Gary Trent Jr. - Fair Contract Offer?

[deeps6x]

Please don't bring Brown back at $20M next season. I'd rather give Gary a $15M one year deal. I don't see anything in Brown that makes him worth $20M.

[ForeverTFC]

Please don't bring Brown back at $20M next season. I'd rather give Gary a $15M one year deal. I don't see anything in Brown that makes him worth $20M.

$20m contracts are probably the best contracts for trade purposes, that's his value tbh.

[twiggy2]

I'd rather let theese expiring contracts bounce. We could have 3 decent rookies and a bigger role for gradey to fill. I know you all love asset management talk ,but keeping everyone is sometimes a disservice.

[greekman]

when raptors were trying to win games
11/2/2 40%
when raptors are tanking and full of g leaguers
20/4/1 43%

it's possible he turned things around but the track record isn't great.

[OAKLEY_2]

Please don't bring Brown back at $20M next season. I'd rather give Gary a $15M one year deal. I don't see anything in Brown that makes him worth $20M.

$20m contracts are probably the best contracts for trade purposes, that's his value tbh.

Exactly. If we pay him that til the 2026 deadline then that is what he is worth. Having said that if Gary's assists continue to go up maybe he gets the 20+ but people are crazy if they think Gary is only getting the MLE. Boucher is making near MLE as we speak. Brown is a good two-way talent.

[OAKLEY_2]

Sorry I mean 2025 deadline.

[Kingsway_fan]

when raptors were trying to win games
11/2/2 40%
when raptors are tanking and full of g leaguers
20/4/1 43%

it's possible he turned things around but the track record isn't great.

Classic Gary... trash when it means something and playing with legit starters.... unreliable and low percentage shooter who sometimes gets hot...

Please do not extend...m same with Brown.. let them both expire

[ruckus]

If Dick is ready to start at the 3 then you don't bring back Trent unless they move off the Brown contract. He'll probably be looking at Cam Johnson ($23mil aav)/Duncan Robinson ($18mil aav) types of contracts.

It feels like a lot to give to a guy that we're looking to replace in the starting lineup.

[XTC]

Honestly 3 years $45 million is fair. He's our only consistent shooter besides Quickley, and he's a decent defender.

[YogurtProducer]

when raptors were trying to win games
11/2/2 40%
when raptors are tanking and full of g leaguers
20/4/1 43%

it's possible he turned things around but the track record isn't great.

Y'all do realize it is simply because he is taking more shots since everyone is hurt, right? His efficiency is unchanged with the additional volume.

[agkagk]

when raptors were trying to win games
11/2/2 40%
when raptors are tanking and full of g leaguers
20/4/1 43%

it's possible he turned things around but the track record isn't great.

Hes a shooter needs a point guard to feed him.

Instead he was coming back from an injury, missed the preseason and had to babysit flynn.

His numbers pre and post flynn are more telling to me.

[Scase]

Somebody will pay him 20 over multiple years. He is not taking a haircut.

Anything is possible;
It just takes one team to set the market

I would have thought that last summer was a better opportunity for him to get paid compared to this summer;
You never know.

I just know they are never paying Brown-Gary 45mil. Meaning they can S+T Gary and get a TPE/pick and overpay Brown for one year and deal him at next deadline. That's 45ish the team saves by 2026 by Brown getting his full contract value and them running from Gary at earliest opportunity.

S+Ts are generally pretty rare. Maybe there is a higher likelihood with GTJ if all he cares about is the highest bidder, in the event said team is the highest bidder. S+Ts require all 3 parties to agree and have a vested interest in making it work, that is not a common occurrence.

As for Brown, why bother? They could've dealt him at this deadline as an expiring, why get another year to pay him, just to not get anything valuable for him then? His value isn't changing at the next deadline.

Neither of them hold any particular value, and letting them walk wouldn't even register as a blip on the radar, leaves us with capspace that can be used to absorb some salary in a trade without having to send much of anything back.

Trading either of them results in a smaller return, whereas with a bunch of capspace and the ability to take on some junk, opens you up for a much bigger potential haul.

