2024 NBA DRAFT THREAD 3

[Risk101]

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[Dalek]

Love this kid

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How many undersized guards who can shoot but are average in athleticism have actually worked out well in the NBA? Not too many that I can think of but the G-League is full of those types of players.

Jaylen Brunson is a borderline MVP candidate. Fred VanVleet is much smaller and was an all-star and all-NBA Defensive team ptoential player. Donte DiVincenzo was nearly 6 man of the year this year while Grayson Allen can start for title teams like the Suns and Bucks, and a guy like Seth Curry can at least space the floor for a jumbo creator.

Those are all different possibilities. I think if I dig back in history Mark Price is a guy he most reminds me of. The thing with any player is IQ, aggressiveness and grittiness. How much is this player willing to get their nose broken drawing a foul or taking a charge? I sense that Sheppard has that type of competitive spirit. His defensive analytics show some big potential.

[grant101]

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Super underrated cause of his age and the fact that he played for a smaller school in a smaller conference. He was prime to breakout a couple years back but was derailed by a bad knee injury. Since then he's really rounded out his game, improved his shot and transitioned into a hub for LA Tech's offence. His advanced stats are great too. I think he has a chance to be a real steal

[WuTang_OG]

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[alpngso]

Ron Holland becoming next Andrew Wiggins or Reed Sheppard being next Fred Vanvleet (both 1x time all-star, 1 championship)

Which has higher chance of happening?

[metafisical]

This draft is looking like a generational draft. Glad we have 2-3 picks, hopefully the latter and at #1. My bold prediction: we will draft someone really good. And "really good" is based on my criteria, which I will reveal after I see our draftee play for a few seasons and I get to pick and choose the sample size.

[RoteSchroder]

Grab McCain ASAP and don't look back. Or Reed Sheppard if you're a believer, can't decide on this guy. Otherwise grab Nique Clifford with 31.

McCain reminds me of Brunson but with some sniping skills. Absolutely the Jamie Jaquez of this draft.

I really like McCain as well. But I don't see him as a Jaime Jaquez type draft pick because the thing is, he only plays like a college veteran - but he's only a freshman! Jaquez was 22 entering this past year. McCain will only be 20.

But that's exactly the thing that stands out to me when I watch McCain. He just always looks like he knows what he's doing on the court. He's not a pure point guard, but I have no doubts about his ability to develop enough of those skills to be an excellent backup in the league.

And his shooting stroke is just so good and consistent that it'll definitely be a weapon at the next level. He's also fairly scrappy as a defender and everywhere on the court in general.

I think he's the 1st round PG least likely to bust because all of his good skills seem transferable and his weaknesses aren't serious enough to be dealbreakers.

Haven't watched game tape of his defense, but it seems that McCain was a big negative factor on D. Team's defensive rating would drop any time McCain hit the floor under any combination of players.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2024/03/duke-mens-basketball-analytics-analysis-jared-mccain-tyrese-proctor-jeremy-roach-caleb-foster

Reed seems to be good at close outs, help defense, deflections/blocks, but is quite porous in terms of keeping his man in front of him. He also gets caught up on screens and gets caught ball-watching a lot. I think he has room for improvement though, whereas I don't see McCain improving much.

If their offense is good enough though, defense may not matter as much.

[aminiaturebuddha]

Grab McCain ASAP and don't look back. Or Reed Sheppard if you're a believer, can't decide on this guy. Otherwise grab Nique Clifford with 31.

McCain reminds me of Brunson but with some sniping skills. Absolutely the Jamie Jaquez of this draft.

I really like McCain as well. But I don't see him as a Jaime Jaquez type draft pick because the thing is, he only plays like a college veteran - but he's only a freshman! Jaquez was 22 entering this past year. McCain will only be 20.

But that's exactly the thing that stands out to me when I watch McCain. He just always looks like he knows what he's doing on the court. He's not a pure point guard, but I have no doubts about his ability to develop enough of those skills to be an excellent backup in the league.

And his shooting stroke is just so good and consistent that it'll definitely be a weapon at the next level. He's also fairly scrappy as a defender and everywhere on the court in general.

I think he's the 1st round PG least likely to bust because all of his good skills seem transferable and his weaknesses aren't serious enough to be dealbreakers.

Haven't watched game tape of his defense, but it seems that McCain was a big negative factor on D. Team's defensive rating would drop any time McCain hit the floor under any combination of players.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2024/03/duke-mens-basketball-analytics-analysis-jared-mccain-tyrese-proctor-jeremy-roach-caleb-foster

Reed seems to be good at close outs, help defense, deflections/blocks, but is quite porous in terms of keeping his man in front of him. He also gets caught up on screens and gets caught ball-watching a lot. I think he has room for improvement though, whereas I don't see McCain improving much.

