GSW - TOR: Warriors salary dump while staying competitive

[Ackshun]

Feel like we can move Brown for the seconds, without taking back deadweight.

There’s gotta be something out there. Cupboards are pretty bare in LA and NY. Maybe Denver with Braun, Pickett or some of their other young guys?

[Tor_Raps]

Wiggins does fit the wing defender that we need in the starting lineup. Yes he comes with issues but I'd easily do this trade since we get Moody + 2 picks and get to dump McDaniels too.

[Merit]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

Accidentally and 1’d this but I think Wigs contract is gonna be exactly like RJ’s in that he’s going to outperform it as the cap goes up. I doubt we get better depth for the price on the FA market. Malik Monk and Moody are a wash for me. GP3 is an awesome defender and ideal backup.

The issue is Wigs contract and GSW pays for it in prospects. I think we could probably squeeze a first out of them if we included a 2nd.

[Merit]

Feel like we can move Brown for the seconds, without taking back deadweight.

There’s gotta be something out there. Cupboards are pretty bare in LA and NY. Maybe Denver with Braun, Pickett or some of their other young guys?

Yeah this definitely isn’t the only option, but the Canadian factor and storyline makes this a hard one to pass up on. I happen to think Wigs contract is going to age well and I can’t wait to see us getting more hometown “value” whether via future contracts or even via community and national team presence. You gotta remember that we have Shai watching how we handle the Canadians here too.

[MessiahUjiri]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

Accidentally and 1’d this but I think Wigs contract is gonna be exactly like RJ’s in that he’s going to outperform it as the cap goes up. I doubt we get better depth for the price on the FA market. Malik Monk and Moody are a wash for me. GP3 is an awesome defender and ideal backup.

The issue is Wigs contract and GSW pays for it in prospects. I think we could probably squeeze a first out of them if we included a 2nd.

I agree with your line of thought. Overall, there are a few strategic benefits for Toronto:

Wiggins contract can age well if he resets with a homecoming. Even at 80% of his self, he fills the Raps need for a big wing. If he thrives, this could turn out to be a great Risk/Reward similar to Barrett.

Moody is a 3&D breakout candidate. Hes also a former teammate of Scottie Barnes. Scottie was clearly bummed for losing his 2 best friends (OG & Precious), so there are non-basketball benefits too.

Payton is positive value when he plays, but he’s probably gonna get injured again, like Otto Porter. He’s an expiring.

Raps also dump J McDaniels here, and pickup 2 2nds. They probably let Trent walk if Klutch acts difficult - in this negotiation the Raps will hold all the cards.

Team Canada considerations: After this trade, the Raps will have 3 of the Canadian Olympic team’s stars on the roster. You best believe there will be locker room talk.




Quickley / Payton
Barrett / Moody / Ochai
Wiggins / Dick
Scottie / (Boucher?)
Poeltl / Olynyk

+ Add 2 or 3 draft picks from this year, depending on lotto.



The Raps fans hoping to land a star are being unrealistic, and they should stop smoking that Vancouver kush.

[Merit]

I want Wiggins nowhere close to our young guys.

We want positive influences. Wiggins is just so hot and cold and really that's unacceptable for a former #1 pick.

I was remarking on how Wemby has such a competitive edge and wants to be the best.

How many former #1 picks have issues with motivation and entitlement? From recent memory I can can come up with:
Andrew Wiggins (all the natural gifts...no motor)
Zion Williamson (criticism on his weight and eating)
Ben Simmons (would it kill you to learn how to shoot?)
DeAndre Ayton (Luka definitely better but still....)
Andrea Bargnani
Michael Olowakandi (what a waste of a pick)
Anthony Bennett (probably just the wrong pick but still)

Paolo looks legit
Anthony Edwards is legit
Cade is probably going to be worth a #1...maybe?

I agree with this. However, he won’t be the leader on this team and we have a solid locker room. He got crowned Prince without ever having to do anything and his hype hasn’t converted. IMO he’s more a Vince Carter/Uncle Jeff guy. Nothing wrong with that. Let the man mature. He has generational athleticism and is ideal in a complementary role.

Frankly, I would be open to a simpler trade for Wiggins and Moody. I’d rather have Moody than GTJ but it seems the club may be interested in keeping GTJ around. We could conceivably keep both but why would we?

Wiggins, Moody and a first for Brown, McDaniels and a distant second.

We get a first for Brown. We get the best player in the trade and we get rid of a small crappy contract of our own. Optics are great with the first and the Canadian content. Side note: if we send our pick to San Antonio, then it makes us more likely to stick with the original trade that includes GP3.

IQ/#6 Reed Sheppard
RJ/Moody
Wigs/Gradey
Scottie/Ochai
Poeltl/Kelly

+ Boucher, 17, 31

[Ackshun]

Feel like we can move Brown for the seconds, without taking back deadweight.

There’s gotta be something out there. Cupboards are pretty bare in LA and NY. Maybe Denver with Braun, Pickett or some of their other young guys?

Yeah this definitely isn’t the only option, but the Canadian factor and storyline makes this a hard one to pass up on. I happen to think Wigs contract is going to age well and I can’t wait to see us getting more hometown “value” whether via future contracts or even via community and national team presence. You gotta remember that we have Shai watching how we handle the Canadians here too.

