The Positivity Thread

[MagicFan101]

I think if Wiggins was half the player you think he is Minny would be a much better team. Lavine is shooting .412 from 3 and .857 from the free throw line. I've seen him hit plenty of tough shots off the dribble as well. That's a very good shooter. I also totally disagree Wiggins has it. He still has to prove that.

How good was Seattle / OKC in the early KD days?

How good is New Orleans with Anthony Davis now?

We live in a super TEAM league. Expecting 21 year old kids to lead young teams to wins is a flawed argument.

This board is filled with people that want to tank and then complain when it takes too long to get good. They want the Magic to tank to get a pick but will complain when the 20 year old guy we get doesn't develop fast enough. You are seeing it right here. We have a legit stud in AG and people are already complaining about him in a thread meant for positivity.

Well we are talking about Wiggins rather than AG but the point carries.

Box score researches will behead Henny for taking AG. But those who watch the games are seeing him develop before our eyes. The same story applies to Wiggins.

[Dennis Reynolds]

I edited my post - but I don't think Giannis or Embiid are far more advanced yet. Advanced indicates experience to me. Embiid still does tons of dumb stuff. My opinion on Giannis is above. I think both players are complete studs, but AG is showing signs of rapid development that your buddy Pepe casts aside to force his negative opinion in on every thread.

Many things you have said about Fournier are simply wrong, and have been identified as such by multiple posters. You assume that the Magic are making him the #1 option for long term, which is also wrong. Evan Fournier is going to be a great SG for us once we balance out our roster. I am amazed that people really think that the Magic intend to roll with Vuc/Biz/Ibaka and Zimmerman long term.

I didn't say Fournier is the long term number 1 option. I said a guy like him should never be a number 1 option in the first place. Never, ever unless you're tanking and that's not what we're doing. You might as well try to develop anyone on the roster who has any kind of potential because Fournier's not taking you anywhere.

Yet Fournier has improved as a scorer every year. He will be a classic 18 PPG SG which is perfect for us once we get the pieces around him. Nick Anderson was a very good SG for us as well and he was our first pick ever.

Your argument against Fournier makes no sense. The Magic traded Oladipo, who will never be as good of a shooter as Fournier to DEVELOP AG and Elfrid as well. Those guys need a reliable shooter on the floor with them and that is what Evan is.

But Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier. Who cares if Fournier is a better shooter or not?

[Dennis Reynolds]

How good was Seattle / OKC in the early KD days?

How good is New Orleans with Anthony Davis now?

We live in a super TEAM league. Expecting 21 year old kids to lead young teams to wins is a flawed argument.

This board is filled with people that want to tank and then complain when it takes too long to get good. They want the Magic to tank to get a pick but will complain when the 20 year old guy we get doesn't develop fast enough. You are seeing it right here. We have a legit stud in AG and people are already complaining about him in a thread meant for positivity.

Well we are talking about Wiggins rather than AG but the point carries.

Box score researches will behead Henny for taking AG. But those who watch the games are seeing him develop before our eyes. The same story applies to Wiggins.

I think most Wolves fans would disagree with you when it comes to Wiggins.

[Dennis Reynolds]

I'm sorry but nothing here is true.

Lavine is not a great shooter. He is a hot shooter in the mold of JR Smith. Steph Curry, Ray Allen and Reggie Miller. These are great shooters.

The T-Wolves seem to keep grabbing the guys I am highest on. Wiggins > Parker. KAT > Okafor. I also really liked Dunn. So along with my Magic, I have the T-Wolves as my second League Pass team.

To say Wiggins has made no major improvements just says you aren't watching. This kid has it. I strongly urge you to watch more games. They are a very young team with an aggressive coach. They aren't going to win a lot right not as mistakes will come frequently. So box scores will lie to you but you can see what is brewing if you actually watch the games. Also, I am disappointed with the start for Dunn, he still flashes good stuff. I wouldn't give up just yet.

I think if Wiggins was half the player you think he is Minny would be a much better team. Lavine is shooting .412 from 3 and .857 from the free throw line. I've seen him hit plenty of tough shots off the dribble as well. That's a very good shooter. I also totally disagree Wiggins has it. He still has to prove that.

Again, are you watching the games or looking up box scores? Curry drops 3s with two guys charging at him. Lavine is WIDE open for the majority of his shots because he isn't "the guy". He is the outlet option ala JR Smith.

How good was Seattle / OKC in the early KD days?

How good is New Orleans with Anthony Davis now?

We live in a super TEAM league. Expecting 21 year old kids to lead young teams to wins is a flawed argument.

