I'm intrigued by all the big men in this draft (power forwards and centers).
Out of the players I've listed, who will be the three most successful (short-term and long-term) in this draft and why? This is in terms of talent rather than team-fit.
Cliff Alexander
Rakeem Christmas
Montrezl Harrell
Kevon Looney
Bobby Portis
Trey Lyles
Jonathan Holms
Jordan Mickey
Jarell Martin
Vince Hunter
Aaron White
Best of these bigs?
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Best of these bigs?
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doordoor123
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Re: Best of these bigs?
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No-Man
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Re: Best of these bigs?
I rank them likes this,
Bobby Portis
Cliff Alexander
Jordan Mickey
Trey Lyles
Kevon Looney
Montrezl Harrell
Jarell Martin
Jonathan Holmes
Rakeem Christmas
Aaron White
Vince Hunter
A clear top3, I have Alexander in terms of potential a bit ahead of Mickey, but Jordan will be a really solid big, Taj Gibson-esque.
Lyles and Looney are both projects with higher ceilings than Harrell and Martin, but if they dont improve they might be worse than the other two.
Same thing with Holmes and Christmas, I like Holmes quite a lot.
White and Hunter are borderline draftable at this point.
Bobby Portis
Cliff Alexander
Jordan Mickey
Trey Lyles
Kevon Looney
Montrezl Harrell
Jarell Martin
Jonathan Holmes
Rakeem Christmas
Aaron White
Vince Hunter
A clear top3, I have Alexander in terms of potential a bit ahead of Mickey, but Jordan will be a really solid big, Taj Gibson-esque.
Lyles and Looney are both projects with higher ceilings than Harrell and Martin, but if they dont improve they might be worse than the other two.
Same thing with Holmes and Christmas, I like Holmes quite a lot.
White and Hunter are borderline draftable at this point.
Re: Best of these bigs?
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kennydorglas
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Re: Best of these bigs?
Portis (highest floor)
Cliff (highest upside)
Looney (high upside)
Mickey (high floor)
Lyles (average potential - could be high if he adds a reliable 3pt)
Harrell (average floor - high motor guy on the bench)
Christmas (average floor - defensive big on the bench)
Martin/Holmes - meh
White - high IQ player, has potential to be a stretch 4 (I think he has a chance to stick in this league)
Hunter - really good rebounder, but has a really bad size to be a 4.
Cliff (highest upside)
Looney (high upside)
Mickey (high floor)
Lyles (average potential - could be high if he adds a reliable 3pt)
Harrell (average floor - high motor guy on the bench)
Christmas (average floor - defensive big on the bench)
Martin/Holmes - meh
White - high IQ player, has potential to be a stretch 4 (I think he has a chance to stick in this league)
Hunter - really good rebounder, but has a really bad size to be a 4.
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Five foot Eighton
“No matter what you do or how you do it, as long as you have true passion you will succeed.”
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Re: Best of these bigs?
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LloydFree
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Re: Best of these bigs?
doordoor123 wrote:I'm intrigued by all the big men in this draft (power forwards and centers).
Out of the players I've listed, who will be the three most successful (short-term and long-term) in this draft and why? This is in terms of talent rather than team-fit.
Cliff Alexander
Rakeem Christmas
Montrezl Harrell
Kevon Looney
Bobby Portis
Trey Lyles
Jonathan Holms
Jordan Mickey
Jarell Martin
Vince Hunter
Aaron White
I don't count Looney as a big man, as I believe he will play SF in the league as a Joe Smith type. I also don't count Jarrell Martin as a big, I think he will be a Jared Dudley type swing forward.
For the others I'd rank them:
1. Lyles (Highest floor)
2. Alexander (highest ceiling)
3. Harrell
4. Mickey
5. Portis (Drew Gooden type career)
6. Vince Hunter
Fischella wrote:I think none of you guys that are pro-Embiid no how basketball works today.. is way easier to win it all with Omer Asik than Olajuwon.
Actually if you ask me which Center I want for my perfect championship caliber team, I will chose Asik hands down
Re: Best of these bigs?
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Webbdog
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Re: Best of these bigs?
Lyles
Looney
Mickey
Looney
Mickey
Re: Best of these bigs?
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King Ken
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Re: Best of these bigs?
Portis
Looney
Christmas
Looney
Christmas
Re: Best of these bigs?
