Cooper Flagg - HS

[SNPA]

He looks bigger.

Kid is an absolute stud. Franchise changer.

[SeattleJazzFan]

.....

whn?

[scrabbarista]

I can't believe how good this kid is. He and Wemby are going to be the faces of the league for 15 years. I have no doubt he'll be a top 10 player almost immediately and should be an MVP candidate yearly once he's fully developed. The NBA is without a doubt going to steer him to a big market team with draft night shenanigans

Like they did with Wembanyama? Or Zion? Or LeBron? Or Duncan? Or Shaq? Or Kareem? Sorry, but at some point everyone should understand that conspiracy theories like this one do not hold up to any scrutiny and that it's just nonsense.

yes, exactly like those

Kareem went to an expansion team which was great for business and everyone knew he wasn't long for Milwaukee and this was before the lottery so it's moot. Duncan went to the Spurs because the league punished the Celtics for shamelessly tanking. Cleveland had the highest odds and it was Lebron's hometown, the story was too good. Wembanyama went to an organization that he had ties with (former teammates, french mentors). Shaq went to the team with the best odds but similarly to Kareem, he was never going there long-term and the league didn't want to reward the shamelessly tanking Timberwolves. The NBA gifted the Magic the #1 pick the following year as well to maximize Shaq's brief stay there. Pelicans just lost AD and needed a star so they got Zion. But like Shaq and Kareem before him, he won't be long for New Orleans.

Like Wembanyama, Yao (8.9% chance) and Rose (1.7% chance) also both went to fanbases/organizations that were tailor-made for them. I'm not saying it is or isn't rigged. And "it's rigged" doesn't have to mean it's rigged every year. I'm just saying you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences."

[DOT]

Like they did with Wembanyama? Or Zion? Or LeBron? Or Duncan? Or Shaq? Or Kareem? Sorry, but at some point everyone should understand that conspiracy theories like this one do not hold up to any scrutiny and that it's just nonsense.

yes, exactly like those

Kareem went to an expansion team which was great for business and everyone knew he wasn't long for Milwaukee and this was before the lottery so it's moot. Duncan went to the Spurs because the league punished the Celtics for shamelessly tanking. Cleveland had the highest odds and it was Lebron's hometown, the story was too good. Wembanyama went to an organization that he had ties with (former teammates, french mentors). Shaq went to the team with the best odds but similarly to Kareem, he was never going there long-term and the league didn't want to reward the shamelessly tanking Timberwolves. The NBA gifted the Magic the #1 pick the following year as well to maximize Shaq's brief stay there. Pelicans just lost AD and needed a star so they got Zion. But like Shaq and Kareem before him, he won't be long for New Orleans.

Like Wembanyama, Yao (8.9% chance) and Rose (1.7% chance) also both went to fanbases/organizations that were tailor-made for them. I'm not saying it is or isn't rigged. And "it's rigged" doesn't have to mean it's rigged every year. I'm just saying you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences."

That's because y'all aren't accounting for the coincidences that don't happen

How many times has that not happened, where a player has a team that'd be perfect for them and they don't end up there?

I don't know, because nobody tracks that.

[wemby]

Like Wembanyama, Yao (8.9% chance) and Rose (1.7% chance) also both went to fanbases/organizations that were tailor-made for them. I'm not saying it is or isn't rigged. And "it's rigged" doesn't have to mean it's rigged every year. I'm just saying you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences."

Ah, so it's only rigged when it fits your narrative, otherwise it's not. That's the definition of cherry picking, good job making a claim that's unfalsifiable by definition.

[scrabbarista]

Like Wembanyama, Yao (8.9% chance) and Rose (1.7% chance) also both went to fanbases/organizations that were tailor-made for them. I'm not saying it is or isn't rigged. And "it's rigged" doesn't have to mean it's rigged every year. I'm just saying you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences."

Ah, so it's only rigged when it fits your narrative, otherwise it's not. That's the definition of cherry picking, good job making a claim that's unfalsifiable by definition.

A) I didn't make a claim.

B) Why couldn't the league rig it sometimes and have it be truly randomized at other times?

[wemby]

Like Wembanyama, Yao (8.9% chance) and Rose (1.7% chance) also both went to fanbases/organizations that were tailor-made for them. I'm not saying it is or isn't rigged. And "it's rigged" doesn't have to mean it's rigged every year. I'm just saying you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences."

Ah, so it's only rigged when it fits your narrative, otherwise it's not. That's the definition of cherry picking, good job making a claim that's unfalsifiable by definition.

A) I didn't make a claim.

B) Why couldn't the league rig it sometimes and have it be truly randomized at other times?

