I Attended The Raptors Coaching Clinic and Open Practice, Some Takeaways

[Scase]

Exactly. What he was traded for doesn't impact who he is. You can dislike the trade and still understand what he brings to the table.

What he brings to the table is directly tied to the trade, the **** are you talking about? You trade Lebron for a 2nd and that's a steal. You get a 2nd FOR Lebron and you got robbed.

Jak was not worth what he cost us, couple that with the cascading impacts and then it was a bad trade. Trades are evaluated based on the cost, and the quality of the return. His skill set is not good enough to have justified the cost IMO.

You get to say his skill set is the only important thing to discuss, if he was signed outright, and even then it's comparative to his salary. In this case it's both acquisition, and the retention costs. How is this so hard to understand?

Okay you get Lebron as a free agent or a massive haul. You still have a franchise player either way. You now have your roster and move on. What he brings to the court now, what he will bring to the court in the future, and his value as an asset are what matter now.

Jak has his uses, but ultimately he's "out of date", centres with zero range are a dying breed, and overall detrimental to a team.

That quote is about him as a player and should be true whether he was a free agent, acquired for as a free agent or playing for another team entirely. Unless you think him being a free agent changes the fact that he's a "dying breed" and "overall detrimental to a team"

If you have to trade your entire team to get Lebron, it is a worthless trade. When you gut a team and result with one player, it's pointless. Not that I even mentioned anything about that. I was trying to make it as simple as a concept for you to understand. When you trade away more than a player is worth, it's usually a bad trade. Now trade away more than a player is worth, AND have that player actively derail your team and the ability to rebuild, now it's REALLY bad. Jak is not the level of player, nor was this team in the position to be throwing away a lotto pick.

And my quote about a dying breed IS relevant no matter the acquisition method, it's just WORSE when you pay salary AND assets to acquire them. Sweet jesus, take a breath and READ.

There are teams out there that can compensate for the limitations of their players. We are not one of them, and even then, most teams don't run that as a starter.

Jokic, shoots 3's.
Embiid, shoots 3's.
AD, not a 3pt shooter, but WAY better than Jak.
Bam, doesn't shoot 3's, Heat have FOUR players who shoot 40%+ from 3.
Sabonis, shoots 3's.
Porzingis, shoots 3's.
Lopez, shoots 3's.
Gobert, doesn't shoot 3s, Wolves have FIVE players who shoot 40%+ from 3, and one of the best scorers in the league in Ant.

Like you can go down the list of the entire NBA, and all you find is either teams that have solid to very good shooting bigs, teams that can heavily compensate for them not being shooters, or bad teams.

Guess which one we rank as.

[YogurtProducer]

Exactly. What he was traded for doesn't impact who he is. You can dislike the trade and still understand what he brings to the table.

What he brings to the table is directly tied to the trade, the **** are you talking about? You trade Lebron for a 2nd and that's a steal. You get a 2nd FOR Lebron and you got robbed.

Jak was not worth what he cost us, couple that with the cascading impacts and then it was a bad trade. Trades are evaluated based on the cost, and the quality of the return. His skill set is not good enough to have justified the cost IMO.

You get to say his skill set is the only important thing to discuss, if he was signed outright, and even then it's comparative to his salary. In this case it's both acquisition, and the retention costs. How is this so hard to understand?

Okay you get Lebron as a free agent or a massive haul. You still have a franchise player either way. You now have your roster and move on. What he brings to the court now, what he will bring to the court in the future, and his value as an asset are what matter now.

Jak has his uses, but ultimately he's "out of date", centres with zero range are a dying breed, and overall detrimental to a team.

That quote is about him as a player and should be true whether he was a free agent, acquired for as a free agent or playing for another team entirely. Unless you think him being a free agent changes the fact that he's a "dying breed" and "overall detrimental to a team"

He doesn't get it man, might as well let him stew in his ignorance.

He blatantly attacks Poeltl as a player and is now shifting the goalposts to say he really meant the trade was bad. He will shift them every time you call him on his BS

[nikster]

What he brings to the table is directly tied to the trade, the **** are you talking about? You trade Lebron for a 2nd and that's a steal. You get a 2nd FOR Lebron and you got robbed.

