SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT)

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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#81 » by G R E Y » Fri Mar 8, 2024 6:25 am

imagump1313 wrote:None of these guys understand the importance of not turning it over. On that possession the very most important thing besides scoring was to NOT TURN THE BALL OVER!!

I was sitting there telling myself the entire time "we are just going to turn it over". Its soo predictable with this team..

Yeah like those falling elevator dreams. I actually believed we'd pull through, just didn't see the 'weak pass to get rid of pressure' for the TO and basket coming. I believed...

You can tell Pop is pissed in the post-game presser. Pretty much saying more diplomatically what you are - mental mistakes - aka not protecting the ball, the one damn thing we needed to do most in that moment.

If Branham never makes another pass like that again, it's a lesson learned. Better get this **** out of his system now than in the POs. He earned the chance to be out there. Now he knows the weight of responsibility of it.
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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#82 » by imagump1313 » Fri Mar 8, 2024 11:29 pm

G R E Y wrote:
imagump1313 wrote:
G R E Y wrote:Terrible TERRIBLE terrible way to lose.

Like...

I have no words...

We did SO much right for so long only to **** make brain farts down the stretch.

Sochan is not the player you want on O in clutch situations.

The loss isn't all on him. But he just goes all dumb bruiser mode trying so hard to 'make something happen' and he just **** heaves the ball time and again.

Devin had a clean shot.

Sabonis just said he expected a P&R and was surprised we just passed to the C. Ripe for the picking. Weak weak Branham pass. After a drive miss. Then a Sochan O ball whiff. Just everything that could go wrong there did.

I wouldn't have Sochan in late on O because that 3 and that end of clock heave exemplify his hero tunnel vision mentality. Has he made one in clutch yet? Just a **** travesty to have to get dragged along with his bad O. He's regressed and he's pushing to the team detriment. Just too stubborn to not make the team first play and here we are.


I totally agree with you about Sochan but what other options do we really have? Everyone else on this team seems to have just as ridiculously low BBIQ as Sochan does. I don't trust any of them.

When you posted this I thought for a second who else on this team do we have that knows anything about ball security and good offence? I even looked up the roster online in case I was forgetting someone LOL.

The answer is no one.....

Yeah I mean, fair point looking up and down the roster. Wemby makes rookie mistakes. I'd say Cedi is solid. Devin has been better.

Not everyone has a sense of... not sure what I'm picking up from Sochan. Entitlement is too strong... something along the lines of he deserves as much of a chance as anyone else, and well that's fine when he's having a good O game, but he doesn't care if he's sucking.

I've written before about how Sochan is, not stupid, but stupidly stubborn, and he has a bit of 'you get yours now I get mine' aspect to him that I don't like. He's also show a streak of like 'well you didn't pass to me so I won't to you.' He's done it with Wemby, Devin, and clearly Collins tonight. He motioned that he should have gotten the ball when Collins shot and missed a 3, then got back on D late, and then when Collins had his man sealed, Sochan drove and **** nearly airballed it on the drive rather than passing to Collins.

You see what I mean? It's not a good quality. He tries to insert himself into the O when he's not **** shooting it well and I find that **** infuriating. Like just do what you do best - THAT'S what we need from you, especially when your shot's not falling. And we have far more polished scorers on the team but no we have to watch him **** fumble his way to some energetic frenetic thoughtless heaves. Or bad shot selection (3s). Or choosing to shoot at the expense of the better pass play. It's a mental approach that isn't team first, leading with what we need most and best from him.


This I have to blame on coaching I'm afraid.
Coaches (at least Spurs coaches in the past) are supposed to teach players to be good and useful teammates. Maybe they are trying to do this behind the scenes and we dont see it but the selfishness has been going on for 63 games now. Its not just Sochan obviously but WTF? I have never seen a Spurs team act this way. And in my eyes the entire staff seems to be ignoring it.

It took them a good 50 games of trying to shut out Wemby until it became obvious that he is far and away the best player. Also Wemby has learned to be more assertive himself, almost forcing his selfish teammates to get him the ball. They still try to shut him out now for stretches now think they themselves are "The Man" but Wemby is becoming soo good he overcomes his own teammates stupidity. Maybe stupidity is too harsh of word. Maybe its just like we keep saying, bottom of the barrel BBIQ.

From the start of the season it seems like all these guys decided Wemby was going to fit in with them and not the other way around. I don't understand why we let this go on almost all season without our staff hammering that point home at least behind the scenes.

In my last post I typed that besides Wemby, we can dump this entire roster and I wouldn't miss any of them because Im soo frustrated. I then deleted that because I understand in the real world we cannot dump everyone.