A) You clearly implied it was rigged, if you mention that:

you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences"

You're saying that there are anomalies and by putting the word coincidences between quotation marks you're implying there's a cause. That is saying it's rigged, only you're not owning up to it.
B) Have you seen the lottery procedure? It's filmed and uploaded into YouTube. I'd love to hear how you'd go about making the outcome deterministic, either to learn something new or for enterainment purposes.

[scrabbarista]

Ah, so it's only rigged when it fits your narrative, otherwise it's not. That's the definition of cherry picking, good job making a claim that's unfalsifiable by definition.

A) I didn't make a claim.

B) Why couldn't the league rig it sometimes and have it be truly randomized at other times?

A) You clearly implied it was rigged, if you mention that:

you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences"

You're saying that there are anomalies and by putting the word coincidences between quotation marks you're implying there's a cause. That is saying it's rigged, only you're not owning up to it.
B) Have you seen the lottery procedure? It's filmed and uploaded into YouTube. I'd love to hear how you'd go about making the outcome deterministic, either to learn something new or for enterainment purposes.

There are no anomalies. An anomaly would be if a team with 0% odds won. I put the quotes to make it clear I was representing the side of the devil's advocate.

I have not seen the procedure, but I've seen a million magic tricks (even one that's were filmed! and broadcast! or uploaded!) and I've never been able to explain how a single one of them was done.

I am not saying it's rigged, and I don't know why I have to keep repeating that without you understanding it. Since you seem to mistake everything I say, I'll clarify: I'm not saying "the lottery procedure is a magic trick." I'm saying that to assume it could not be rigged strikes me as the height of naivete.

Also, whatever the exact procedure is now, I know it has changed more than once over the years, which goes back to your ridiculous idea that if it were rigged once, it would have to be rigged every time, for all time, forever, otherwise it would be "cherry picking" to "fit my narrative."

It's hard for me to understand why you responded so sarcastically and defensively at the very mention of the possibility that rigging could have occurred; at least, without knowing you personally. But I've given you the kind of response I think yours deserved. And I'll probably bow out here, as I don't see this becoming very constructive, particularly as pertains to Cooper Flagg.

[FarBeyondDriven]

Ah, so it's only rigged when it fits your narrative, otherwise it's not. That's the definition of cherry picking, good job making a claim that's unfalsifiable by definition.

A) I didn't make a claim.

B) Why couldn't the league rig it sometimes and have it be truly randomized at other times?

A) You clearly implied it was rigged, if you mention that:

you don't have to look very hard to find lots of "coincidences"

You're saying that there are anomalies and by putting the word coincidences between quotation marks you're implying there's a cause. That is saying it's rigged, only you're not owning up to it.
B) Have you seen the lottery procedure? It's filmed and uploaded into YouTube. I'd love to hear how you'd go about making the outcome deterministic, either to learn something new or for enterainment purposes.

the lottery wasn't always filmed and I'm not even certain the ping pong balls are filmed now since they do it much differently. I think they hire auditors (who can be bought off btw) to watch it and vouch for the sanctity of it all. Besides, many of the more egregious examples of rigging go way back.

As for now, like with Wembnayam, there are other ways to ensure they get the result they want. You think if the NBA (owners, players, advertisers) wanted something to happen they couldn't make it happen? That's naive if so. They all stand to gain by ensuring certain outcomes. Why would owners and players go along with it? Ever heard "a rising tide lifts all boats". If it's good for the league, it's good for the owners, players and advertisers.

These owners have watched their franchises shoot up in value and the players are watching their salaries move up as well, they're just going along for the ride. If they're sitting down and doing the math and deciding what's best for the league is for the Knicks to get Ewing, then the Knicks are getting Ewing. If they want Kobe in a big market then they'll force Calipari to draft Kerry Kittles instead. They've even vetoed trades and suspended pivotal players during the Finals. A ref was busted for fixing games. But rigging the draft is a conspiracy theory?'

"Have you seen the lottery procedure? It's filmed and uploaded into YouTube. I'd love to hear how you'd go about making the outcome deterministic, either to learn something new or for enterainment purposes."

where are these videos? I'd love to see them so I can attempt to do so. Since I haven't seen them yet, I'll ask this. Why does the league conduct their lotteries like this if not so that they can affect the outcome? Every other sport drafts according to standings and they all seemingly do just fine. If they wanted to take a step to dissuade tanking they could do a coin flip between the bottom two teams giving them each a 50/50 chance. Then keep flipping after that for each subsequent pick until all of the lottery was chosen then revert back to standings.