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sweetcity
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Re: Best of these bigs?
Fischella wrote:I rank them likes this,
Bobby Portis
Cliff Alexander
Jordan Mickey
Trey Lyles
Kevon Looney
Montrezl Harrell
Jarell Martin
Jonathan Holmes
Rakeem Christmas
Aaron White
Vince Hunter
A clear top3, I have Alexander in terms of potential a bit ahead of Mickey, but Jordan will be a really solid big, Taj Gibson-esque.
Lyles and Looney are both projects with higher ceilings than Harrell and Martin, but if they dont improve they might be worse than the other two.
Same thing with Holmes and Christmas, I like Holmes quite a lot.
White and Hunter are borderline draftable at this point.
Who do you think Cliff Alexander projects like?
Re: Best of these bigs?
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Notanoob
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Re: Best of these bigs?
Putting them in tiers like everyone else:
Bobby Portis
Jordan Mickey
Two guys who I think should pan out. Portis is a solid 3rd big who can contribute offensively with his jump shot, can rebound on both ends, and won't get torched on defense. He doesn't have a particularly high ceiling, but he's as close to a sure thing as there is.
Mickey is a bit less likely to pan out due to his offensive game. He's strictly a power forward, but his overall offensive game needs polish. It looks like he's getting a working mid-range jump shot, but that's about it. Doesn't finisher, draw fouls, or really create his own looks at all. However, he's an excellent defender. He knows what he's doing, puts in very good effort and blocks shots very well for a guy his size. Very quick on both ends, and good explosiveness. His mobility will let him guard PnRs and mobile stretch 4s well in the NBA, and he's a natural at protecting the rim. If his jump shot stays true in the NBA, he should get work.
Kevon Looney
Trey Lyles
A pair of guys who seem to have good potential but are hard to project. Looney is a smart kid with a very nice body who hits the glass well, and that combination of traits should lead to him contributing somewhere at the next level, but he did so little scoring and played a strange defense, so you can't really say what he can do on either end just yet. Lyles has a nice offensive game, but had a bad rep on defense in high school and had no opportunity to improve it by playing SF at UK. Nice length but not a good athlete.
Aaron White
Rakeem Christmas
Cliff Alexander
Vince Hunter
White is a complete offensive player. When he faces up, he gets all the way to the rim, finishes very well, and draws fouls absurdly well. He's finally extended his jump shot to beyond the ark, and he's one of the best-passing PFs in this draft. Problem is that he has terrible length and is skinny, so despite being a game defender, he's going to seriously suck on defense and isn't a good rebounder. His offensive game might be good enough to get him some floor time though.
I really am not a fan of Syracuse prospects at all, as a general rule, but Christmas played well enough at the combine cut him some slack. He's small for a center but has a freakish wingspan. If he really can score like he did in the 5 on 5, then you could put him at PF though, where his size (mostly length) would be an asset. He has good mobility, finishes well, can post up and might have a legit jump shot. He draws fouls really well. Defensively his length means he should be able to play, but he's weak and didn't put forth fantastic effort. Also, he's really old, so you have to wonder how much developing he can still do. I'm not a fan at all, but he has a chance at panning out.
Alexander is really not that great. He's the same size and length as Mickey, but doesn't sport nearly the same defensive awareness, and it shows in his inferior blocks per40 pace adjusted and abysmal steal rate. While Mickey can hit a jump shot, Alexander has no offensive game outside of being fed easy looks inside. Where it not for his great strength and rebounding, I'd consider him a sure bust, but as is, you can hope he develops a better feel for defense while he attacks the glass on both ends.
Vince Hunter is an undersized PF, but he's extremely energetic. Rebounding machine, high motor, finishes well. He's really quick, competes very hard on defense. He's unlikely to make it, but sheer energy and determination could get him into someone's rotation as an energy guy.
Jonathan Holmes
Jarell Martin
Montrezl Harrell
Pretty sure all of these guys bust. Holmes can't really shoot that well, finish that well, draw fouls that well, or pass that well, but he's undersized for a PF and doesn't bring it on defense. No room in the NBA for a guy without a calling card on offense who is going to be a liability on defense.
Martin at least can score, with a real nice face-up game and quickness, but his terrible length means he's sure to be a sieve in the NBA (plus he doesn't look like he really knows what he's doing on defense), and his offense just isn't spectacular enough to put up with his defense and poor rebounding.
