Aaron Gordon says Scottie Barnes when asked about "guy miscast in role as star who might excel as the ultimate glue guy"

[PoundTown]

So if Scottie isn’t the #1 guy and we’re not interested in tanking for high draft picks, how are we supposed to become contenders?

The same way we won a championship 5 years ago? Increase the value of players we have and make good moves.

Scottie can be a 1B in my opinion, but we need a big time perimeter scorer with him. A guy like a Brunson or a Maxey to go with him is what is needed. Maybe Quickley or RJ get close enough they eventually get traded for that piece.

[2019nbachamps]

I think it’s even a stretch at this point to say Barnes is like Pippen. Pippen was in the DPOY convo every year, MVP candidate the one year he carried the Bulls to the playoffs. Also made the dream team early in his career despite a slow rookie season.

Scottie has a lot of potential and arguably a higher ceiling than Pippen but basketball is a game where 1 guy can have an outsized impact on winning. His supporting cast sucks but I can’t think of too many star players on 25 win teams. And before anyone says “tank”, we were the 7th worst team in the league while healthy and wouldn’t have tanked if we weren’t treadmilling. Scottie has more work to do to contribute to winning and earn the star label and accolades from our fans.

[DG88]

Scottie isn't a finished product only Scottie can dictate how good he'll be. Let just enjoy the journey and the fact that we have a blue chip prospect on our team. Hope that we can add another in next year's draft to be his running mate.

[Tha Cynic]

Gordon would be the 3rd or 4th best player on the current Raptors. He would like of be our OG.

[agkagk]

Dont worry,

At this point rj’s worst case scenario is demar 2.0

Ive seen enough, kids very legit.

Scottie - rj - winning vets - a boadload of kids.


Lets go.

[Spates]

I think it's fair to try and interpret what AG means by 'star' and realize that he's very likely using himself as a reference point. Gordon was the defacto 'star' during his tenure in Orlando so he's very much aware of how being the go-to-guy didn't mesh with his talents. He's not someone who can get you a bucket in any situation, particularly from the perimeter. Scottie is similar in that he doesn't have the fluidity and repertoire to be KD or Kawhi on the perimeter. His focus should be on playing excellent within himself before his strengths are diluted by expanding his game. Scottie greatest gifts are his connective passing and ability to bully down low. I'd much prefer him to maximize these talents before trying to master PnR ball handling.

It's isn't a knock on Scottie by any means. I've always envisioned Scottie as a high level connector. You impact winning at the highest level by playing a role best suited to your ability. Scottie is someone who'll be pivotal to a team playing a certain type/brand of basketball. I'm thinking along the lines of great players on non-heliocentric teams like Dennis Rodman, Marc Gasol, Draymond, Boris Diaw(2023/2014), etc.

I'm glad to hear AG comments because point-guard Scottie has the flavour of development nightmare. It has Lauri Markkanen/Aaron Gordon written all over it.

He wasn't the de facto star in Orlando at all during his tenure.

Vucevic was easily the de facto star on that team. Fournier was actually probably the #2 option and Gordon was the #3 option.

During his time on Orlando the team won 25, 35, 29, 25, 42, 33 and 21 games...one of the worst teams in the league for a long time.

So Gordon was essentially a #2 or #3 option on a lottery team and now he's a #4 option on a championship team, which makes sense.

He was never a "star" caliber player ever. I remember Gordon being seen as a great athlete that was good defensively, but quite raw and limited offensively. Even today he's not really much of a creator, but relies on his athleticism, screens and backdoor cuts because of all the attention Jokic gets. He's the perfect forward next to Jokic because he has the athletic ability and speed to catch lobs and finish on cuts.

This is the article's blurb: Once miscast as a no. 1 option, Gordon has turned himself into a supercharged role player who can fill the gaps around Nikola Jokic and Jamal Murray. “There are only two positions in basketball: on the floor and off the floor,” he says. “And I like being on the floor.”

