What to do with Brogdon and Williams

[Blazers20]

What does Cronin do with Brogdon and Williams now? What kind of a hit did the trade value take for each player? Does Cronin keep Williams and hopes he makes a full recovery? Is Williams still part of the future rebuild? Seems like Cronin and Schmitz new the risk and decided to roll the dice instead of cash in on both players and trade for more assets.

[m0ng0]

I say trade Brogdan, Williams we're kinda stuck with... Too bad but he just can't stay healthy

[DaVoiceMaster]

William's is going nowhere until he recovers. Even then, I doubt they get much for him. Brogdon may not bring much of a return. I imagine a contender may be interested in him.

[JRoy]

Move Brogdon for value if that is out there. If not, keep him as vet mentor and try to move him again in the off-season or next year.

[Blazers20]

Curious what could teams have offered for Brogdon and Williams before the season started? Who was interested in the pair?

[JasonStern]

Both are solid role players that, when healthy, seem to be embracing the fact that they are solid role players on a rebuilding team. Both are massive DNP-Injured risks as we've seen. I doubt the return on either player is going to be what most Blazers fans are expecting.

Timelord is young enough to keep. Could evolve into a poor man's Buck Williams. Or be out of the league due to injuries. But that's better than getting 1-2 second round picks. He's proven to be a solid role player when healthy. And given his injury history, I don't view him as a flight risk. Just a depreciating asset that we should appreciate when he is healthy.

Brogdon might net a late 1st in an Afflalo style trade. But he has to be healthy, which he hasn't been. And you need a team willing to trade a late 1st for a player owed $22.5M that misses 20-30 games a season, and is over 30. So, slim market there. But if the opportunity presents itself, sure.

[Pattycakes]

Brogdon is def worth a 1st rounder and we’ll get that. He’s trying to help us not suck but the team doesn’t have the backbone behind him in those moments to maximize it and he’s suddenly painted as a black hole. Regardless, the nba and it’s management mostly know what they’re
Doing, we’ll get good value.

[DusterBuster]

I would trade Brogdon to whatever team offers the best first rounder asap.

Blazers are probably stuck with Williams' contract for the long-haul. Maybe they can get some sort of medical retirement out of him? The fact the dude's knees couldn't even handle 2 weeks of basketball anymore is a pretty telling sign. At least he's not a huge contract.

[DusterBuster]

Timelord is young enough to keep. Could evolve into a poor man's Buck Williams. Or be out of the league due to injuries.

My money is on the latter unfortunately.

[Norm2953]

Even Zach Collins after 3 injury filled seasons has managed to finally stay on the court.

Portland has got nothing to lose for TL can play if he can get onto the court. With all the
injuries, Skyler has had a chance to play and likely is ready to be the fourth guard in
Portland behind Simons, Sharpe and Scoot. Hopefully Portland will be able to get
FRP for Brogdon, assuming he can get back onto the court and put up some numbers to
get the attention of a contender.

[The Sebastian Express]

Zach's injuries were shoulder related for the most part.

Which isn't in the same league as chronic knee injuries.

But!

I'm glad the Blazers did the season-ending surgery for Rob rather than a quick heal. He's had the quick heal before and been brought back to soon. Let the young man take his time, not get rushed back, and where he is next year.

[Wizenheimer]

yeah, comparing Zach's injuries to Timelord's chronic knee problems is not equivalent. I think there's a much better chance that Timelord follows the Brandon Roy track than the Ilguaskas track. Blazers are probably stuck with him and just have to hope for the best

Brogdon? I doubt the Blazers get much for him if they do trade. He's a solid player with good versatility, and he has two-way talent. But he doesn't have enough talent to significantly alter a playoff team's trajectory. I think the Blazers are deep in lottery purgatory for the next few seasons and Brogdon doesn't fit that type of team. I've also never placed a real high value on "mentoring"; not unless the player is an extraordinary leader....like Dame. If somebody like Scoot needs mentoring when the coach is Chauncey Billups, then there's an issue with Billups. And, Brogdon has a pretty extensive injury history himself