Why do you believe Shai is watching how we handle Canadians? Or that it will impact his decision 4 years from now?

Would Wiggins become our starting SF?

Wiggins 2023: 13/4.5/1.7 shooting 45/36/74 - 26 mill
Gradey (last 15): 14/2.7/0.9 shooting 43/38/78 - 4.7 mill

I’d rather give those minutes to Gradey and build a nice bench..if Wiggins was 1/3 the cost, I’d do it but worth that player option, paying 30 million in 2026/27 doesn’t make sense for me. I’d be more inclined to give Demar 28mill to bring him back for 3-4 years ..but nah **** that

[Scase]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

Accidentally and 1’d this but I think Wigs contract is gonna be exactly like RJ’s in that he’s going to outperform it as the cap goes up. I doubt we get better depth for the price on the FA market. Malik Monk and Moody are a wash for me. GP3 is an awesome defender and ideal backup.

The issue is Wigs contract and GSW pays for it in prospects. I think we could probably squeeze a first out of them if we included a 2nd.

There is absolutely nothing to suggest he would bounce back, aside from wishful thinking. RJs contract even at the knicks level of production wasn't that bad, the cap going up doesn't change bad production. Wiggins has had 2-3 good seasons in his entire career, and those needed him being paired with arguably the 2 greatest shooters in NBA history. Picking up one of the worst contracts in the NBA under the hopes that he will magically bounce back, is just clueless.

[Raps in 4]

Why would we do that? Nobody is taking on Wiggins without a FRP coming back as well.

[Tor_Raps]

Why would we do that? Nobody is taking on Wiggins without a FRP coming back as well.

We just gave a 1st rounder for Ochai so wouldn't getting a much better prospect in Moody + 2 2nd Rounders + getting rid of McDaniels = a 1st Rounder that many people in this thread are expecting?

[Raps in 4]

Why would we do that? Nobody is taking on Wiggins without a FRP coming back as well.

We just gave a 1st rounder for Ochai so wouldn't getting a much better prospect in Moody + 2 2nd Rounders + getting rid of McDaniels = a 1st Rounder that many people in this thread are expecting?

Wiggins is a terrible contract, and he has 3 years left. I'm not very high on Moody, and two SRPs are nearly worthless. We'd also be giving up an asset in Brown in this proposed trade. That kind of trade only makes sense if we're planning to bottom out and tank for the next three seasons, but it's already too late for that. All trading for Wiggins would do is handicap our ability to add pieces around Scottie.

[bballsparkin]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

For Moody I'd contemplate it. The guy is not quite 22. I like him with the group we have. All you have to give up is BB a TPE and JMcD? I'd do it. But I think Wiggins can rebound. Plus 2nds from the Hawks should be good.

Although his last year is a PO. So i can understand not doing it.

[Scase]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

For Moody I'd contemplate it. The guy is not quite 22. I like him with the group we have. All you have to give up is BB a TPE and JMcD? I'd do it. But I think Wiggins can rebound. Plus 2nds from the Hawks should be good.

Although his last year is a PO. So i can understand not doing it.

I just dont see any world, where a guy who has shown multiple times in the past, that he doesn't care much about bball, and is just here for the check, turns it around. Maybe he does, but tying up that much salary on a hope, I'm not too keen on it. I'd take it if it were moody and a future top 5 protected first, say like 2026.

[bballsparkin]

[
I just dont see any world, where a guy who has shown multiple times in the past, that he doesn't care much about bball, and is just here for the check, turns it around. Maybe he does, but tying up that much salary on a hope, I'm not too keen on it. I'd take it if it were moody and a future top 5 protected first, say like 2026.

Lol at the top 5 protected pick part. That's not happening.

Clearly there is a risk involved. I don't know the details if he can bounce back. Being at home with Kelly O and RJ on his case might help. His contract is not that bad. The Raptors would need to pay him $28M for two years then he's a nice juicy expiring at $30M in 2026/27.

I don't have any strong feelings about this other than I would love to add Moody to the mix.

[Scase]

[
I just dont see any world, where a guy who has shown multiple times in the past, that he doesn't care much about bball, and is just here for the check, turns it around. Maybe he does, but tying up that much salary on a hope, I'm not too keen on it. I'd take it if it were moody and a future top 5 protected first, say like 2026.

Lol at the top 5 protected pick part. That's not happening.

Clearly there is a risk involved. I don't know the details if he can bounce back. Being at home with Kelly O and RJ on his case might help. His contract is not that bad. The Raptors would need to pay him $28M for two years then he's a nice juicy expiring at $30M in 2026/27.

I don't have any strong feelings about this other than I would love to add Moody to the mix.

It's rumoured that GSW are pretty hard pressed to shed a lot of salary to avoid the repeater tax. 25-30mil is not a small amount, you gotta pay up to shed that, and we'd be giving up an expiring 23mil, taking another 9mil off their books in Payton, AND taking on Wiggins for moody and 2 SRPs?