If their offense is good enough though, defense may not matter as much.

I'm curious why you think that. Do you think there is a significant work ethic difference or something? Certainly Sheppard isn't a better overall athlete than McCain.

[Psubs]

Grab McCain ASAP and don't look back. Or Reed Sheppard if you're a believer, can't decide on this guy. Otherwise grab Nique Clifford with 31.

McCain reminds me of Brunson but with some sniping skills. Absolutely the Jamie Jaquez of this draft.

I really like McCain as well. But I don't see him as a Jaime Jaquez type draft pick because the thing is, he only plays like a college veteran - but he's only a freshman! Jaquez was 22 entering this past year. McCain will only be 20.

But that's exactly the thing that stands out to me when I watch McCain. He just always looks like he knows what he's doing on the court. He's not a pure point guard, but I have no doubts about his ability to develop enough of those skills to be an excellent backup in the league.

And his shooting stroke is just so good and consistent that it'll definitely be a weapon at the next level. He's also fairly scrappy as a defender and everywhere on the court in general.

I think he's the 1st round PG least likely to bust because all of his good skills seem transferable and his weaknesses aren't serious enough to be dealbreakers.

McCain looks like his potential is Ben Gordon.

[RoteSchroder]

I'm curious why you think that. Do you think there is a significant work ethic difference or something? Certainly Sheppard isn't a better overall athlete than McCain.

While both are out-sized, Reed already has instincts/ability to rack up stocks/deflections. Where he needs to improve upon is disciplined defense and awareness off-ball. And despite Reed's short comings, the team does much better defensively with him on the floor.

Without having elite athletic size or speed/hops, McCain's at a disadvantage in terms of contesting shots. I don't see him developing the ability to rack up deflections like Reed, for instance.

However, I'm not too high on Reed in the first place at his respective draft position.

[aminiaturebuddha]

Grab McCain ASAP and don't look back. Or Reed Sheppard if you're a believer, can't decide on this guy. Otherwise grab Nique Clifford with 31.

McCain reminds me of Brunson but with some sniping skills. Absolutely the Jamie Jaquez of this draft.

I really like McCain as well. But I don't see him as a Jaime Jaquez type draft pick because the thing is, he only plays like a college veteran - but he's only a freshman! Jaquez was 22 entering this past year. McCain will only be 20.

But that's exactly the thing that stands out to me when I watch McCain. He just always looks like he knows what he's doing on the court. He's not a pure point guard, but I have no doubts about his ability to develop enough of those skills to be an excellent backup in the league.

And his shooting stroke is just so good and consistent that it'll definitely be a weapon at the next level. He's also fairly scrappy as a defender and everywhere on the court in general.

I think he's the 1st round PG least likely to bust because all of his good skills seem transferable and his weaknesses aren't serious enough to be dealbreakers.

McCain looks like his potential is Ben Gordon.

Ben Gordon with a pick in the middle of the 1st round would be fantastic value. Until he had a serious ankle injury later in his career Gordon was a very good player and reliable scorer. Not All-Star, but high level rotation player as both a starter and 6th man.

[aminiaturebuddha]

I'm curious why you think that. Do you think there is a significant work ethic difference or something? Certainly Sheppard isn't a better overall athlete than McCain.

While both are out-sized, Reed already has instincts/ability to rack up stocks/deflections. Where he needs to improve upon is disciplined defense and awareness off-ball. And despite Reed's short comings, the team does much better defensively with him on the floor.

Without having elite athletic size or speed/hops, McCain's at a disadvantage in terms of contesting shots. I don't see him developing the ability to rack up deflections like Reed, for instance.

However, I'm not too high on Reed in the first place at his respective draft position.

Stocks and deflections are fine, but from a backup point guard I want to see solid positional defence and someone who does a good job fighting around screens and keeping their man in front of them on point of attack defence. I don't really see any reason why McCain can't improve that kind of defence, given the effort he gives on that end, just as much as Sheppard.

Sure, McCain makes a lot of freshman mistakes on defence, but I see effort and while not elite, enough athleticism to believe that he can become at least average on that end. I don't pay too much attention to advanced defensive stats for freshman in college because most tend to be bad anyway (kind of like how rookies are generally net negative defenders in the NBA), and defensive stats are tough enough without needing to try to account for the vast variety in schemes and quality of opponents.

I'd agree with you though, that Sheppard may be overvalued a bit at his draft projections. I do think he's a better prospect than McCain, but I'm not sure that there's enough of a difference between them to justify one going top 6 and the other 15-20.

But in any case, I was mostly talking about McCain as an option with the Pacers pick, and Sheppard will be gone by then, so comparisons between the two are somewhat of a moot point.