Of course Curry is a much better shooter than Lavine. I didn't say Lavine's a historically great shooter but he's still a very good shooter.

Durant made the playoffs in his 3rd season winning 50 regular season games. Will the Wolves even win 30 games this season? I also don't think Wiggins will ever come close to being Durant.

[PennytoShaq]

I didn't say Fournier is the long term number 1 option. I said a guy like him should never be a number 1 option in the first place. Never, ever unless you're tanking and that's not what we're doing. You might as well try to develop anyone on the roster who has any kind of potential because Fournier's not taking you anywhere.

Yet Fournier has improved as a scorer every year. He will be a classic 18 PPG SG which is perfect for us once we get the pieces around him. Nick Anderson was a very good SG for us as well and he was our first pick ever.

Your argument against Fournier makes no sense. The Magic traded Oladipo, who will never be as good of a shooter as Fournier to DEVELOP AG and Elfrid as well. Those guys need a reliable shooter on the floor with them and that is what Evan is.

But Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier. Who cares if Fournier is a better shooter or not?

Again you are wrong and your second sentence just tells me you don't really understand what you are arguing about.

Oladipo is better at attacking the rim and finishing than Evan? He has better vision? He can draw fouls and make Fts consistently? Since when? Oh wait, since never because those are all things he can't do better. And while he was pretty good at staying in front of his man, he sucks at fighting through screens and doesn't have the size that Evan has there.

Again, just really poorly thought out arguments here. BTW, Oladipo's FT % this year is only 63% and he is averaging less than 17 PPG in an offense where many complainers here predicted him to average 18-20.

[MagicFan101]

This board is filled with people that want to tank and then complain when it takes too long to get good. They want the Magic to tank to get a pick but will complain when the 20 year old guy we get doesn't develop fast enough. You are seeing it right here. We have a legit stud in AG and people are already complaining about him in a thread meant for positivity.

Well we are talking about Wiggins rather than AG but the point carries.

Box score researches will behead Henny for taking AG. But those who watch the games are seeing him develop before our eyes. The same story applies to Wiggins.

I think most Wolves fans would disagree with you when it comes to Wiggins.

lol, what does that matter?

First, if true, the fact that they disagree with me alone discredits their opinion and general intellect.

Second, the Wolves organization is rumored to actively be engaged in trading Lavine. Where are the rumors for trading Wiggins?

But it is understandable. One guy is flashy. The other isn't. If you're going to lose games you might as well do it in style right? But that is the short term thinking that makes fans fans rather than GMs.

[Dennis Reynolds]

Yet Fournier has improved as a scorer every year. He will be a classic 18 PPG SG which is perfect for us once we get the pieces around him. Nick Anderson was a very good SG for us as well and he was our first pick ever.

Your argument against Fournier makes no sense. The Magic traded Oladipo, who will never be as good of a shooter as Fournier to DEVELOP AG and Elfrid as well. Those guys need a reliable shooter on the floor with them and that is what Evan is.

But Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier. Who cares if Fournier is a better shooter or not?

Again you are wrong and your second sentence just tells me you don't really understand what you are arguing about.

Oladipo is better at attacking the rim and finishing than Evan? He has better vision? He can draw fouls and make Fts consistently? Since when? Oh wait, since never because those are all things he can't do better. And while he was pretty good at staying in front of his man, he sucks at fighting through screens and doesn't have the size that Evan has there.

Again, just really poorly thought out arguments here. BTW, Oladipo's FT % this year is only 63%.

Other than scoring. Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier other than scoring.

Fournier's size is meaningless. He's a poor defender who always gets destroyed on a mismatch. Every time a bigger guy posts him up he looks like pure trash out there. It's tough to find players who aren't too strong or too quick for him to guard.

[PennytoShaq]

But Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier. Who cares if Fournier is a better shooter or not?

Again you are wrong and your second sentence just tells me you don't really understand what you are arguing about.

Oladipo is better at attacking the rim and finishing than Evan? He has better vision? He can draw fouls and make Fts consistently? Since when? Oh wait, since never because those are all things he can't do better. And while he was pretty good at staying in front of his man, he sucks at fighting through screens and doesn't have the size that Evan has there.

Again, just really poorly thought out arguments here. BTW, Oladipo's FT % this year is only 63%.

Other than scoring. Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier other than scoring.

Fournier's size is meaningless. He's a poor defender who always gets destroyed on a mismatch. Every time a bigger guy posts him up he looks like pure trash out there. It's tough to find players who aren't too strong or too quick for him to guard.

Other than scoring? That's a vital part of playing SG. You do know that much right?