Sochan is one guy who I would keep but I would strip away all the chances he has to make decisions.(at least for now). His job should be like last year. Play defense, rebound and try to move around for offensive rebounds and thats it. Get your points off turnovers and steals and fast breaks or offensive rebounds. You are not Kobe.
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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#83 » by G R E Y » Sat Mar 9, 2024 1:58 am

imagump1313 wrote:
G R E Y wrote:
imagump1313 wrote:
I totally agree with you about Sochan but what other options do we really have? Everyone else on this team seems to have just as ridiculously low BBIQ as Sochan does. I don't trust any of them.

When you posted this I thought for a second who else on this team do we have that knows anything about ball security and good offence? I even looked up the roster online in case I was forgetting someone LOL.

The answer is no one.....

Yeah I mean, fair point looking up and down the roster. Wemby makes rookie mistakes. I'd say Cedi is solid. Devin has been better.

Not everyone has a sense of... not sure what I'm picking up from Sochan. Entitlement is too strong... something along the lines of he deserves as much of a chance as anyone else, and well that's fine when he's having a good O game, but he doesn't care if he's sucking.

I've written before about how Sochan is, not stupid, but stupidly stubborn, and he has a bit of 'you get yours now I get mine' aspect to him that I don't like. He's also show a streak of like 'well you didn't pass to me so I won't to you.' He's done it with Wemby, Devin, and clearly Collins tonight. He motioned that he should have gotten the ball when Collins shot and missed a 3, then got back on D late, and then when Collins had his man sealed, Sochan drove and **** nearly airballed it on the drive rather than passing to Collins.

You see what I mean? It's not a good quality. He tries to insert himself into the O when he's not **** shooting it well and I find that **** infuriating. Like just do what you do best - THAT'S what we need from you, especially when your shot's not falling. And we have far more polished scorers on the team but no we have to watch him **** fumble his way to some energetic frenetic thoughtless heaves. Or bad shot selection (3s). Or choosing to shoot at the expense of the better pass play. It's a mental approach that isn't team first, leading with what we need most and best from him.


This I have to blame on coaching I'm afraid.
Coaches (at least Spurs coaches in the past) are supposed to teach players to be good and useful teammates. Maybe they are trying to do this behind the scenes and we dont see it but the selfishness has been going on for 63 games now. Its not just Sochan obviously but WTF? I have never seen a Spurs team act this way. And in my eyes the entire staff seems to be ignoring it.

It took them a good 50 games of trying to shut out Wemby until it became obvious that he is far and away the best player. Also Wemby has learned to be more assertive himself, almost forcing his selfish teammates to get him the ball. They still try to shut him out now for stretches now think they themselves are "The Man" but Wemby is becoming soo good he overcomes his own teammates stupidity. Maybe stupidity is too harsh of word. Maybe its just like we keep saying, bottom of the barrel BBIQ.

From the start of the season it seems like all these guys decided Wemby was going to fit in with them and not the other way around. I don't understand why we let this go on almost all season without our staff hammering that point home at least behind the scenes.

In my last post I typed that besides Wemby, we can dump this entire roster and I wouldn't miss any of them because Im soo frustrated. I then deleted that because I understand in the real world we cannot dump everyone.

Sochan is one guy who I would keep but I would strip away all the chances he has to make decisions.(at least for now). His job should be like last year. Play defense, rebound and try to move around for offensive rebounds and thats it. Get your points off turnovers and steals and fast breaks or offensive rebounds. You are not Kobe.

I had a Prof in grad school who said he'd give the class lots of rope and it was up to each student to decide whether by the end of the year they would pull themselves up or hang with it.

Besides benching and Pop gesturing wildly on the sidelines, what are we to do this season? Each of Sochan, Branham, Collins to name but three knows there's not much behind them to challenge for minutes.
That's one thing. Another relates to the rope. If with more leeway guys are choosing the Kobe route, then we have data, and evaluate and choose for next season onwards. We will soon have competition for minutes and roles. This season is for separating wheat from chaff. Anyone not accepting Wemby as our north star can **** off to wherever. Anyone playing for their second contract instead of team first needs met can do the same.

I predict we have at least 5-6 players off this current iteration of the team. And those who think they comfortably have a secured spot will realize they have anything but if they continue to not fall in line. Just watch. This is the last season we put up with this ****.
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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#84 » by imagump1313 » Sat Mar 9, 2024 5:51 am

G R E Y wrote:I had a Prof in grad school who said he'd give the class lots of rope and it was up to each student to decide whether by the end of the year they would pull themselves up or hang with it.

Besides benching and Pop gesturing wildly on the sidelines, what are we to do this season? Each of Sochan, Branham, Collins to name but three knows there's not much behind them to challenge for minutes.
That's one thing. Another relates to the rope. If with more leeway guys are choosing the Kobe route, then we have data, and evaluate and choose for next season onwards. We will soon have competition for minutes and roles. This season is for separating wheat from chaff. Anyone not accepting Wemby as our north star can **** off to wherever. Anyone playing for their second contract instead of team first needs met can do the same.