Harrell is just stuck being too small. Even with his freak wingspan, he's undersized. His shot-blocking isn't up to par with other small guys, just 1.3 per40 pace adjusted, and that's supposed to be his calling card. His offensive game is basically dunking- his jump shot is not a real weapon. His rebounding isn't that great either. He isn't going to just get fed looks at the rim all day in the NBA, and he isn't going to be an impact defender, so he has no NBA role.
Bobby Portis
Jordan Mickey
Two guys who I think should pan out. Portis is a solid 3rd big who can contribute offensively with his jump shot, can rebound on both ends, and won't get torched on defense. He doesn't have a particularly high ceiling, but he's as close to a sure thing as there is.
Mickey is a bit less likely to pan out due to his offensive game. He's strictly a power forward, but his overall offensive game needs polish. It looks like he's getting a working mid-range jump shot, but that's about it. Doesn't finisher, draw fouls, or really create his own looks at all. However, he's an excellent defender. He knows what he's doing, puts in very good effort and blocks shots very well for a guy his size. Very quick on both ends, and good explosiveness. His mobility will let him guard PnRs and mobile stretch 4s well in the NBA, and he's a natural at protecting the rim. If his jump shot stays true in the NBA, he should get work.
Kevon Looney
Trey Lyles
A pair of guys who seem to have good potential but are hard to project. Looney is a smart kid with a very nice body who hits the glass well, and that combination of traits should lead to him contributing somewhere at the next level, but he did so little scoring and played a strange defense, so you can't really say what he can do on either end just yet. Lyles has a nice offensive game, but had a bad rep on defense in high school and had no opportunity to improve it by playing SF at UK. Nice length but not a good athlete.
Aaron White
Rakeem Christmas
Cliff Alexander
Vince Hunter
White is a complete offensive player. When he faces up, he gets all the way to the rim, finishes very well, and draws fouls absurdly well. He's finally extended his jump shot to beyond the ark, and he's one of the best-passing PFs in this draft. Problem is that he has terrible length and is skinny, so despite being a game defender, he's going to seriously suck on defense and isn't a good rebounder. His offensive game might be good enough to get him some floor time though.
I really am not a fan of Syracuse prospects at all, as a general rule, but Christmas played well enough at the combine cut him some slack. He's small for a center but has a freakish wingspan. If he really can score like he did in the 5 on 5, then you could put him at PF though, where his size (mostly length) would be an asset. He has good mobility, finishes well, can post up and might have a legit jump shot. He draws fouls really well. Defensively his length means he should be able to play, but he's weak and didn't put forth fantastic effort. Also, he's really old, so you have to wonder how much developing he can still do. I'm not a fan at all, but he has a chance at panning out.
Alexander is really not that great. He's the same size and length as Mickey, but doesn't sport nearly the same defensive awareness, and it shows in his inferior blocks per40 pace adjusted and abysmal steal rate. While Mickey can hit a jump shot, Alexander has no offensive game outside of being fed easy looks inside. Where it not for his great strength and rebounding, I'd consider him a sure bust, but as is, you can hope he develops a better feel for defense while he attacks the glass on both ends.
Vince Hunter is an undersized PF, but he's extremely energetic. Rebounding machine, high motor, finishes well. He's really quick, competes very hard on defense. He's unlikely to make it, but sheer energy and determination could get him into someone's rotation as an energy guy.
Jonathan Holmes
Jarell Martin
Montrezl Harrell
Pretty sure all of these guys bust. Holmes can't really shoot that well, finish that well, draw fouls that well, or pass that well, but he's undersized for a PF and doesn't bring it on defense. No room in the NBA for a guy without a calling card on offense who is going to be a liability on defense.
Martin at least can score, with a real nice face-up game and quickness, but his terrible length means he's sure to be a sieve in the NBA (plus he doesn't look like he really knows what he's doing on defense), and his offense just isn't spectacular enough to put up with his defense and poor rebounding.
Harrell is just stuck being too small. Even with his freak wingspan, he's undersized. His shot-blocking isn't up to par with other small guys, just 1.3 per40 pace adjusted, and that's supposed to be his calling card. His offensive game is basically dunking- his jump shot is not a real weapon. His rebounding isn't that great either. He isn't going to just get fed looks at the rim all day in the NBA, and he isn't going to be an impact defender, so he has no NBA role.