I like moody, but not that much. We'd be helping them out for no real reason. Not to mention it is just as, if not more likely, that Wiggins has a negative impact on the players here.

[Tor_Raps]

Why would we do that? Nobody is taking on Wiggins without a FRP coming back as well.

We just gave a 1st rounder for Ochai so wouldn't getting a much better prospect in Moody + 2 2nd Rounders + getting rid of McDaniels = a 1st Rounder that many people in this thread are expecting?

Wiggins is a terrible contract, and he has 3 years left. I'm not very high on Moody, and two SRPs are nearly worthless. We'd also be giving up an asset in Brown in this proposed trade. That kind of trade only makes sense if we're planning to bottom out and tank for the next three seasons, but it's already too late for that. All trading for Wiggins would do is handicap our ability to add pieces around Scottie.

This team will never have any real cap space so the only way we're going to be able to add players is via trade. IQ is getting extended this summer and Barnes is getting extended next summer.

Wiggins is getting 25M and it honestly isn't even that horrible of a contract. I get his ups and downs are annoying as hell and 3 years of that can be annoying to want to deal with. I just think the positive far outweigh the negatives from this trade proposal.

[SpezNc]

Webster also said months ago (after TDL) that one of the option would be to decline Brown’s options and then negotiate an extension .

[Merit]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

Accidentally and 1’d this but I think Wigs contract is gonna be exactly like RJ’s in that he’s going to outperform it as the cap goes up. I doubt we get better depth for the price on the FA market. Malik Monk and Moody are a wash for me. GP3 is an awesome defender and ideal backup.

The issue is Wigs contract and GSW pays for it in prospects. I think we could probably squeeze a first out of them if we included a 2nd.

I agree with your line of thought. Overall, there are a few strategic benefits for Toronto:

Wiggins contract can age well if he resets with a homecoming. Even at 80% of his self, he fills the Raps need for a big wing. If he thrives, this could turn out to be a great Risk/Reward similar to Barrett.

Moody is a 3&D breakout candidate. Hes also a former teammate of Scottie Barnes. Scottie was clearly bummed for losing his 2 best friends (OG & Precious), so there are non-basketball benefits too.

Payton is positive value when he plays, but he’s probably gonna get injured again, like Otto Porter. He’s an expiring.

Raps also dump J McDaniels here, and pickup 2 2nds. They probably let Trent walk if Klutch acts difficult - in this negotiation the Raps will hold all the cards.

Team Canada considerations: After this trade, the Raps will have 3 of the Canadian Olympic team’s stars on the roster. You best believe there will be locker room talk.




Quickley / Payton
Barrett / Moody / Ochai
Wiggins / Dick
Scottie / (Boucher?)
Poeltl / Olynyk

+ Add 2 or 3 draft picks from this year, depending on lotto.



The Raps fans hoping to land a star are being unrealistic, and they should stop smoking that Vancouver kush.

Hey, don’t knock VanCity for its primary export.

Agreed with you on all counts. Didn’t know about the Moody/Barnes connection. Thanks! Wiggins as he is right now is a solid rotation piece and well above average defender. I guarantee he will get his here more frequently since we desperately need more driving and shot creation, and he and moody can anchor bench units.

I’m indifferent to GP3 as long as we keep our pick.

[Merit]

Taking on wiggins is a FRP in in itself. Wiggins' contract, is what people thought/said RJs was. Why would we take on a prospect (good) salary filler in payton (bad), and 2 crappy picks, for wiggins' awful contract?

I'd rather waive McD and let BB expire than this crap.

Accidentally and 1’d this but I think Wigs contract is gonna be exactly like RJ’s in that he’s going to outperform it as the cap goes up. I doubt we get better depth for the price on the FA market. Malik Monk and Moody are a wash for me. GP3 is an awesome defender and ideal backup.

The issue is Wigs contract and GSW pays for it in prospects. I think we could probably squeeze a first out of them if we included a 2nd.

There is absolutely nothing to suggest he would bounce back, aside from wishful thinking. RJs contract even at the knicks level of production wasn't that bad, the cap going up doesn't change bad production. Wiggins has had 2-3 good seasons in his entire career, and those needed him being paired with arguably the 2 greatest shooters in NBA history. Picking up one of the worst contracts in the NBA under the hopes that he will magically bounce back, is just clueless.

Wiggins as he is right now is exactly what this team needs. A tertiary scorer who can hold down a bench unit and a defensive stopper. The only issue is his contract, but that’s what makes him available. I still take him even if he stays the same and makes zero improvement.

Fortunately, we will have complementary shooting around him, and Wiggins can shoot as well. He’s not someone who’s going to be left unguarded, that’s for sure. As it stands, IQ, RJ, Scottie and Wigs all require their man to be nearby. Same with Gradey and Kelly for their shooting. We have what we need on this team for him to be successful - especially in a system where he’ll be set free and allowed to make a few mistakes.

[Merit]

If the Warriors include their 2025 pick then I'd trade Brown for Wiggins. Otherwise I pass.

Gsw also passes. IMO it’s either moody or the 2025 FRP. I lean towards moody.

Wiggins/Moody/2x 2nds for Brown/McDaniels and I still do it.