I predict we have at least 5-6 players off this current iteration of the team. And those who think they comfortably have a secured spot will realize they have anything but if they continue to not fall in line. Just watch. This is the last season we put up with this ****.


I agree. This roster needs a big turnover.

I was waiting patiently but I am now convinced Johnson and Vassell cannot play together. They dont feed off of each other. They don't try to make each other better. Its like a struggle between them every night to see who is going to jack up more shots.

Collins can be useful if he is put into the right situations. We are asking him to do too much. This is why I don't understand why Barlow doesnt play more.

Jones is as good as he is going to be which is a bit player who can play very small minutes as one of the last guys off the bench. Not a starter.

Champaigne is a g-leaguer and nothing more.

Osman is ok for spot up threes in an offense that moves the ball. (Which is something we do not do)
Branham is a bit player at best.
Wesley is less than Branham.
We dont know what Cissoko is but I doubt it will ever be anything more than a bench player.
Bassey is the same.

At least Tankathon has us taking the Praying Mantis with one of our picks.
I really like Zach Edey from Purdue. He is a big man from the past with all the moves and fundamentals of an actual big man. Something Wemby can play along side of as a PF and also learn from.


Edit:I forgot Mamu because, well basically his game is forgettable and is a G-Leaguer :lol:
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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#85 » by G R E Y » Mon Mar 11, 2024 1:34 am

4TH Q: SPURS 129 KINGS 131

Yeah this one hurts. To make so many great plays and come back from down 20 to up 8 to keep ahead of a strong team and then make mistake after mistake, fittingly the last one on a TO for a basket against, is a hard pill to swallow. The TO came from a weak, unconfident Branham pass, sort of to get rid of the ball and the pressure he had and there goes the game.

We did have a good shot to win it by Devin, can’t ask for much better, and it was by the right guy given the game he had, though I’m not sure he’s good in clutch situations overall.

Once the sting subsides, there’s a lot to be proud of this game. Devin, Collins, Keldon, Blake, and Branham had great games.

We did so many things right: won three Qs, made six more 3s for +18, made 21-21FTs for +4, terrific both for efficiency and the effort to get to the FT line. There were frankly some brutal non calls under their rim but it is what it is. Pop was working the refs hard all night; it seemed as if they were pulling their whistles. The kindest thing you can say is refs were letting the game be physical.

We made 51.1% of our FGs and had 39 assists. We had only 12TOs and actually won the points off TOs category +11. But of course timing is crucial.

We lost PITP badly 76-52 and lost the rebounding battle 46-36 and 14-8 on O boards. These were costly as we gave up 16-6 against in second chance points. Crucial possessions, all adding up. We once again ended up with far fewer FGAs as a result, this time 12 extra chances against.

Being down 20 to being up 8 is a huge positive, and staying ahead until the bloody last minute is as well. When they made a quick 5 points to tie there’s always those who want a timeout but frankly out inbounding under pressure has been abysmal. I don’t trust it. We were felled by a series of small, fundamentals-lacking plays and some myopic decisions. In the every play counts category, some were glaringly crucial and costly.

Obviously Branham would love that wonky pass back. Obviously Devin would love that last shot back. We wouldn’t have gotten the lead back without both.

Devin led us with 30 on terrific 11-18, 4-7 from 3, 4-4FTs, 5 boards, 9 assists, 2 steals, 1 block. He made good decisions with the ball, made tough shots, found team mates well, and was tough defensively staying with his man, protecting the rim, switching well, contesting well. The Kings commentators praised him repeatedly for his growing game. He stood out well and was impressive in increasingly higher tests throughout the season.

Zach started for Wemby and was on the whole terrific. He stepped up with 22 on 8-16, 2-3 from 3, 4-4FTs, with 6 boards (3 on O). He was much more engaged mentally and the physicality followed. His footwork and balance in post moves were terrific, and when he was in more forward motion getting to the rim he was more successful than when he went vertical. His shot was reliable, including, crucially, the 3. Solid banging for rebounds, good screens, and passing. He’s a more traditional floor stretching C and we were able to comfortably slip right into running good sets with him, far more P&Rs, and some good back door and paint cuts as well.
The last play, though, was all kinds of hot mess. For all the good we did this game, there was a fundamentals deficiency and BBIQ decision making that exposes guys leaning on their habits, whatever they may be, under pressure.

Ive read three slightly different versions of that play: Here was Branham’s view of the game altering turnover:
“We were running a play for Dev. Zach came up,” Branham said “I thought he held (Sabonis) off. Next thing you know Sabonis reached in and stole it. That’s a hard one to actually read. I should have waited a second or two, instead of turning the ball over.”


