Did we give up on Banton too soon?

[brownbobcat]

Banton gambles a lot - he is lost in a team concept and he is not quick enough to guard guard nor strong enough to guard forwards or bigs. He is just bad on that end.

Disagree, he does decently on switches and his length makes it a problem even when guards turn the corner. Awareness and strength are definitely issues.

Being great 1v1 is a skill you still need on a team. It is also is one NBA skill Agbaji has... Banton has zero other than height (which he does not use to his advantage anyways)

Anyone who thinks Kelly brought much value back as an expiring 32 year old is out of their mind.

Yeah, it's not as if this team has any history of overpaying for mediocre expiring Cs, right? And even a 32yr old Olynyk is going to vastly outperform the expected value from the 29th pick - see how stupid that sounds?

Banton might not even be on a roster next season, let alone a couple of years. Trust me when I say teams are not clamoring at the ability to add a below average efficiency, bad playmaking, meh defending, point guard.

And yeah... Dalano's minutes are garbage time.

The fact you dont see the difference between what Dalano is doing now, and Agbaji being a rotational player for the entirety of his career is just showing the bias. Ochai was literally a rotational player on a Jazz team for a decent chunk of last season that was in the play-in until they pulled out the full tank with 10 games left. And this year, he again was a rotation player / spot starter for the 26-26 Jazz when he was traded.

Banton on the other hand has been glued to the bench his entire career until he got traded to one of the worst teams in the league and is allowed to play and do whatever he wants because Portland does not care.

Banton showed enough to get a contract from Boston in the first place - which says something. Was he ever going to play significant minutes for a title contender? Of course not. As for Agbaji being a rotational player for his "career", don't make me laugh. You and I both know there are heavy politics involved with FRPs getting minutes. Gradey doesn't get force-fed minutes if this team didn't pick him 13th last year. The fact that Ainge is hitting the reset button on Agbaji for a pick that's basically worthless is way more telling.

[WaltFrazier]

I liked Banton despite his lack of performance here and I think it would have been interesting to give him a full year with Darko and team development. Get him on those Gradey Dick roids too. But I'm not willing to discount the off court distractions whispers either and it might be better for him to be away from the city.

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

[Fairview4Life]

I liked Banton despite his lack of performance here and I think it would have been interesting to give him a full year with Darko and team development. Get him on those Gradey Dick roids too. But I'm not willing to discount the off court distractions whispers either and it might be better for him to be away from the city.

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Sure, if all those things had happened you might have had some hypothetical people to argue with.

[WaltFrazier]

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Sure, if all those things had happened you might have had some hypothetical people to argue with.

More like hypothetical people to agree with. There'd be a lot of good vibes about local kid coming home and doing well, look Masai found another good one, can't wait to see him play with Scottie, should be able to help us next year, etc.

[Los_29]

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Sure, if all those things had happened you might have had some hypothetical people to argue with.

More like hypothetical people to agree with. There'd be a lot of good vibes about local kid coming home and doing well, look Masai found another good one, can't wait to see him play with Scottie, should be able to help us next year, etc.

I’m sure people would love a non-shooting, non-playmaking guard next to Scottie. Perfect fit.

[YogurtProducer]

Banton showed enough to get a contract from Boston in the first place - which says something. Was he ever going to play significant minutes for a title contender? Of course not. As for Agbaji being a rotational player for his "career", don't make me laugh. You and I both know there are heavy politics involved with FRPs getting minutes. Gradey doesn't get force-fed minutes if this team didn't pick him 13th last year. The fact that Ainge is hitting the reset button on Agbaji for a pick that's basically worthless is way more telling.

Boston gave him away for free. Like literally for free.

That is where this argument just falls apart - any negative you bring up for Agbaji is tenfold for Banton.

Agbaji was "given up" on by Utah and traded as part for a first round pick - Banton was cut by Toronto and traded by Boston for nothing

Agbaji is playing "garbage minutes" for Toronto (if you ignore his 1.5 years in Utah) - Banton is playing garbage minutes for Portland and no one else ever

[YogurtProducer]

I liked Banton despite his lack of performance here and I think it would have been interesting to give him a full year with Darko and team development. Get him on those Gradey Dick roids too. But I'm not willing to discount the off court distractions whispers either and it might be better for him to be away from the city.

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Why don't we have a whole bunch of Nwora fans then?

I even said if Banton maintains a 39% 3 point shot he has a place in the league as a backup, but I think we all know that is a mirage.