[Scase]

Honestly 3 years $45 million is fair. He's our only consistent shooter besides Quickley, and he's a decent defender.

Consistent is the last word anyone should be using to describe GTJ. He always goes on hold/cold streaks, it's the reason why we should be moving on from him.

[ForeverTFC]

Honestly 3 years $45 million is fair. He's our only consistent shooter besides Quickley, and he's a decent defender.

MLE will be roughly ~$13m next year. With 5% raises, a 3 year MLE deal would be ~$41m. I'd be shocked if Gary Trent commits to MLE money for 3 years; IF that's his price, he probably takes a 1+1 MLE deal at any non-tax team that gives him the most options and goes from there.

We really need to start thinking about salaries as % of the cap because the numbers have changed so drastically. These cap sites should really add % of cap to their databases so we can go back and compare. For Gary, I think ~15% of the cap is fair, which would translate to a ~$20m AAV.

[ForeverTFC]

Honestly 3 years $45 million is fair. He's our only consistent shooter besides Quickley, and he's a decent defender.

Consistent is the last word anyone should be using to describe GTJ. He always goes on hold/cold streaks, it's the reason why we should be moving on from him.

We're not looking to win right now and no longer have a cap crunch in front of us so I don't think we should just let him walk. If you can get him for $20m-$25m AAV on a 2+1 team option type contract, it's probably the best move. Keep that salary slot filled above the cap and give yourself trade flexibility.

[Scase]

Honestly 3 years $45 million is fair. He's our only consistent shooter besides Quickley, and he's a decent defender.

Consistent is the last word anyone should be using to describe GTJ. He always goes on hold/cold streaks, it's the reason why we should be moving on from him.

We're not looking to win right now and no longer have a cap crunch in front of us so I don't think we should just let him walk. If you can get him for $20m-$25m AAV on a 2+1 team option type contract, it's probably the best move. Keep that salary slot filled above the cap and give yourself trade flexibility.

Trade flexibility only matter if you ever exercise that ability, we rarely do. We also rarely if ever give out contracts with team options. I would rather not have a floor raiser like GTJ costing us potential draft spots next year. Assuming we actually try and tank, and not just retool.

[ForeverTFC]

Consistent is the last word anyone should be using to describe GTJ. He always goes on hold/cold streaks, it's the reason why we should be moving on from him.

We're not looking to win right now and no longer have a cap crunch in front of us so I don't think we should just let him walk. If you can get him for $20m-$25m AAV on a 2+1 team option type contract, it's probably the best move. Keep that salary slot filled above the cap and give yourself trade flexibility.

Trade flexibility only matter if you ever exercise that ability, we rarely do. We also rarely if ever give out contracts with team options. I would rather not have a floor raiser like GTJ costing us potential draft spots next year. Assuming we actually try and tank, and not just retool.

Eh, we've rarely allowed significant contracts move without replacing the salary through trade. FVV is the only real exception; everyone else that walked wasn't making that much of the cap OR we were facing a cap crunch OR we were actively trying to open cap space. See: Lowry and Norm in '20. This is true for the majority of the league.

The issue here is that once you're over the cap, if you allow salary to walk away, it becomes very hard to replace it. If we're so worried about him being a floor raiser, we should still sign him and just trade him for some equivalent money immediately. It's just not good cap management to let that salary walk when you're in our situation; after we pay IQ and Scottie, we really don't have much coming our way that we need to fit in for a few years.

[Scase]

We're not looking to win right now and no longer have a cap crunch in front of us so I don't think we should just let him walk. If you can get him for $20m-$25m AAV on a 2+1 team option type contract, it's probably the best move. Keep that salary slot filled above the cap and give yourself trade flexibility.

Trade flexibility only matter if you ever exercise that ability, we rarely do. We also rarely if ever give out contracts with team options. I would rather not have a floor raiser like GTJ costing us potential draft spots next year. Assuming we actually try and tank, and not just retool.

Eh, we've rarely allowed significant contracts move without replacing the salary through trade. FVV is the only real exception; everyone else that walked wasn't making that much of the cap OR we were facing a cap crunch OR we were actively trying to open cap space. See: Lowry and Norm in '20. This is true for the majority of the league.