Here was Collins’ view:
“I’m supposed to set a screen, and (Branham) is supposed to come off and throw me the ball,” Collins said “He waived off the screen. I was like, ‘Cool.’ Sabonis did a good job. I didn’t feel him behind me. I thought he was far behind. I went soft for the ball. That’s what happens when you do that, they steal it.”

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/spurs/article/3-takeaways-san-antonio-spurs-let-kings-steal-win-18708431.php?utm_campaign=CMS%20Sharing%20Tools%20(Premium)&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral

Meanwhile there was Pop gesturing wildly on the sideline for Zach to run up and set it. Too late. By this point the D was better set up for it. Branham had called off screens throughout the game, directing the timing of them. Well if we were to run a play for Devin from the screen, why did Branham call it off? Just run the **** play! But he improvised and there it is.

Jones, the Spurs’ starting point guard, was watching from the bench at the time. His view provides a compelling argument for using the team’s final timeout:
“We didn’t necessarily know the plays we were running,” Jones said. “I don’t think we were on the same page there.”

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/spurs/article/3-takeaways-san-antonio-spurs-let-kings-steal-win-18708431.php?utm_campaign=CMS%20Sharing%20Tools%20(Premium)&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral

A couple of things here – Tre was honest about it, perhaps hinting at the inexperience and decision making abilities on the court, and Tre was not on the court to finish the game. On IG he wrote, To The High even when I feel low.” Tre was just 1-1 in 24 minutes. We really need him to step up and do more of what he has improved on O. The last three games Tre has combined for 8 points on 3-10, 0-3 from 3, 2-2FTs. So in three games he’s shot it 30%FG, 0% from 3, and managed only one trip to the FT line. Was the IG quote about the trial of his game or of getting subbed out late in the game, his usual role? He did get 5 boards and a team-high 12 assists, and he is a steadier ball handler now and better than Branham at it. But he got subbed out for Branham who was having a great game, and was given the chance to finish it.

Branham was our second leading scorer with 23 on 6-11, career-high 5-5 from 3 (double check the career high), team-high 6-6FTs, 1 board, 4 assists, 2 steals, and team-high 3TOs. He was also team worst -16. This is always a messy stat, but it does speak to positive two-way, team-first, fundamentals-based impact. Still, he’s been coming along with respect to growing his game within the team concept and credit to him for stepping up to next man up stepping up and showing out with his strengths. But fundamentals have to be the foundation. Ball protection, running plays as designed, not taking any plays off on D. Every play counts. We saw in this game just how much.

Keldon was right with him with 22 on 9-16, 4-11 from 3, 3 boards (1 on O), 4 assists (tied for bench high with Branham), and 1 steal but also -14 in bench high 28 minutes. For a punishing paint bruiser, the nearly 70% of shot attempts from the arc is not the optimal use of strengths. I do appreciate the better finding of teammates and the clean 0TOs sheet.

Blake bounced back with 11 on terrific 5-6, 1-1 from 3, 1 board, 3 assists, 1 steal 1 block for the kind of two-way impact he’s growing into providing.

These were good counters to Julian’s 0-5, 0-2 from 3, 4-4FTs with 1 O board and 1 assist in 17 minutes. Thanks, man. And frankly it was also a counter to Sochan’s 9 points on 3-10, 0-3 from 3, 3-3FTs. While Sochan grabbed 8 boards (2 on O), 2 assists, 1 steal, 2 blocks. This quid pro quo aspect to his game where he didn’t get a pass he thought he should have from Collins so he didn’t make one later to him is troubling. And maybe he was right. Maybe Collins should have passed it to him. But that does not mean Sochan should have reciprocated. And perhaps I’m attributing motives. But we go by what we see. And Sochan’s frustrations when he does not get the ball yield predictable results.

Sochan wanted part of the O action when others had the hot hand, when he didn’t. These are the moments to recognize where he can best help, and that includes not **** chucking away when his shot is not falling. He keeps trying to be a clutch shooter regardless of whether his shot’s falling and that’s just not him. It may be one day, but with poor handles and unreliable shooting, it is not yet now. But he does defend, distribute, cut, and hustle well. Focusing on what’s working in a given game while always giving physical, smart, team-first effort is the best way he can flourish.

God bless the patience it takes to get guys through the development process. We’re going to need to see some better ego-in-check, team-first play choices that become habits or there’s going to be changes that include those who don’t. Fundamentals. Focus. Two-way. Team-first. Effort. Execution. Repeat. Or reap the consequences. Let’s put this one behind us and do what we know to do better.
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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#86 » by G R E Y » Mon Mar 11, 2024 1:47 am

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Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 63: SPURS AT KINGS, 7-3-2024, 9PM (CT) 

Post#87 » by G R E Y » Mon Mar 11, 2024 1:51 am

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