[brownbobcat]

Banton showed enough to get a contract from Boston in the first place - which says something. Was he ever going to play significant minutes for a title contender? Of course not. As for Agbaji being a rotational player for his "career", don't make me laugh. You and I both know there are heavy politics involved with FRPs getting minutes. Gradey doesn't get force-fed minutes if this team didn't pick him 13th last year. The fact that Ainge is hitting the reset button on Agbaji for a pick that's basically worthless is way more telling.

Boston gave him away for free. Like literally for free.

That is where this argument just falls apart - any negative you bring up for Agbaji is tenfold for Banton.

Agbaji was "given up" on by Utah and traded as part for a first round pick - Banton was cut by Toronto and traded by Boston for nothing

Agbaji is playing "garbage minutes" for Toronto (if you ignore his 1.5 years in Utah) - Banton is playing garbage minutes for Portland and no one else ever

Boston was cutting costs - no different than Toronto waiving Dinwiddie. D level prospects aren't worth anything in the trade market except as filler. The whole point was that we have a bunch of D-level guys (Agbaji, Nwora, JFL, Porter) who aren't exactly blowing the doors off a bad team either.

[MiamiSPX]

I liked Banton despite his lack of performance here and I think it would have been interesting to give him a full year with Darko and team development. Get him on those Gradey Dick roids too. But I'm not willing to discount the off court distractions whispers either and it might be better for him to be away from the city.

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I genuinely think SGA is a possibility. Hopefully we are tampering behind the scenes.

Murray, I don't know. As long as Jokic is there, you can't just walk away from being the sidekick to the best player in the league. I also saw an interview with him where he said he lives in Colorado year-round and he was going on about how much he loves the outdoor activities there (hiking, etc).

[libertyYYZ]

I was always a big fan. Let’s see if he can turn this hot stretch into a career.

EDIT:

Watching the vids…his shot preparation is much improved. He now has a one motion shot. Footwork way better. Same release every time. Much quicker release. Shot doesn’t fly left or right anymore, it’s straight every time. Doesn’t play too fast in the halfcourt anymore and is much more patient and under control, allowing him to use his natural vision, which he has always had. Is a much better ball handler. Still blocks shots from behind (he did that here, too). Still puts lots of pressure on the defence in transition (did that here too). Still struggles to finish in traffic (same was true here).

I think with more reps he can fully figure it out. From those vids he still looks like a player with potential and not a guy you can trust every night but another season of consistent minutes and he can become something. The experience here might have been a huge wake up call, and being in the Celtics system might have given him more professional habits. I say all this because it’s very apparent that he’s put A LOT of work into his game the past two off seasons.

Portland has Chauncey Billups and Scott Brooks. Are they the ones who've helped him turn the corner?

[RoteSchroder]

Got Barrett.
Got Olynyk.
Getting Shai and Murray.

So, bringing back Dalano is the next obvious step.

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Why don't we have a whole bunch of Nwora fans then?

I even said if Banton maintains a 39% 3 point shot he has a place in the league as a backup, but I think we all know that is a mirage.

There was actually some initial excitement with Nwora after he had 2 decent games (24 pt and 17 pt), but being a huge hole on defense and providing very little for the next 10 games kind of squashed out any possible hype.

Banton's put up 18+ points in 5 of his last 12 games and is a better ball-handler and passer than Nwora. Nwora has also had a ton of more opportunity to play in the NBA whereas this is pretty much Banton's real first shot to get some valuable development minutes.

Overall, Banton has higher upside than someone like Ochai, but Ochai has a higher floor. It's still unknown whether Banton can put it together consistently and become a serviceable role player.

[anotherhomer]

it's nice Banton is finding a place to build his career

i don't think it would happen in Toronto, not because of coaching but because of the distractions

Rexdale is a somewhat rough neighborhood, and maybe all kinds of ppl popping up

[JRoy]

Some FOMO in this thread.

Banton is nothing special. POR didn’t unlock him. He’s jusr playing because we are so damn terrible.

[Badonkadonk]

We do this every time. We also want to bring back people years after they've been any good.

[nikster]

I know you're joking. I think.

But picture this. If Banton had spent his Raptor years with another team, then Boston, and now came home to a tanking Toronto team rather than similarly tanking Portland. And was putting up the same numbers with the injury depleted tanking Raptors, I bet the posters now downplaying what he's doing would be having quite different takes.

Why don't we have a whole bunch of Nwora fans then?

I even said if Banton maintains a 39% 3 point shot he has a place in the league as a backup, but I think we all know that is a mirage.