If I was to guess how they'd manage to rig it now, it's because they're in cahoots with the auditors so when they are pulling the four sets of ping pongs, they're pulling from a selected group of balls that will ensure the numbers they require. I could be wrong but I believe this is done in the back room and isn't filmed. Which if true is pretty telling. After all, if all the owners are in agreement that certain things need to be done for the betterment of the league they'll go along with whatever they've collectively decided. I think they hire high profile companies that specialize in auditing these types of things. However, these companies are all governed by greed and would do anything to keep a high profile client. These are the same yahoos that value worthless paintings for auctions so people can launder money. Looking the other way for a client when it's just you and them in the room isn't beneath these people. So that's easily a way this could be done.

It just seems odd how Victor literally said in an interview after the draft he knew he was going to the Spurs because of previous relationships with Tony Parker, France and the Spurs. And that a former teammate in Sochan was there to help him get acclimated. Then there's the fact that they were one of the teams that refused to tank the previous couple of seasons and lost Kawhi for nothing and needed a jolt so were being rewarded for being good soldiers? Plus they built a $500 million practice facility like they knew something was coming down the pipe? Lot of coincidences.

[The-Stallion70]

How good is this kid? I havent kept up,

I know he's 6'8" athletic nice overall game.

Is he like Luka?

To me he seems like a smaller but more well rounded Franz Wagner. Less of an initiator but can score in more ways.

[crows2]

How good is this kid? I havent kept up,

I know he's 6'8" athletic nice overall game.

Is he like Luka?

To me he seems like a smaller but more well rounded Franz Wagner. Less of an initiator but can score in more ways.

Still the likely number 1 pick (Bailey is the only challenger). The difference between someone like him and Wagner is his defense - Flagg is one of the best defenders to come through in years.

[Duke4life831]

How good is this kid? I havent kept up,

I know he's 6'8" athletic nice overall game.

Is he like Luka?

To me he seems like a smaller but more well rounded Franz Wagner. Less of an initiator but can score in more ways.

Pretty freakish defensive game. His on ball defense has taken a big step up as well to that elite category as well. His help side defense was his original calling card, but his on ball defense is elite now as well.

Also I think he’s the more explosive athlete compared to Franz.

When it comes to his offense he’s shown two pretty drastically different roles this past year. During the summer on the AAU circuit, he was the ball dominant high usage guy. For high school he plays on the most stacked team in the country and plays more team first.

With that said he is averaging 4 assists per game (2nd on the team). He’s really begun to show legit point forward ability over the last year.

[mattao313]

I think his offensive game is underwhelming he does not have a bag to go to at all. Guess we'll see in college.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

[The-Stallion70]

How good is this kid? I havent kept up,

I know he's 6'8" athletic nice overall game.

Is he like Luka?

To me he seems like a smaller but more well rounded Franz Wagner. Less of an initiator but can score in more ways.

Pretty freakish defensive game. His on ball defense has taken a big step up as well to that elite category as well. His help side defense was his original calling card, but his on ball defense is elite now as well.

Also I think he’s the more explosive athlete compared to Franz.

Yea I agree I think he is a better athlete than Franz.

[Colbinii]

I think his offensive game is underwhelming he does not have a bag to go to at all. Guess we'll see in college.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

Correct. He isn't a Generational Talent as a whole and it is his defensive versatility along with Offensive Feel and IQ which gives him the total of Package.

[165bows]

I think his offensive game is underwhelming he does not have a bag to go to at all. Guess we'll see in college.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

Correct. He isn't a Generational Talent as a whole and it is his defensive versatility along with Offensive Feel and IQ which gives him the total of Package.

I think this sort of undersells that he's in an elite mold, no? Elite defensive wing that looks like a plus on offense is right at the top of every team's wish list.

[Colbinii]

I think his offensive game is underwhelming he does not have a bag to go to at all. Guess we'll see in college.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

Correct. He isn't a Generational Talent as a whole and it is his defensive versatility along with Offensive Feel and IQ which gives him the total of Package.

I think this sort of undersells that he's in an elite mold, no? Elite defensive wing that looks like a plus on offense is right at the top of every team's wish list.

I said he isn't a generational talent. He isn't.

[God Squad]

Andrei Kirilenko 2.0. He should be really good

[BlazersBroncos]

Andrei Kirilenko 2.0. He should be really good

Ya - he is a Bobby Jones / AK47 caliber defensive prospect. Hard to compare anyone to AK since he was a uniquely twitchy athlete, see Flagg as more in the Jones mold where he is 'only' an elite athlete for his size w/ generational defensive instincts (Reading passing lanes, switching, block timing, etc).

Think Flagg has the defensive upside of a Anthony Davis but as a swing SF/PF rather than PF/C.

[wegotthabeet]

Andrei Kirilenko 2.0. He should be really good

How good is this kid? I havent kept up,

I know he's 6'8" athletic nice overall game.

Is he like Luka?

To me he seems like a smaller but more well rounded Franz Wagner. Less of an initiator but can score in more ways.

i don't know how good he will be, but i do know he can only be compared to other white guys.