am

How many playoff series did he win?

J the Drafter · Post #405 » by **J the Drafter** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:25 am

PeePee la Fritz wrote:
J the Drafter wrote:
PeePee la Fritz wrote:You mean the idiot that demanded Orlando draft Okafor over Howard, and pouted and cited irreconcilable differences because Wisebroad didn't call him to wish him a happy birthday? I'm sorry, there is no way you convince me that Dwight with T-Mac wins a title. McGrady is way too mentally weak to ever win a championship as the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd option

McGrady's pouting doesn't make any less effective as a player.

3-1 up against the Pistons and you don't win the series. Championship caliber players DO NOT let that happen. That team would contend every year with T-Mac and Dwight, but it would never win. You need mental toughness to win a title, and those are 2 players that just don't have it

It's not like that Pistons team was better than us, or hell, like Kobe's Lakers' had a similar collapse in 2006.

Reverse_Angle · Post #406 » by **Reverse_Angle** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:30 am

Bobby Ray wrote:I know it's early but take it with a grain of salt. What Vuc is doing isn't too bad

now considering Marc is playing 6 more minutes the numbers are somewhat similar. Got to appreciate that at the very least Vuc is contributing. Has a long way to go to be any REAL comparison to Marc Gasol but through 8 or so games he's been comparable

The good Gasol is a special player primarily because of his basketball mind aside having the tools of being a decent NBA starting center, which does show up in stats--well, maybe apg. Closest comparison to marc gasol would be vlade divac. Vuc is more of mobile scorer type of game at the moment.

RickB-Orlando · Post #407 » by **RickB-Orlando** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:37 am

Bobby Ray wrote:I disagree with almost everything Thelead just said. I think he has a high ceiling and i think he deserves a chance to try to reach that potential. It's all on Vucevic to work hard to become a great player i swear man some people may be spoiled because of Dwight being our center for so long so everything else looks weak in comparison whether people are comparing without knowing. No Big in this upcoming draft class or the next one seems good enough to me to take Vuc's spot he's only in his second year and he's a project and only 22 years old let's have some patience. Let's judge him after another year of development

Is that you, Nik?

Just kidding, I tend to agree with this. Vucevic has shown a pretty impressive skillet so far, for a 22 year old. He's got plenty of ceiling. I've been saying since training camp started he's got the potential to be a top ten, possibly top five center in the league in a few years.

arsenal6106 · Post #408 » by **arsenal6106** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:46 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjvLGxftIIE[/youtube]

SmiteaDwight · Post #409 » by **SmiteaDwight** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 7:00 am

Reverse_Angle wrote:
Bobby Ray wrote:I know it's early but take it with a grain of salt. What Vuc is doing isn't too bad

now considering Marc is playing 6 more minutes the numbers are somewhat similar. Got to appreciate that at the very least Vuc is contributing. Has a long way to go to be any REAL comparison to Marc Gasol but through 8 or so games he's been comparable

The good Gasol is a special player primarily because of his basketball mind aside having the tools of being a decent NBA starting center, which does show up in stats--well, maybe apg. Closest comparison to marc gasol would be vlade divac. Vuc is more of mobile scorer type of game at the moment.

You guys are forgetting the obvious fact that Gasol plays next to Zach Randolph, whos averaging 14 rpg(!). Seriously, Marc Gasol is world's ahead of Vuc in every way, even if their numbers are similar.

TBH Vuc hasnt really impressed me at all. He could be an alright backup but I don't expect him to ever really be a competent starting center. Of course the Magic are pretty good at developing players like we have Gortat, Dwight and JJ so he could come around, but currently he's nothing to write home about.

If we draft Zeller or Nerlens I expect them to take the starting spot next year.

SmiteaDwight · Post #410 » by **SmiteaDwight** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 7:05 am

thelead wrote:
J the Drafter wrote:
thelead wrote: I'm still pissed we couldn't put one great scorer around that defensive monster.

Who'd you have in mind? Wade? Kobe? (I suppose we could have gotten Ellis or the like if we'd still had Gortat to trade, I'll grant you that.) We had multiple 20+ per game scorers around Howard, even if Lewis largely spotted up. It's not Jameer's fault he got injured in 2009, and Carter was very effective for most of his stay here, even if he wasn't driving for layups all game.

I said "great" not "good" (ie Lewis and Carter do not fall into the great scorer category). We had one under contract the year we drafted Dwight... just sayin'.

Dwight + 1 other guy in the top 25 on the team we had in 09 would beat the Lakers IMO.