Jak was not worth what he cost us, couple that with the cascading impacts and then it was a bad trade. Trades are evaluated based on the cost, and the quality of the return. His skill set is not good enough to have justified the cost IMO.

You get to say his skill set is the only important thing to discuss, if he was signed outright, and even then it's comparative to his salary. In this case it's both acquisition, and the retention costs. How is this so hard to understand?

Okay you get Lebron as a free agent or a massive haul. You still have a franchise player either way. You now have your roster and move on. What he brings to the court now, what he will bring to the court in the future, and his value as an asset are what matter now.

Jak has his uses, but ultimately he's "out of date", centres with zero range are a dying breed, and overall detrimental to a team.

That quote is about him as a player and should be true whether he was a free agent, acquired for as a free agent or playing for another team entirely. Unless you think him being a free agent changes the fact that he's a "dying breed" and "overall detrimental to a team"

And my quote about a dying breed IS relevant no matter the acquisition method, it's just WORSE when you pay salary AND assets to acquire them. Sweet jesus, take a breath and READ.

There are teams out there that can compensate for the limitations of their players. We are not one of them, and even then, most teams don't run that as a starter.

Jokic, shoots 3's.
Embiid, shoots 3's.
AD, not a 3pt shooter, but WAY better than Jak.
Bam, doesn't shoot 3's, Heat have FOUR players who shoot 40%+ from 3.
Sabonis, shoots 3's.
Porzingis, shoots 3's.
Lopez, shoots 3's.
Gobert, doesn't shoot 3s, Wolves have FIVE players who shoot 40%+ from 3, and one of the best scorers in the league in Ant.

Like you can go down the list of the entire NBA, and all you find is either teams that have solid to very good shooting bigs, teams that can heavily compensate for them not being shooters, or bad teams.

Guess which one we rank as.

Yeah we know that comment is about the player. But when we call out your terrible assessment of him as a player you respond with arguments about the trade.

Should we just avoid any good role players because this roster has several flaws? Can we compensate for a weak defensive Centre with our current roster? Yeah a lot of the best Centres shoot 3s, because the best players at all positions are good at everything. And why can't our roster compensate for it? Quickly and Gradey can be border line elite next year (one off the dribble and one excellent off ball), if Barnes develops a consistent shot thats the foundation for plenty of spacing around the core. Its obviously not a contender but we're not there with anybody at Centre.

[Scase]

Okay you get Lebron as a free agent or a massive haul. You still have a franchise player either way. You now have your roster and move on. What he brings to the court now, what he will bring to the court in the future, and his value as an asset are what matter now.



That quote is about him as a player and should be true whether he was a free agent, acquired for as a free agent or playing for another team entirely. Unless you think him being a free agent changes the fact that he's a "dying breed" and "overall detrimental to a team"

And my quote about a dying breed IS relevant no matter the acquisition method, it's just WORSE when you pay salary AND assets to acquire them. Sweet jesus, take a breath and READ.

There are teams out there that can compensate for the limitations of their players. We are not one of them, and even then, most teams don't run that as a starter.

Jokic, shoots 3's.
Embiid, shoots 3's.
AD, not a 3pt shooter, but WAY better than Jak.
Bam, doesn't shoot 3's, Heat have FOUR players who shoot 40%+ from 3.
Sabonis, shoots 3's.
Porzingis, shoots 3's.
Lopez, shoots 3's.
Gobert, doesn't shoot 3s, Wolves have FIVE players who shoot 40%+ from 3, and one of the best scorers in the league in Ant.

Like you can go down the list of the entire NBA, and all you find is either teams that have solid to very good shooting bigs, teams that can heavily compensate for them not being shooters, or bad teams.

Guess which one we rank as.

Yeah we know that comment is about the player. But when we call out your terrible assessment of him as a player you respond with arguments about the trade.