No. 1 option, star, lead ball handler etc. are more or less synonyms.

AG not being star caliber as a no.1 option is the point he's making about Scottie.

[anotherhomer]

Aaron Gordon could be right

[PushDaRock]

I think the parallel that Gordon probably draws for this comparison is when he was on the Magic and one of the focal points and had the ball more in his hands, he wasn't very efficient but now that he's on Denver and playing off better players, he's become an above average scorer. Scottie is somewhat similar in that he hasn't been that efficient in his career, last year was a step in the right direction though that hopefully he is able to build on.

[JB7]

I think it's fair to try and interpret what AG means by 'star' and realize that he's very likely using himself as a reference point. Gordon was the defacto 'star' during his tenure in Orlando so he's very much aware of how being the go-to-guy didn't mesh with his talents. He's not someone who can get you a bucket in any situation, particularly from the perimeter. Scottie is similar in that he doesn't have the fluidity and repertoire to be KD or Kawhi on the perimeter. His focus should be on playing excellent within himself before his strengths are diluted by expanding his game. Scottie greatest gifts are his connective passing and ability to bully down low. I'd much prefer him to maximize these talents before trying to master PnR ball handling.

It's isn't a knock on Scottie by any means. I've always envisioned Scottie as a high level connector. You impact winning at the highest level by playing a role best suited to your ability. Scottie is someone who'll be pivotal to a team playing a certain type/brand of basketball. I'm thinking along the lines of great players on non-heliocentric teams like Dennis Rodman, Marc Gasol, Draymond, Boris Diaw(2023/2014), etc.

I'm glad to hear AG comments because point-guard Scottie has the flavour of development nightmare. It has Lauri Markkanen/Aaron Gordon written all over it.

He wasn't the de facto star in Orlando at all during his tenure.

Vucevic was easily the de facto star on that team. Fournier was actually probably the #2 option and Gordon was the #3 option.

During his time on Orlando the team won 25, 35, 29, 25, 42, 33 and 21 games...one of the worst teams in the league for a long time.

So Gordon was essentially a #2 or #3 option on a lottery team and now he's a #4 option on a championship team, which makes sense.

He was never a "star" caliber player ever. I remember Gordon being seen as a great athlete that was good defensively, but quite raw and limited offensively. Even today he's not really much of a creator, but relies on his athleticism, screens and backdoor cuts because of all the attention Jokic gets. He's the perfect forward next to Jokic because he has the athletic ability and speed to catch lobs and finish on cuts.

Gordon is probably the 3rd most important player on the Nuggets, after Jokic & Murray. Jokic has completely transformed Gordon's game, where Gordon is now a significant off ball threat because of Jokic's passing ability. The two are a perfect compliment to each other, and I could easily see the Nuggets trading MPJ first if they needed to save money.

[wegotthabeet]

I think it’s even a stretch at this point to say Barnes is like Pippen. Pippen was in the DPOY convo every year, MVP candidate the one year he carried the Bulls to the playoffs. Also made the dream team early in his career despite a slow rookie season.

Scottie has a lot of potential and arguably a higher ceiling than Pippen but basketball is a game where 1 guy can have an outsized impact on winning. His supporting cast sucks but I can’t think of too many star players on 25 win teams. And before anyone says “tank”, we were the 7th worst team in the league while healthy and wouldn’t have tanked if we weren’t treadmilling. Scottie has more work to do to contribute to winning and earn the star label and accolades from our fans.

Pippen was a rookie at 22 and definitely not in the conversation for dpoy that year.

[tanuki1031]

He's making the case that Scottie is good enough in ability and that much better in personality where you don't need to cater / force everything to him (i.e.: 35%USG, 20+FGA, "star treatment stuff") because he's the kind of guy who will do what's right and will cater to the team. Glue guy = unselfish guy necessary for winning

He's saying Scottie is a team-first guy being thrust into a traditionally me-first title and role of star.

