Calderon/Turkoglu/Triano/Colangelo Venting Thread

[Tommy Gun]

I dont think he's done a good job at all, but he will not be fired..probably ever. Accept that and move on

[cdel00]

blaming Jay/Jose is nuts simply nuts.

Facts: Farmar/Fisher scored 2 points from 1:15 left in the 3rd (when Jose replaced Jack) until the end of the game and those 2 points were by Fisher from the stripe and Jose denied the and1 with that foul.

Facts: Farmar/Fisher had exactly 1 assist in that same time frame.

Facts: The Lakers went to the line 4 time in 5 trips from 6:48 to 5:30 left in the 4th on calls against the Raps that the Lakers were getting away with repeatedly on the other end in the 2nd half.

[Chosen_One23]

First of all, I dont understand why the other thread was locked. Some of you mods need a life; this is a freaking 'BASKETBALL FORUM' for fans to discuss anything related to basketball & the raptors. So what if a fan wants to call out the GM when the team is evidently struggling. I dont understand the logic behind locking it.

To respond to the OP of that topic; I agree. It's been a while since BC has been put in office and evidently he has not produced. He has had many chances; a) when he first came here b) trading TJ (who had high value at that time) and c) the 09' offseason where we had a lot of money

but he ended up screwing up all this situations. It's time to get him out--he has cripplied this team now and for the future

[JWiLL02]

Maybe you guys are right, but I think Belinelli is unfamiliar with some of the plays. Jose, Wright or DeRozan has been playing with the core, and I believe they are better at executing the play.

WHAT PLAYS?

Yeah, Beli has no idea how to stand in the corner and wait for a possible pass while we pick and roll/pick and pop.

The fact is if Beli is in there we aren't forced to watch Jose pound the ball for 18 seconds before giving it to Hedo in the corner for a 3 he doesn't want to take. He's also a constant threat, defenders won't sag off of him.

Jack should be the primary ball handler to end games, switching it up some possessions for Hedo to pick and roll/pop with Bosh and Bargs.

Go back and watch the last 5 minutes. We have Jose bringing the ball up most of the time, it makes no sense at all.

[JWiLL02]

blaming Jay/Jose is nuts simply nuts.

Why can't we blame Jay for taking away primary ball handling responsibilities from Jack? It's inexcusably bad coaching. We have no control over how the refs will officiate the games, but Jay can sure as hell control player roles.

I didn't expect to win this game, but that doesn't mean I'll ignore the horrible mismanagement of players during it.

[Dr Octagon]

People need to realize:

BC came here and was given:

1) Young All-Star PF
2) Cap space
3) 1st overall pick in the draft.

Name me a GM that went to a new team, and had those 3 assets to start his build.

Almost 5 years later, this is a .500 team which might make the playoffs in a horrible conference. No draft picks, no cap space, Bosh could leave, horrible contracts, no real head coach.

[TJ Calderon]

man calderon is freaking garbage. i hope he gets injured and never play again. what a waste of 40 million. he can't defend anyone to save his life and now that he's lost his shot, what the hell is he good at? I still dont understand why triano plays calderon so much. I much rather have bellineli or banks play over him.

[outofbounds]

man calderon is freaking garbage. i hope he gets injured and never play again. what a waste of 40 million. he can't defend anyone to save his life and now that he's lost his shot, what the hell is he good at? I still dont understand why triano plays calderon so much. I much rather have bellineli or banks play over him.

I hate Jose more than anyone but I can't blame him for being what he is or getting 40 million dollars. Bryan Colangelo is the one that paid the man and locked this bum up long term.

Blame Colaneglo

[Southward1]

I have no idea why people are defending Jose Calderon. The guy has never started for a team that was any good. He never seriously contributed on a team that made any damage. He had a tim thomas like 25 game span that had the team go .500 and then received a horribly overpaid contract by a GM that throws a crap load of them out (Not a bc hater either, he just overpays for everybody) He's getting outplayed by his pg counterpart, Sonny "goddamn" Weems, Marco Belinelli at times and even Antoine Wright was contributing more than him for a 10 game stretch. He plays way too many minutes, but there are probably circumstances why.