The issue here is that once you're over the cap, if you allow salary to walk away, it becomes very hard to replace it. If we're so worried about him being a floor raiser, we should still sign him and just trade him for some equivalent money immediately. It's just not good cap management to let that salary walk when you're in our situation; after we pay IQ and Scottie, we really don't have much coming our way that we need to fit in for a few years.

Maybe I'm not up to speed on our cap situation, but if GTJ/Brown walk, we are well under the cap are we not?

I agree with what you are saying overall, and yeah we don't normally do that. But the question is, should we stay that course?

[ForeverTFC]

Trade flexibility only matter if you ever exercise that ability, we rarely do. We also rarely if ever give out contracts with team options. I would rather not have a floor raiser like GTJ costing us potential draft spots next year. Assuming we actually try and tank, and not just retool.

Eh, we've rarely allowed significant contracts move without replacing the salary through trade. FVV is the only real exception; everyone else that walked wasn't making that much of the cap OR we were facing a cap crunch OR we were actively trying to open cap space. See: Lowry and Norm in '20. This is true for the majority of the league.

The issue here is that once you're over the cap, if you allow salary to walk away, it becomes very hard to replace it. If we're so worried about him being a floor raiser, we should still sign him and just trade him for some equivalent money immediately. It's just not good cap management to let that salary walk when you're in our situation; after we pay IQ and Scottie, we really don't have much coming our way that we need to fit in for a few years.

Maybe I'm not up to speed on our cap situation, but if GTJ/Brown walk, we are well under the cap are we not?

I agree with what you are saying overall, and yeah we don't normally do that. But the question is, should we stay that course?

We are, but we'd have to get to 95% of the cap by the time the season starts. Once we get to that 95%, we can only add to our salary roll by signing MLE guys and giving raises to our own players. It will be hard for us to punt the cap space to next year (what the Spurs did) because of the IQ and then Scottie extension to follow. So unless there is a real target in FA this year (see Houston and Indiana) OR they know they can't sign GTJ for money they're comfortable at OR there is a good trade lined up where you can get assets back by absorbing a bad contract into the cap, it makes more sense to operate as an above the cap team. If you are going to operate above the cap, you want to keep as much salary on the books as possible close to the tax, factoring in any raises due to your own players over next 2-3 years. So in that sense, it just makes sense to keep both Brown and GTJ and do all you can to replace most of that salary, even if you don't want the players themselves.

There's obviously nuances to this, but in general, this is how I think about cap management in today's NBA.

[islandboy53]

Anything is possible;
It just takes one team to set the market

I would have thought that last summer was a better opportunity for him to get paid compared to this summer;
You never know.

I just know they are never paying Brown-Gary 45mil. Meaning they can S+T Gary and get a TPE/pick and overpay Brown for one year and deal him at next deadline. That's 45ish the team saves by 2026 by Brown getting his full contract value and them running from Gary at earliest opportunity.

S+Ts are generally pretty rare. Maybe there is a higher likelihood with GTJ if all he cares about is the highest bidder, in the event said team is the highest bidder. S+Ts require all 3 parties to agree and have a vested interest in making it work, that is not a common occurrence.

As for Brown, why bother? They could've dealt him at this deadline as an expiring, why get another year to pay him, just to not get anything valuable for him then? His value isn't changing at the next deadline.

As I pointed out to you in another thread, Utah were offering Olynyk and Agbaji for Brown. We also know that the Knicks were offering Fournier and a 1st. There were other offers that we don’t know the details of. He has value, but I think we’re better to move him this summer.

Neither of them hold any particular value,
and letting them walk wouldn't even register as a blip on the radar,

Even by your standards, this is nonsense.

leaves us with capspace that can be used to absorb some salary in a trade without having to send much of anything back.

Trading either of them results in a smaller return, whereas with a bunch of capspace and the ability to take on some junk, opens you up for a much bigger potential haul.

You can take back almost as much “junk” operating over the cap, under the tax utilizing the Siakam TPE and the NTMLE as you could via cap space. Those returns would be on top of your returns for Brown and Trent. A much bigger haul.