I think the reality is that Portland didn't do as well as many were saying when they traded Dame, Nurkic, Nassir and Keon for Ayton, Brogdon, Timelord, Camara, this year's Warriors pick plus a couple of picks 5-6 years from now. Ayton is a solid but overpaid C. Camara might become a starter around Aminu's level. Brogdon and Timelord seem pretty incidental at this point

[JasonStern]

yeah, comparing Zach's injuries to Timelord's chronic knee problems is not equivalent. I think there's a much better chance that Timelord follows the Brandon Roy track than the Ilguaskas track. Blazers are probably stuck with him and just have to hope for the best

Brogdon? I doubt the Blazers get much for him if they do trade. He's a solid player with good versatility, and he has two-way talent. But he doesn't have enough talent to significantly alter a playoff team's trajectory. I think the Blazers are deep in lottery purgatory for the next few seasons and Brogdon doesn't fit that type of team. I've also never placed a real high value on "mentoring"; not unless the player is an extraordinary leader....like Dame. If somebody like Scoot needs mentoring when the coach is Chauncey Billups, then there's an issue with Billups. And, Brogdon has a pretty extensive injury history himself

I think the reality is that Portland didn't do as well as many were saying when they traded Dame, Nurkic, Nassir and Keon for Ayton, Brogdon, Timelord, Camara, this year's Warriors pick plus a couple of picks 5-6 years from now. Ayton is a solid but overpaid C. Camara might become a starter around Aminu's level. Brogdon and Timelord seem pretty incidental at this point

Glass half full guy. Until I drink it. Then just glass guy.

The Blazers did way better than expected given a GM in over his head being forced to trade a top 75 player.

Picks value is TBD. Player value is TBD.

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick, Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft", Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft", Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

[monopoman]

yeah, comparing Zach's injuries to Timelord's chronic knee problems is not equivalent. I think there's a much better chance that Timelord follows the Brandon Roy track than the Ilguaskas track. Blazers are probably stuck with him and just have to hope for the best

Brogdon? I doubt the Blazers get much for him if they do trade. He's a solid player with good versatility, and he has two-way talent. But he doesn't have enough talent to significantly alter a playoff team's trajectory. I think the Blazers are deep in lottery purgatory for the next few seasons and Brogdon doesn't fit that type of team. I've also never placed a real high value on "mentoring"; not unless the player is an extraordinary leader....like Dame. If somebody like Scoot needs mentoring when the coach is Chauncey Billups, then there's an issue with Billups. And, Brogdon has a pretty extensive injury history himself

I think the reality is that Portland didn't do as well as many were saying when they traded Dame, Nurkic, Nassir and Keon for Ayton, Brogdon, Timelord, Camara, this year's Warriors pick plus a couple of picks 5-6 years from now. Ayton is a solid but overpaid C. Camara might become a starter around Aminu's level. Brogdon and Timelord seem pretty incidental at this point

Glass half full guy. Until I drink it. Then just glass guy.

The Blazers did way better than expected given a GM in over his head being forced to trade a top 75 player.

Picks value is TBD. Player value is TBD.

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick, Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft", Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft", Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

The pieces we already have on this rebuild are pretty damn big, sure we might not have a true top 5 guy in the NBA in his future prime, but very few teams have a superstar get traded away or leave, and have this many good pieces left behind.

Scoot and Sharpe both have an extremely high level of potential, but we will see if either one gets there as always when you have a young team you never know how good any player is going to end up.

[Wizenheimer]

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick,

so was Andrea Bargnani

Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft",

like Kwame Brown

Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft",

Anthont Bennett?

Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

ok...I'm not as impressed so far as you are though. Besides, Ayton was the only asset you mentioned that came from the Dame trade and we're already seeing some of the flaws Ayton has

The pieces we already have on this rebuild are pretty damn big, sure we might not have a true top 5 guy in the NBA in his future prime, but very few teams have a superstar get traded away or leave, and have this many good pieces left behind.

well, so far, all those good pieces have achieved the 3rd worst record in the NBA with the 2nd worst net rating

Obviously, it's way early and this season isn't about wins. But right now I see several straight years of the lottery ahead of this team

and I was talking about the return from the Dame trade more than anything else. Ayton is a C who probably won't reach all-star level in an era when C's are the least important position unless you have an MVP there. Robert Williams is already out for the season with a completely predictable injury. Camara is a solid defender but may also be a terrible shooter. And Brogdon looks like trade bait because he doesn't fit the timeline. And yeah, 3 first's, but one will likely be mid first round in a weak draft in 8 months, and the other two are 5 and 6 years away

don't et me wrong, it's probably about as good as the Blazers could have done. But it's not a great return like some were saying

[monopoman]

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick,

so was Andrea Bargnani

Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft",

like Kwame Brown

Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft",

Anthont Bennett?

Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

ok...I'm not as impressed so far as you are though. Besides, Ayton was the only asset you mentioned that came from the Dame trade and we're already seeing some of the flaws Ayton has

The pieces we already have on this rebuild are pretty damn big, sure we might not have a true top 5 guy in the NBA in his future prime, but very few teams have a superstar get traded away or leave, and have this many good pieces left behind.

well, so far, all those good pieces have achieved the 3rd worst record in the NBA with the 2nd worst net rating

Obviously, it's way early and this season isn't about wins. But right now I see several straight years of the lottery ahead of this team

and I was talking about the return from the Dame trade more than anything else. Ayton is a C who probably won't reach all-star level in an era when C's are the least important position unless you have an MVP there. Robert Williams is already out for the season with a completely predictable injury. Camara is a solid defender but may also be a terrible shooter. And Brogdon looks like trade bait because he doesn't fit the timeline. And yeah, 3 first's, but one will likely be mid first round in a weak draft in 8 months, and the other two are 5 and 6 years away

don't et me wrong, it's probably about as good as the Blazers could have done. But it's not a great return like some were saying

I was speaking more of the roster in general, looking at our best prospects obviously those were not a result of the Dame trade but it's extremely rare to get a top tier player for your leaving all-star. The last one I can recall was Kevin Love swap for Andrew Wiggins swap nearly straight up, it looks like they didn't get much these days but back then Wiggins had a lot of hype.

The only way this Dame trade will look better is if we find some gem with one of the draft picks we got, otherwise it will be a bunch of salary relief, which doesn't mean much to us typically, a good starter or bench player or two, and random picks.

It's also pretty ridiculous to expect Sharpe and Scoot to lead to wins early on you have Sharpe in his second season but his first with a more dominant role and Scoot in his first season ever. These two might be extremely good at some point but it's not today, **** it's even better if they take a few years to figure it out lets us acquire more talent around them. The last thing we want is a team like the CJ+Lillard one that was far too good to get a nice draft pick, but nowhere near good enough to get by the true best teams.

The Blazers desperately need some good wings with size and/or a C that might be the true C of the future.

[Wizenheimer]

Spoiler:

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick,

so was Andrea Bargnani

Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft",

like Kwame Brown

Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft",

Anthont Bennett?

Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

ok...I'm not as impressed so far as you are though. Besides, Ayton was the only asset you mentioned that came from the Dame trade and we're already seeing some of the flaws Ayton has

The pieces we already have on this rebuild are pretty damn big, sure we might not have a true top 5 guy in the NBA in his future prime, but very few teams have a superstar get traded away or leave, and have this many good pieces left behind.

well, so far, all those good pieces have achieved the 3rd worst record in the NBA with the 2nd worst net rating