Egos (Can't hurt his feelings)
Contract (BC has to somehow make that contract not look as horrible as it really is)
A possible trade (You have to play him to get any sort of value out of him this summer)

Plus:
Jack + Hedo has proven to work
Jack + Calderon doesn't work
Hedo + Calderon hasn't worked out very well either
Hedo + Calderon + Jack definitely doesn't work

He has to be dealt this summer. He doesn't fit the make-up of this raptors team anymore. The team has less shooters and more slashers. This team has 3 ball-handlers outside of him (Jack, Hedo, Marco) so it's not his team anymore. He had a year where he was the man and he blew it and was excused because of apparent hip injury which I think was highly overrated when it comes to effecting his game. Just deal him this summer, you can always replace him with Steve Blake for the MLE or even playing Marco has the backup who actually can. But I honestly do not think Jose Calderon is a starting caliber point guard and shouldn't be treated as one.

[Undefeated]

man calderon is freaking garbage. i hope he gets injured and never play again. what a waste of 40 million. he can't defend anyone to save his life and now that he's lost his shot, what the hell is he good at? I still dont understand why triano plays calderon so much. I much rather have bellineli or banks play over him.

- How many points did Fisher and Farmar score last night?
- A 57.5 TS% is still good
- Jose was key in putting the Raptors a lead over the Lakers going into half-time

[Undefeated]

He has to be dealt this summer. He doesn't fit the make-up of this raptors team anymore. The team has less shooters and more slashers. This team has 3 ball-handlers outside of him (Jack, Hedo, Marco) so it's not his team anymore. He had a year where he was the man and he blew it and was excused because of apparent hip injury which I think was highly overrated when it comes to effecting his game. Just deal him this summer, you can always replace him with Steve Blake for the MLE or even playing Marco has the backup who actually can. But I honestly do not think Jose Calderon is a starting caliber point guard and shouldn't be treated as one.

No one ever said Jose was a starting caliber PG. Considering Jose has the 4th highest WS on the Raptors; he's certainly helping the Raptors more than you think he is. And Jose has been playing a huge role on the bench getting wins here and there when the team happens to be in a deficit and has to rely on the bench to get them back into games.

[Indeed]

I have no idea why people are defending Jose Calderon. The guy has never started for a team that was any good. He never seriously contributed on a team that made any damage. He had a tim thomas like 25 game span that had the team go .500 and then received a horribly overpaid contract by a GM that throws a crap load of them out (Not a bc hater either, he just overpays for everybody) He's getting outplayed by his pg counterpart, Sonny "goddamn" Weems, Marco Belinelli at times and even Antoine Wright was contributing more than him for a 10 game stretch. He plays way too many minutes, but there are probably circumstances why.

Egos (Can't hurt his feelings)
Contract (BC has to somehow make that contract not look as horrible as it really is)
A possible trade (You have to play him to get any sort of value out of him this summer)

Plus:
Jack + Hedo has proven to work
Jack + Calderon doesn't work
Hedo + Calderon hasn't worked out very well either
Hedo + Calderon + Jack definitely doesn't work

He has to be dealt this summer. He doesn't fit the make-up of this raptors team anymore. The team has less shooters and more slashers. This team has 3 ball-handlers outside of him (Jack, Hedo, Marco) so it's not his team anymore. He had a year where he was the man and he blew it and was excused because of apparent hip injury which I think was highly overrated when it comes to effecting his game. Just deal him this summer, you can always replace him with Steve Blake for the MLE or even playing Marco has the backup who actually can. But I honestly do not think Jose Calderon is a starting caliber point guard and shouldn't be treated as one.

+1

Jose is better off with the bench.
Jose + Amir has proven
Jack + Amir has proven
Hedo + Amir is average

Jose + DeRozan has proven
Jack + DeRozan is average
Hedo + DeRozan is average

Jose + Weems has proven
Jack + Weems is average
Hedo + Weems is average

Jose + Belinelli doesn't work
Jack + Belinelli has proven
Hedo + Belinelli is average


Therefore, no Jack/Jose/Hedo please, Jose comes off the bench, and at most play until 3mins mark at the end of 4th quarter.