Denver works because you have Jokic and Murray who are and could act like even greater stars, but both play and carry themselves like ultimate glue guys. Denver hasn't and has had no need to cast Jokic or Murray as stars. They just go out collectively and play basketball.

The reaction of people taking Gordon's answer to mean "Barnes is a role-player, not a star player" proves his point about players being miscast and the perceptions/vitriol that follows. No Denver fan would get riled up from someone calling Jokic a glue guy.

The fact that Gordon even answered Scottie Barnes shows that he watches a lot of basketball and knows/likes what he sees. If he wanted to slight someone why bother with someone the league and fans barely care about? It's not like he's doing the click-bait trick of riling up Raptor fans to boost his media platform a la Pat "Toronto has no dogs" Bev.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

In the end Scotties not a superstar and there's nothing wrong with that. An NBA champion like Gordon knows that a whole lot better then a bunch of tankers on here do.

I think this validates the portion of the board who have been called 'nuts' for suggesting that Barnes wouldnt be the one to take us to the promise land.

And remember he is the one we tanked for.....so let's think twice before we go scorched earth with this team.

[will]

In the end Scotties not a superstar and there's nothing wrong with that. An NBA champion like Gordon knows that a whole lot better then a bunch of tankers on here do.

I think this validates the portion of the board who have been called 'nuts' for suggesting that Barnes wouldnt be the one to take us to the promise land.

And remember he is the one we tanked for.....so let's think twice before we go scorched earth with this team.

He's trending to be a superstar. Just not an elite scorer.

[kalel123]

In the end Scotties not a superstar and there's nothing wrong with that. An NBA champion like Gordon knows that a whole lot better then a bunch of tankers on here do.

I think this validates the portion of the board who have been called 'nuts' for suggesting that Barnes wouldnt be the one to take us to the promise land.

And remember he is the one we tanked for.....so let's think twice before we go scorched earth with this team.

What a defeatist attitude. Barnes may not turn out to be a superstar at the end of the day and he definitely needs another guy (but who doesn't?) that we don't yet have. But damn, you've lost before you even began.

And you spew BS like tanking was by design. We entered the season with no intention to tank but were forced up against a wall to do so almost at the last minute and even then we had to luck into top 4 in what was supposed to be a 3-man draft. I'm not for tanking necessarily but at the same time, we didn't tank the way that so-called "tankers" would want. To say he's the one we tanked for is a f'ing insult to anyone's intelligence including your own.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

In the end Scotties not a superstar and there's nothing wrong with that. An NBA champion like Gordon knows that a whole lot better then a bunch of tankers on here do.

I think this validates the portion of the board who have been called 'nuts' for suggesting that Barnes wouldnt be the one to take us to the promise land.

And remember he is the one we tanked for.....so let's think twice before we go scorched earth with this team.

NBA players do not get automatic credit as nba talent evaluators, not from me at least.

[Chandan]

Dont worry,

At this point rj’s worst case scenario is demar 2.0

Ive seen enough, kids very legit.

Scottie - rj - winning vets - a boadload of kids.


Lets go.

then why does Drake only visit us like 3 times a year?

[TGM]

Don’t see this as a bad thing. Scottie is like a rich man Draymond. Allstar and glue guy. But agree he isn’t an alpha scorer go to guy. That’s just not his game.

[Anticon]

So if Scottie isn’t the #1 guy and we’re not interested in tanking for high draft picks, how are we supposed to become contenders?

Realistically, we won't. You need multiple lottery level talents to compete and the idea that Toronto can do that outside the draft is wishful thinking. Which is why the wasted opportunities of the last two years are so painful.

That said, I do think Scottie is a much better player now than Gordon ever was in Orlando. And arguably the second best player we've had to build around besides Lowry. So I don't agree with the comparison.

[anotherhomer]

I have to agree...I watched barnes play and he doesn't have the scoring bag

[refshateRaps]

Raps carrying the long running tradition of giving the keys to a guy that needs to be a secondary option on a contender, at best.