Should we just avoid any good role players because this roster has several flaws? Can we compensate for a weak defensive Centre with our current roster? Yeah a lot of the best Centres shoot 3s, because the best players at all positions are good at everything. And why can't our roster compensate for it? Quickly and Gradey can be border line elite next year (one off the dribble and one excellent off ball), if Barnes develops a consistent shot thats the foundation for plenty of spacing around the core. Its obviously not a contender but we're not there with anybody at Centre.

So your defence of Jak, is that we need 2 of our players to just randomly become elite next year, for him to playable? Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

Jak is not a role player, he is a starter. So his expectations are held to such heights. There is absolutely zero problems with acquiring role players with limitations or flaws, but again you cannot separate the cost of the acquisition, from the impact of the player. Jak is limited, that becomes even more exacerbated when you factor in the COST of acquisition. He was NOT a FA acquisition, so you don't get to ignore the greater impact to the team and its future.

[YogurtProducer]

And my quote about a dying breed IS relevant no matter the acquisition method, it's just WORSE when you pay salary AND assets to acquire them. Sweet jesus, take a breath and READ.

There are teams out there that can compensate for the limitations of their players. We are not one of them, and even then, most teams don't run that as a starter.

Jokic, shoots 3's.
Embiid, shoots 3's.
AD, not a 3pt shooter, but WAY better than Jak.
Bam, doesn't shoot 3's, Heat have FOUR players who shoot 40%+ from 3.
Sabonis, shoots 3's.
Porzingis, shoots 3's.
Lopez, shoots 3's.
Gobert, doesn't shoot 3s, Wolves have FIVE players who shoot 40%+ from 3, and one of the best scorers in the league in Ant.

Like you can go down the list of the entire NBA, and all you find is either teams that have solid to very good shooting bigs, teams that can heavily compensate for them not being shooters, or bad teams.

Guess which one we rank as.

Yeah we know that comment is about the player. But when we call out your terrible assessment of him as a player you respond with arguments about the trade.

Should we just avoid any good role players because this roster has several flaws? Can we compensate for a weak defensive Centre with our current roster? Yeah a lot of the best Centres shoot 3s, because the best players at all positions are good at everything. And why can't our roster compensate for it? Quickly and Gradey can be border line elite next year (one off the dribble and one excellent off ball), if Barnes develops a consistent shot thats the foundation for plenty of spacing around the core. Its obviously not a contender but we're not there with anybody at Centre.

So your defence of Jak, is that we need 2 of our players to just randomly become elite next year, for him to playable? Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

Jak is not a role player, he is a starter. So his expectations are held to such heights. There is absolutely zero problems with acquiring role players with limitations or flaws, but again you cannot separate the cost of the acquisition, from the impact of the player. Jak is limited, that becomes even more exacerbated when you factor in the COST of acquisition. He was NOT a FA acquisition, so you don't get to ignore the greater impact to the team and its future.

He is literally talking about their "elite" ability to shoot the ball. IQ/Dick have flaws but shooting certainly is not one of them. You are a smart dude, you know what he was trying to say

Your argument against Jak initially was that non-shooting centers are detrimental to the overall makeup of a team. We all saw the post - we all can read - you can't just shift the goalposts now that people called out that bull.

[Shaazzam]

I was thinking about these parts of the OP:

3. ⁠This whole season is about teaching the fundamentals of how to play as a team. And they’re basically spending 75% of the time working on the offence. The things they’re working on look amazing. It’s no wonder we generate so many quality looks.

10. Pat Delaney’s principles on defence are strong, we just don’t spend a lot of time on it in practice. The focus this year seems to be the offence.

Dwayne Casey was on with Will Lou last week before the Pistons game with a lot of reminiscing of his coming to the Raps. He talked at length how he first focused on building a good defensive team first and succeeded. Then the offense caught up a year or 2 later as Kyle and DD improved. Whereas Darko is taking the opposite approach, offense first. Makes sense because Casey came from being defensive coach of the champion Mavs while Darko is an offensive coach, each coach playing to his own strengths. It will be interesting to see how long it takes for the raptors to improve their defense back to Nurse levels, if possible. And the front office has to pivot away from the 6'9 athlete vision, to acquiring players who are not only smart enough to learn Darko's offense (as per HiJiNX), but also capable defenders as well.