I'll humor you - Evan averages over 1 APG more than Oladipo. So again you are wrong.

Every time Evan is in a mismatch he is bad on defense. Ok? Thats your argument now? LOL, you really just need to stop, you have no clue what you are even saying anymore.

[Dennis Reynolds]

Well we are talking about Wiggins rather than AG but the point carries.

Box score researches will behead Henny for taking AG. But those who watch the games are seeing him develop before our eyes. The same story applies to Wiggins.

I think most Wolves fans would disagree with you when it comes to Wiggins.

lol, what does that matter?

First, if true, the fact that they disagree with me alone discredits their opinion and general intellect.

Second, the Wolves organization is rumored to actively be engaged in trading Lavine. Where are the rumors for trading Wiggins?

But it is understandable. One guy is flashy. The other isn't. If you're going to lose games you might as well do it in style right? But that is the short term thinking that makes fans fans rather than GMs.

Wiggins is flashy as well. It's not that.

[MagicFan101]

I think if Wiggins was half the player you think he is Minny would be a much better team. Lavine is shooting .412 from 3 and .857 from the free throw line. I've seen him hit plenty of tough shots off the dribble as well. That's a very good shooter. I also totally disagree Wiggins has it. He still has to prove that.

Again, are you watching the games or looking up box scores? Curry drops 3s with two guys charging at him. Lavine is WIDE open for the majority of his shots because he isn't "the guy". He is the outlet option ala JR Smith.

How good was Seattle / OKC in the early KD days?

How good is New Orleans with Anthony Davis now?

We live in a super TEAM league. Expecting 21 year old kids to lead young teams to wins is a flawed argument.

Of course Curry is a much better shooter than Lavine. I didn't say Lavine's a historically great shooter but he's still a very good shooter.

Durant made the playoffs in his 3rd season winning 50 regular season games. Will the Wolves even win 30 games this season? I also don't think Wiggins will ever come close to being Durant.

That was his second full season with Westbrook and the year they brought in rookies Harden / Ibaka + grabbing quality vets Sefalosha and Krstic.

This is still the second year of Wiggins / KAT. Dunn isn't the rookie Harden was and they didn't attack free agency for stabilizing vets.

People need to stop saying that just because Team X completed their rebuild in year Y then so should all other teams. It isn't that simple.

[Dennis Reynolds]

Again, are you watching the games or looking up box scores? Curry drops 3s with two guys charging at him. Lavine is WIDE open for the majority of his shots because he isn't "the guy". He is the outlet option ala JR Smith.

How good was Seattle / OKC in the early KD days?

How good is New Orleans with Anthony Davis now?

We live in a super TEAM league. Expecting 21 year old kids to lead young teams to wins is a flawed argument.

Of course Curry is a much better shooter than Lavine. I didn't say Lavine's a historically great shooter but he's still a very good shooter.

Durant made the playoffs in his 3rd season winning 50 regular season games. Will the Wolves even win 30 games this season? I also don't think Wiggins will ever come close to being Durant.

That was his second full season with Westbrook and the year they brought in rookies Harden / Ibaka + grabbing quality vets Sefalosha and Krstic.

This is still the second year of Wiggins / KAT. Dunn isn't the rookie Harden was and they didn't attack free agency for stabilizing vets.

People need to stop saying that just because Team X completed their rebuild in year Y then so should all other teams. It isn't that simple.

You're the one who brought up OKC. I have no problem with the Wolves not making playoffs but they are God awful. They actually had a better win% last season If I'm not mistaken. I still like their potential very much and think they'll improve but I see nothing wrong in saying Wiggins will never become as good as Durant.

[Dennis Reynolds]

Again you are wrong and your second sentence just tells me you don't really understand what you are arguing about.

Oladipo is better at attacking the rim and finishing than Evan? He has better vision? He can draw fouls and make Fts consistently? Since when? Oh wait, since never because those are all things he can't do better. And while he was pretty good at staying in front of his man, he sucks at fighting through screens and doesn't have the size that Evan has there.

Again, just really poorly thought out arguments here. BTW, Oladipo's FT % this year is only 63%.

Other than scoring. Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier other than scoring.

Fournier's size is meaningless. He's a poor defender who always gets destroyed on a mismatch. Every time a bigger guy posts him up he looks like pure trash out there. It's tough to find players who aren't too strong or too quick for him to guard.

Other than scoring? That's a vital part of playing SG. You do know that much right?

I'll humor you - Evan averages over 1 APG more than Oladipo. So again you are wrong.

Every time Evan is in a mismatch he is bad on defense. Ok? Thats your argument now? LOL, you really just need to stop, you have no clue what you are even saying anymore.