There was actually some initial excitement with Nwora after he had 2 decent games (24 pt and 17 pt), but being a huge hole on defense and providing very little for the next 10 games kind of squashed out any possible hype.

Banton's put up 18+ points in 5 of his last 12 games and is a better ball-handler and passer than Nwora. Nwora has also had a ton of more opportunity to play in the NBA whereas this is pretty much Banton's real first shot to get some valuable development minutes.

Overall, Banton has higher upside than someone like Ochai, but Ochai has a higher floor. It's still unknown whether Banton can put it together consistently and become a serviceable role player.

In 5 of his last 12 game he's attempted 19 or more shots, and has a 50 TS% over that span.

I really don't see how Banton has better upside than Ochai. Ochai is a few months younger, a better defender. Both of them need to fix their 3 point shot but if they do I'm taking Ochai.

[Los_29]

5-19 from the field, 1 assist and below average defense. It’s easy to get excited about Banton’s height and ball handling but that’s not enough. After three years, you need to show more than that.

[RoteSchroder]

Why don't we have a whole bunch of Nwora fans then?

I even said if Banton maintains a 39% 3 point shot he has a place in the league as a backup, but I think we all know that is a mirage.

There was actually some initial excitement with Nwora after he had 2 decent games (24 pt and 17 pt), but being a huge hole on defense and providing very little for the next 10 games kind of squashed out any possible hype.

Banton's put up 18+ points in 5 of his last 12 games and is a better ball-handler and passer than Nwora. Nwora has also had a ton of more opportunity to play in the NBA whereas this is pretty much Banton's real first shot to get some valuable development minutes.

Overall, Banton has higher upside than someone like Ochai, but Ochai has a higher floor. It's still unknown whether Banton can put it together consistently and become a serviceable role player.

In 5 of his last 12 game he's attempted 19 or more shots, and has a 50 TS% over that span.

I really don't see how Banton has better upside than Ochai. Ochai is a few months younger, a better defender. Both of them need to fix their 3 point shot but if they do I'm taking Ochai.

No point in ragging a player for bad games when he's still developing.

Banton is showing flashes of potential, but we need to wait and see if he can get to the level of consistency required to be a rotation player on a winning team. Not sure why you expect an unproven G-league scrub to turn into a high level rotation player overnight.

Ochai tops out as a mid-level 3 and D player. Banton has better upside because he can dribble a ball. His upside and what Banton should strive to be is a combo guard off the bench who can score, pass a little and play average to decent defense. Ochai has the higher floor because he can already consistently bring above average defense every game whereas Banton has yet to show consistency on anything yet.

As I said though, this is Banton's first real chance at logging a decent stretch of NBA minutes. Ochai has played 963 more minutes than Banton.

[BlackThought]

We gave up on him just in time so that he can help us catch the Blazers by helping them win.

[HiJiNX]

Another big game last night (in a losing cause). 31 pts 5 rebs, 9 asts on 5/11 shooting.

[HiJiNX]

There was actually some initial excitement with Nwora after he had 2 decent games (24 pt and 17 pt), but being a huge hole on defense and providing very little for the next 10 games kind of squashed out any possible hype.

Banton's put up 18+ points in 5 of his last 12 games and is a better ball-handler and passer than Nwora. Nwora has also had a ton of more opportunity to play in the NBA whereas this is pretty much Banton's real first shot to get some valuable development minutes.

Overall, Banton has higher upside than someone like Ochai, but Ochai has a higher floor. It's still unknown whether Banton can put it together consistently and become a serviceable role player.

In 5 of his last 12 game he's attempted 19 or more shots, and has a 50 TS% over that span.

I really don't see how Banton has better upside than Ochai. Ochai is a few months younger, a better defender. Both of them need to fix their 3 point shot but if they do I'm taking Ochai.

No point in ragging a player for bad games when he's still developing.

Banton is showing flashes of potential, but we need to wait and see if he can get to the level of consistency required to be a rotation player on a winning team. Not sure why you expect an unproven G-league scrub to turn into a high level rotation player overnight.

Ochai tops out as a mid-level 3 and D player. Banton has better upside because he can dribble a ball. His upside and what Banton should strive to be is a combo guard off the bench who can score, pass a little and play average to decent defense. Ochai has the higher floor because he can already consistently bring above average defense every game whereas Banton has yet to show consistency on anything yet.

As I said though, this is Banton's first real chance at logging a decent stretch of NBA minutes. Ochai has played 963 more minutes than Banton.

Agreed absolutely.