Obviously, it's way early and this season isn't about wins. But right now I see several straight years of the lottery ahead of this team

and I was talking about the return from the Dame trade more than anything else. Ayton is a C who probably won't reach all-star level in an era when C's are the least important position unless you have an MVP there. Robert Williams is already out for the season with a completely predictable injury. Camara is a solid defender but may also be a terrible shooter. And Brogdon looks like trade bait because he doesn't fit the timeline. And yeah, 3 first's, but one will likely be mid first round in a weak draft in 8 months, and the other two are 5 and 6 years away

don't et me wrong, it's probably about as good as the Blazers could have done. But it's not a great return like some were saying

I was speaking more of the roster in general, looking at our best prospects obviously those were not a result of the Dame trade but it's extremely rare to get a top tier player for your leaving all-star. The last one I can recall was Kevin Love swap for Andrew Wiggins swap nearly straight up, it looks like they didn't get much these days but back then Wiggins had a lot of hype.

The only way this Dame trade will look better is if we find some gem with one of the draft picks we got, otherwise it will be a bunch of salary relief, which doesn't mean much to us typically, a good starter or bench player or two, and random picks.

It's also pretty ridiculous to expect Sharpe and Scoot to lead to wins early on you have Sharpe in his second season but his first with a more dominant role and Scoot in his first season ever. These two might be extremely good at some point but it's not today, **** it's even better if they take a few years to figure it out lets us acquire more talent around them. The last thing we want is a team like the CJ+Lillard one that was far too good to get a nice draft pick, but nowhere near good enough to get by the true best teams.

The Blazers desperately need some good wings with size and/or a C that might be the true C of the future.

salary relief doesn't mean as much since the rule changes in the new CBA. Teams get penalized if they don't have a payroll equal or above 90% of the cap

by the way, completely unrelated to what we are discussing, but sticking with rule changes: starting next season, teams can use the MLE as they normally have for signings....or they can use it like a TPE for trades. I think that's really going to change the thinking for a lot of teams in the off-season

[m0ng0]

Blow it up, trade Brogdon and Grant, we ain't going anywhere

[Sinobas]

Robert Williams: offer him up for anything. Picks/expirings.
Brogdon: May as well trade him since we're not winning now anyway. I wouldn't give him away though. I'd actually love it if we could use him to get Zach back from SA. SA could really use a guard.

[JasonStern]

But while I hate to use this cliché, Ayton was a #1 pick,

so was Andrea Bargnani

Sharpe could have been another #1 pick "in a weaker draft",

like Kwame Brown

Scoot could have been pick #1 "in a weaker draft",

Anthont Bennett?

Simons could have been a lotto pick "in a weaker draft", etc. This isn't a be bad for 5 years roster if the talent reaches even mediocre expectations.

ok...I'm not as impressed so far as you are though. Besides, Ayton was the only asset you mentioned that came from the Dame trade and we're already seeing some of the flaws Ayton has

Stop. There will be no Sharpe slander here.

Scoot may develop into Westbrook 2.0, but that's all speculation. This season, he's exposed. Question now is how does he respond?

Ayton is probably Whiteside 2.0. Which does beg the question - why pay 40x what it would cost to bring Whiteside back for Whiteside 2.0?

But until I get banned, I'll keep posting it. Sharpe's floor is Darius Miles and his ceiling is Vince Carter. I'd much rather watch him play than Grant going 6-22 but still managing to score 18 points despite 3 rebounds, so the team feels obligated to give him minutes.

And if I'm wrong. Big if. That's pretty much what always happens. My dad used to have some "bet you dollars to donuts" saying, which makes no sense now because inflation has donuts costing more than a dollar. But Sharpe is legit. So, he'll look amazing and end up having some knee or leg injury. Because Blazers. And if that doesn't happen, I will buy you a donut.

Honestly, if you really want a donut, I'll buy you a donut now. Just keep the receipt just-in-case someone questions the purchase and ownership of said donut. Paper trail. IRS won't have anything on you if they trace your purchase of a donut. And if said receipt is not enough, then I guess we are off to Mexico.