[RoteSchroder]

I'm curious why you think that. Do you think there is a significant work ethic difference or something? Certainly Sheppard isn't a better overall athlete than McCain.

While both are out-sized, Reed already has instincts/ability to rack up stocks/deflections. Where he needs to improve upon is disciplined defense and awareness off-ball. And despite Reed's short comings, the team does much better defensively with him on the floor.

Without having elite athletic size or speed/hops, McCain's at a disadvantage in terms of contesting shots. I don't see him developing the ability to rack up deflections like Reed, for instance.

However, I'm not too high on Reed in the first place at his respective draft position.

Stocks and deflections are fine, but from a backup point guard I want to see solid positional defence and someone who does a good job fighting around screens and keeping their man in front of them on point of attack defence. I don't really see any reason why McCain can't improve that kind of defence, given the effort he gives on that end, just as much as Sheppard.

Sure, McCain makes a lot of freshman mistakes on defence, but I see effort and while not elite, enough athleticism to believe that he can become at least average on that end. I don't pay too much attention to advanced defensive stats for freshman in college because most tend to be bad anyway (kind of like how rookies are generally net negative defenders in the NBA), and defensive stats are tough enough without needing to try to account for the vast variety in schemes and quality of opponents.

I'd agree with you though, that Sheppard may be overvalued a bit at his draft projections. I do think he's a better prospect than McCain, but I'm not sure that there's enough of a difference between them to justify one going top 6 and the other 15-20.

But in any case, I was mostly talking about McCain as an option with the Pacers pick, and Sheppard will be gone by then, so comparisons between the two are somewhat of a moot point.

I don't like most players mocked at the Indiana position, but I'm fine with McCain, Devin Carter, Filipowski (he's been dropping in a lot of drafts)

I'm also ok with some random dude that Masai pulls out of a hat that no one's talking about

[RoteSchroder]

There is no SUPERSTAR level prospects like Victor, Luka, what they thought AD was, KAT, Zion, LeBron, KD etc. I think the level of “stars” are more that of a Jaylen Brown, Siakam, Jrue Holiday etc…not true franchise changers or face of the franchise level talent BUT they still can potentially become stars…to an extent lol and that’s not the most exciting outcome as a high end unless someone kinda “flukes” into it (ie/ Yang turned out to be a near Jokic player that ppl slept on that prototype again or Chomche had massive unforeseen development to become a Giannis) but there is no obvious superstar talent, only what’s likely a 3rd to 2nd option at absolute best.

I'm off the Yang bandwagon. Not sure what's going on, but he seems a lot slower compared to his U19 World Cup performance. Maybe he's injured or put on weight or if it's fatigue, but he looks incredibly immobile now:

Watch on YouTube

[aminiaturebuddha]

While both are out-sized, Reed already has instincts/ability to rack up stocks/deflections. Where he needs to improve upon is disciplined defense and awareness off-ball. And despite Reed's short comings, the team does much better defensively with him on the floor.

Without having elite athletic size or speed/hops, McCain's at a disadvantage in terms of contesting shots. I don't see him developing the ability to rack up deflections like Reed, for instance.

However, I'm not too high on Reed in the first place at his respective draft position.

Stocks and deflections are fine, but from a backup point guard I want to see solid positional defence and someone who does a good job fighting around screens and keeping their man in front of them on point of attack defence. I don't really see any reason why McCain can't improve that kind of defence, given the effort he gives on that end, just as much as Sheppard.

Sure, McCain makes a lot of freshman mistakes on defence, but I see effort and while not elite, enough athleticism to believe that he can become at least average on that end. I don't pay too much attention to advanced defensive stats for freshman in college because most tend to be bad anyway (kind of like how rookies are generally net negative defenders in the NBA), and defensive stats are tough enough without needing to try to account for the vast variety in schemes and quality of opponents.

I'd agree with you though, that Sheppard may be overvalued a bit at his draft projections. I do think he's a better prospect than McCain, but I'm not sure that there's enough of a difference between them to justify one going top 6 and the other 15-20.

But in any case, I was mostly talking about McCain as an option with the Pacers pick, and Sheppard will be gone by then, so comparisons between the two are somewhat of a moot point.

I don't like most players mocked at the Indiana position, but I'm fine with McCain, Devin Carter, Filipowski (he's been dropping in a lot of drafts)

I'm also ok with some random dude that Masai pulls out of a hat that no one's talking about

Haha yeah, I'm fully expecting some random guy that I hadn't considered and then will scramble in the days following the draft to read and watch as much as possible to form an opinion on the guy.

[Psubs]

I'm curious why you think that. Do you think there is a significant work ethic difference or something? Certainly Sheppard isn't a better overall athlete than McCain.