Also in this era teams need to be able to score to have a chance, back in the day you could slog it out and win games with defence. That's not quite the case nowadays. You have to be able to keep up with no other teams, no matter how good your defence is cuz they're going to score.

[Merit]

Darko is going to stay for at least 1 more season (in case anyone wants to launch a FIRE DARKO' campaign this summer). We may want to try to get back at least to the play-in next season, but Darko is going to have at least 1 more season to build up our young guys.

I would bet money he's staying for more than that. Darko is a no BS coach.

Yeah I think the Raptors are getting exactly what wanted from Darko. He will get three seasons minimum imo.

And he’s not a ‘nice guy’…a good guy for sure, but not a nice guy if that makes sense. Extremely respectful. But not afraid of conflict.

This is an important distinction.

[Merit]

Yeah and one thing that really stands out is that young NBA players are completely foreign to this style of play. They’re more about simple pnr, dho, iso stuff. What Darko is installing is…well you’ll all see it in a year or two. He has sets for different parts of the floor and different situations and about three to four options per set. LOTS of emphasis on weakside actions and cuts. Any above the break threes we take are designed that way for the most part, and they’re usually wide open because of off ball stuff happening going toward the paint. Very intricate. I won’t give away the team’s total philosophy (and they likely didn’t give us anything they wouldn’t want people talking about anyway) but…there’s a very clear plan of what shots they want and how to get them. And watching the games, they’re getting what they want consistently—it’s just about making the shots and refining the smaller things to create better advantages.

One thing also is that to play that style you really need a high IQ especially to do it at a high level (playoff basketball). So I expect any new additions to be competent enough to create a role for themself.

With all this it will be interesting what kind of players the team adds. It won't be easy to find the kind of smart do-everything players his system requires.

Great OP. I can tell Darko is a great technical coach and a positive guy. I wish I was 20+ years younger and still coaching, I would have loved to attend that.

I think they're going to take flyers on guys who are young enough to improve. Two who come to mind are Malik Monk and Talen Horton Tucker.

[Merit]

Haha unfortunately I’m neither.

Writing is however one of the many things I do to make a living, but probably the least lucrative. I almost got on with Raptors Republic a couple of years ago but life got in the way of taking that on.

Then you writing the wrong stuff

Wanna be my life coach??

What's my rate?

[HiJiNX]

Watching the BKN game, the Raptors are running a lot of what they were working on in this open practice but not some of the side actions they were working on. Maybe those aren’t ready yet?

And I can see the transition formation they were showing off in practice as well.

[HiJiNX]

Then you writing the wrong stuff

Wanna be my life coach??

What's my rate?

Can I pay you in And1s??

[dafan590]

this is great, thanks for sharing OP, now we just need another RealGMer that attend the raptors draft workouts.

[Ducksplatt]

This has to be one of the best posts I have read. Great stuff HiJiNX. It restores my faith in RealGM.

Maybe we should start a GoFundMe for you to give more reports

[LoveMyRaps]

They found your post HiJiNX. It's now circulating over Twitter.

[Merit]

Wanna be my life coach??

What's my rate?

Can I pay you in And1s??

Done.

[WaltFrazier]

What's my rate?

Can I pay you in And1s??

Done.

Hey HJ is a mod you could ask for more. Make certain posters disappear, that kind of thing.

[HiJiNX]

They found your post HiJiNX. It's now circulating over Twitter.

Hahaha you’re lying.

Right?

[HiJiNX]

Can I pay you in And1s??

Done.

Hey HJ is a mod you could ask for more. Make certain posters disappear, that kind of thing.

DM me…and maybe I can add to my list.

[Chandan]

Done.

Hey HJ is a mod you could ask for more. Make certain posters disappear, that kind of thing.

DM me…and maybe I can add to my list.

context:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=TheOffice

[DelAbbot]

Hey HJ is a mod you could ask for more. Make certain posters disappear, that kind of thing.

DM me…and maybe I can add to my list.

context:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=TheOffice