[Enfur]

While I'd like to blame Triano cause he makes some stupid decisions, really how can you win in this league when your GM decides to pay 25 million dollars a year for like 10 million in production? (Banks/Canceron/Turk).

On another note, Calderon really has to go to Triano and say "Hey, I'm a backup. Don't play me at the end of games." People have to stop pretending this guy has a place in the NBA.

[Rhettmatic]

Mike Ulmer -- a Raptors employee -- was much harder on Turkoglu in a blog post today than Doug Smith has ever been:

http://www.nba.com/raptors/news/ulmer.html

But we are on dangerous ground here. Turkoglu has always been defined as a big-time, big-game player who would make you forget any other deficiencies when the real money was on the barrel. His playmaking was supposed to remove the emphasis of defenders from both Chris Bosh and Andrea Bargnani. He was to give the Raps the kind of clutch-time shooter who beat them Monday in the form of Kobe Bryant.

But while Kobe was making shots, Hedo was either missing or not taking them and turning the ball over at a critical moment. In the fourth quarter, Turkoglu took two shots, missed both and turned the ball over twice.

Turkoglu scored six points (the same as Sonny Weems who had roughly half the minutes) shot the ball seven times, made two. The five rebounds, all defensive, might auger that a bit but for the four turnovers, including an errant pass easily pounced on by the Lakers with 30 seconds to play.

The Raptors are struggling for a playoff spot. They were going hammer and tong against the NBA champions on the first night of a vital road trip.

That should have been big enough for a big game player, even one competing on a tender ankle.

Kobe Bryant went just as long as Turkoglu in the NBA finals. His conditioning has allowed him to ward off injuries.

Now, there is no comparing Turkoglu to Bryant. One is one of the best players to walk on the basketball court. The other is a gamer who possesses a range of skills that should make him a dynamic presence in any ballgame.

It has taken the better part of the season but Hedo Turkoglu needs to become the player the Raptors outbid Portland for.

All this is well within reach for a player of Turkoglu’s ability. But it’s about time he got to it.

[gregdj]

jay is so clueless and so stuck with his rotations, always trying to please.

jays rotations are HORRIBLE i hope he watches the game again and realizes how much of an idiot he really is... waiting forever to put bosh back in the 4th? jose playing extended mins in the 4th when jack was on effin fire... we could have had a defensive player on the floor to help double kobe on that last shot. Cack in the 4th is a fail and triano is a fail for believing in that combo...

[Brinbe]

I dont think he's done a good job at all, but he will not be fired..probably ever. Accept that and move on

Of course he will be, in fact, BC has already brought in his replacement, in Iavaroni.

[jsakltk]

add bargs to the mix. if he had the slightest idea of playing D, we would have won.

[outofbounds]

I dont think he's done a good job at all, but he will not be fired..probably ever. Accept that and move on

Of course he will be, in fact, BC has already brought in his replacement, in Iavaroni.

If anyone it will be that little chipmunk Gherandini who won't be able to convince a single north american player to sign so he will go 100% euro and run this franchise out of the league.

[RiceANDPeas]

People need to realize:

BC came here and was given:

1) Young All-Star PF
2) Cap space
3) 1st overall pick in the draft.

Name me a GM that went to a new team, and had those 3 assets to start his build.

Almost 5 years later, this is a .500 team which might make the playoffs in a horrible conference. No draft picks, no cap space, Bosh could leave, horrible contracts, no real head coach.

Exactly. He had a near perfect situation to change the fortunes of this franchise. Colangelo is vastly overrated.

[cage]

i just can't believe we actually had the first overall pick... god, of all the years to get it it had to be that year. seems like we've just benefited from a playing in a crappy eastern conference and were never that good of a team. now 4 years later we're in a fight for a playoff spot with the heat/bulls/bobcats/bucks, teams that most of us laughed at. it's sad