While both are out-sized, Reed already has instincts/ability to rack up stocks/deflections. Where he needs to improve upon is disciplined defense and awareness off-ball. And despite Reed's short comings, the team does much better defensively with him on the floor.

Without having elite athletic size or speed/hops, McCain's at a disadvantage in terms of contesting shots. I don't see him developing the ability to rack up deflections like Reed, for instance.

However, I'm not too high on Reed in the first place at his respective draft position.

Stocks and deflections are fine, but from a backup point guard I want to see solid positional defence and someone who does a good job fighting around screens and keeping their man in front of them on point of attack defence. I don't really see any reason why McCain can't improve that kind of defence, given the effort he gives on that end, just as much as Sheppard.

Sure, McCain makes a lot of freshman mistakes on defence, but I see effort and while not elite, enough athleticism to believe that he can become at least average on that end. I don't pay too much attention to advanced defensive stats for freshman in college because most tend to be bad anyway (kind of like how rookies are generally net negative defenders in the NBA), and defensive stats are tough enough without needing to try to account for the vast variety in schemes and quality of opponents.

I'd agree with you though, that Sheppard may be overvalued a bit at his draft projections. I do think he's a better prospect than McCain, but I'm not sure that there's enough of a difference between them to justify one going top 6 and the other 15-20.

But in any case, I was mostly talking about McCain as an option with the Pacers pick, and Sheppard will be gone by then, so comparisons between the two are somewhat of a moot point.

I think the play-making and passing instincts makes Reed a top 6 pick as a PG/SG, while McCain is pretty much a 6'3 SG that might handle the ball like CJ McCollum.

McCain looks like his potential is Ben Gordon.

Ben Gordon with a pick in the middle of the 1st round would be fantastic value. Until he had a serious ankle injury later in his career Gordon was a very good player and reliable scorer. Not All-Star, but high level rotation player as both a starter and 6th man.

Thick base and looks balanced on his 3pt shots.

[Thaddy]

If Filipowski is available at the Pacers pick it would be stupid to not draft him. He's better on paper than Buzelis. The shooting, size, and passing are real. I see him being better than Aldama.

[Psubs]

Stocks and deflections are fine, but from a backup point guard I want to see solid positional defence and someone who does a good job fighting around screens and keeping their man in front of them on point of attack defence. I don't really see any reason why McCain can't improve that kind of defence, given the effort he gives on that end, just as much as Sheppard.

Sure, McCain makes a lot of freshman mistakes on defence, but I see effort and while not elite, enough athleticism to believe that he can become at least average on that end. I don't pay too much attention to advanced defensive stats for freshman in college because most tend to be bad anyway (kind of like how rookies are generally net negative defenders in the NBA), and defensive stats are tough enough without needing to try to account for the vast variety in schemes and quality of opponents.

I'd agree with you though, that Sheppard may be overvalued a bit at his draft projections. I do think he's a better prospect than McCain, but I'm not sure that there's enough of a difference between them to justify one going top 6 and the other 15-20.

But in any case, I was mostly talking about McCain as an option with the Pacers pick, and Sheppard will be gone by then, so comparisons between the two are somewhat of a moot point.

I don't like most players mocked at the Indiana position, but I'm fine with McCain, Devin Carter, Filipowski (he's been dropping in a lot of drafts)

I'm also ok with some random dude that Masai pulls out of a hat that no one's talking about

Haha yeah, I'm fully expecting some random guy that I hadn't considered and then will scramble in the days following the draft to read and watch as much as possible to form an opinion on the guy.

The "random" guy that not many have heard of is Ulrich Chomche.

[Psubs]

If Filipowski is available at the Pacers pick it would be stupid to not draft him. He's better on paper than Buzelis. The shooting, size, and passing are real. I see him being better than Aldama.

To me he's pretty much Jonas Valanciunas with PF handles. I'd rather just sign JV to the MLE.

I still want to gamble on Chomche at #17 and watch if he develops into Giannis that can shoot FT's and 3's. He can learn offense from Olynyk and defense from Poeltl. In 3-4 years Olynyk back for vet min will be old 3rd PF and 3rd C and maybe Chomche starts at C over Poetl who's brought back for the MLE.

[Thaddy]

If Filipowski is available at the Pacers pick it would be stupid to not draft him. He's better on paper than Buzelis. The shooting, size, and passing are real. I see him being better than Aldama.

To me he's pretty much Jonas Valanciunas with PF handles. I'd rather just sign JV to the MLE.

I still want to gamble on Chomche at #17 and watch if he develops into Giannis that can shoot FT's and 3's.

Filipowski is much more mobile and a better shooter than JV. The handles are way more fluid too. Since his freshmen year he gained 20lbs and improved his three point shooting. He's a legit C in the NBA now instead of a large PF.