There's a reason Dipo has much better advanced stats than Fournier. Better RPM, on/off, net rating, etc. His style of play leads to winning. At least more than Fournier's. Dipo has also shown he can make open 3s at a respectable clip so I disagree Fournier is a better fit.

That's why I mentioned the Wolves. Their main players are scorers who don't do anything else just like Fournier and that's why they suck. They're actually better scorers than Fournier but they still can't win. Luckily for them they have plenty of room for improvement unlike Fournier.

You keep saying we'll get an all star SF and I think it's an awful idea to have him carry our offense and guard the best opposing wing but that's what he would have to do since Fournier has plenty of troubles guarding average players.

[PennytoShaq]

Other than scoring. Oladipo does everything else better than Fournier other than scoring.

Fournier's size is meaningless. He's a poor defender who always gets destroyed on a mismatch. Every time a bigger guy posts him up he looks like pure trash out there. It's tough to find players who aren't too strong or too quick for him to guard.

Other than scoring? That's a vital part of playing SG. You do know that much right?

I'll humor you - Evan averages over 1 APG more than Oladipo. So again you are wrong.

Every time Evan is in a mismatch he is bad on defense. Ok? Thats your argument now? LOL, you really just need to stop, you have no clue what you are even saying anymore.

There's a reason Dipo has much better advanced stats than Fournier. Better RPM, on/off, net rating, etc. His style of play leads to winning. At least more than Fournier's. Dipo has also shown he can make open 3s at a respectable clip so I disagree Fournier is a better fit.

That's why I mentioned the Wolves. Their main players are scorers who don't do anything else just like Fournier and that's why they suck. They're actually better scorers than Fournier but they still can't win. Luckily for them they have plenty of room for improvement unlike Fournier.

You keep saying we'll get an all star SF and I think it's an awful idea to have him carry our offense and guard the best opposing wing but that's what he would have to do since Fournier has plenty of troubles guarding average players.

Ok so now you are moving the goalposts again. Before Oladipo was better than Evan at everything "besides shooting". I debunked that.

So now we are at the last chasm of hope - the good ol plus minus net rating. Man, those are fun. Never mind that Fournier played out of position last year and guarded guys a lot bigger than him most of the year and that this year Oladipo plays with an absolute god who carries OKC on his back (they are terrible without him - stunner).

Also I never said we would just get an All-star SF and he wold guard the best opposing wing. Never said that. Your arguments are so poorly constructed sometimes. I suggested Gallinari to crossmatch and guard PFs (since you know, most are his size now) and let Gordon guard the best wing. At this point you are just pulling stuff out of thin air just to try and make a counterargument.

[Dennis Reynolds]

Other than scoring? That's a vital part of playing SG. You do know that much right?

I'll humor you - Evan averages over 1 APG more than Oladipo. So again you are wrong.

Every time Evan is in a mismatch he is bad on defense. Ok? Thats your argument now? LOL, you really just need to stop, you have no clue what you are even saying anymore.

There's a reason Dipo has much better advanced stats than Fournier. Better RPM, on/off, net rating, etc. His style of play leads to winning. At least more than Fournier's. Dipo has also shown he can make open 3s at a respectable clip so I disagree Fournier is a better fit.

That's why I mentioned the Wolves. Their main players are scorers who don't do anything else just like Fournier and that's why they suck. They're actually better scorers than Fournier but they still can't win. Luckily for them they have plenty of room for improvement unlike Fournier.

You keep saying we'll get an all star SF and I think it's an awful idea to have him carry our offense and guard the best opposing wing but that's what he would have to do since Fournier has plenty of troubles guarding average players.

Ok so now you are moving the goalposts again. Before Oladipo was better than Evan at everything "besides shooting". I debunked that.

So now we are at the last chasm of hope - the good ol plus minus net rating. Man, those are fun. Never mind that Fournier played out of position last year and guarded guys a lot bigger than him most of the year and that this year Oladipo plays with an absolute god who carries OKC on his back (they are terrible without him - stunner).

Also I never said we would just get an All-star SF and he wold guard the best opposing wing. Never said that. Your arguments are so poorly constructed sometimes. I suggested Gallinari to crossmatch and guard PFs (since you know, most are his size now) and let Gordon guard the best wing. At this point you are just pulling stuff out of thin air just to try and make a counterargument.

I meant to say scoring but said shooting. Big difference.

Fournier can't guard anyone as a full time 2 as well. He's simply a bad defender.

Gallinari most certainly isn's an all star SF. Having him as your number 1 option isn't much better than having Fournier. We need real difference makes. Not to mention we won't have any cap space if we sing both Gallinari and Ibaka. Ibaka also won't play full time which means Gordon wont't play much so your idea isn't any good.

[PennytoShaq]

There's a reason Dipo has much better advanced stats than Fournier. Better RPM, on/off, net rating, etc. His style of play leads to winning. At least more than Fournier's. Dipo has also shown he can make open 3s at a respectable clip so I disagree Fournier is a better fit.

That's why I mentioned the Wolves. Their main players are scorers who don't do anything else just like Fournier and that's why they suck. They're actually better scorers than Fournier but they still can't win. Luckily for them they have plenty of room for improvement unlike Fournier.

You keep saying we'll get an all star SF and I think it's an awful idea to have him carry our offense and guard the best opposing wing but that's what he would have to do since Fournier has plenty of troubles guarding average players.

Ok so now you are moving the goalposts again. Before Oladipo was better than Evan at everything "besides shooting". I debunked that.

So now we are at the last chasm of hope - the good ol plus minus net rating. Man, those are fun. Never mind that Fournier played out of position last year and guarded guys a lot bigger than him most of the year and that this year Oladipo plays with an absolute god who carries OKC on his back (they are terrible without him - stunner).

Also I never said we would just get an All-star SF and he wold guard the best opposing wing. Never said that. Your arguments are so poorly constructed sometimes. I suggested Gallinari to crossmatch and guard PFs (since you know, most are his size now) and let Gordon guard the best wing. At this point you are just pulling stuff out of thin air just to try and make a counterargument.

I meant to say scoring but said shooting. Big difference.

Fournier can't guard anyone as a full time 2 as well. He's simply a bad defender.

Gallinari most certainly isn's an all star SF. Having him as your number 1 option isn't much better than having Fournier. We need real difference makes. Not to mention we won't have any cap space if we sing both Gallinari and Ibaka. Ibaka also won't play full time which means Gordon wont't play much so your idea isn't any good.

Ok so you meant to say shooting. Yet I already debunked that. Evan is better at Passing, finishing at the rim, drawing fouls and making FTs (which not all shooters are good at). Additionally while he is not a great defender, neither is Oladipo. As much as you underrate Evan and state that he's "simply a bad defender" (which Skiles and Vogel disagree with), we could easily say Oladipo is overrated there as well.

Additionally you constantly complain and have zero real suggestions for improving the team. Yes with Gallo here we would not have cap space. But if it works for us, who cares?

Let me know where our superstar is coming from. Id like to hear this one. A high draft pick is no guarantee for anyone anymore. You cant bring that up and then in the next post complain about Minnesota being bad. I know you must be smarter than that, right?

[woosah]

i know we don't have much to be positive about but did the title of the thread change or....???????

[The Other Ankle]

I'm positive there's no game thread up for tonight's tilt...

[woosah]

I'm positive there's no game thread up for tonight's tilt...

make one. you could be the good luck charm that brings a win.

[pepe1991]

Yes, because all that matters in basketball is offense right? Everyone called out your terrible posts on Fournier so now you jump into an argument on here to troll as well?

It's obvious who actually has played basketball before.

You said none of the guys pepe listed are far more advanced than Gordon. If that's not nonsense nothing is. Embiid and Giannis definitely are. Giannis is an absolute beast. When it comes to other guys I specifically said they're much more advanced when it comes to offense. Don't know how you can even argue that.

And nothing I said about Fournier is wrong. He's a bad defender and most definitely not a difference maker. Making him a number 1 option and trying to make the playoffs that way is a damn joke.

I edited my post - but I don't think Giannis or Embiid are far more advanced yet. Advanced indicates experience to me. Embiid still does tons of dumb stuff. My opinion on Giannis is above. I think both players are complete studs, but AG is showing signs of rapid development that your buddy Pepe casts aside to force his negative opinion in on every thread. You piggy backed on his argument and downgraded it to offense only. That was not that argument that you hitched your wagon to, so don't try and move the goalposts.

Many things you have said about Fournier are simply wrong, and have been identified as such by multiple posters. You assume that the Magic are making him the #1 option for long term, which is also wrong. Evan Fournier is going to be a great SG for us once we balance out our roster. I am amazed that people really think that the Magic intend to roll with Vuc/Biz/Ibaka and Zimmerman long term.

Embiid PER 36: 27,7 PPG, 11 rpg, 3,4 bpg ,2,8 apg. 57,7% TS. Once when he can play over 25 min he will be MVP candidate. Only somebody who never watched him play can say he is not couple of light years ahead of Gordon.

[bargnanimvp]

We might win a game tonight!